DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2016 NFL Season 2016 NFL Draft Mock Drafts part 3

Why? because it's April!

In this draft, I want to see what it would look like if the Browns didn't take a QB at #2. Not likely, but I wanted to see anyway.

1) Titans - Larry Tunsil

There is a possibility of Ramsey here, but if they don't trade down, I don't see it. Tunsil gives them the possibility of upgrading 2 positions moving Lewan to the right side and protects their investment in QB.

2) Browns - It's most likely Wentz, but that is boring to post over and over again, so I'm going to go BPA. I am pretending that they have a QB targeted for later. Jalen Ramsey upgrades what we had in Gipson. I predict him to be like Ed Reed was in his prime. Not only that, he is athletic enough to slide over to the LCB position if your starter goes down and Haden has gone down a lot recently.

3) Chargers - Deforest Buckner. They wanted Ramsey at this spot, but the Browns steal him. Buckner fits their defense better than Bosa. He fits our defense better than Bosa as well and I could see Horton really wanting this guy, because he is a lot like Calais Campbell.

4) Cowboys - Joey Bosa. He fills a need and Jerry Jones likes to pick the player in the draft with the most hype. This year that is Bosa. Another possibility here is Myles Jack.

5) Myles Jack - BPA here. They upgraded their secondary in FA and their LB corps is weak.

6)Ronnie Stanley - BPA. They really wanted either Bosa or Buckner, but they are both gone in this scenario.

7) 49ers - It's either Wentz or Goff. Chip Kelly really doesn't seem to have much of a say in who is picked either so this one is tough to project. I'm going to go with Goff here because he is the safer pick even though I think that Wentz is the better prospect.

8) Eagles - Carson Wentz - They will sprint to the podium and their GM will get multiple pats on the back for trading up to this spot.

9) Bucs - Leonard Floyd. They really need another pass rusher.

10) Giants - Ezekiel Elliott. Hagreaves is BPA but they have more of a need at RB.

11) Bears - Vernon Hargreaves - BPA and a position of need.

12) Saints - A'Shawn Robinson - again BPA and position of need.

13) Miami - Jack Conklin - They really want a swing tackle and I think Conklin is more of a RT, but his the best available at this spot.

14) Oakland - Reggie Ragland - Oaklands front 7 is starting to get scary.

15) Rams - Laquon Treadwell - Gives them a viable #1 WR.

16) Lions - Sheldon Rankins - I did not expect him to fall this far. Still lots of good d-lineman out there.

17) Falcons - Emmanuel Ogbah - They need a pass rusher desperately.

18) Colts - Cody Whitehair - They will take the best o-lineman available. They are all-in with Luck and can't afford him getting hurt.

19) Bills - Vernon Butler - BPA - position of need

20) Jets - Paxton Lynch - Yes it's a little reach but teams seem to do that every year for QB's RIght now they don't have anyone.

21) Redskins - Ryan Kelly - They have a huge need at Center and Kelly is NFL ready.

22) Texans - William Fuller - Gives them a deep threat to compliment Hopkins.

23) Vikings - Josh Doctson - They need a guy that catches everything. Doctson fits the bill.

24) Bengals - Corey Coleman - They really need a WR with speed to take the pressure off of AJ Green.

25) Steelers - William Jackson - Seems to be shooting up draft boards and this is a position of need.

26) Seahawks - Jarran Reed - This is a steal at this spot and gives them a replacement for Brandon Mebane.

27) Packers - Kenny Clark - BJ Raji retired and Clark would be an upgrade anyway.

28) Chiefs - Kevin Dodd - a really great fit for their defense and BPA here.

29) Cardinals - Keanu Neal - There biggest need is a box safety and he fits the bill.

30) Panthers - Jason Spriggs - The Panthers need a LT. I think Taylor Decker is a better prospect, but he is more of a RT than LT.

31) Broncos - Connor Cook - Yes they lost some pieces to their defense, but they are built to win now and need a QB. They don't need a QB to go out and win games, they just need one that won't lose them. Look for Cook to take on the familar game manager role that he had at Michigan State.

32) Browns - Noah Spence. He's the BPA here and a position of need. I really wanted to pull the trigger on a WR, but the next best on my list was Michael Thomas and I thought that he was a bit of a reach. Nkemdiche is still on the board, but I just couldn't pull the trigger on him either. Not that Spence is a choir boy, but I think Nkemdiche is an arrest waiting to happen.

So it looks like defense with the first 2 picks if we don't get QB. Again I think we'll get QB @ #2, but you never know, Hue may have a target later in the draft.

To continue on...

3) Cardale Jones

4A) Charone Peake WR - A great combination of size and speed, has good hands as well.

4B) Jaylon Smith LB - Big risk here because his knee has nerve damage. The payoff is worth it though. Hard to say if someone takes a chance earlier, but this is where I would take it now.

5A) Shawn Oakman - Favorite of mine and surprised that he is still here.

5B) Victor Ochi - Another favorite of mine

5C) De'Runnya Wilson - He may struggle to separate, but he is 6' 4" and would be a good endzone target.


The statement by Sashi that 6th and 7th rounders are like first rounders to them led me to think that we will pick a guy with a similar situation to IFO again this year. So here are my final two picks.

6) Jordan Swindle - Played LT last year but RT before that. He was banged up for a lot of this season and didn't make the combine, but I like what I see on film. Could fill the swing tackle role very well if JT got hurt.

7) Tra Carson RB - Physical downhill runner that is also a good receiver out of the backfield. Didn't do drills at the combine because of a knee injury and missed a lot of last season, so he is flying a bit under the radar. He should be ready to play week 1 though and is a steal in my opinion.

Not the big name offensive picks everyone wants, but I'd be pretty happy if the draft unfolded like this.

I would be thrilled if the Browns took Ramsey, Spence, and Jones w/their first three picks.

I have been thinking that Ramsey might be a corner early in his career and move to FS later, just like Ronnie Lott and Rod Woodson. Not sure if I am right about that, but he has the skills for both.

I might take Lawson over Spence, but wouldn't complain if Spence can stay clean.

I'm not a big Oakman fan. I'm not sure what the remaining players look like on your board at that point.

I wanted to like De'Runnya, but I just don't see him being successful as a WR. I might roll the dice on the German guy if he's still on the board.

Looks pretty good all in all though.

Have you watched any tape of Dwayne Washington, the RB from UW, Vers? Had some injury issues, but looks interesting to me.

It was actually a toss up between Dwayne and Tra when I posted this. They are similar size and speed and both good pass catchers.

I'm coming around on Ramsey. It helps getting Spence at the top of the second round to help up front. I like other players that you mention Peake and Ochi. Of course Cardale.

I'm including a Browns only mock that doesn't take nearly the effort you put into your post. This mock that I'm offering surprises even me. I've been inclined to go heavy on the defense. But recently a childhood friend who is a Steelers fan made a good point. Some of the Browns defensive problems can be attributed the fact that the offense is unable to sustain drives. He thinks that better offensive time of possession will help our D unit. Besides we're putrid on offense.

Round 1 Pick 2: Jalen Ramsey, FS/CB, Florida State (A+)
Round 2 Pick 1: Noah Spence, DE, Eastern Kentucky (B+)
Round 3 Pick 2: Cardale Jones, QB, Ohio State (D+)
Round 4 Pick 1: Tyler Higbee, TE, Western Kentucky (B-)Drays gone team looking at TEs he's a weapon
Round 4 Pick 40 (COMP): Charone Peake, WR, Clemson (B+)Sharpe might be graded higher switch their slots
Round 5 Pick 2: Sheldon Day, DT/DE, Notre Dame (A+)
Round 5 Pick 33 (COMP): Keith Marshall, RB, Georgia (B+)Talent too good to ignore
Round 5 Pick 34 (COMP): Tajae Sharpe, WR, Massachusetts (A+)
Round 6 Pick 1: Brandon Shell, OT, South Carolina (B)
Round 7 Pick 2: Mike Jordan, CB, Missouri Western State (D)

I like Ramsey a lot, but I do believe there is small chance the Titans pass on Tunsil and take the corner.

Walter Football has Ramsey going 1, Wentz 2, Tunsil 3, and Bosa 4. That's interesting. I get that it's just one person's opinion, but I really wonder if the Titans feel like they can get someone to protect Mariota in the second or third round...

I really don't have much of an opinion on Wentz. He certainly looks the part. It's just so hard to judge these quarterbacks coming out of college, and it's probably even tougher when they play on a weaker level. You don't really grade these guys on what they've done, it's really on what you think they can do, so playing at NDSU doesn't rule you out, it just makes it tougher to evaluate.

I really like what I've seen from Goff. I don't care about the measurables. He can throw. I would probably have him as the best pro QB prospect.

I really love all the guys at the top of this draft though. I feel pretty good that we are walking away from 2 with a hell of a player, and I think we should all feel good that there will be some really good talent left when we are back up at 32.

I'm in complete 100% agreement with you on everything about Ramsey.

What do you guys think of ESPN's DB guru, Louis Riddick? The reason I ask is because I heard he said that Ramsey was a better athlete than he was a football player, and compared him to ... Justin Gilbert. He also apparently made a big deal out of the fact that Ramsey had only 4 INTs in his FSU career (which also could mean nobody threw in his direction). Riddick says the best DB in this draft is Karl Joseph. I don't know if Riddick has the credibility to be making such statements, though I do remember liking him as a Browns' DB.

I actually respect Riddick. I believe he spent time in a front office. He is intelligent and well-spoken.

I usually like him, but I'm not sure about this comparison. I guess it would depend on the context. As an athlete I guess I could somewhat see it, but I think Ramsey is better between the ears. INTs are nice, but they aren't the end-all, be-all. Does he impact plays?

If the premise was why might players not succeed, I could see those responses.

My thinking is that at #2, we need to find an All-Pro, possible HOF talent. From my amateur point of view, there appears to be only one "sure thing" in this draft - Laremy Tunsil. There are question marks about the other top 5 players, unless Riddick is wrong about Ramsey. God, I'm sick of the trade-downs, but this might the year where it makes sense - just trade back to 12-15 and take Treadwell, the WR. Pickup another 2nd and 3rd this year, and a #1 for next year. Just thinking out loud.

Done on Fanspeak, using CBS's Big Board, no trades:

2: R1P2
CB/S JALEN RAMSEY
FLORIDA STATE

32: R2P1
OLB LEONARD FLOYD
GEORGIA

65: R3P2
OLB JOSHUA PERRY
OHIO STATE

99: R4P1
WR KENNY LAWLER
CALIFORNIA

138: R4P40
SS KJ DILLON
WEST VIRGINIA

141: R5P2
TE TYLER HIGBEE
WESTERN KENTUCKY

172: R5P33
QB KEVIN HOGAN
STANFORD

173: R5P34
CB KEN CRAWLEY
COLORADO

176: R6P1
DE ANTHONY ZETTEL
PENN STATE

223: R7P2
OT CLAY DEBORD
EASTERN WASHINGTON

I'd put Perry at ILB

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...eet-with-titans

Look at the diving play at the end of the video and tell me the 4 INTs are really that big of a concern. (Directed more at the argument than you, Dave)

Impressive. By the way, the last time the Browns took a DB at #2 in the 1st ... Eric Turner in 1991. He was pretty good.

Fanspeak, Composite board, BPA (all selections except Cardale Jones, he was 3rd on the board)... I could live with this


2: R1P2
CB JALEN RAMSEY
FSU

32: R2P1
RB EZEKIEL ELLIOTT
OHIO STATE

65: R3P2
C RYAN KELLY
ALABAMA

99: R4P1
DT HASSAN RIDGEWAY
TEXAS

138: R4P40
QB CARDALE JONES
OHIO STATE

141: R5P2
TE TYLER HIGBEE
WESTERN KENTUCKY

172: R5P33
WR JAY LEE
BAYLOR

173: R5P34
K ROBERTO AGUAYO
FLORIDA STATE

176: R6P1
OT KYLE MURPHY
STANFORD

223: R7P2
WR ROGER LEWIS
BOWLING GREEN

http://fanspeak.com/ontheclock/draft.php?d=lyhoqk

These mock draft sites are a scourge.

Fun to look at a draft like this though... I'm not into fantasy FB and don't follow college closely, so it is a good source of who the talking heads think is BPAs for me.

I did a fanspeak as well (with CBS board). I'd love, love, love this draft, especially the first 2 rounds:

2: R1P2 OT LAREMY TUNSIL OLE MISS
32: R2P1 WR LAQUON TREADWELL OLE MISS
65: R3P2 C NICK MARTIN NOTRE DAME
99: R4P1 OLB KYLER FACKRELL UTAH STATE
138: R4P40 WR AARON BURBRIDGE MICHIGAN STATE
141: R5P2 RB JONATHAN WILLIAMS ARKANSAS
172: R5P33 OLB JAMES COWSER SOUTHERN UTAH
173: R5P34 DE AZIZ SHITTU STANFORD
176: R6P1 FS JUSTIN SIMMONS BOSTON COLLEGE
223: R7P2 QB KEVIN HOGAN STANFORD


I also did a Browns only draft with no trades using CBS
2 DeForest Buckner, DE, Oregon
32 Josh Doctson, WR, TCU
65 Nick Martin, OC, Notre Dame
99 Tyler Matakevich, ILB, Temple
138 Sean Davis, FS, Maryland
141 Charone Peake, WR, Clemson
172 James Cowser, OLB, Southern Utah
173 Denver Kirkland, OT/OG, Arkansas
176 KJ Dillon, SS, West Virginia
223 Kevin Hogan, QB, Stanford

There are a couple guys I'd love to draft. Round 1, I have 3 guy's I'd like to draft - Tunsil, Buckner, and Ramsey in that order. Matakevich, Kirkland, and Hogan are going to be better than their draft positions.

UDFAs
Nate Sudfield, QB, Indiana
Jalin Marshall, WR, Ohio State
Caleb Azubike, OLB, Vanderbilt
Taveze Calhoun, CB, Mississippi State
Tra Cardon, RB, Texas A&M
LeShaun Sims, CB, Southern Utah
Anthony Brown, CB, Purdue

Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 2: DeForest Buckner, DE/DT, Oregon (A+)
Round 2 Pick 1: Josh Doctson, WR, TCU (B)
Round 3 Pick 2: Jordan Jenkins, OLB, Georgia (C)
Round 4 Pick 1: Evan Boehm, C, Missouri (C-)
Round 4 Pick 40 (COMP): Tyvis Powell, FS, Ohio State (C-)
Round 5 Pick 2: Malcolm Mitchell, WR, Georgia (A)
Round 5 Pick 33 (COMP): Brandon Allen, QB, Arkansas (D+)
Round 5 Pick 34 (COMP): C.J. Prosise, RB, Notre Dame (A+)
Round 6 Pick 1: Justin Simmons, FS, Boston College (B)
Round 7 Pick 2: Mike Thomas, WR, Southern Mississippi (B+)

http://first-pick.com/NFL/DraftGame.aspx

Just did a First Pick with Trades. I'd be pretty stoked if this happened as well.

Dallas gets Round 1 Pick 2 (2)
We get Round 1 Pick 4 (4) and Round 2 Pick 3 (34) and Round 3 Pick 4 (67)

Miami gets Round 3 Pick 2 (65) and Round 3 Pick 4 (67)
We get Round 2 Pick 11 (42)

Round 1 Pick 4 (DAL): Laremy Tunsil, OT, Ole Miss (A+)
Round 2 Pick 1: Reggie Ragland, ILB, Alabama (A+)
Round 2 Pick 3 (DAL): Emmanuel Ogbah, OLB, Oklahoma State (A-)
Round 2 Pick 11 (MIA): Josh Doctson, WR, TCU (A-)
Round 4 Pick 1: T.J. Green, FS, Clemson (A+)
Round 4 Pick 40 (COMP): Charone Peake, WR, Clemson (A-)
Round 5 Pick 2: Daniel Lasco, RB, California (A+)
Round 5 Pick 33 (COMP): James Bradberry, CB/S, Samford (A+)
Round 5 Pick 34 (COMP): James Cowser, OLB, Southern Utah (B+)
Round 6 Pick 1: Beau Sandland, TE, Montana State (B)
Round 7 Pick 2: Joe Dahl, OG, Washington State (B+)

Hi vers got a question for you due you think hue jackson came here saying owe good I can draft ramsey?

Your score is: 7661 (GRADE: C+) 

Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 2: DeForest Buckner, DE/DT, Oregon (A+)
Round 2 Pick 1: Emmanuel Ogbah, DE, Oklahoma State (B+)
Round 3 Pick 2: Joshua Perry, OLB/ILB, Ohio State (A+)
Round 4 Pick 1: Rashard Higgins, WR, Colorado State (A+)
Round 4 Pick 40 (COMP): Tyvis Powell, FS, Ohio State (C-)
Round 5 Pick 2: KJ Dillon, SS, West Virginia (B)
Round 5 Pick 33 (COMP): Briean Boddy-Calhoun, CB, Minnesota (A+)
Round 5 Pick 34 (COMP): Brandon Allen, QB, Arkansas (D+)
Round 6 Pick 1: Malcolm Mitchell, WR, Georgia (A+)
Round 7 Pick 2: BJ Goodson, LB, Clemson

I had to take this to an old, toothless woman who lives on a mountain top in West Virginny to figure out what the hell you were asking. She chewed on her corn cob pipe for awhile, exhaled a bit of stale smoke and spat: "he's calling you a fool for thinking Ramsey is the pick."

Well jackson...........I don't know if Hue said that or not. Then again, I don't think he is running the draft. I do think the analytics guys probably want to draft the best player on their Vertical board w/out compromising their Horizontal board too much. If you know what I'm saying.........

I have explained the boards. Several times.

Btw------not sure where you found your information, but it is not all that accurate.

Because in my opinion there isn't a franchise quarterback available at #2.

I agree, I guess they are going to have RG3 playing all year not getting hurt. Should be great. I mean he is the guy who played Free Safety on Washington"s scout team last year.

I just went with the best player on the board in my mock, I think that there is a strong chance that we will go Wentz at #2 as long as Hue thinks he can be the guy. On my Big Board I rate Wentz the #4 prospect behind Ramsey, Bosa, and Tunsil.

I usually bring this up once a year and during draft discussions. I posted this a couple of weeks ago. I will admit it was not my most comprehensive explanation. In part, because it usually gets ignored. But, this may help a bit.




I don't know if it still exists, but a few years ago, there was a great article where Belichick talked in-depth about the boards. You might want to search for that if you are still interested.

Btw-----Ozzie brought Belichick's board to Baltimore when he went there.

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=206267
here is some info from 2003...When you stack your board, you're going to look vertically ... The way we do it, we look vertically by positions. Here's all the quarterbacks, here's all the tight ends, here's all the running backs. Horizontally across the board, you try to get some kind of value of ... This cornerback and this guard, and this linebacker and this tight end would have about the same value. They'd come in and they'd be role players for us. They're never going to be starters. Or whatever their value is. And so when you're sitting there trying to make your picks, you may be looking at three or four guys and they're all kind of about the same. You're five or six picks away and whichever one of these guys we end up with, we take them in this order, but we could live with any of them. But sometimes you're sitting there and you have three or four guys in that category and you have one guy that you feel like is sitting up there and is significantly higher and you're not saying, 'Well, he's just going to come in and be a role player and he'll never be a starter.' You're saying, 'Well, this guy could come in and he's going to be a starter for us, now it might take a year and he has a little developing he has to do, but we feel like this guy can come in and he can be a starter for us.' That's when you sit there and think about, 'Alright, do we want to try to jump up and get this guy if we don't think he's going to fall to us and give up whatever we have to give up to move up and get him, or do we want to stay here and hope he's on the board -- he probably won't be -- and we'll end up with one of these other guys.' It just comes down to draft management. Sometimes you try to trade up and get him and nobody wants to trade with you and you sit there and let it come to you. But that's basically the process. I don't think you sit there and say, 'Well, we're only going to trade up if we think the guy's going to be an impact player or we're only going to trade up if the guy's going to be a starter or whatever.' We've traded up in the fourth round, fifth round, down in the fifth round, sixth round, so I don't think when you're picking in the sixth round you're really thinking, 'This guy's going to be an impact player.' We would have picked him in the second."

sure this has changed some in a decade plus, but probably close.....GO Browns!!!!

Oz and BB are vertical board guys. I think most are. I am not sure if I mentioned it in this year's edition, but teams don't want to move more than 2 to 3 spots....max.....from their vertical board. The horizontal board works better w/trades and lower round picks.

This is from the middle of an article written back in 2011...



Bill Belichick enters his 12th season in charge of the Patriots' draft. Over the years, he's detailed how the team executes its "stack", with one of the most detailed explanations coming back in 2003.

There is the vertical stack and the horizonal stack.

"When you stack your board, you're going to look vertically ... The way we do it, we look vertically by positions. Here's all the quarterbacks, here's all the tight ends, here's all the running backs," Belichick said at the time.

"[Then] horizontally across the board, you try to get some kind of value of ... This cornerback and this guard, and this linebacker and this tight end would have about the same value. They'd come in and they'd be role players for us. They're never going to be starters. Or whatever their value is.

"And so when you're sitting there trying to make your picks, you may be looking at three or four guys and they're all kind of about the same. You're five or six picks away and whichever one of these guys we end up with, we take them in this order, but we could live with any of them."

But Belichick also detailed how sometimes there is one player who is far and away above the remaining players on the board. That could spark the team to seek a trade.

"Sometimes you're sitting there and you have three or four guys in that category and you have one guy that you feel like is sitting up there and is significantly higher and you're not saying, 'Well, he's just going to come in and be a role player and he'll never be a starter.' You're saying, 'Well, this guy could come in and he's going to be a starter for us, now it might take a year and he has a little developing he has to do, but we feel like this guy can come in and he can be a starter for us.' That's when you sit there and think about, 'All right, do we want to try to jump up and get this guy if we don't think he's going to fall to us and give up whatever we have to give up to move up and get him, or do we want to stay here and hope he's on the board -- he probably won't be -- and we'll end up with one of these other guys.'

"It just comes down to draft management. Sometimes you try to trade up and get him, and [sometimes] nobody wants to trade with you and you sit there and let it come to you. That's basically the process."

espn.go.com

I don't think it's the same exact article, but a lot of the quotes are the same.

Great find. Thanks.

Yeah, there are a lot of articles that use pieces/parts of an original article, (from 2003), which I'm certain contains the entire interview complete.

Unfortunately I can't find that original story. Every link I've found to it so far is broken.

Something I found interesting, if I understand it correctly, is that his vertical board is grouped by position. I expected a vertical board of BPA overall with the positional grades being on the horizontal. But it looks like each position has it's own vertical.

Then, again if I understand it correctly, the horizontal compares different positions/players who graded out equally.

To be honest Belichick's explanation confused me more than I thought I was already.

I also found his use of "...you're sitting there", "...so you sit there" or just his often use of "sit there" to be comical. That's because my brother talks the same way. As if "to sit there" means "to think".