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Polar opposites, one is positive and one is negative....what is truth, depends on how you see it, what you have experiences...each of us should look in the mirror...suggest reading James1 19-20.....Go Browns!!!
"You've never lived till you've almost died, life has a flavor the protected will never know" A vet or cop
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Ves Dog is correct, staffs don't win games, what is wrong with praising an experienced staff and a team that hasn't played a real game....nothing. Sad truth is our record, we have stunk in immediate years past AND most pundits say we will again...let's play the games before we declare we have no O and our D stinks....time will tell....I like the positive more, but I lean toward negativity way too much.......GO Browns!!!!
"You've never lived till you've almost died, life has a flavor the protected will never know" A vet or cop
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If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Tabber - I agree that coaching is huge .. So is TALENT .. And a coach can ONLY BE AS GOOD AS HIS TALENT ALLOWS TO be .. You know that first hand ... Not sure why your talking solely about coaching here .. You know these guys have there hands tied this year .. I would feel a lot better about Hue's coaching abilities ... Question first ... - is Hue calling plays or is Pep? Cause if Hue's calling plays who care3s about Pep .. He's the OC in title only ifue's calling the plays .. If Hue had: Andy Dalton instead of RG3 or McCown AJ Green instead of Casey Cpleman Tyler Eifert instead of Gary Barnidge Bernard and Hill instead of Johnson and Crowell (why is he still on our team? .. I'm ASHAMED) .. I could keep going but I think you get the point ..  .. I could care less if Lombardi was the HC .. Walsh the OC and Bill Billicheck as DC .. This team would still SUCK THIS YEAR ,, this is a TOTAL and COMPLETE re-build ... With the MONEYBALLERS deciding to not spend ANY MONEY IN FA even to re-sign our own so we could have it Jon the books at the end of the year .. Anyhow .. Even if they spent money in FA this team is either YOUNG AND RAW or just not very good .. That's what happens in a COMPLETE RE-BUILD ,.. And I think a complete re-build was the absolutely right and IMO only division .. I just would have gone about the tear down and the re-build a lot differently .. *L* .. On paper this is the 2nd best staff we've had since our return .. Hopefully they'll get the TALENT and TIME for us to find out .. My guess is the SNAKES MONEYBALLERS won't give them the talent they need witch will lead to the SNAKE FIRING the coaches cause he has to big an ego to ADMIT MONEYBALL doesn't work in football .. And back on the hamster wheel we go ..
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The hate and bitterness that exists w/in your heart is not healthy. Nah no hate, I don't really know you...if seeing each other personally we could be best friends. I know you from this board.
I do not Respect you...not hate.
You throw my favorite team that I love under the bus 24/7 some with credibility and sound football...but most just out of some Agenda that I really don't understand...Possibly you are the one who is Bitter cause you are a season ticket holder and feel you are more justified in your frustration than others??
As I said I really don't know you that well. I don't Hate what I don't know. I definitely do not respect you. And I'm clear on why.
I think you bully post more than anyone here. You cry to refs more than anyone here. And a hypocrite as I just easily proved where you state you never said Hue was a dirty coach...and I quote 3 posts up where you did just that???
You post your way...I post mine...but it has to be your way or the highway. Now its me being positive and Homer meaning I HATE YOU. smh
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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D Dawg, you ever see Kelly's Heroes...Sutherland always saying, "what's will all the negativity, man", you negative man, this team hasn't practiced a real football down yet, you call the owner a snake constantly, a billionaire who's invested his money in team AND the city...what positives do you contribute...the team will sub par (JMHO) coaching staff was in most games, few blowouts...with better coaching maybe they get few more wins...our FA loses, good player WHO DIDN'T WANT TO BE HERE...hope the door did hit them in butt as they felt...good they're gone...front office can't and shouldn't beg guys to stay here...lastly, to say "the snake" will fire everyone, jump on treadmill again....before a down off football....man, you the negativity man for sure....GO Browns!!! EO +1, truths hurt, his only comeback was LOL....really....is laughing positive....GO Browns!!!!
"You've never lived till you've almost died, life has a flavor the protected will never know" A vet or cop
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You come across as an extremely educated person.
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The roster speaks for itself Versatile Dog and Diam Dawg aren't being negative. They have looked at this roster the 90 man roster And they see I think a roster is not ready to reach .500 Yet or even compete in the AFC North If you did a list of the Top 100 players in the AFC how many Browns would make it? Be real. This team has drafted very poorly since 1999. It's never had even a above average draft Every year the Browns draft the 4th best or worst out of the North teams Compare this roster to the rest of the North or AFC. It's sad.
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We have danced this dance for so many years that I have lost count. During most off-seasons, I give my opinions on the talent--or lack thereof--of the current roster. eotab, and some others, come on here and attack my character. The season plays out. The team stinks. No apologies. NO admissions of being wrong. And then they jump right back into the same character attacks the next year.
It's to the point I don't care what they think. I will give my honest opinions on the roster. When the talent gets better, I will change my tune. But, no amount of character attacks is going to make me give false evaluations.
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Attack your character...lol Make it up as you go along.
Just because our roster is young you think we have a terrible roster.
Just cause the Browns have not faired well in the past does not make you right in your football.
You have called, Haden a bum...yet he makes the Pro Bowl. You have called Gipson a bum yet he prospered. You have called Skrine a bum yet he progressed nicely. You told us McCown was a bum and yet he did just fine. You don't think our RBs are good enough and yet Hue thinks their great. I'm to ignore Hue over you.
You are not as correct as you present yourself. The only record you have is this Franchise just has not been able to set itself...because of that you think all your slamming of our talent is correct.
And your entire base of credibility you put out there is that you've been right in the past so ergo you are correct now.
And if you have posted positive in the past we are garbage in our evaluations. Just cause you post negative on the subjects and we end up losing and changing regimes over again which makes it difficult for positive results right away. Does not make you correct.
As for your comment that I attack you for your honesty and pure posting
Again you are probably the biggest Bully poster ever.
This is one of the first years that fans frustration are so great that they have been swayed to your line of thinking and so you finally have the majority of the boards behind you...now its a fabrication saying I've ATTACKED you for your opinion. I've given my opinion as a contrast...Actually I for several years protected you from attacks of others. you just make it up as you go along don't you.
Hear is the good news...now that the majority of this board is so fed up with our changing of the guard they agree with you whole heartedly.
We are going to turn it around this year. Yes cause we have a good coaching staff. Yest cause we have more talent than you know. But then you don't state any of that until AFTER THE FACT...so you can say see I'm so smart...like you have with Skrine and Gipson and others. Unbelievable.
Our Browns I think have the best young talent we have ever had.
The only thing that can hold us back is the natural transition period of a new O and D. Also a run on key injuries would do us in. But in most positions we have Depth for one of the few times since 1999.
jmho
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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You make a lot of things up when it comes to who I like or liked. I don't really care anymore.
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Not at all...after the fact you say you like so n so...especially when we are losing them to FA... My apologies for calling you out on your in correct slapping yourself on your back...lol
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Gents ... Who's calling plays for us this year?
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Crowell should be cut tabber .. I'm ashamed to be a Dawg for the first time in my life!
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Gents ... Who's calling plays for us this year? Here is an article about it. The article also has a couple of other funy quotes from Jimmy Crook. CLEVELAND, Ohio – Browns owner Jimmy Haslam has no issue with new coach Hue Jackson calling his own plays next season. Haslam cited the success of Chiefs coach Andy Reid and Packers coach Mike McCarthy running their own offenses. Reid actually sought help from offensive coordinator Doug Pederson late in the season while McCarthy reportedly went back calling plays. "I actually feel great, I really do," Haslam said of Jackson's decision. "You look at some of the better offenses. How do you feel about Kansas City's offense? How do you feel about Green Bay's offense?" Jackson called plays for the Bengals the past two seasons while serving as their offensive coordinator. "Hue and I, we had a lot of candid talks about it when we interviewed him," Haslam said Thursday night at the 16th annual Greater Cleveland Sports Awards. "He said, 'listen, it's one of the things I do best. I don't want to delegate that, at least early on.' and we're enthusiastic about him, so why would you have one of the best play callers in the league not call plays?" Pat Shurmur was the last Browns coach to call his own plays in 2011. He relinquished the duties the following season. Horton 2.0 Haslam said there's no sense of awkwardness with the return of Ray Horton. The defensive coordinator also worked in the same capacity on Rob Chudzinski's staff, which was fired after one season in 2013. "Listen, we have good relationships," the owner said. "We try to keep relationships. I called Chud on a reference the other day. Chud calls me on references. So we keep those relationships. I've seen Ray several times. Ray likes to go out to Arizona and play golf. He would send me pictures of truck stops of ours he's in, so we've kept the relationship up." Quotebook Haslam on whether the team's relationship with quarterback Johnny Manziel can be mended: "Oh, yeah, I don't think there's any question about that. We talked to Johnny before he left. I know a big deal was made that Hue hasn't called Johnny yet. Well, we've got 53 players on the active and 10 more and there were a couple of other real prominent players that he just talked to in the last day or two, so I'm sure he'll get around to talking to him. http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2016/01/owner_jimmy_haslam_fine_with_c.html
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I know a big deal was made that Hue hasn't called Johnny yet. And why would Hue call Manziel anyway? I expect Hue is busy enough with the present Browns that he doesn't need to mix with those (failures) of the past...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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That article was from late January.
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We are going to turn it around this year. While it is unlikely that we will reach our goal, I do believe that we have turned the corner and are on the right path...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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~ Legend
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Horton would text Jimmy whenever he was at a Pilot? Hahaha that's funny.
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I think the year zero was absolutely needed here in Cleveland. Last year we had the highest paid defense in the NFL and could not stop anyone. The Offensive Line was touted as being a top 5 Offensive line in the NFL last year yet ranked 22nd in rushing yards. Things had to change.
Fans are complaining that we lost good players like Alex Mack, Mitchell Schwartz, Travis Benjamin, and Tashawn Gipson. Could these players have helped us in 2016 yes. But, we were 3-13 with them. I hope they do well with their new teams but have moved on.
This team was not going to win more than 5 games with or without them this upcoming season. That is why drafting 14 new young players will infuse this team with much needed youth and enthusiasm. They will improve the overall team speed on both sides of the ball. Then next years draft is set up to again infuse the team with another surge of young talent. The culture was not going to change holding onto players that did not want to be here.
I think the 2 biggest areas this team improved is at the skill position and pass rush.
There is speed and talent at the skill position. Better than the last few years. Duke and Crow in the backfield, Barniedge at Tight End, and Coleman, Hawkins, Higgens, Payton, and Louis. Maybe Pryor. Reports is he is doing really well. I think you can feel the expectations at the skill position by not see article after article about Josh Gordon because he was the only hope the last few years on the outside. This team will score more points this year vs last. Unfortunately, I expect more turnovers too. That comes with so much youth.
The pass rush will be improved with young players like Emmanual Ogbah, Carl Nessib, and Joe Schobert. There is still work to do to have a great pass rush but it will be improved from last year.
Biggest question marks are;
Will RG3 emerge as the QB he was drafted 2nd overall to be or will the Browns still be looking for a QB in 2017?
Will a new scheme and better conditioned Danny Shelton improve the run defense?
Can Cameron Erving adequately replace Alex Mack? Can Shon Coleman or the 2 Ex Seattle Seahawk lineman replace Mitchell Schwartz?
Can the Browns find an improved run game?
Will Joe Haden return to his pro bowl level of play?
Will we see any of the past 1st round disappointments improve under Hue and Ray Horton?
It is much easier to come onto these boards and post negative than positive. I try to be realistic. There are still quite a few question marks. I do not see a huge turn around during the 2016 season but I do see this year zero as a positive.
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
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Day Dawg, no negativity, refreshing....agree with your points, Haden's ankle scares me- will be interesting to see if our current cast can bring heat to Qbs...no one is mentioning Mingo, he has talent, wonder if Horton can get it out of him....GO Brown!!!
"You've never lived till you've almost died, life has a flavor the protected will never know" A vet or cop
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Day Dawg, no negativity, refreshing....agree with your points, Haden's ankle scares me- will be interesting to see if our current cast can bring heat to Qbs...no one is mentioning Mingo, he has talent, wonder if Horton can get it out of him....GO Brown!!! Wouldn't be a real treat if players like Mingo and Gilbert stud out this year. Would sure speed up the growth of this young team if that was to happen. They both have the physical talent.
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
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This team has more question marks than sure things. Mingo ...Gilbert are busts failures wasted draft picks. Doesn't matter the scheme or coaching they cant make that transition To be elite NFL talents. Worst defense in the AFC. NO DIFFERENCE MAKERS YOUTH DOES NOT EQUATE SUCCESS. Theirs gonna be so much miscommunication on defense in 2016
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I think the year zero was absolutely needed here in Cleveland. Last year we had the highest paid defense in the NFL and could not stop anyone. The Offensive Line was touted as being a top 5 Offensive line in the NFL last year yet ranked 22nd in rushing yards. Things had to change.
Fans are complaining that we lost good players like Alex Mack, Mitchell Schwartz, Travis Benjamin, and Tashawn Gipson. Could these players have helped us in 2016 yes. But, we were 3-13 with them. I hope they do well with their new teams but have moved on.
This team was not going to win more than 5 games with or without them this upcoming season. That is why drafting 14 new young players will infuse this team with much needed youth and enthusiasm. They will improve the overall team speed on both sides of the ball. Then next years draft is set up to again infuse the team with another surge of young talent. The culture was not going to change holding onto players that did not want to be here.
I think the 2 biggest areas this team improved is at the skill position and pass rush.
There is speed and talent at the skill position. Better than the last few years. Duke and Crow in the backfield, Barniedge at Tight End, and Coleman, Hawkins, Higgens, Payton, and Louis. Maybe Pryor. Reports is he is doing really well. I think you can feel the expectations at the skill position by not see article after article about Josh Gordon because he was the only hope the last few years on the outside. This team will score more points this year vs last. Unfortunately, I expect more turnovers too. That comes with so much youth.
The pass rush will be improved with young players like Emmanual Ogbah, Carl Nessib, and Joe Schobert. There is still work to do to have a great pass rush but it will be improved from last year.
Biggest question marks are;
Will RG3 emerge as the QB he was drafted 2nd overall to be or will the Browns still be looking for a QB in 2017?
Will a new scheme and better conditioned Danny Shelton improve the run defense?
Can Cameron Erving adequately replace Alex Mack? Can Shon Coleman or the 2 Ex Seattle Seahawk lineman replace Mitchell Schwartz?
Can the Browns find an improved run game?
Will Joe Haden return to his pro bowl level of play?
Will we see any of the past 1st round disappointments improve under Hue and Ray Horton?
It is much easier to come onto these boards and post negative than positive. I try to be realistic. There are still quite a few question marks. I do not see a huge turn around during the 2016 season but I do see this year zero as a positive.
I was only going to quote your 1st 1.5 paragraphs, but you stuck with the point. I get so tired of reading this kind of nonsense year after year, (and this is not to insult you, poster) But if all there is to say is 1. BLAME LAST YEARS WIN LOSS TOTAL 2. SAY THEY WEREN'T GOING WIN THIS COMING YEAR ANYWAY, 3 That those first two JUSTIFY incontinuity , and justifying blowing everything up again, and for the I honestly don't know 5 OF THE LAST 7 YEARS??? STARTING WITH ANOTHER ROOKIE HEAD COACH AND ANOTHER SET OF NEW COORDINATORS, AND NEW SCHEMES. That this is some kind of positive. I don't know about you, or everyone else, BUT I WANT A TEAM I CAN ROOT FOR! A TEAM WITH AN IDENTITY AND YOU CAN'T HAVE THAT WITH THE FULL CHANGE EVERY TIME. EVENTUALLY YOU HAVE TO STICK A PLAN OUT, WIN OR LOSE, FOR SOME AMOUNT OF TIME. otherwise it's just orange helmuts and the team name.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Maybe the young pups will put em in the smasher.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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Crowell should be cut tabber .. I'm ashamed to be a Dawg for the first time in my life! Now that is funny...lol Why on earth should we cut Crowell? Does he have a fumbling problem, discipline problem. He's a dependable down hill runner that in our recent past we have had trouble with our run game cause teams as a rule Game plan to stop our run and dictate that our PASSING game beat them which just doesn't.
He catches the ball all be it that it doesn't always look pretty but he doesn't have a dropping problem.
He spends time in the class room and is looking to learn and work hard. I don't get the we should just cut him statement.
Is he Adrian Peterson...no but who is?
jmho - Odd I'm at one of my highest as for (real) expectations of the Organization. I like the staff, I like the young talent. I just think we are finally on the right track and the Boss will not pull the trigger fast this time.
Finally I see some continuity on our horizon. Ashamed??? Why what did we do compare to other years that would make you all of a sudden ashamed? I don't get it...I understand the words, I can understand frustration. Ashamed though???
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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right and there goes your hypocritical claim that I alway attack and insult you for your opinion. smh
That was uncalled for.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Perhaps you should google Crowell's name before you start making fun of Diam.
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Again, with the negative/positive poles....Crow acted on two impulses within minutes...one real dumb, then judgement kicked in and rest is history....again, he's committed his money and time to fix a mistake....to state we don't have racial social differences is lie....we are all imperfect....football isn't the only thing in life....hope our young over achieving stud draftees produce...we sure need them...AND Mingo/Gilbert need to step up and be more than they have been.....GO Browns!!!!
"You've never lived till you've almost died, life has a flavor the protected will never know" A vet or cop
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Gents ... Who's calling plays for us this year? Hue Jackson, and I wonder how many people around here will be calling for his head six games into the season when we are not scoring 40 points per game 
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Vers is talking about Crowells troubled past in college, I'm not sure if Diam is.
As for his college issues, he seemed (up to this point) to be on the right track, head in the books, plays hard. Not the second coming of Jim Browns, but then few are.
As for my thoughts on his recent transgression, yeah, that was without a doubt, boneheaded.. Stupid.. Idiotic.. Shameful. I don't think I know anyone that things otherwise.
As for cutting him, maybe that will happen. not sure. It's not like we have this bunch of pro bowlers behind him. And maybe that shouldn't matter.
I wouldn't cut him at this point. But I have to be honest, the thought crossed my mind.
Hopefully he'll be able to make amends and we can just move on.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
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It's not that I don't think coaching is important. It is that I think people are overrating the current coaching staff and trashing the previous coaching staff. This made me think about a video on the Browns home page I watched.. I'm not sure if it was posted on this board. I'm sure a lot of posters may have seen it. Here it is, just for the heck of it... Hue What I saw was a HC being hands on and showing lots of energy and trying to teach the players.. All I can remember from Pet was that scowl and his arms folded as he just stood there. Pet When the season starts we will get the opportunity to see how the new staff and players are molding themselves to be. Not sure how it will work out, but I do like the energy so far... Not over rating.Not even rating... Nothing to rate yet.. As far as trashing last years staff.. 3-13 from 7-9 the previous season... Well..the record speaks for it's self.
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Vers is talking about Crowells troubled past in college, I'm not sure if Diam is. No, Vers is not talking about Crow's college past. Vers believes that Diam wants Crow cut because of the cutting of a cop's throat hat Crow posted on the internet. Vers also believes that eotab was not aware of that despicable act and was therefore, wrongly making fun of Diam. Furthermore, Vers has never said to cut Crow, but he is tired of tab saying stupid things.
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Again, with the negative/positive poles.. Go away.
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Joined: Apr 2013
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No....write about football more than personal attacks...JMHO, Crow should be kept because we all make mistakes and he's taking positive steps to fix his mistake....DeisleDawg, will be interesting to see if positive vibes from nearly every player for Hue/staff equals more wins....I think O will be much improved/less predictable and attack vs read/react D will be more fun to watch/time will tell if more successful....GO Browns!!!!
"You've never lived till you've almost died, life has a flavor the protected will never know" A vet or cop
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,188
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,188 |
Tabber - has nothing to do with his football skills or his acting like a dumb ass in college ..
Not the place to talk about it .. It's all about the tweet ... He should have been cut before he deleted it .. DISGUISTING POS IMO!
As for his football .. He's way to inconsistent for me .. He shows flashes of being an above average back .. The he'll disappear for 2 or 3 games in a row .. He's the best we got right now .. Don't think Duke can be the every down back ..
I don't understand why u guys are setting such high expectations ... We'll be lucky to win 4 games ... And I mean LUCKY ...
We're so YOUNG ,,, new systems on O and D .. Not much talent in the older fella's .. Like I said before .. Lombardi as HC .. Walsh as OC and Billicheck as DC couldn't win THIS year with the youth, learning curve that comes with new systems and a lack of talent at most positions ...
We could win 1 game with our staff getting every ounce of production this team is capable of this year .. Our staf could do there best coaching jobs ever and we still may not win 2 games ..
Just a real bad SET OF CIRCUMSTANCES for this years W/L record ,..
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 7,091
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 7,091 |
... He should have been cut before he deleted it .. IMO, it depends on how genuinely contrite that he actually was. Only his team/teammates likely know...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
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OP
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
No....write about football more than personal attacks.. Are you freaking kidding me. Almost every post you makes begins w/an attack on "negative" posters.
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Year Zero for Hue and the Browns?
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