DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum RGIII Continued

They often refer to Terrell Pryor in Oakland. He got the most out of him ever. He did very well with Campbell as well.

Diam, you are hearing it from Brown's fans. The same guys that insisted Norv would make Weeden into a really, really good qb. The same guys who said that The Big Show would make BQ great. [I always wondered how he was gonna do that from a golf cart???]

I think Hue is a good offensive coach. I don't see him as a QB Guru, though. People credit Hue for turning around Dalton, but Dalton actually regressed [numbers-wise] in his first year w/Hue. Dalton did have his best year last year, though. But, if you look at Dalton's stats and have watched him play......he's always been pretty much the same guy. Obviously, experience in the NFL lends itself to improvement. Thus, I ain't really buying the "QB Guru" thang.

Good coach who has some respect? Yes.
QB Guru or QB Whisperer? A stretch by the same homers who always talk that way.




I brought this up earlier. There were quotes from Mike Shanahan about what kind of offense RGIII should play in. That's one man's opinion, but it got me to thinking about how bad RGIII was when he had to read coverages post-snap. He really struggled and took a bunch of needless sacks that caused issues because the OL got blamed. Because we know that according to some fans, if a qb holds the ball for 5 seconds, it's the OL's fault that he got sacked. LOL

Anyway.....I start thinking about which qb would be the best fit in an offense where the field is cut in half, so the reads aren't as difficult. Where quick, timing plays are the majority of the calls, w/some bombs thrown in to keep the defense honest. Plays where you roll out your qb and have him throw on the run to guys running horizontal routes. I got some feedback, and the best I can come up with is:

Paxton Lynch. Big, strong, great arm, mobile, but very raw. Will have to sit a couple of years. Might be perfect timing while RGIII reestablishes himself and gets the hell out of Cleveland and goes and plays for a real team.

Dak Prescott: Had a DUI recently, but another athletic guy who played at Miss. St. He needs some work on his mechanics and he tends to lock in on receivers. He is another project. Again, this would correlate w/RGIII's time here.

Some say that Cardale Jones would be that kind of guy. I agree that he needs time to develop and that he played in a similar system in college under Urban, but that offense didn't really suit Jones. I see him playing better in a more traditional offense, but that's just my opinion.

Vernon Adams: He is only 5'11" Good scrambler. He really turned some heads in the Shrine game w/his passing. He also ran it well. Might be available as a free agent.

Bro, I am not as impressed w/this qb class as most on here. I think one or more could be good, but they all are risky. Too risky to draft at #2. I think some people overvaluing their abilities. It's like when you are really, really thirsty and even that mud puddle looks good.......if you know what I'm sayin?

I don't think that is true. I think it is another example of people giving Hue more credit than he deserves.

I could be wrong and please correct me if I am wrong, but I thought:

--Hue was Oakland's HC in 2011? Right or wrong?

--Pryor threw exactly zero passes in 2011? Right or wrong?

--Hue had a say in drafting Pryor in the Supplemental draft in Oakland? Right or wrong?

--Hue had a say in bringing Pryor to the Bengals? Right or wrong?

I just don't get where Hue got the most out of Pryor ever bit. Help me, people.

Btw..........Pryor's BEST year was in 2013, where he threw for 7 TDs and 11 picks. His QB Rating was 69.1. Terrelle Pryor never has had a good year.........ever. Oh, where was Hue in 2013? Let me look.................Ahhhhh........he was in Cincy.

Diam, like I said earlier. Not all you read on here is true.

There's another thing, Hue gets credit for the QB if he was the OC. With another guy he gets credit when he's the HC. What' up with that? Is his role with the QBs the same regardless of whether he's the OC or HC. Or is this grasping at any and everything looking for hope?

I think he's proven himself as an OC. I don't believe the HC job is over his head, plus he's at least been a HC before he got here. So as the HC calling the plays he should do ok.

But this thing of putting the guy on a pedestal is over hype of you ask me. It's like the mud puddle thing you mentioned earlier. He ain't no mud puddle. He might be a drink of clean water. But let's not make him into a can of beer yet. LOL

Just for some clarification:



It's from Wiki, so I don't know if it's all true or not, but I think it adds depth to the conversation that is centered around Diam's question.

j/c:

Article with Tom House quote



Maybe we're looking to the wrong place for hope with RG3. Maybe House is the whisperer more than Hue. It looks like RG3 will be working with both.

I thought it was interesting the body parts he mentioned in the sequence, and the one he didn't. Just saying.

I agree w/what House says. Good mechanics transcend sports.

Grimm, I think you are misinterpreting what some of us are saying. You don't get great rotation if your feet are out of whack.

I agree with you on mechanics and feet being out of whack. I just think what constitutes feet being out of whack or not can vary within certain parameters based upon the individual. Shoulders and hips are pretty straightforward and consistent as far as optimum positions mechanically.

I was trying to zoom out a bit away from the feet because we had been discussing Hogan, and I think his biggest issue is at the shoulder level and perhaps tying the various levels together.

*LOL* ... Thats amazing u typed that .... I don't know much about Hue so I went to 3 or 4 sites yesterday trying to figure out who he "groomed" ... After looking at 3 or 4 sites I'm scratching my head going .... QB guru???? .... Then I said to myself ... Hmmmm .... I've really only heard it on the board, then it made more sense ... *LOL* ,,... U said in your first words exactly what I thought to myself ....

I agree with U and ddub and others .... Not a QB guru by any stretch .....

I agree with U and ddub and others in that I think he definitely gets the most out of his players .... As a position coach he's had some good players but they've all shined under him ... He's done a pretty damm good job as an OC also ,,,,

I like what I see in his background .... Let's hope his upward trajectory continues here ....



I don't think anyone can take credit for dalton ... Grimm's article may be the main reason and that's House ... He's had to many coaches to really give credit to anyone ... If I was to pick one it would have to be Gruden ..... I think he was with him as a few years as QB coach and then OC a few more (but I am only about 52 - 48 on that one ... *L*) ...

Plus this year they had Eifert for an entire year .... They had a real good OL and the BEST WEAPONS in the NFL .... Hill, Bernard, AJ, Jones, Eifert and Sanu .... That's pretty damm scary ....

Anyhow .... I like his background ... And agree .... No QB guru but that's OK he gets the most out of what he has and that's huge ....

Thanks for your take on the other guys although u really didn't answer my question ... .... I don't know squat about anyone we may take at 2 so I will stay mum and hope and pray we got a good player ....

My only concern is that Hue likes the athletic running type QB's like RG3 or Kap or Vick ... That mold .... Not a big fan of that genre of QB ... Give me someone with accuracy and brains first and foremost and the rest is just gravy ....

I guess we'll know more soon ....

Good post, Diam! Well-balanced comments with no apparent "leaning" or agenda . Should be a model for all posters...

I kinda did, bro.........LOL

Neither of those guys are similar in style to RGIII. Thus, if the Browns want a qb that can thrive in the same system that we need for RGIII to be successful, they will probably pass on both and grab a guy like Lynch at the bottom of the first or top of the second.

Now, I am not saying that the Browns are going to tailor an offense specifically to fit RGIII's needs, but if they do, the top two guys, especially Lynch, would not fit that particular style of offense.

Agree 100% ... Plus I remember saying that year "holy crap was he wide open" ... They had guys running wide open all over the field that year .... Shanny Jr maybe one of the biggest jerks ever but he's building a really good rep as an OC ... He did a great job in Houston with Schuabb and did a wonderful job with RG3 ...

It looks like you'll get your wish at 2 as I don't know how we don't take a QB ..... I don't know enough to weigh in as to weather I think that's good or bad .... It is going to make some pretty mad .... It's happened before ... *L* ....

It's a QB league and we don't have one so if we don't take one there were taking a huge risk ... On the other hand taking one that high is always a huge risk .... Good luck men ... *L*



QB based runs at all? .... Something like they do with Cam or just a normal run package ....

Can Wentz or Goff run an O where QB run plays are sprinkled in? ... Can they run an nfl version of a spread option or are these guys pure pocket guy or along the Andrew luck lines? ...

Yeah, try it sometime.

You wouldn't believe how many issues would be resolved if you guys stopped posting in that manner.

Well if we take a QB at 2 .... Then that's no it good ... Will make me scratch my head over the RG3 signing .... If we're not going to tailor an O to fit his skill set we should have just went with McCown if we're going to draft a QB at 2 ....

Maybe they want one of the guys u mentioned (when u weren't answering my question ... *L*) I your previous post ....

Cause signing RG3 w/o tailoring on O to his skill set makes no sense .... And drafting a QB at 2 and then having them learn an O that will not resemble anything they will ever run makes no sense either ....

Am I missing something? ... Or does signing RG3 and then drafting a QB at 2 make no sense outside of C-town?

Thanks Grimm ... Often wondered about this Tom House dude ... Looking forward to going to read the entire article ... Guess I could have googled him myself ... *L* ...

Diam, of the two it's pretty clear that Wentz would fit better in that particular type of offense than Goff.

On the hand, I think you would severely limit Wentz's potential by doing so.

You probably know I like a qb to be a bit more cerebral [like what you said earlier] than an athlete who needs the offense to be dummied down for.

I wouldn't sell Lynch short, though. He's very raw. Some people think he has the most potential and upside in the draft.

Bro, it's just really hard to project how qbs are going to transition into the NFL nowadays because of not really knowing if they can make post-snap reads. A lot of people don't want to hear that, but man, I think it's dead on.

I think anyone who says that one of these qbs

-------is the guy, or isn't the guy......

is simply blowing smoke up your butt.

Terrelle Pryor started ten total games at QB for the Raiders and was horrible.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/P/PryoTe00.htm

General reply...

Here's another fine thread that took a left turn at the intersection of "agenda" and "personal attacks". I'd almost bet nearly 1/3 of the posts on this board is that crap.

Diam pops in here, a few good conversations get going, things get interesting but somehow it's not interesting enough so the personal BS starts.

Is that an example of who an offense needs to be dumbed down for? Knowing you're a Jack/Goff guy, now I'm confused.

But unlike most Browns' QBs he actually beat the Steelers.

Yep. It's hard to generate spin while fighting for your balance.

Ddubia, that's what people mean by getting personal on the board. Calling someone a "JackGoff guy." ;-)