DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum As the Cavs World Turns, Part Deux

Cavs-Bulls is Feb 18th, not tonight. I think the NBA is in All-Star Break mode for the next several days.

That game is next Thursday or Friday. NBA is off because of All Star game.

It seems like they are taking more time off than they used to. Anyone know if they changed the amount of time off recently?

But yeah, Swish...........pretty big game for the Cavs because Chicago beat them last time around. Wonder if Butler will be back?

I kinda like the longer break. Sucks as fans, but it's better for players. Tell guys to spend time with their families and get healed up. Play hard until late April, take another break and then get ready for big boy basketball.

I want the east wrapped up ASAP.

I honestly think at this point, Windhorst just throws out names so that his bosses at ESPN still think he has connections and keep him employed.

I don't think the Cavs should make any trades.

Talent is not the issue w/the Cavs. It's all about how much they are willing to sacrifice and play championship ball.

Tyreke Evans is out for the year by the way.

Also, it is pretty clear Windhorst still has connections within the team. His piece on the Blatt firing was the best one out there.

They should only make a trade if they can consolidate some of their lesser players for one clear upgrade. They have too many guys right now.

Haha my bad guys. I was amped up for tonight for no reason

So.....

Melo for Love.


What say ye? Melo is better than Love offensively and defensively. However, he's 4 years older. Then again, if there's a guy who's game would age well it's Melos.

The rumor is Love to the Celtics, Melo to the Cavs, and other pieces (including Mozgov) to the Knicks.

Man, that makes no sense whatsoever, beyond name value.

We want better ball movement, and that is not one of Anthony's strengths. It's not even in his top 50 or so strengths.

Do they actually want better ball movement though?

Plus, Carmelo and LeBron are friends. Duh.

If this trade happens, Love is going to go to the Celtics and immediately revert back to his old self under Brad Stevens.

I wonder if Olynk would be one of those moving peices out of Boston.. With Love going there and all..

I still don't get why people want the Cavs to make trades????

They have plenty of talent. Talent is not the problem.

Melo plays better defense than Love. As a matter of fact, there's nothing Love does better. Melos age is the biggest concern.

Melo does not have the range that Love has. Melo is a poor defender. Melo is a selfish player.

Melo is not a poor defender. What do you mean he doesn't have the same range....? Also is he selfish, or forced to score because the 2nd best offensive player he's ever been with was a washed up AI and Amare.


Carmelo has a trade kick starting next summer that will give him a 8-9 million dollar bonus if he gets moved. This may be why the Knicks want to move him now.

I hate mentalities like this. You should ALWAYS be trying to improve. If the Cavs don't win the title you've already sold yourself on the mindset that it's probably going to be Lebrons fault if we don't win it all instead of maybe the Cavs just aren't good enough.

Two things:

1. You and I disagree about Melo. Big time.

2. You may hate my mentality, but I hate the mentality that says firing coaches and making outlandish trades are good ideas.

Man i pray this trade for Melo doesn't happen..that would do two things, weaken us on the boards and offensive flow and instantly make Boston a threat, the problem with Love in cleveland is 100% coaching. He's proven he can outscore/rebound anyone in the nba in the right situation. I don't think we need a blockbuster type trade, get a 3 and D and maybe add a guy like Jon Henson. I like watching Melo, but he's always been the problem at the places he is because he relies almost soley on Iso ball.

we don't agree on much..lol, but I agree here, I don't think coaching was ever the issue other than rotation problems and how to use love, but thats something you work on and learn, Lue hasn't done any better than blatt. But I also agree a blockbuster trade for another ball dominate player and trying to figure it out in time for playoffs, while taking away 2 big pieces doesn't make any sense to me. Small tweaks to shore up the bench i'm fine with.

I'll ask the question. Is this team TALENTED enough to beat Golden State as currently constructed? Let's say they start "playing team basketball" how you want them to. Are they talented enough to beat Golden State?


I honestly say no.


There needs to be changes made. You can say and buy into the belief that it's a Lebron thing. I see it as a not good enough thing.

I gotta agree with ya.

Changes are good if they add, this trade would subtract, you trade our best rebounder and only rim protection for another guy that doesn't move the ball. I don't see how that works

I wouldn't want to move Moz. Unless you're implying Love is a rim protector...?

The rumor is that Love will be in Boston and Moz in NY.

I do think the team has enough talent to win the championship. I think the difference between teams like GS and SA vs teams like the Cavs is how well they move the ball. It's a simple answer, but it has many implications.

With this group, it's always been about what style of ball they wanna play. Do they wanna continue to play ISO and/or have LeBron and Kyrie dominating the ball while other guys stand around and watch, or do they wanna use ball movement to get open shots and tire the other team out......like GS and SA do?

Bringing in Melo would only make this team worse.

With all due respect, have you watched Golden State and more specifically Steph Curry play? There's a reason they're challenging MJ Bulls record. Playing team ball can only do so much. You need the talent to compete as well. The Cavs as it stands are not talented enough to beat Golden State.

The Spurs are the golden standard for team ball and they got raked through the coals by 30+ against Golden State.

Yes, I have.

Talent can only take you so far.....playing team ball w/talent is what separates the great from the good.

I say yes.

As the teams are constructed and performing right now, the Cavs would probably be a moderate underdog in a series vs the Warriors (or maybe a heavy underdog?)-- either way, the Cavs could realistically win a championship with no changes. Vegas has the Cavs at 3/1, second best in the NBA, although they have a huge advantage in that regard from playing in the East

Talent wise if the chemistry/culture on this team was better, they might only be small underdogs vs Golden State.

Is that good enough? Maybe instead of asking if this team is as good as Golden State/talented enough to beat them/whatever, is to ask if any trades can be made that improves the Cavs chances? Keeping in mind that immediate upgrades to an extent have to be balanced with the team's future as well. Love and Irving are both signed long term and LeBron de facto is as well. This team can be a strong contender for at least a few years.

I posted recently that San Antonio and Golden State this year were #1 and #2 in margin of victory in NBA history. It is what it is. You can't just decide you're going to make a team better than that. It just doesn't work that way lol. Also keep in mind that upsets and injuries do happen-- it's not a given that the Cavs will be playing a full-strength, clicking-on-cylinders Warriors team come the finals. There's probably a 50/50 shot that somebody beats the Warriors in a 7 game series this season.

I don't want anything to do with these Love for Howard or Love for 'Melo deals. I wish we could go back in time and build the team differently possibly with Wiggins and that warchest of young players/picks/assets that was mostly squandered but it is what it is. Love is a good player, he's signed long term, and he's too valuable to ship off in a panicked trade to try to catch up with Golden State.

I might be overstating what the Cavs chance of beating the Warriors is but consider this: A hallmark of Lebron's teams, for better or for worse, is that they really don't try very hard in the regular season. I'm not saying this is a good thing, it can be very frustrating to watch, but going back to his days in Miami and now, Lebron's teams (led by Lebron himself) always step it up in the post-season. The Cavs series last year with Love and Irving would have probably looked much different. Of course the Warriors have stepped it up a notch themselves, so it's hard to say. I don't think the Cavs are in such a bad spot right now though.

So some of you guys are content with being the Bills of the 90's, because that's what is going to happen when we just "wait it out" unless we upgrade the talent level. You saw how great "waiting it out" has been for Chicago.


As it stands now, it doesn't matter how well things click for this team and how well they buy in, Golden States ceiling is much higher. You need elite game changers to have a chance. It's why people think OKC has the best chance. A guy like Howard can have the same impact on a game as a Lebron.

I disagree.

This team had no Kevin Love and no Kyrie Irving in the Finals last year. They had Delly forced into playing more minutes than he had played all year long. They had Shawn Marion at the end. Andy was out.

They took Golden State to the limit, until their pieces just wore out.

This team is more talented and deeper than last year's team. The only real downgrade is the fact that Moz is not playing as well as he did last year.

The talent is not the problem. Sure, I'd love to add one more shooter, but this team is talented enough to beat anyone. They can't play hero ball though, doing as someone says, "pounding nails". They have to move the ball, and when they do, they can beat anyone.

You're also forgetting the massive growth of Draymond Green and Steph Curry.

Because it's Cleveland. If we aren't blowing up rosters and pissing in the team chemistry pool, then we ain't living.

I don't think trading Love for Howard upgrades this team. Howard has shown himself to be a whiny baby and a team destroyer of the worst kind. He did it in Orlando and L.A. and I have a suspicion that there is more going on in Houston than people realize. Why else did Kevin McHale get fired early in the season? He is a darn good coach who took James Harden and a bunch of guys (Howard was injured much of the year) to the #2 seed in the west last year. They made it to the conference finals, knocking off the more talented Clippers in the process. Yet he got canned, the G.M. doesn't want to give Howard a max deal and he very well might walk from whatever team he's on at the end of the season.

Same here. Sure, GS has improved. I don't think they've improved to the point they can beat us in 7 with all of our players healthy. Where they have the advantage right now is their star players have all been playing together for several seasons developing chemistry. If we keep monkeying with the roster, we'll never catch up to where they're atThe Cav's ball movement has been improving in spurts and the pace has picked up since Lue took over...that should get better as time goes on.

I dont know whats better.. Dunking between your legs from the Free Throw Line..

Or that Orlando's mascot is named "Stuff" The Magic Dragon.

That was the best dunk contest I've seen since Vince Carter back in 2000. Aaron Gordon and Lavine are super athletic freaks, but they still shocked me.

I agree. Best finals in a long time, maybe ever. This one blew my mind away:

Click on this for a 360 degree vid of the dunk. Un-stinking-real!!!!

http://www.sbnation.com/lookit/2016/2/14...r-in-360-replay