DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum cont..:.Re: Browns Big Brain front office - not ready for prime time...

The only reason I even ever mentioned "my life" and "seeing the positives" is in defense of posting positive things. I mention it in effort to explain why I don't point out the negatives as much, why I choose to pass them over.

The negatives are so obvious everyone should be able to see them. At this point in time, as a Browns fan, if you want to be right in your assessment just point out the negatives because there are so many it's a real stretch to think other than we'll suck next season. Perhaps you missed my dozen or so posts adamantly pointing out the need for football people to be running the football side of the organization. Peen and I went back and forth on that subject several times. But it didn't happen the way I wanted it to happen, we get Sashi Brown. And then, instead of getting a real GM we hire a VP of Player Personnel who's primarily worked the Pro side, very little if any experience evaluating college talent. He'll come in real handy come draft time. Perfect!

Instead of sticking to my point, which was pointless by then, I chose to try and understand why they didn't do it my way. What makes sense in the new set-up, if anything? For me that was moving forward rather than being stuck on my original position. I'm still in that process.



There is no way it's meant to be an insult to anyone. I'm just trying to explain MY position. If it's taken as an insult then I think that is a problem the taker has. If it truly does come across that way and others take it like that then I sincerely apologize to everyone.

We all have our message board personalities. I've always tried to be the same guy here as I am everywhere else. In all the years you've known me have you known me to take a superior position/attitude toward others? Do you know me to call people stupid and that they have no idea what they're talking about? There's a poster here and there I'll argue with but overall I hope I don't and don't think I do post like that.



I have no control either. Do you think I think my positive takes will make a difference? They don't listen to me either nor do I subscribe to some metaphysical 'cause and effect' thinking that my positive "vibes" will somehow have a positive effect in the realm. If I don't post what I think because I have no control on the outcome then pretty much nobody should post anything they think because it's all in vain, not even good for discussion.

It's all about discussion. Positives vs Negatives, Opinions vs Opinions, it should all be weighed out in an effort for each to develop their own opinions. At the risk of sounding superior it's what I do to develop my own opinions. I listen to all of you and try to put it together with what I alreaddy think for myself into something that makes sense to me.

It's impossible that nothing I have said has made any sense at all and therefore should be stricken from the record. Much of what I've said is opinion and assumptions and I've tried to make that clear in my posts.



I never thought I should have to explain myself that way. But when I post something positive that I think/believe and it garners a response like, "Amazing", which, to me, is not so subtly saying, "You're so full-of-shit." So I try to further explain the logic behind my thought and then get a response like, "Even more amazing", then I feel prompted to explain why I look at it that way. Am I full-of-shit because my logic is flawed, or is it because I got my facts wrong, or am I full-of-shit simply because I'm posting something positive that you don't agree with? I'm left thinking the only thing to do is explain my personality and see if it then makes sense. But the result of that goes from being simply full-of-shit to being outright insulting.

I'd really like to end this post with some profound statement but I don't have many of them in my bag-o-tricks.

So in summary I want to apologize to you and everyone else if I come off as insulting and/or with a superior bent that is off-putting.

My post was not aimed directly at you. There are multiple posters who talk about being positive and optimistic and call anyone who disagrees negative, haters, agenda posters, etc and resort to saying stupid crap like: go root for another team.

It's been getting on my nerves for years. I think that such labels stunt conversation. I also think that is exactly the purpose of why some posters use such labels. They don't want to hear both sides.

I also think a lot of posters who have issues w/things the Browns do are afraid to post because they know they will be attacked by all the "positive" posters. It certainly occurred last summer when people questioned Farmer and how good the Browns roster really was.

Look, I understand that this plea isn't going to change how people post. But, I felt the need to get it off my chest.

Carry on, Positive Posters!

It's very unfortunate that posters now feel they have to defend their posting style.

And vice versa.

So mac, is this you conceding that Denver called us about JT and not the other way around??

I hope they do trade Joe. I just don't want the man to undergo yet another ground up, total rebuild here. Someone so damn elite, deserves to go to a place where he can add onto his legacy outside of just being "the best LT on the worst NFL team" and the rumor of Seattle is just perfect. He can go right to a team with high credibility and a great shot to make a run.

Sad I'm even admitting it, but I'm serious when I say... I hope they do make a trade as long as Joe is going to a non scrub team. Tough words to type, tough words to admit.

Naturally.

Nope. I just found that JT line interesting and I think even you overlooked it when you posted the article. I've always thought Denver called the Browns, not the other way around. I think that comment from JT illustrates that more than the alternative.

Again, I pointed it out because you adamantly said it didn't happen that way.

I can only think of one thing worse.

A person that constantly rags on people for their thoughts if they don't agree with his. That gets pretty damned old...

I'm cautiously optimistic about bringing RG3 in here. I think I mostly feel that way because it's not us trading for Kaepernick. I am curious about what this does for McCown. I really hope he stays here for two reasons. Our QBs get pummeled, and we'll need as many QBs as we can fit on the roster, and McCown will be good for the rookie QB we draft.

Our roster is shot.

Every position except left tackle and left guard is in question.

memp...Joe Thomas' name came up in trade talks in the middle of the season. I posted the information...just like this!



Cleveland Browns RUMORS: Joe Thomas, Alex Mack, Barkevious Mingo On Trade Block

The Cleveland Browns are reportedly shopping tackle Joe Thomas, center Alex Mack and linebacker Barkevious Mingo before the trade deadline Tuesday

By Henry Buggy | Nov 01, 2015 12:27 PM EST

The Cleveland Browns have reportedly been in discussions about trading two top-tier NFL lineman in tackle Joe Thomas and center Alex Mack, according to NFL reporter Ian Rapoport. The Browns aren't only putting two of their best offensive linemen on the block, as linebacker Barkevious Mingo is reportedly being shopped around the league, according to Browns reporter Mary Kay Cabot.
link


A couple of decent sources...

...anyhow, why the hell does it matter if I said the Browns called Denver or Denver called the Browns.

What freaking difference does it make? Trade talks took place!

If the company line is an attempt to deny that the Browns put Thomas on the block, there are alot of reports that claim they did.

It doesn't matter who called first and you will never know the truth...I read what Joe said and I want to believe him, but if he is honestly wanting to stay, I can understand his choice of words.

Our idiot front office tried to clean house in the middle of the season...with the news of the trade being leaked to the locker room just before the Browns played the Cards...great front office timing...

...then Haslam wonders when the team only won one more game the rest of the season...blame it on Pettine, then fire him.

BUILDING THE BROWNS THE HASLAM WAY!

I like the move as well. I said before I'd trade for Kap, sign RGIII, keep the 3 guys we have under contract and draft two QB's this year and at the end of the off season keep the 3 that the coach thinks gives us our best chance to win. I'm being somewhat tongue in check, but the point is, keep firing until you hit the target! I'm less excited about trading picks for Kapernick but the rest I'd be all on board for.

Well, this seems like a stark contrast from your earlier opinion on the matter.

Of all the posters on this board and it's these two who bring it up.

Oh, the irony.

Poor rebuttal.

I guess you figured out who I was speaking of.. What's that tell you? It tells me that even you know you do that.

Truth kills ya doesn't it!

mac, you should write children's books. Something in the Dr. Seuss family. My kids love those books. The imagination runs wild in those things.

One fish, two fish, red fish, blue fish ...

One GM, two GM, red GM, blue GM ... by mac.

Oh, I'm sure a couple people think I'm a troll. If you want to add yourself to that mix, that's a personal choice... I can't make that decision for you.

Joe Thomas being quoted as saying Denver called the Browns changed your narrative that the Browns went out and tried to trade Joe....now you say we'll never know the truth?? That's a far cry from your original position and I wanted to point that out. If you need to call me a troll to help deal with that shift in thinking, then go right ahead. Call me a troll.

Actually Mac, I think there is a difference.

If the Browns called Denver, that makes it pretty clear they are dismantling and rebuilding and that it was started back in November of 2015. That tells me that even if Haslam hadn't pulled the plug on Pettine and Farmer, changes were in the works anyway. That's what it says anyway.

If the Broncos called the Browns, it means they understood that they needed a LT and they went hard after the best one out there. Perfect sense and no slam on the Browns at all.

I don't know what kinda car you drive, but if I needed a REALLY fast car and you drove a Bugatti Veyron and I called you up to see if I could trade my 49 packard for it straight up, that's just me trying to get over on you.



You taking the deal shows you aren't very smart!

Get it?

Doesn't it seem just a tad odd to you that somehow the Broncos thought the Browns would be interested in trading Thomas? I mean why, out of thin air would they contact the Browns about Thomas if they had no clue a trade possibility was there?

Do you really believe they contacted all teams who had good LT's?

It just seems odd to me that out of the clear blue sky the Broncos thought, "Hey let's call the Browns! Maybe they'll trade the best player on their team?"

I have no clue how it went down. That just seems like a very odd scenario to me.

And you have to admit, I doubt Joe Thomas was in the office when the call actually happened. He is probably only going by what he was told.

I'm not predicting this will happen, and it seems unlikely; but it would be deliciously ironic if, after paying the price Washington paid to beat us to RG3, he were to sign here as a FA, recover the promise he once showed, and become successful.

Yes. Rish will always have an open seat in my watercraft of trollitude.

Not to me. I think a large part of a GMs job is picking up the phone as popping the question...whether they know the answer or not.

The GMs have depth chart of every team in the NFL, and considering they had a need at LT and we were falling fast, why not pick up the phone as ask the Browns? What hurt could it do? Why not, if I'm the Browns, listen? Why not have a couple conversation, even if you're not serious about it just to see if you would ever get a deal you couldn't pass up? You don't need any insight to do that.

This just seems like common activity to me in a FO. Maybe I'm wrong.

Honestly Pit, I don't know which way it went down. I would not surprise me to hear that Farmer put out feelers. Wouldn't surprise me to find out that Sashi Brown, who by that time, may have already been aware of the changes that were going to be made didn't put out feelers.

I was only commenting on the difference in meanings if they called us or we called them

I honestly don't know who did what or when.

Ha,, I hadn't thought of that, but it would be funny.

I always look at the source. That's my first thought.

But again Mac, I don't really know what happened. I don't know which came first, the chicken or the egg.

Once again, please don't take this personal as it's not intended that way, BUT.....

You are, for the most part, naming players that are at a lower level than some of the FA's that walked out the door.

Which means we have more holes than we had at the end of last season with a team that went 3-13.

I'm sorry if that doesn't exude confidence from me.

Which was pretty much my point as well. I think the idea of anyone who claims to know the answer is a rather foolish endeavour.

The only two people who really know the answer are those involved in the phone calls.