DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2016 NFL Season 2016 NFL Draft Carson Wentz

I'm not sure where you're getting one of the worst teams in the NFL, Vers. The Vikings D is the real deal, and AP makes any QB's job at least somewhat easier. I don't think the difference in offensive talent is really that big between Minni and Oakland. I'd give Oakland the edge at WR, but I'd give Minni RB and TE and the rest is a push. I'll give you the Vikes should have won that playoff game, but don't know how much credit for that should go to Bridgewater. He definitely wasn't the reason they lost, but the D should get a lot of credit for playing pretty lights out and keeping it close.

Oakland's D is a mess outside of Mack, Green Bay was in a funk all year, the Lions are a mess, Jay Cutler is Jay Cutler and didn't have Alshon to bail him out most of the season. Someone had to win the division (not sure why I included OAK.)

It's hard for me to compare the QBs because the teams they are on are vastly different. I can see arguments for each one being considered the best.

It would be hard for any QB to succeed behind that Vikings offensive line. With that said, I think that Derek Carr would make the Vikings a better team than they currently are.

I would take Bridgewater over Bortles though. That dude is a turnover machine.

Wasn't there another QB in this discussion during the draft? Whatever happened to him?

I got it because the Vikings won 5 games the year before they drafted Teddy.

The Raiders receivers are way better than the Vikings.

The Raiders OL is very good while the Vikings is perhaps the worst in football at pass blocking.

cfrs: Jimmy G was the other guy. He's stuck behind Brady in NE.

No. The other one. The short one who likes to party.

Oh........I can't remember his name.

Kim Jong Il?

That's the one!

Mayock calls Wentz best QB in the draft



I've always respected Mike's opinion on draft prospects.

I would be thrilled if a team traded up to 1 to take Wentz.

'Long as it ain't us.

He also said that Goff is much more polished, but Wentz has more upside.

I'm still on the Goff train.

Lynch ... chuga, chuga ... woo woo!!!

Johnny Manziel train:

...cfr...now that is funny..

Carson Wentz Article on OptimumScouting

Found this article while looking through my draft-centric bookmarks. I like his completion percentage on out-breaking routes. I was somewhat surprised at the number of snaps he took from under center. It was lower than I expected from a "pro-style" offense. Anyways, I thought it was an interesting read.

Decent read.

We've got 2 scenarios here.

Wentz and the Div II thing.
Goff and his slim frame.

Huey and Sanders need to work both of these guys hard and take the one they like best to work with.

Then comes the decision as to when to cut the guy loose and start rolling with him.

Two things will help the chosen one.

Get Gordon back on the field and sign Jones. Weapons.
Get this damn running game going. Even if it requires a different back and some OL manuevering.

The Browns have a third option.

Don't take any of the bum quarterbacks in this draft and instead draft a player that will impact games.

Agreed. We could probably take a QB later in the draft that really isn't a drop off in talent from the alleged top 3.

Thoughts to ponder:

When do you fix the hole in the dike?

When do you move forward: next year?

Have we become so enchanted searching for the holy grail we now seek only greatness at the QB position?

Have we fans overstated the QB position?

Has Denver removed this once proclaimed prophecy QB is a must have in order to win?

The Browns need to fix the qb position, bugs. I just don't see them fixing it w/any of the guys they would take w/the second overall pick.

They would then have to give those guys 3 years or so to prove himself, which would mean that they would be even further removed from fixing the quarterback position.

If I thought there was a guy who was "the guy," I would certainly be a proponent of drafting him at number 2.

I think we as Browns fans probably overstate the QB position, but that's pretty understandable considering the football we have watched for a decade and a half. Quarterback is still the most important position on the field. Sometimes big numbers and high scores don't always tell the story either. Decision making and consistency get undersold quite a bit by all fans.

I'm not dead set on drafting a QB at 2. I just want the pick to be done right. I think the Browns would love to fall in love with one of these quarterbacks and be done with it at 2. To find a guy who fits every trait they are looking for and will be ready to start in training camp, preseason, and September. No stupid quarterback competitions or split reps or stupid coachspeak and mediaspeak about how Josh McCown could be the guy. It would be beneficial to the team to just give Hue and a rookie QB a year to fit in, and work things out.

It's so hard to tell with these college QB's, but how did every school in d1 miss out on Wentz? 6'6" and well over 230? damn

I can't argue against. I agree. My thinking is what if the gurus are correct. Without a QB you can't win. I think hogwash, but I hate being bullheaded to the point I don't see.

Teams proved having adequate talent around a QB can win. Teams have not proved they can survive putting just anyone behind the center. It is a chain of command that is unavoidable.

Staring at the alleged three best is it a must taking one? Here lies the state of the franchise.

My only argument against this thinking is what if Browns pass on the next top DL getting an average QB. As we seen for years, average QB simply kills a franchise. Browns already have an average QB on roster.

Then it would be more about this team failing (once again) to evaluate talent.

The thinking is that if you like a quarterback and think he can be a franchise guy, you take him over another high prospect at another position.

You are thinking more in hindsight. Believe me, the Browns won't knowingly take a guy at 2 who they see as average. If they don't see Goff or Wentz or Lynch or anyone else as a franchise guy, they won't just take one to take one. Other than Brandon Weeden, the Browns took a guy who they thought would be a franchise guy. Weeden was a result of Holmgren thinking he could cut corners.

As I said in another topic, I wanna give these guys a chance, but if I'm being totally honest, it scares me that their first pick as Browns executives is really really tough. Second pick, 99% chance of having any QB you want, and a class that seems very hard to evaluate. There is no clear cut guy like Newton or Luck or a Manning brother. That's not to say that any of these guys can't turn into one of those, it's just tougher. We know Hue is great with QB's that are brought to him, but can he judge them with only college film and some combine reps, and maybe a private workout? The Browns are probably going to lean on him with this pick.

If we are going QB at two then it should be Wentz.

I think you mean to say a rational deduction instead of logical one.

I dont know if any of these guys are worth the #2 overall but its a good debate as to how these guys will be ranked. I am not opposed to taking a QB at 2 but I really want to see all 3 at the combines. BTW I really do respect these guys for throwing at the combines.

I like Lynch the best but I am not sold on anyone. Hue made Flacco work. Hue made Dalton into a different QB. Its all about who he beleives he can make into your franchise QB and unless you believe he can be your franchise QB you dont take him at 2. it really is that simple.

I just want us to have a starter from the high draft picks...an impact player..Richardson, Weeden, Mingo, Manziel, Shelton, Erving,Gilbert...not a single WINNER...I trust Hue, he will pick a guy with character, who wants it...NOT a "brand" loser.....GO Browns!!!!

jc

Haven't read this thread or anything on this board lately. Just saw two of his games and wanted to share my take. One game from 2014 at Iowa St and the Jax St game this past season. Here's what I saw:

Pros:

- the arm, touch and accuracy are already all well above average
- makes very good decisions. Is not too protective and not too risky with the ball. Good balance.
- football smart. Knowns down and distance.
- very competitive and fearless. Natural leader
- very athletic, can run and isn't afraid of hits
- uncanny pocket presence, keeps eyes downfield, feels pressure and steps up

Cons:

None. I'm serious. This guy has it ALL.

I didn't expect much. All I read is that there's no franchise QB available. This guy is 1-1 material and the only question for the Browns should be if they have to trade up to get him or stay at 2 and select him.

Not because I necessarily agree with your take, because I know crap about evaluating talent, but keep posting. We could use your perspective in the mix.

This line of thought that Hue is the QB Whisperer is being repeated more and more often.

I am NOT knocking him, but please......Flacco has talent and he was good after Hue. Dalton had success under Gruden. He is gaining experience and qbs should naturally progress.

I never read any of the QB Whisperer stuff before the Browns hired him.

I think it's just more hopeful rhetoric by a fan base that needs hope.

I find it a bit odd that people LOVE Wentz, but don't even like Osweiler.

Check them both out.

Thanks double D. I'll probably post a little more now that it's draft time, but my apathy hit rock bottom during this season. This roster is a mess and it will take years to undo whatHaslam and Farmer assembled.

Wentz was the first I looked at and I'm a little hooked already. Not sure what the rest on here thinks about him, but I see a better QB than Bortles and Bridgewater (and yes, even Weeden, lol). In a way, he's the perfect mix of both and the closest thing to pre-draft Roethlisberger that I've seen on tape the past few years. How can you watch his tape and NOT see a 1st round talent?

Don't have a strong opinion on Osweiler either way, but Wentz is a much better athlete and has a better arm. Osweiler's throws some ugly passes, maybe he learned it from Peyton

Then there's the pocket presence. This is where many good college QBs fail to take their game to the NFL. Wentz clearly has IT there. Great mix of poise, pocket feel, escapability and quick arm that is almost impossible to teach. And that's despite almost never taking his eyes from downfield. This is the kind of mix that the elite QBs in the NFL have. Sure, he has some inaccurate throws in there and some shots he shouldn't take, but he flashes enough arm strength and accuracy to improve consistency and give him a very high ceiling. His floor is high too, thanks to his pocket presence and athleticism. He's a 1-1 QB

I may jump on it soon. I'm no evaluator but I'm liking him more and more.

Hopefully we find our QB, whether it's him or someone else.