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Interesting article,, goes into some detail as to what to expect. I really wish I understood this better.



Quote:

The rebuild: Cleveland Browns make radical changes
90

By Conor Orr
Around The NFL Writer
Published: Jan. 5, 2016 at 06:12 p.m.
Updated: Jan. 5, 2016 at 08:20 p.m.

When Baltimore Ravens president Dick Cass heard the Cleveland Browns promoted Sashi Brown to vice president of football operations, his immediate reaction was not competitive curiosity regarding the division rival's massive -- and unorthodox -- maneuver, one of several Cleveland would make over the coming days.

It was pride.

Cass was the head of a massive Washington D.C. law firm, Wilmer Cutler Pickering Hale and Dorr when Brown first joined as an associate out of Harvard Law School in 2002. The firm, where Cass handled Jerry Jones' purchase of the Dallas Cowboys, offered brilliant minds the opportunity to gravitate toward the intersection of law and professional sports. Brown showed promise in the field right away, and Cass did not hesitate to recommend him for a job with the Jacksonville Jaguars in 2005.

"He's always had good judgement," Cass told Around The NFL on Tuesday. "He's easy to get along with and he's a consensus builder. Good temperament. Doesn't fly off the handle. He's well-suited for the Browns' job, I think -- all of those qualities will serve him well."

Most importantly, as Brown prepares to run a Cleveland team that also hired former Mets executive Paul DePodesta to be their chief strategy officer, Cass sees a quality in Brown that will serve him extraordinarily well.

"Sashi is smart," Cass said. "So he knows what he doesn't know."

In that spirit, Around The NFL spoke to several executives either directly informed of the Browns' revamped power structure, or rival executives with intimate knowledge of the team's plans to help parse a week of change in Cleveland. While many are picturing Brown and DePodesta assembling a sequel to Moneyball, a book on the 2002 Oakland Athletics about the infusion of sabermetrics and analytics in baseball which featured DePodesta as a central character, the truth is slightly less complex. Coaches won't be scrolling through Pro Football Focus before drafting a player. Scouts won't be whipping out pocket calculators at the combine.

"This model averts a lot of the real trouble that festers inside organizations," one NFC executive said. "It's not like these guys are going to be calling plays. It's different, but it could work."

ORGANIZATIONAL STRUCTURE

First off, how will this work? According to a person briefed on the team's plans, here's the Browns' power structure: DePodesta and Brown are considered "one and one," or equals. They will both work directly under owner Jimmy Haslam and report to him. The team's new head coach also will report to Haslam. Once hired, the personnel director will report to Brown.

Some rival executives have lampooned Brown's position and have made some valid points against it. Since Brown has control of the 53-man roster, a team can turn down any request the Browns make to interview one of their assistants. In theory, this would make a pool of eager candidates relatively shallow and has more than likely prevented the Browns from lining up certain scouts and evaluators.
Castrol EDGE Clutch Performers:

Vote: Peyton Manning, Broncos
Vote: Leodis McKelvin, Bills
Vote: Ryan Tannehill, Dolphins
Vote: J.J. Watt, Texans
Vote: Xavier Rhodes, Vikings

This could put the Browns at a disadvantage heading into their third straight season with two picks in the top 32, but the previous regime's setup didn't help on draft weekend, either. Between 2014-15, the team selected Justin Gilbert, Johnny Manziel, Danny Shelton and Cam Erving in the first round.

Above all else, the move seems to be considerate of recent history in Cleveland and meant to fix bigger problems.

Consider the following, an amalgamation of a few scenarios posed by those familiar with the decision:

Struggling teams often have tension between their coach and general manager. And those teams, especially ones where an owner is not in the building every day like Haslam, consistently struggle to win because the tension never goes away. Small problems create bigger problems. Coaches end up making veiled comments to the media about the roster's lack of talent. General managers disguise comments about players being out of position. Decisions don't really become decisions without motive.

Imagine, then, that Brown's job is to be the liaison in the building every day, making sure the head coach and general manager are on the same page both publicly and privately. Brown's calm and affable demeanor could be well-suited for his role, and his power will prevent a personnel czar from simply stacking the roster as they see fit. Will Brown really be picking the players on the roster, or has he simply been given the opportunity and power to settle a dispute when there is one?

For years, Brown thrived in a corporate environment with far more money -- and far, far larger egos -- at stake and earned a reputation as a problem solver. Football is often described as a world unto its own, but the basic issues of power and respect rarely change.

A BASEBALL MAN?

It is true that DePodesta was Oakland Athletics general manager Billy Beane's statistical muse during their unexpected playoff runs in the early 2000s. DePodesta helped identify devalued players with overlooked attributes and built a winner.

And while the immediate assumption is that he will revamp the club's analytics department -- which they already have -- there are far more valuable and important matters at hand, especially considering that the NFL is a salary-cap league. Teams are already on an even financial platform.

"Paul completely reorganized the Mets scouting and player development functions and had an extraordinary impact in both areas," Mets general manager Sandy Alderson said in a statement to reporters Tuesday. "But he was also very directly involved in our trade and free agent acquisitions. His commitment to excellence and his passion for innovation will be missed by the Mets and all of baseball. I wish him well with the Browns."

After the analytics swoon in baseball, every club for better or worse employed some version of what the Athletics were doing. This eventually caused a situation where the advantages were less significant for the teams that were already ahead of the curve.

What DePodesta, a former football player at Harvard, does well is look at things from a bird's eye view. When he started working under Alderson with the Mets, he aided the team's infrastructure building process and helped synchronize all facets of the organization.

On some levels, this is called "design thinking," and it has helped countless teams improve everything from morale to player development. Rather than simply being labeled as a former baseball executive, DePodesta is more like a CEO that has been brought in to aid a fledgling company.

"We are fortunate to bring in Paul, an extremely talented, highly respected sports executive who will add a critical dimension to our front office," Browns owner Jimmy Haslam said. "His approach and ambition to find the best pathways for organizational success transcend one specific sport and his experience as a high level sports executive make him a terrific addition to the Cleveland Browns."

DePodesta's fingerprints will be behind the scenes. He will check in with the diet and nutrition department regularly to see if what they are doing harmonizes with the activities players are doing on the field. He will analyze salary cap numbers to see if there is a more efficient way to structure deals or spend on free agents. Like Brown, who will aid in the synchronicity of coaching and scouting, DePodesta will do so for the entire organization.

"Paul has invaluable experience in management and leadership with a number of highly successful sports teams," Brown said in a statement. "His ability to create better processes and systems throughout organizations, his use of data as a tool to produce better outcomes, and his relentless focus on looking for innovative ways to create more success will be a strong asset as we look to be as comprehensive as possible in our decision making."

WILL IT WORK?

The Browns now have our attention, even if it is misdirected. On Tuesday, suspended wide receiver Josh Gordon tweeted that he loved the movie Moneyball. Visions of a plucky fourth-string wide receiver no one thought to unearth at Southwestern Michigan danced through our heads. More than likely, this will not happen.

The common response from evaluators and executives asked about the moves fell into three categories: "What on Earth?" "Well, if everything else fails, might as well..." and "This is brilliant." Cleveland hopes it is the latter.

Is this a last-ditch effort of an owner who has already fired too many coaches and general managers to be taken seriously? Is it the sign of a man who has employed a lot of smart non-football people, and those people have finally taken over? Or is it the start of something much more significant; a way for teams to finally compartmentalize the rapidly increasing amounts of data, analytics, talent, personalities, finances, nutrition, infrastructure and sports science that have only been maximized on an individual level?

Most importantly, is it a move that can save football in Cleveland?


#GMSTRONG

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Daniel Patrick Moynahan

"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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I can see it now...Jimmy asks his baseball guy..analyze this..will the Browns be a better team with Johnny Manziel starting?

Baseball guy runs numbers and says...YES the Browns would be better if the Browns kept their resident drunk as the starter.

Yep, Nick Saban is sure going to be Haslam's next HC..sure.

A RADICAL CHANGE WOULD BE ...the Browns new HC will also be in charge of personnel and responsible for the 53 man roster.

The Browns will be stuck with some unqualified coordinator as HC.


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What in the hell are you talking about?


#GMSTRONG

“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan

"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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daman...like I said, "A RADCIAL CHANGE" would be a HC who is in charge of his roster..who is in charge of who is drafted and in charge of free agent signings.

Just heard John Gruden comment on the Browns structure...can you imagine how confusing a meeting is going to be with this many people in the room.

Gruden said he like to keep the management structure simple..and I agree with him.

All the talk of the Browns landing a high profile coach with a proven record..like Nick Saban...let's see how interested those high profile candidates are in Jimmy Hs new management structure.

Last edited by mac; 01/06/16 08:36 AM.

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Interesting read,I find reading these articles and the ones that DeputyDawg have been posting interesting , helpful and refreshing..

For someone like myself and I believe like yourself that don't understand all of this, It's best to read and try to get a grasp on things on a level note.

I understand the ones who do not like or accept this method, It's just the way they are going about expressing it.. And actually the way the are is kind of the only way they can.. I get it, it makes sense.

Then there's the ones who are willing to listen and support it until the results are in, that won't be til the end of a season or two. This seems to be a situation that will take a while to ride out.

As for now I'm surely enjoying reading up on this new way of things in Cleveland.. I'm not going to knee jerk or accept or despise any of this until I see a proven outcome.

Will it be this season, next or the season after ? Who knows, all I know at this very moment, I'm not reading about what Farmers going to do in the draft and if him and Pet are on the same page..

I'm listening to both sides of the argument, Just tuning out some of the really negative unnecessary stuff.

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Quote:
"A RADCIAL CHANGE" would be a HC who is in charge of his roster..who is drafted, free agents.


Farmers gone , it's a start.

Okay Mac, This new way of things being put into place, How will it translate to the HC and the field?

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Originally Posted By: DeisleDawg
Quote:
"A RADCIAL CHANGE" would be a HC who is in charge of his roster..who is drafted, free agents.


Farmers gone , it's a start.

Okay Mac, This new way of things being put into place, How will it translate to the HC and the field?


dies...what kind of person is going to want to coach the Browns?...Bill Cowhr?, Nick Saban?...or some coordinator who has no experience beyond the coordinator level and more than likely, a young guy with little experience in the NFL.


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Originally Posted By: DeisleDawg
Will it be this season, next or the season after ? Who knows...


Good point, Billy. It is going to take awhile to accumulate data and provide output. I don't expect to see/hear significant results perhaps until late this season or next at the earliest...


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Originally Posted By: mac
Originally Posted By: DeisleDawg
Quote:
"A RADCIAL CHANGE" would be a HC who is in charge of his roster..who is drafted, free agents.


Farmers gone , it's a start.

Okay Mac, This new way of things being put into place, How will it translate to the HC and the field?


dies...what kind of person is going to want to coach the Browns?...Bill Cowhr?, Nick Saban?...or some coordinator who has no experience beyond the coordinator level and more than likely, a young guy with little experience in the NFL.


mac: although not on par with the Giants vacancy perhaps, but it is still a prime job...


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Radical change?

I think that we had too many voices making decisions the last two years and we will continue to have too many voices making decisions and that the Haslams are and will still be among the voices. That is not a radical change. It's the same old crap that leads to dysfunction.

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Quote:
what kind of person is going to want to coach the Browns?


I don't know Mac, I really don't.. I don't know, understand this yet to see why coaches won't.

This Analytic thing.. Is it not appealing to a guy who would embrace and enjoy coaching like that ?

I'm honestly trying to figure all this out

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Originally Posted By: bbrowns32
Originally Posted By: mac
Originally Posted By: DeisleDawg
Quote:
"A RADCIAL CHANGE" would be a HC who is in charge of his roster..who is drafted, free agents.


Farmers gone , it's a start.

Okay Mac, This new way of things being put into place, How will it translate to the HC and the field?


dies...what kind of person is going to want to coach the Browns?...Bill Cowhr?, Nick Saban?...or some coordinator who has no experience beyond the coordinator level and more than likely, a young guy with little experience in the NFL.


mac: although not on par with the Giants vacancy perhaps, but it is still a prime job...


An NFL Head Coach vacancy where he won't report to anyone but the Owner and the new VP's job is to ensure that the Personnel Guy (GM) gets the kinds of players the coach asks for without going rogue and doing his own thing?

I'm thinking there are a TON of coaches that will jump at that.
Add in that Cleveland is known for getting you PAID, and it's a no-brainer.


Browns is the Browns

... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.

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I Think the way this hierarchy is set up lends itself to grabbing a relatively unknown personnel guy tying to make the next leap in his career. Simply due the fact that he won't have control of the 53, many teams can axe a interview request as it being a lateral move. Conversely, he we actually do hire a GM/Director of Personnel, and he does well, he can then jump ship to a team that will give him roster control.

I'm interested to see how this position unfolds. I do agree that the HC job may not be as bad as some think. The GM position, however, may need some massaging.


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Originally Posted By: PrplPplEater
Originally Posted By: bbrowns32
Originally Posted By: mac
Originally Posted By: DeisleDawg
Quote:
"A RADCIAL CHANGE" would be a HC who is in charge of his roster..who is drafted, free agents.


Farmers gone , it's a start.

Okay Mac, This new way of things being put into place, How will it translate to the HC and the field?


dies...what kind of person is going to want to coach the Browns?...Bill Cowhr?, Nick Saban?...or some coordinator who has no experience beyond the coordinator level and more than likely, a young guy with little experience in the NFL.


mac: although not on par with the Giants vacancy perhaps, but it is still a prime job...


An NFL Head Coach vacancy where he won't report to anyone but the Owner and the new VP's job is to ensure that the Personnel Guy (GM) gets the kinds of players the coach asks for without going rogue and doing his own thing?

I'm thinking there are a TON of coaches that will jump at that.
Add in that Cleveland is known for getting you PAID, and it's a no-brainer.


prp...with every hire Haslam makes, the Browns HC job becomes "less attractive"..especially to the very best coaching prospects.

I look for the Browns to interview a ton of candidates, but ultimately they will get the leftovers..an offensive or defensive coordinator who is just looking for a payday, willing to put up with Haslam's crap.

I'm beginning to think that there is something wrong with Haslam...I'm serious...some kind addiction or a physical/mental issue like a tumor or something.

Haslam's decision making is so off the wall..like he has no plan and is just making this up as he goes.

Again, what kind of coach will want the job here, with Haslam as the owner?

BTW, you can take Gruden off the list, he just said it is going to be too many men in the room and that he likes to keep the management structure simple.


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Quote:
I look for the Browns to interview a ton of candidates, but ultimately they will get the leftovers..an offensive or defensive coordinator who is just looking for a payday, willing to put up with Haslam's crap.


I think the term 'leftovers' might be in play, but not from a coaching perspective, rather, the personnel side.


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Quote:
Haslam's decision making is so off the wall..like he has no plan and is just making this up as he goes


Actually I have the complete opposite feeling...this feels well thought out and has a plan put together...and I'm not going to cry over Chucky not wanting to come here...not that there is anything wrong with his coaching per-say...but is there a quarterback that guy doesnt love or thinks he can make them work??

We will find out soon enough if this idea works...or if Jimmy is patient enough to let it work.

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Quote:
I'm beginning to think that there is something wrong with Haslam...I'm serious...some kind addiction or a physical/mental issue like a tumor or something.


That's uncalled for.

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Quote:
I'm beginning to think that there is something wrong with Haslam...I'm serious...some kind addiction or a physical/mental issue like a tumor or something.


That's uncalled for.


Glad someone called him on it...

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You're delusional and just wanting to complain because you don't want to even try to understand the situation. You don't even WANT to try to understand it, you just want to lash out.

That's all well and fine, but for the love of God, stop with the dramatics and rhetoric like "with every hire he makes it so no coach will want to come here".

If a coach isn't bright enough to see that this structure is being set up to make it so that the team is the Coach's baby, he has the power to do what he needs to do, and the personnel guys are there to serve the coach, then it's a coach that's simply too dumb to be here. The coach will have autonomy over how the team is run and he has executives backing him up to make sure the personnel guys get him what he is asking for.


p.s. - I'm glad that Gruden doesn't want it, he was never on my list. I think the guy is a blowhard and an idiot.


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Originally Posted By: PrplPplEater
You're delusional and just wanting to complain because you don't want to even try to understand the situation. You don't even WANT to try to understand it, you just want to lash out.

That's all well and fine, but for the love of God, stop with the dramatics and rhetoric like "with every hire he makes it so no coach will want to come here".

If a coach isn't bright enough to see that this structure is being set up to make it so that the team is the Coach's baby, he has the power to do what he needs to do, and the personnel guys are there to serve the coach, then it's a coach that's simply too dumb to be here. The coach will have autonomy over how the team is run and he has executives backing him up to make sure the personnel guys get him what he is asking for.


WHAM WITH THE RIGHT HAND...you put it better then I did...I like whats going on and dont feel its as unattractive to a head coach as mac is portraying at all the opposite actually.

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I maintain that literally picking players from Pro Football Focus notebook would have yielded better results than Farmers drafts. I'm not sure it will work but it's an IDENTITY! Can we finally have an identity?

The process isn't over so it's to early to say.

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prp...tell me what the plan is...

Just what is the management structure?

Last edited by mac; 01/06/16 09:48 AM.

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Originally Posted By: mac
prp...tell me what the plan is...

Just what is the management structure?


Wasnt that already laid out in articles and Jimmy's presser??

Just say you dont like it instead of asking questions in circles Mac.

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Google it yourself. It's out there. It's in articles here.

Wait, nevermind... I'll spoon feed you:


Coach reports to Haslam.
Sashi & Moneyball are equals and also report directly to Haslam.
Sashi Brown is over the GM (a.k.a. Personnel Director).
Brown is there to be the in-house, day-to-day mediator between Coach & GM.
GM makes draft picks and signs free agents.
Brown makes sure that what the GM is doing aligns with what the coach wants and the team needs.
Moneyball makes sure that the money makes sense and also contributes lots elsewhere.

The entire goal is to solve every big problem we've had since coming back - namely football guys that keep wanting to do other people's jobs and end all of the in-house bickering and finger-pointing. This keeps everyone in their lanes, worrying about only their own jobs.


Now, feel free to resume complaining.


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Originally Posted By: bbrowns32
Originally Posted By: DeisleDawg
Will it be this season, next or the season after ? Who knows...


Good point, Billy. It is going to take awhile to accumulate data and provide output. I don't expect to see/hear significant results perhaps until late this season or next at the earliest...


I think missed by many is this:

immediate assumption is that he will revamp the club's analytics department -- which they already have

WHICH WE ALREADY HAVE so this isn't being built by scratch its ready to role now with some revamping of course.

I didn't realize his Leadership qualities in making things run cohesively within the Organization.

We have failed for so long - yes, instability with no continuity is a large fault but because of all the changes over the years the ORGANIZATION is in shambles. Glad to see we are fixing this from top to bottom. I don't mind brilliant people getting involved and I think they are more than just geeks they are into Football and Sports.

jmho


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Quote:
Coach reports to Haslam.
Sashi & Moneyball are equals and also report directly to Haslam.
Sashi Brown is over the GM (a.k.a. Personnel Director).
Brown is there to be the in-house, day-to-day mediator between Coach & GM.
GM makes draft picks and signs free agents.
Brown makes sure that what the GM is doing aligns with what the coach wants and the team needs.
Moneyball makes sure that the money makes sense and also contributes lots elsewhere.


prp...thank you...I rest my case.

In the military, we had a word for this...

BTW, since when did Manziel become a banned subject?


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Quote:
I can see it now...Jimmy asks his baseball guy..analyze this..will the Browns be a better team with Johnny Manziel starting?

Baseball guy runs numbers and says...YES the Browns would be better if the Browns kept their resident drunk as the starter.


Hey Mac, I was just reading an article on espn and thought about your comment here...let me paste the snippet I'm reading and you tell me this is a bad idea or not...

"While we are excited about what Paul will provide our organization, we remain fully focused on the critical task of identifying the right head coach and player personnel executive who will provide the football expertise needed to be successful."

So they are trying to find the football side...if they get it right idk but I like what I'm seeing being done.

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This structure is all designed to stop the infighting between the Head Coach and the General Manager. To prevent the GM from texting the field wanting to know why the "Star QB" he drafted isn't playing during the middle of a game. Trying to prevent a GM from going Rouge and signing an aging Wide Receiver who can not get separation ( Dwayne Bowe ) when the coach wants a young WR with potential upside ( Sammy Watkins ). This is to prevent the constant bickering about who is to blame.

To an extent, it also seems to be a return to the Banner/Lombardi structure, but with different personalities involved, a rule by committee, rather than an autocracy. The Head Coach will now report to Haslam and not to Brown ( Banner ). The addition of Depodesta to the mix also adds a buffer to prevent anyone getting too powerful and running roughshod over things. The Head Coach, by reporting directly to the owner, has an unfiltered pipeline to plead his case.

In other words, Haslam is trying to rectify all of the perceived problems of his past 2 administrations.

Last edited by Halfback32; 01/06/16 10:33 AM.

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Not sure where to put this, but I didn't want to start a new thread:

Quote:
Former Browns GM: Organization Trying To Survive, Not Thrive
January 5, 2016 1:16 PM
Filed Under: Cleveland Browns, NFL, Phil Savage


Another year, another regime change for the Cleveland Browns.

Cleveland fired Mike Pettine and Ray Farmer on Sunday following a disastrous 3-13 season. The Browns have finished with a losing record in 16 of the last 18 seasons, including eight straight.

What has been the Browns’ main problem since, well, returning to Cleveland?

“Oh man, where do you start?” former Browns general manager Phil Savage said on CBS Sports Radio’s Gio and Jones. “This has been going on really since 1999, and now it’s extended beyond the ownership that I was under to a new ownership group led by Jimmy Haslam. I think when you look at the AFC North, you’ve got the Steelers, the Ravens and the Bengals that all have a thousand times more stability than the Browns. While those teams worry about winning on a day-to-ay basis, honestly, at the Browns, when one thing goes wrong for a new regime, everybody runs for cover and it starts becoming more about surviving. That was the experience that I had during my four years in Cleveland. It was one of the real frustrations: while your opponents are focused on winning and what they need to do to make their team better, you had people within the organization – because they had been through this a number of times – you have people that basically are trying to survive rather than thrive. There’s just never a way to catch up.

“So they go on this quest again to find a new GM and a new coach,” Savage said. “One of the real issues there, in my opinion, is that when they fire people, they fire both sides of the building, so there’s never any carryover whatsoever in any part of your football operation. I know when I came from the Ravens, we always kept the front office side of the building in place. They basically just changed the coaches, and you look at the Ravens over the last 20 years, their scouting structure is the same that it’s bene virtually for 20 years, whereas it’s just been the coaching side of the place that has changed.”


Savage, who is now a radio analyst for the Alabama football team, served as a Ravens executive from 1996 to 2004 and was the Browns’ general manager from 2005 to 2008. He experienced firsthand just how different the two franchises are and feels the Browns need to take a page from the Ravens – and the rest of the AFC North – when it comes to running a football team.

“They’ve got to find the right people and get them in place and let them do their job,” Savage said. “It’s really a tough call. They’ve kind of painted themselves into a tough spot already with this search. On Sunday night, Jimmy Haslam announced that Sashi Brown, who is more of a capologist/contract man, (is) in charge of the 53-man roster. So to say that they’re going to go out and hire a coach, okay, that’s one thing. But how you’re going to fit a general manager to this equation, what GM candidate out there is going to pigeonhole himself into a spot where he doesn’t really have a final say on the draft or free agency or what have you? I think that there are going to be a number of candidates that say, ‘I’m not going to waste my time on the interview for what is not really a GM job. It’s a glorified personnel position.’ So that’s a bit problematic. We’ll see if this formula can work for them. I’m not sure how much thought was put into it because quite honestly, some of the teams won’t even have to grant permission for their guy to go interview for that spot because it’s not a bonafide GM-titled position.”

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(Phil Savage)...feels the Browns need to take a page from the Ravens book



Would that be the same page they ripped out of our book in '95?


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J/C .....

I don't have a problem with having a guy looking at processes and best practices. I think that is extremely important for any organization.

My concern here is that we have this organizational chart that could easily lead to more confusion and chaos.

We have 3 "legs" that all report to Haslam, and that may, or may not, want to cooperate and work together, especially on more difficult items, where, perhaps, one of the 3 are firmly entrenched in part of their philosophy.

I thought, originally, that football operations were all going to be under Sashi Brown. Now the new coach, Brown, and DePotesta will all report to Haslam directly instead. This certainly does have the appearance of being made up on the fly.

Could this work? Sure, almost anything "could" work. Will it turn this team around? I have serious doubts. As I said on another thread, teams have used analytics to one degree or another for many years. Once an assistant coach started tracking the weekly opponent's most likely approaches to various situations, he was using analytics. When a team looks at an opponent to find weaknesses, and how best to attack those weaknesses, they use analytics. I don't have a problem with analytics as an augment to the strategy of the game. It cannot be the backbone though.

People have mentioned Baseball, and how well analytics work there. Well, baseball is more of a one on one battle with every pitch. It definitely helps to know how player A or B react to having runners on base, and who may be most likely to hit into a double play, for example. It helps to know where a player can be pitched more safely, and where he should not be pitched. Football really doesn't have those directly one on one situations. I do wonder how this will all work, and how far we will go with analytic use.

This could work, then again, it could blow up in everyone's face. I see a lot of huge concerns. The 3 we have as "legs" has better have no egos, because 1 ego in the bunch could cause major problems. How many great head coaches have no egos, though? Can a coach be a great head coach without that ego, that says "Put it all on me, and I will get us where we want to go"? (and this is not to say that a head coach should not delegate, and listen to suggestions, but that the refusal to fail that is built into most great head coaches may make this type of arrangement difficult. How heavily will we use analytics? Will it be the 2nd or 3rd tool out of the toolbox, used to confirm other approaches, or will it be the main tool used by the team?

One thing is for sure, we cannot do much worse as far as winning than we have done over the past 15 years. That is about the only real upside I see here. We are either going to be way ahead of the curve when compared to other teams, or driving off the cliff ...... yet again. I want to believe, but I just can't. I see too many potential problems in this setup. Hopefully I am wrong, and if so, I will be happy to say I was.


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I think they will use the analytics in a similar way to what Banner did with the Bridgewater/Manziel study. To look at which of 2 candidates for a draft pick could be the best choice. Banner's stucy said Bridgewater.. and Farmer picked Manziel.. Hindsight tells us that the analytics have a high probability of being right...


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Quote:
Hindsight tells us that the analytics have a high probability of being right...


What teams are using analytics as heavily as we seem ready to do.


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Originally Posted By: YTownBrownsFan
Quote:
Hindsight tells us that the analytics have a high probability of being right...


What teams are using analytics as heavily as we seem ready to do.




Quote:
Before the season began for the eventual AFC representative in Sunday’s championship game, the Baltimore Ravens hired “director of football analytics,” Sandy Weil. While the team’s GM Ozzie Newsome only presented a general outline for the new hire – a former NBA stats consultant who would “provide an edge for us in personnel and coaching” – the Ravens did leave the team open as an analytic “work in progress.”


Quote:
The other team vying for the Lombardi Trophy on Sunday is accustomed to championship success – and looking at the data. The San Francisco 49ers COO Paraag Marathe first came to the team 12 years ago to help with analysis surrounding draft picks, something currently paying dividends on the field. Also, in plans for the team’s new Santa Clara, Calif. stadium and existing website are applications to streamline the game day experience and tap into social media feeds for business opportunities.


Quote:
Another long-time proponent of analytics for player performance, the Patriots were even a subject of interest in sports trend assessments a few years ago by MIT. Based on data analysis of risk and reward, coach Bill Belichick has taken a more daring attitude than most in the NFL toward running offensive plays on fourth down – when most conservatively punt the ball back to the opposing team – to varying degrees of success.


Quote:
Akin to the trucking industry, the Falcons are joining a small group of teams openly using GPS data to assess player movements during practice. The movement tracking data could bring more efficient plays, as Sports Illustrated reported, or create predictive models on injury potential, according to ESPN.


This article is old, so there are likely even more teams using analytics. It isn't as "ground breaking" as a lot seem to think it is.

http://www.information-management.com/ga...10023884-1.html

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Too much we don't know about Ytown...
a few speculating it as good, a few bad and a few are more at the Hmmmm I wonder stage.

Lets see who the HC is I think that is very important and they should have a lot of control of the football. Personnel wise not quite sure we would get a candidate for GM or just a high level Personnel guy...but it will be done (search) after the hire.

All I know is that since 1999 it appears our organization has been in turmoil. This power struggle and that power struggle I think Davis had full Power and was the only one and coincidentally our only Play off game.

As one article stated...get that picture out of your mind of this Chubby nerd depicted in the picture. The guy putting a lot of this has a football background and has done many things besides billy ball. Including the organizational side. Including restructuring the SCOUTING
department cause ours doesn't seem to be a well oiled machine. With 7 regimes its made a mess.

Hey its like day 2 and we got a plan at least. Lets see it out.



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The main football team that uses them are the Patriots


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Originally Posted By: PrplPplEater

Coach reports to Haslam.
Sashi & Moneyball are equals and also report directly to Haslam.
Sashi Brown is over the GM (a.k.a. Personnel Director).
Brown is there to be the in-house, day-to-day mediator between Coach & GM.
GM makes draft picks and signs free agents.
Brown makes sure that what the GM is doing aligns with what the coach wants and the team needs.
Moneyball makes sure that the money makes sense and also contributes lots elsewhere.

The entire goal is to solve every big problem we've had since coming back - namely football guys that keep wanting to do other people's jobs and end all of the in-house bickering and finger-pointing. This keeps everyone in their lanes, worrying about only their own jobs.


That sounds great, but the REAL problem remains unsolved. The biggest problem was TALENT EVALUATION. That's where this whole mess starts and ends with. The in-fighting was BECAUSE of it.

Who is going to scout all these players and rank them and who's good at it? DeP is coming from baseball and is more like a CEO, Sashi Brown is a smart, nice guy who can mediate. Haslam is a proven idiot.

Who has a clue about football, may I ask?

Some random scout from another team? Because that will be pretty much the only guy willing to work in this structure.

Last edited by DjangoBrown; 01/06/16 03:12 PM.

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A radical change...why not give total control to a coach...HC/GM...instead of giving the Harvard boys control of the Browns.

I think that is what Bob Kraft did in NE....you know, where they have all those Super Bowl trouphies?

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I think everyone is going a little overboard in thinking what analytics may or may not do for our franchise. I don't think JH is trying to build a franchise that will be run by "analytics".

The information itself will be INVALUABLE, how it's interpreted is where the sticking point is... I used to hate Hargrove (since we have baseball invading our football world) because every move was "by the book". This hitter does this against this pitcher, etc. Sometimes a little "gut feeling" and emotion would seem to have served him better. Gut feeling is an important part of coaching a team on the field of play, analytics plays a much larger role in preparation (in my eyes, anyway).

Lost within this baseball hire and the term "analytics" is the "alignment" that was spoken of. Getting people together that aren't trying prove they are the smartest guy in the room at every turn.

Analytics becomes "the other guy" in the room. The one with the most facts, the one that is usually right (again, if data is interpreted correctly), the one that is a bridge to help others create a common opinion based on the facts as we know them. I see nothing wrong with creating an alliance of people that buy into the whole deal. I really don't care where they came from. Watching 2014 and the struggle between Pet and Shanny incessantly trying to prove who was smarter did us no favors. Watching 2015 between Pet and Farmer was no different, it was obvious they weren't on the same page from the veiled remarks about the talent pool. Enough.

DATA puts people in the best position to make good decisions, data gives them an "out" when things don't go as planned. Data can be your best friend one week and the black sheep the next. As we learn from the experience we get better at our interpretation. DATA will take a bunch of the EGO out of a group of men on ego trips.

I'm all for it. The question is more about whether we can plug the proper coach and GM into the system. The FACT is - this is the system that the billionaire owner is going to put in place, and I doubt that he will waiver from it for quite a while. If it works and we become leaders in the idea, the rest of the league may be playing catch-up for a while. If it doesn't, well, we're the Browns lol.

Last edited by FATE; 01/06/16 03:21 PM.

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Originally Posted By: mac
A radical change...why not give total control to a coach...HC/GM...instead of giving the Harvard boys control of the Browns.

I think that is what Bob Kraft did in NE....you know, where they have all those Super Bowl trouphies?


Isn't that what we've been doing for the past 16 seasons?

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