DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Allowing school assignments to be turned in late

I know that this has been discussed in other threads over the years, I particularly remember DC talking about his own son and turning assignments in late and how the school was OK with it.

My son is in 7th grade and does really well - he gets a 3.75-4.0 GPA each grading period and is enrolled in 3 advanced classes (math, language arts, and social studies). School has been very easy for him thus far but he turns many, many assignments in late and still gets full credit when he eventually does - this drives me insane! Allowing kids this age to get into the habit of "it's OK to turn things in late" scares me to death about how deadlines will be perceived once he hits the real world.

What are some of my DT brethren's thoughts on this? I know we have some teachers on here, as well as some younger folks who likely went through school with this type of leniency. I know when I went to school if a deadline was missed at the very least there were points taken off, at the most a zero was received.

My personal thoughts are that a day or two late should have some sort of penalty associated, not necessarily a zero. When something is a week or two late (which he has done) no credit should be given. My son's attitude of "I'll get it done eventually and still get full credit" is very disturbing to me - I'm almost to the point of punishing him myself, but my ex won't get on board with that yet.

I've had the same problem with my son with these late assignments. He has no respect for deadlines, and it's now biting him in the arse his senior year. He blew some assignments off until the last minute and his GPA dropped enough to end up costing us more for his college next year. In hindsight, I should have been all over him to start early and complete assignments and projects on time. I didn't show much concern because he's in the gifted program and his GPA was 4+ until these last 2 years. I really am concerned about him going off to school next year and having the discipline to meet due dates without mom and dad pushing the issue.

If they're given a deadline for a report or project and they fail to met it they should fail it. Teaching that procrastination is okay is a failure of leadership.

My policy is 10% off for each day that the assignment is late. I rarely receive assignments that are more than a day or two late.

That is fair - I like that policy. What grade do you teach?

That is where my concerns lay as well. He is still young, and I had a talk with him today about how I was going to speak with his mom again about us disciplining him if the school won't. Your son sounds a lot like mine.

Not sure I agree with total failure, though that is what I would have gotten when I was in school. That fact ensured that I got everything done on time though. If that was the case, I certainly would have no problem with it, but I do like what PA said he does.

I didn't do very good in school, mostly because I didn't try that hard and I hated it. I did, however, make sure everything was always turned in on time as it was the easiest way to ensure at least a mediocre grade. Meeting deadlines is a part of a good work ethic IMO and is a very important, if not the most important, part of school.

wouldn't that depend on the reason for being late?

That's where my problem lies...he achieved the goals of high GPA and high standardized test scores, but it came easy to him and he didn't develop the work ethic needed for success.

I regret not putting the hammer down more, but how do you tell an academic all-leaguer in a division one football program he's not doing enough? He's a good kid, active in the church and community, wants to major in secondary education and I should count my blessings....but I'm now certain that I should have been more strict with the procrastination habits.

The standard at my school when I was younger was, for each day late, you lost a letter grade. I think that's usually pretty reasonable. Having no penalty associated with turning things late just reinforces bad habits.

One time I turned in a college paper a couple days late, the professor looked at me and said 'I don't accept late papers. Zero'.

I missed that class because I had gotten a flat tire due to a nail in the road, I showed him the paperwork and he still said zero. I firmly but politely re-explained my situation and he finally took it and told me to go sit down. I think I got a C on that paper (it was A quality but I was happy nonetheless).

Maybe I deserved that break, maybe I didn't, but there's another lesson there in persistence/not always backing down.

ETA: that is probably not a great fit in this thread, there are plenty of people who do stupid things then argue for breaks they don't deserve, but I do think there is a place for it in certain situations

i had a professor last year who tried to fail me because i didn't turn in a paper on time.

i was in the hospital for a week. i had to go all the way up to the dean to show them my paperwork proving i was in the VA hospital before dude finally let me turn it in.

and he still only gave me a C because it was late.

8th and 9th - Algebra 1 & Geography

j/c

As many know I am a HS English teacher (mostly honors students) and my policy is 10% for each day late (which is a letter grade). Beyond 4 days I won't accept any late work.

However, this can get tricky and I know why it's difficult to keep such a hard line with due dates: special education and IEPs. Many (if not all) of those students have unlimited deadlines and it becomes a gray area for the teacher with the other students. Thus, I think a lot of professionals have just become lenient for the sake of not getting themselves in trouble.

Not sure this is the case with your son's school/teachers, but I know it's an issue at our school. It's not that the teachers are lazy or undisciplined; it's that they don't want to set a precedent they are unable to reach.

My A-B student met a wannabe thug and dropped out her senior year. My wife and I picked up the pieces, got her a GED, helped them get on their feet by letting them live with us on three different occasions watching them fail at everything in between. We finally got her head right and she left him and went to college.

She had female issues with ovarian cyst as a kid and was told she would never have children. Two years into her college he comes back around and worms his way into her life, she ends up pregnant. She decides taking this chance to have a child is worth putting college on hold, so she does.

Meanwhile he gets addicted to pills. Grandchild is about a year old when all of a sudden she drops out of our life. Can't find her, can't contact her, nothing for over 10 months...

She finally calls her mother (my ex-wife) and tells her that they are homeless and need a place to live. This is when we start seeing all the signs of heroin addiction in both her and the boyfriend.

Fast forward to Christmas, I had to find out the depths to which she had sunk to get her fixes, the life she and my grandchild had lead for 10 months and figure out a way to bring her back from the brink of being lost forever to heroin.

After a battle which included turning my back on her, cutting her off financially and turning her into children's services so that the situation with my grandson (which I could do nothing about legally) could be monitored... we are finally talking again. She has been in out patient treatment for two months, clean for 10 weeks...

She was an A-B student and always turned her work in on time. So the point I'm trying to make is that there are many other things you should spend your time worrying about IMHO, this is not one of them.

I think this is perfect... You need to learn at a young age that there are thing you need to get done on time for your job... I think giving some leway is good though

My policy is very similar to the two other teachers.

I take 10% off per day w/a 4-day limit. We are not permitted to ever give a student anything below 60% anyway, but I think the 10%--4-day rule is fair.

My reasoning:

1. Students who put off the work should not receive the same score as the students who are conscientious enough to get it done.

2. Getting students to understand that effort and responsibility are very good traits to nurture.

3. I give them extra time because there are things that come up in families in this busy era that we live in.

4. I want the students to learn the material. Having a Zero tolerance policy doesn't really help w/that particular goal.

Honest question...to you and any other k-12 teachers...will your school allow you to even fail a student? Based off of either not turning in homework or they are just not hmm...smart enough..or the PC term just not grasping the material?

I'm just curious if it aligns with what Ive been told by other teachers.

I've failed students before for various reasons, so yes it is allowed in our district. Like I stated previously, I teach mostly honors students so there is zero reason for them to fail IMO.

I wouldn't hesitate to fail a student for the year. I have never had a student that failed because they weren't grasping the material. Every student that has failed my class was from complete lack of effort.

Thanks PA and Dawgs4life...I appreciate your responses.

Growing up, when I didn't hand in major assignments, teachers usually would call my parents and I'd end up having to do the assignment whether it was accepted or not. I was a terrible HS student, always a good test taker, but I had no interest in doing projects. Papers I was a little better about, but if you asked me to make a poster or a mobile or any sort of thing like that, you rarely ever got it. Not until it was too late to count for anything. But as I said, I usually would have to turn it in eventually (my parents rules).

Once I figured out how much my parents were spending on me in college (and saw the new slate opportunity i was given by getting into the school i got into), everything changed. It was very difficult, as I had absolutely no study habits at all. I had to learn how to study. I also have huge issues focusing, and I had to learn how to pay attention in class. First day of class in college, I always went to the teacher and explained that I would be eating and drinking water a lot, and I sit near the front. It was the only way I could pay attention (but it worked, and never was a problem. I contributed a lot and tried to be quiet and not bother anyone. Funny thing is, I do the same thing to stay awake in the middle of the night on the tugboat i work on now).


Anyway, I got an education degree and taught for a year before moving on to a maritime career. I usually took 10% off for each day late. So it pretty much equates to a letter grade per day (unless you got a 100, in which you got a 90)

And during my 1 year of teaching, I loved when my 9th graders would say "Mr. _______ why did you give me a __?" I'd always say, "I didn't give you anything (name), but come sit down and we'll see why YOU earned that ___".

I'm in a different environment (college) however I allow pre-approved late work without penalty. However, they have to do twice the work (easy when I'm in the arts and everything is project orientated).

Otherwise, they lose 10% per class period missed.

Lastly, all assignment must be turned in at the end of the semester or 1 letter grade will be deducted from the final grade for each missing project. So with all of that said, I've never had to enforce any of that. Usually that last little bit scares them to completing assignments on time.

Petey I was the same way...I aced all the testing and pulled my grades up to passing with the end of semester exams. When I went to college that was a different story...I have outstanding grades from college.

I'm actually embarrassed to see my high school transcripts..college not so much..maybe because I had to pay for it and it was going to be my career. I thought it was anyway.

Wow OCD, that is certainly something I worry about more than this topic for sure. What a gut wrenching story, I can only imagine how helpless one must feel in a situation like that. I have a close friend who has a daughter that is going through a similar situation, she just hasn't made it to the hard drug use yet but you can see it coming.

I'm certainly not overly worked up about his lack of turning things in on time, just trying to prevent bad habits. As a parent there are most certainly more important things to worry about.

I hated school - graduated high school with a 2.7 but got a 32 on the ACT so I was able to get into pretty much any of the state schools in Ohio.

I went to Ohio University where I graduated with a stellar 2.8 with a 4.0 in my major (Management Information Systems). I have a really, really difficult time focusing on things I dislike - which is pretty much anything not dealing with computers, cars, or golfing lol.

You use the term "deadline". Noun, "the latest time or date by which something should be completed".

Sure common sense should be employed to a degree. If you have the flat tire mentioned that should buy you about an hour. If you're in the hospital, all deadlines should be off at that point. If your dog ate your homework, fail. If the deadline doesn't mean the latest time or date which the work can be turned in then it's not a deadline but a suggested timeline.

quote by columbus above:

"Wow OCD... What a gut wrenching story."

ditto

When my buddy went to school and he had an assignment, the Nuns had a deadline written on the board saying DUE FRIDAY. They provided 3 baskets at the front of the room.

The first basket was marked Thursday, the second Friday and the third was a wastebasket on the floor marked late.

If you turned it in late, they hit your knuckles with a ruler and threw your paper away, unread.

If you turned it in Thursday, they said you could have taken the extra time to double check your paper and turned it in Friday. They hit your knuckles with a ruler and marked your paper down one letter grade.

If you took it in and placed it in the Friday basket, you got fairly graded, patted on the head, blessed, and then they hit your knuckles with a ruler.

I'm with you on this, and a lot of things above. My oldest is extremely smart, however the level of "work" he gets from homework is both stupid and boring. He can do it all without blinking an eye, and because of it he doesn't put forth the effort to get it in on time since the teachers do not dock him for it.

I was the same way as you, if I'm interested in something, I really grasp onto it and work it to death, and if I'm not, I do not. My son is no different than me.

I wish they would dock him points, but they don't. The last two years before this one were a constant argument between us and him. We'd see he was failing a class, or getting a C or D, however he'd have all A's on the tests. Every quarter, he'd end up turning all of his homework in the end and his grade would turn into an A or B. It was very frustrating.

This year, we decided we were not going to monitor his grades throughout the quarter anymore. He knows the expectations come final grade, and if he doesn't live up to it, he'll be punished. THis year has been so much more stress-free and our relationship is better because of it.

Requiring a time limit on assignments is racist.

After excused or arranged absence, a week to get caught up and tests made up. Half off for one day late.

For those absent on test day, all makeups were essay and composition. Varied from teacher to teacher. Some it was a zero posted if not there when required. I felt some penalty should always be assessed for late stuff. Less inclined to accommodate the habitual lazy deadline misser.

Hopefully it is being reinforced at home by parents.

j/c

My son - I absolutely never had to even tell him to do homework. He'd come home from school and do it. Then he had the rest of the night free. Now, on weekends, he might wait till Saturday to do homework, projects, whatever. He was a good student, grade wise, goal wise, timeliness wise, etc. He still is.

My daughter is a straight A student, but I have to constantly remind her "Hey, I don't want to hear about homework you have to do when it's 10 pm. Come home from practice, and DO IT."

She gets upset at me for reminding her. My wife says "she gets good grades, she'll get it done." And I agree. I also see my daughter drag her tired butt out of bed each school day because she was late going to bed because she had homework.

Every morning "Oh, I'm so tired". And I tell her on the way to school "You know you have to get up at 7 on every school day. You're tired because you don't get enough sleep, and there is only ONE way to correct that: Go to bed earlier. And you can accomplish that by getting your homework done earlier."

We've made some changes this year. (read that as DAD has forced some changes this year). It's getting better.

As for late assignments? I like the idea of a 10% downgrade per late day.

Kids are never too young to learn about what deadlines mean. (and yes, at times there are extenuating circumstances, but I think that's just common sense for most people)

It's been a long time since I or any of my children were in school. In both cases a deadline was a deadline. No doubt if you were in a car wreck on the way to school you were given a variance.

What I don't understand is the 60% rule you mentioned. If you have a 10 question test and the student scores 4 correct answers, you have to give them a 60%? What is the reasoning in that? What do the math teachers think of this "new" math??

I try not to be some old fart unable to understand new ways, but I don't get it....

I do understand not failing students. At some point in their academic career, teachers and administrators can identify the students who simply don't get it. It's not always about effort. Sometimes some kids simply don't have the brain power or support at home to have much success in a school setting. Simply failing them will lead to them dropping out. If the kid makes some effort, shows up, and doesn't create trouble, simply pass them along. At least give them a chance to have a HS diploma so they can go get a job after HS. A 19 year old sitting in a 10th grade class isn't going to work.

Whatever happened to Voc-Ed? Get those students in to a welding program or whatever. We have this idea in this country that everybody is college material when that simply isn't true. Some can't do the work and some simply don't like a school setting.

To me it is about helping to guide kids in to areas which will lead them to being able to make a living. The Guidance system is all screwed up IMO. It needs to start sooner and more emphasis needs to be placed on the kids who aren't college material. The kids destined to be MD's don't need a whole lot of guidance. The kids destined to dropping out need a lot of guidance. That guidance might be the difference between them in minimum wage jobs all their life, or not working at all, and learning to be a welder or plumber and actually able to make some money and lead a productive life.

JMO

Thats why I asked if any of the teachers was allowed to fail...a lot of teachers Ive talked with did a similar thing because the higher ups said they couldnt fail them.

I was curious to other teachers response's.

The administration will allow teachers to fail students in first or second grade, but not beyond that.

Well, you can.........but you would have to go through holy hell in order to do so and you would probably get sued and then fired. Then again, I teach in the south.

You still teach? Or are you retired, or on disability?

Thanks this is exactly what Ive been told...appreciate your honest answer Vers

I encountered that rule when I moved to the south. Mostly, I think it is due to sports. Guys like J. Clowney, AJ Green, etc would have never made it into the SEC w/out that rule.

The district says that an F is an F. I fought it for awhile. Well, actually I ignored it and graded the kids on what they actually did. I almost got fired for it. I had to get an attorney.

Well............this is a long story and very complex, but the short version is I said something like: "you are teaching kids to think welfare is okay. Do nothing and still get something. I think that this is the wrong message to send to our kids and we should try to get them to excel rather than settle."

LOL.......that did not go over so well.

Whatever, I still believe it and I know that I got my own students to work their butts off. Wait.......I don't wanna take credit for their hard work, but I can tell you w/out a doubt that my students each year worked so freaking hard. My classes consistently had the best standardized test scores in the school and I attribute that to freaking hard they worked each year.

It's like coaching..........you can have a great plan, but you won't win squat if your players don't buy into what you are preaching.

I hate public education and how the public views teachers. However, I love my former students and they have provided me w/ a great deal of joy over the years. Kids are so cool. They give you what you ask of them. Think about that last sentence from both perspectives for a moment, y'all.

No problem, bro. Thanks for listening.