DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2016 NFL Season 2016 NFL Draft Carson Wentz

There is just to much defensive talent to be reaching for a QB that high. The only O players i would consider that high are the 2 players from Ole Miss. Treadwell and Tunsil. Hell those are probably the only 2 Offensive players I would consider top 15 in this entire draft. Beyond those 2 the next best is probably Elliot the RB from OSU.

but man I am watching this kid Butler and he caught my eye in their practices but the kid has a chance to be the best player in this draft. No idea what the ranking is on him, but power/burst combo is off the charts.

Had similar concerns, very few anticipation throws, accuracy concerns against very low level competition.

Vers, do you think the fact that Wentz is and Academic All-American gives him a much better shot at learning to go through progressions faster, or is that not necessarily the same type of intelligence?

Two different things, Big. That isn't to say that he can't improve, but on the football field, it's more about processing skills.

I will say that his intelligence can help him w/his pre-snap reads. If he really is intelligent, he could do an excellent job in the film room of recognizing tendencies, coverages, and looks of a defense based on down and distance, time left in the game, field position, etc. That would give him an edge. Think Peyton Manning.

What I was talking about was post-snap. If a guy like you or I were back there, we would just see one giant blur. Good qbs are able to slow all that movement down because they can process things so fast. I think it is more of an innate gift.

Do you think that maybe he would process faster if it wasn't a throw together team? What I mean by that, if drafted into the NFL and coached by someone that knows QB's, like for instance, Hue Jackson, does he have the raw talent to get it?

"If a guy like you or I were back there, we would just see one giant blur."

Very true, Vers. You know how some guys see the game in slow motion? Well, when I was a high school gridder, I PLAYED the game in slow motion.

LOL...........

.........but, at least you played, brother.

Your sound like Farmer....has to have quick mind...somewhat true...BUT, if pocket is clean, lots of guys get it done. Like CW lots, only thing I HATED was fumble in SB at the end....he fumbles...not good.

Remember reading about the "new" QB simulator in Tampa??, if Haslam wants to try new things, he needs all our potential QBs to do a simulator test against real NFL Ds and see how they do.....GO Browns!!!!

I sound like Farmer?

Y'all never cease to amaze me.

Lately there has been so much print on this kid and I didn't get a chance to see this weekend Senior Bowl. However, from what I am hearing that there are a lot of mix things about this kid and if he is on the fence then, he isn't worth the risk at 2. Hopefully, the front office can see the things that are needed to make that transition to the NFL like accuracy, anticipation, processing ability (pre and post), can they make throws with defenders in their face, and just good ol football instincts. I'm not one sold on his academic grades or if he plans to go to medical school. I just would like to see if a guy can do what he is drafted to do and that is play football! Ryan Fitzpatrick Ivy league quarterback and whatnot, but give me Big Ben any day of the week who just so happens can do the aformentioned things noted. Although it is early, i like Winston for Tampa Bay. Dude couldn't make good decisions on whether to purchase crab legs or steal them but he has a lot of the skills that are mentioned to go along with intangibles.

I think Wentz has some question marks, just like everyone else in this draft that plays QB. The good news for us is, we have Josh McCown that enjoys the role of mentor, and is just about as good as it gets in terms of being a role model. McCown proved that he belongs in the league as a starter, and us drafting Wentz makes a bit of sense because he could sit behind McCown and not have the immediate pressure of starting. And if Wentz is as smart as we all think he is, then learning might come easy to him. He's got the obvious physical traits, the mental prowess, and after a year in a strength program...I bet his arm will be as lively as ever. I'd be happy with Wentz or Goff. And having the second overall pick in the draft makes me very happy. Since we need a QB so badly, I don't think we trade back...even though it might be tempting. Now, if we do our research and our talent gurus determine that neither Goff nor Wentz is worth the pick...then trading down is the way to go. Easier said than done, but who knows?

What I really want is for Hue to get a guy he thinks he can build on. The guy has been able to do good things with QB's. I'm not going to call him a QB whisperer or anything, but he's good with them.

With Barnage, Pryor and hopefully Gordon, it could be interesting if Hue gets a guy he can trust.

*cough* *cough* Holmgren *cough*

I think we just need to pick the best QB and wish for the best. Only so much coaching you can do. Success on the field is on the player himself.

Don't forget about Lynch.

j/c:

Both CBS Draft Analysts (Rob Rang and Dane Brugler) have the Browns taking Carson after weeks of Goff selections.

Not sure about Rang's history but I really like Dane B.

Wentz may be the "flavor" of the moment, due to his exposure in the Senior Bowl. Goff on the other hand, has been somewhat invisible lately, so may not garner much press until the Combine...

I'm sorry, I do not want us drafting an Andy Dalton or Ryan Tannehill level QB at #2 overall. Wentz is not the type of QB to take the team to the ultimate goal. The delta of him over guys you can get later like Prescott or Brandon Allen does not justify taking him at #2 passing up guys like Treadwell, Bosa, or even Myles Jack or Ramsey in my opinion.

Heck, I'd rather us draft Mike Bercovici in the 7th round than Wentz at #2.

JMO.

Completely agree!!!!

Well, it's early and we're just coming off the CW Senior Bowl hype. There can/will be more changes. Both guys come out w/ their updated mocks weekly.

That is a good point and I agree. It will depend a lot on what Hue thinks and what he wants in his future qb IMO. If he feels a qb like Prescott is not much of a drop off from Wentz or Goff he may go in that direction. Face it, we need help in a lot of areas.

So do about 25 other teams..

There are no "perfect" teams in the league, that have All Pros at every position. Every team has at least a few weak positions..

The difference is that about 6 or 7 teams have THE GUY behind Center.. And that makes up for A LOT of holes on the team..

There are countless ways to "build" a team.

Denver had a solid team, added a HOF QB by luck/timing, and then was able to, due to success, add FAs to their defense to raise its level to elite.

Carolina was "lucky" to make the playoffs last year. Then lost their best (only) WR before the season, but their defense is solid, and their QB level is unheard of.

New England has had the same system for 15 years. Its plug and play to the best possible result. Hell they have a worse O Line than we do by far, but they have Tahm Frihken Brahdy. And the wheels can keep turning.

Arizona, Seattle, hell even Washington.. all got great play from their QB. And made the playoffs, despite lacking in other areas.

------

My overall point is not "draft a QB"

But if you deem a guy, to have the potential, to be THE GUY. You take him, and when he becomes THE GUY, you will surprised how less "noticeable" all the holes on the team are..

j/c

Wentz looks the part but the one thing that worries me is that he didn't seem to lift his team when he played in the Senior Bowl, it was like he was just another guy. I didn't see any fire in him, or his teammates when he was in there.

I wouldn't put TOO MUCH stock in that during an all star game..

Thats like being upset the players arent taking Pro Bowl seriously. (To a different degree)

I don't get the Holmgren reference?

The actual game means almost nothing. It's probably pretty hard to get fired up for a game that means nothing and you just met your teammates a week ago.

He was the "QB Guru" that gave us McCoy, Delhomme, Wallace.. and Brandon fricken Weeden..

You may have said this somewhere else, but I didn't see it. What is it that scares you with Goff? Even moreso than Wentz?

Don't all QBs need time to develop? Are you saying he shouldn't play right away?

Things like this make me think about all the articles I've ever read regarding the whole Tom Brady saga and why he dropped so far in the Draft. He was a scrawny, lanky kid that could barely run.... but, he had everything going on upstairs, had one seriously driven competitive side, was a natural leader and could make all the throws you need to make in the NFL.

If you can find that guy, I think you take him.

I disagree, If your playing a game that you love and trying to show the teams that you belong in the NFL I would think that you would be fired up.

You just have to be careful and think that a guy will become the next Brady just because he is scrawny. LOL

Brady has always had a big arm. He was always a great leader. He was always a great competitor. He was always a pretty good decision maker.

That was exactly my point.
If you have a guy that shows those intangibles, then you should consider ignoring certain physical attributes if they don't meet expectations.