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I agree.. I don't think anybody has Braxton Miller with a first round draft grade. I'm not against the guy but let's not get carried away talking about taking him at 32.. I don't think he's in the top 5 of available WRs...


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Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
I agree.. I don't think anybody has Braxton Miller with a first round draft grade. I'm not against the guy but let's not get carried away talking about taking him at 32.. I don't think he's in the top 5 of available WRs...


I don't think anyone is. But I think you'll see him shoot up draft boards over the next few months. I wouldn't be surprised if he's a mid 2nd rounder to an early 3rd round pick in the draft.

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I liked what Mayock and Charles Davis had to say about him. A team looking for a complementary piece/wrinkle to a good offense could use a late 2nd on him. But we need a primary weapon. We also need a QB and at least one pass rusher. I can't see a realistic scenario where I'm happy about us using a top 60 pick on Miller. JMO.

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Originally Posted By: CHSDawg
Originally Posted By: DCDAWGFAN
I agree.. I don't think anybody has Braxton Miller with a first round draft grade. I'm not against the guy but let's not get carried away talking about taking him at 32.. I don't think he's in the top 5 of available WRs...


I don't think anyone is. But I think you'll see him shoot up draft boards over the next few months. I wouldn't be surprised if he's a mid 2nd rounder to an early 3rd round pick in the draft.

That wouldn't surprise me either.. and if we want to talk about taking him in the 3rd or moving up in to the bottom half of the second, then I'd consider it..


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Originally Posted By: clevesteve
I liked what Mayock and Charles Davis had to say about him. A team looking for a complementary piece/wrinkle to a good offense could use a late 2nd on him. But we need a primary weapon. We also need a QB and at least one pass rusher. I can't see a realistic scenario where I'm happy about us using a top 60 pick on Miller. JMO.


I can see him in the top 60, but not a lot higher.

The gimmicks are not a reason to draft him, but the size/speed is. His route running is raw but if it was better, he'd be drafted higher.

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I wonder how durable he will be in the NFL?

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
I wonder how durable he will be in the NFL?


6' 1" 204. Decent in size. He's had the shoulder injury, but no knee injuries or concussions, which are the ones you worry about with WR's.

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Well, as most OSU fans can tell you, he got dinged up a lot when he was playing qb.

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
Well, as most OSU fans can tell you, he got dinged up a lot when he was playing qb.


He went down with a cramp earlier today and it reminded me of every OSU game ever. He's like a fine ferrari.

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Yeah.........I agree w/that.

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That's not an injury history, that is more of the need to take his skirt off and put on his big boy pants.

I didn't even think about Barry Foster syndrome, but you both have a point.

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Quote:
NFL Draft: Five Studs (and duds) after week of Senior Bowl 2016 practices


They say first impressions are the most important ones. But with this week's Senior Bowl the last time scouts will see players in pads and helmets before the draft, the final impressions made in Mobile can be critical.

While it seems counter-intuitive, the practices are considered much more valuable to scouts than the all-star game, itself. That's because the Senior Bowl, like any other all-star game, is designed with the fans, rather than scouts, in mind. There were hundreds of NFL personnel in Mobile throughout the week of practice but only a fraction of them remain for the game.

The players who showed talent and poise in responding to that pressure will inspire some of the more interesting debates as scouts dive into draft meetings over the next few weeks.

Unfortunately, the players who failed to answer key questions in Mobile have opened their stock up for debate, as well.

Here are the five studs so far of the 2016 Senior Bowl:

1. Carson Wentz, QB, North Dakota State: No player came to the Senior Bowl with a brighter spotlight than Wentz, who needed to answer concerns about his level of competition after facing just one FBS opponent over his career. Physically speaking, the 6-foot-5, 233-pound Wentz quickly and consistently distanced himself from the other quarterbacks competing this week in Mobile, showing a combination of velocity, accuracy and functional athleticism to justify all of the attention he's received. Where Wentz really helped himself, however, was with the intangibles he showed, including the leadership to win over his new teammates and impress teams in interviews, as well.



2. Noah Spence, DE/OLB, Eastern Kentucky: The value of the quarterback position pushes Wentz atop this list but Spence was the most dynamic player competing this week at the Senior Bowl. Whether lining up as a traditional hand-in-the-dirt defensive end or out of the two-point stance, the 6-foot-3, 254 pound Spence was unstoppable, at times, exploding upfield and around tackles to harass the South Team's quarterbacks. The former five-star recruit and Ohio State standout comes with a checkered past and must continue the positive momentum he's created this year all the way to April 28. If he does so, it is hard to imagine too many club's passing on the draft's most explosive pass rusher.

3. Sheldon Rankins, DT, Louisville: For as disruptive as Spence was on the perimeter, Rankins was very nearly as effective from the inside -- though the fact that he suffered a sprained knee on Thursday which will sideline him for Saturday's game pushes him down a peg. The 6-2, 304-pounder was the proverbial bowling ball of butcher knives, slicing through would-be blockers with his initial burst, strength and coordinated hand play to disrupt runs and passes, alike.

4. Braxton Miller, WR, Ohio State: The Senior Bowl has a rich history of producing early round wide receivers but few of them -- and certainly none of this year's class -- can match Miller's remarkable body control. The 6-1, 204-pound Miller is simply a different level of athlete than the other receivers attending this year's Senior Bowl, showing great quickness, balance and reaction time to generate separation and make eye-popping receptions appear routine. Just one year removed from playing quarterback, Miller remains raw and he has struggled with durability in the past but no player drew more wows from the crowd this week.

5. Vernon Butler, DT, Louisiana Tech: Despite measuring in two inches taller and 21 pounds heavier than Rankins, the 6-4, 325-pound Butler proved very nearly as disruptive, beating would-be blockers with his initial quickness and a textbook swim move. Naturally large with a well-distributed frame and strength to complement his athleticism, Butler will draw interest from 4-3 and 3-4 teams alike and may just prove this year's "surprise" first round pick.

Here are five duds so far of the 2016 Senior Bowl:

Given the consistency in games required to earn an invitation to the Senior Bowl (or any other all-star game), players rarely actually harm their stock over the course of a few practices. That said, these players failed to answer some key questions so far this week, making it all the more important that they respond during the game, itself, at the Combine or during Pro Day workouts.

1. The rest of the quarterbacks: The credit goes to Wentz for distancing himself from the pack but scouts had hoped that someone would step up among the other seven quarterbacks in Mobile as the clear second-best player at the position. Michigan State's Connor Cook could have been that player but he declined to participate, according to Senior Bowl director Phil Savage. Southern Cal's Cody Kessler, Mississippi State's Dak Prescott and Alabama's Jake Coker are the bigger names but I thought Arkansas' Brandon Allen was the steadiest.



2. Shawn Oakman, DE, Baylor: There could be a picture of Oakman in the football dictionary under the old scouting cliche, "Looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane." There isn't a more imposing player in this draft (which is why I hope Mr. Oakman never reads this article) but the 6-7, 269-pounder may have a higher upside in professional wrestling or body building than football as he shows limited awareness and use of leverage, negating some of his undeniable power and athleticism.

3. Kenyan Drake, RB, Alabama: An explosive athlete relegated to backup duty throughout much of his career with the Crimson Tide, Drake was viewed by some as a potential breakout candidate this week. While he possesses the 6-1, 210-pounder has the agility and acceleration to break big plays as a runner, receiver and returner, Drake had more than his share of hiccups throughout the week of practice, dropping passes and getting blown up by linebackers during pass-blocking drills.

4. Jordan Payton, WR, UCLA: Though they share similar frames, the 6-1, 216-pound Payton proved a polar opposite of Drake, catching the ball well and showing effort as a blocker but simply lacking the juice to scare defenders. Payton struggled to generate much separation from the North's cornerbacks, in part because he lacks ideal speed. He and his trainers will surely work hard in the coming weeks to fare better during the 40-yard dash testing in Indianapolis and at UCLA's Pro Day.

5. John Theus, OT, Georgia: Starting four years in the SEC theoretically prepared Theus for the speed and power he'd face this week at the Senior Bowl but his athletic limitations were exposed a bit this week, making it likely that he'll need to switch back to right tackle in the NFL. The nearly 6-7, 317-pound Theus simply doesn't have ideal fluidity to handle speed rushers and he can get walked into the backfield by bull rushers when he allows his pad level to rise.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/nfl-d...eek-of-practice


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Its a real testimony to his over-the-top athleticism that Braxton Miller will be drafted higher as a WR than he would have as a QB, even if he had never injured his shoulder - and he was a good college QB. Just not a great pro prospect for that position, IMO. As much as I think he deserves success and wish him well, I do have some doubts whether Miller has the requisite toughness to be a professional WR, where you earn your money going over the dangerous middle of the field.

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I have Time Warner cable, so no NFLN. I'd appreciate any "what I saw" type commentary from the Senior Bowl that anyone wants to post.

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You may be able to watch online with the nfl network app. i think it on there live last year.

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I have it on but I'm doing other stuff so I haven't had time to devote my full attention to it, but I am recording it and will probably watch it this evening and I will try to post what I see. At half South is up 17 to 3.


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Thanks 66 - I heard a guy on the radio say that the South's starting defense was mostly SEC guys and that few, if any, would get past the 3rd round in the 2016 draft. I figured it would be a tough test for Wentz, whose toughest competition to date was from much weaker programs. I hope he's as good as advertised.

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Braxton is looking pretty good at everything but catching the ball... From what little I've seen.

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LOL........that reminds me of the comment about Vick when he was a senior. It was something like he's a good qb except for his passing.

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Well I just finished watching the game as I DVRed it. The South won 27-16 but it would have been closer except that for this game they treated the last 2 minutes of every quarter as a 2 minute drill and at the start of the next quarter the other team got the ball and the North lost a scoring opportunity because of it at the end of the 3rd quarter. The South had 1 huge advantage as the game requires that teams play a 4-3 defense with no blitzing and all of the North defensive linemen are DT or 3-4 DE types so they had no real pass rushers and most of their LBers were inside backers so they lacked edge speed. Here is my player takes:

North QBs

Carson Wentz - he certainly looks the part as he has good size and a strong arm. He went 6 out of 10 for 50 yards but 2 of his passes were dropped (1 by Braxton Miller and 1 by WR Chris Moore, Cincinnati). He didn't lead the team to any points though and he fumbled the ball on a sack. If he shows that he can read defenses and be a leader then he will likely be the first QB taken in the draft.

Kevin Hogan - led the North squad to their only 1st half points, a FG. He went 3 out of 4 for 41 yards. He looked like he could be a mid round pick worth developing.

Cody Kessler - led the North to a 3rd quarter TD that he ran in from the 1 yard line. He was only 4 out of 10 for 45 yards but he had 2 or 3 drops. He has the moxie but he is on the small side and lacks an arm.

Jeff Driskel - went 8 out of 9 for 108 yards and a TD. Did't get to see how he played as the DVR cut off the last 3 minutes of the game.

South QBs

Jake Coker - 3 out of 8 for 23 yards. Led the team to 10 points but didn't do much as it was the running game that got the TD and and the South got the ball from a punt in good field position for the FG and actually last 3 yards on the drive. Looks like backup material at best.

Dak Prescott - 7 out of 10 for 61 yards and a TD. Looked good throwing the ball and running it but he needs work on looking off defenders as he stared down his receiver a few times and almost had 1 passed picked off in the end zone. Won the Outstanding player of the game.

Brandon Allen - 7 out of 10 for 106 yards and lead the team to a FG and another drive that the FG attempt was blocked. Was impressed with Allen as his throws were accurate and he knew right where to go with the ball. Might be a mid to late round pick that could be developed.

Jacoby Brisset - 5 out of 6 for 50 yards and lead the team to a TD. looked average.

Some other players

South RB - Aaron Green - Ran the ball well and put the moves on to score the South's first TD. Probably not a feature back but still a solid player.

South RB - Kenyan Drake - Looked like a very good 3rd down back as he is a solid runner but also a very good pass catcher.

North WR - Braxton Miller - dropped one pass from Wentz on a wide open WR screen and had another pass where Miller and Wentz weren't on the same page as Wentz threw the pass to the outside and Miller turned in. Still caught 2 passes for 8 yards and ran for 5 on reverse he also did pretty good on a KR.

South WR - Jay Lee - He's a bigger WR (6'3") and looked good catching the ball. 4 for 49 yds.

South DL - Shawn Oakman - he was the South's Most Outstanding player of the game with 2 sacks although on 1 the OT did his job and ran Oakman around the back of the pocket but the QB got pressure up the middle and had to turn his back to the LOS to escape and ran right into Oakman. Oakman looks like a situational pass rusher to me as he is so tall that he doesn't get low enough and loses leverage plus he lacks strength in his lower body as has really skinny legs. Charles Davis even made the comment that Oakman has the smallest ankles he has ever seen on a guy that big.

North LB - Tyler Matakevich - he is small for an ILB and he might not be the fastest LBer but all he does is make plays.

South DE - Noah Spence - had 1 sack and numerous pressures. Gave LT Jason Spriggs fits.

South DT - Jarran Reed - Solid stopping the run and even hustled down field to make a tackle.


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I was disappointed that they hardly had the QBs play under center at all. It's understandable because the d-line was dominant, but didn't get to see the QBs drops. Unfortunately, we did get to see plenty of drops from everyone else. Wentz looked better than his numbers indicate, but not spectacular.

I want to watch more film of Sean Davis the DB from Maryland. He seems to fit the "little" guys who can hit that Horton likes.

Darian Thompson the safety from Boise was always around the ball and flashed several times

Spence looked almost unstoppable at times and is probably the best 3-4 OLB candidate.

Adolphus Washington looked good getting penetration. Jarran Reed looked good against the run and has a nice motor. Sheldon Day looked solid all around.

Vernon Butler was a monster at DT.

Matakevich was always around the ball, but got beat to the edge at times.

I want to watch more film of Forrest, the ILB from Kentucky.

Prescott had a good series, but got bailed out by a dropped INT.

The receivers were all pretty underwhelming.


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Thanks 66


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Nice report.

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Originally Posted By: Dave
I have Time Warner cable, so no NFLN. I'd appreciate any "what I saw" type commentary from the Senior Bowl that anyone wants to post.


TWC has NFL network. It's on channels 346 and 1346 for HD for northeast Ohio residents.

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I like that S Sean Davis from Maryland, Loved the tackle he made on Vannett.

On Matakevich, he looks like an ILB but he played most of the game at OLB due to the way the roster was set up, but man was he always around the ball.

One thing that concerns me about Wentz is that even though he had a solid game he didn't seem to fire his team up. I didn't see any passion.

One person I was hoping to see was LB Reggie Ragland, I don't know if he was hurt or what but I don't recall even seeing him in the game.


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Amazing comment was ::: there are like 10 first round defensive Defensive Lineman on someones board !

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
LOL........that reminds me of the comment about Vick when he was a senior. It was something like he's a good qb except for his passing.


Yeah. Made me think of when I would defend Greg Little. "He can't catch it, but if he does, he's ripping at least 7 yards after catch." Pretty funny comments laugh Glad you appreciated the humor.

Braxton isn't like Greg at all though. Greg would never catch with his hands though, Braxton does. His drops/misses were just him and the QB being on the wrong page, for the most part.

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Yeah...........I am not down on Brax, just thought it was a funny comment.

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The Dallas Cowboys employed an unorthodox method toward coaching talent last month at the Reese’s Senior Bowl.

No playbooks.

Yes, there is a joke in there about maybe this being the reason for the 2015 Cowboys finishing with a 4-12 record. But this is no laughing matter when it comes to Dallas’ scouting evaluation of the players on the Senior Bowl’s North squad in Mobile, Ala.

Stanford inside linebacker Blake Martinez told co-host Phil Savage and me Monday on SiriusXM NFL Radio that Dallas coach Jason Garrett and his staff handed players blank notebooks at the beginning of a full week of Senior Bowl practices and meetings.

“Their whole evaluation for us was, ‘How well can this guy take notes?’” Martinez said. “They didn’t give us a playbook. They basically explained it on the board. They expected us to write down good enough notes to go back to our rooms, study, and have the diligence to step on the field the next day and perform at the high level they wanted.”

This was no problem for Martinez, who said he filled a notebook throughout his standout college career.

“I have it with me still because I pride myself on having it,” said Martinez, who is projected as a mid-round pick heading into this week’s NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis. “To learn what I was doing is actually helping me out in the long run is pretty cool to see.”

Savage, who is the Senior Bowl’s executive director, said franchises coaching in the college All-Star game traditionally provide “some semblance of playbook.” Martinez said some of his peers struggled in adjusting to a technique that may help the Cowboys better determine the learning aptitude of draft prospects.

“You could see the facial expressions when we were in the meetings and (the Cowboys coaches) said, ‘We’re not giving you playbooks. Take some notes,’” Martinez said. “It was like, ‘Oh … I’ve never done that before.’

“I feel like it was one of those things where a lot of guys maybe at the beginning struggled but as the week went on they learned or looked at other guys to see how it’s done and what they needed to do. That kind of showed a type of player, a professional player, from that standpoint -- finding a way to get that done whether it’s a weakness or strength.”

Among the top prospects on the North squad the Cowboys coached at the Senior Bowl were North Dakota State quarterback Carson Wentz, Ohio State wide receiver Braxton Miller, Indiana tackle Jason Spriggs and Louisiana Tech running back Kenneth Dixon. Dallas holds the No. 4 overall pick in this year’s draft.


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I think this is a quite normal practice nowadays.

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Learn something every day. Notes of course. Blank playbook and continue on your own with the plays concepts, news to me. I like it as long as it is put in perspective and doesn't make all the Stanford, Michigan, Notre Dame, Duke, etc. players have a jump on others getting drafted.

I like it better than the Wonderlick though.

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I don't mind it as a test of football IQ, but I'm not sure if this was the right setting. Did it put the North team at a competitive disadvantage? I'm not sure how big the (non) playbook was, but for a one week venture seems like there could be a lot of wasted time.


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Originally Posted By: GrimmBrown
Did it put the North team at a competitive disadvantage?


During the game? Who cares.

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The north teams are usually at a competive disadvantage.;)


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You said the same thing during the Civil War. How did that turn out for ya?

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Oh come on vers he was only a young teenager then.


The only reason people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
You said the same thing during the Civil War. How did that turn out for ya?



LOL....OK....For the record, I wasn't alive during the war between the states. That didn't happen until Teddy charged up San Jaun Hill maybe 30 years later. It really wasn't a Civil War. The South never sought to overthrow the North. Lee could have easily taken D.C. inside 6 months if that was the goal. The South simply wanted to go another direction.

But to stay on topic, you did notice the wink, no? These days, they put north player on the south team anf the other way in a effort to balance the teams


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Don't go Daman on me, bro. I knew you were kidding/agitating. I was joking, man. grin

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I know.


If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.

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Shoot...........you, me and Nor are all old farts.

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