DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Gangbangers Kill White Teen Girl

Destroy the class system. Unite the people. Vote for a people who are for the people. That's the only way we can elevate us all.

War On Drugs focused in the inner city
Mass incarceration of male population (age 14-30)
Lack of investment in urban infrastructure/jobs
White flight in the 50's 60's
Food deserts
Real estate 'redlining'
Inequities in lending policies (banks)
Substandard education
Lack of medical facilities

Oh, my bad.... you asked for ONE example.

Jim Crowe didn't die. He just put on some camouflage.

That sounds like a lot of opinion.

Unfortunately for America, it isn't.

You mentioned the 50's?60's?

OK, is American more racist now and if so how did that happen?

I could go line by line and argue those, but you can't throw out blanket statements, and make me dig into them on a case by cases basis. Show me a policy or a person who is racist and we can change it. Saying America is racist is ridiculous.


No where on earth do black people have more opportunities.

My point is you taking blanket statements and saying see, there it is racism. That's not how reasonable people debate. Explain it to me, show me a racist, show me a racist law and we can combat it.

Saying racism doesn't solve anything. Because unfortunately the left in this country had led us to believe that everything is racist and it's lost about all of it's meaning.

I've made a detailed post, with credible links even from conservative sites showing how drugs on the schedule 1 list, and who uses said drugs, are judged accordingly.

It was a long post, filled with nothing but facts.

Everybody here saw it. I know you don't post here a lot, but nothing I said is a blanket statement, nor is anything I said an opinion. It's all fact based.

Individuals are racist. Judges, sure, cops, sure. Saying the system is racist based on choice of drugs is not racism.

So why is smoked cocaine a schedule 1 drug and snorted cocaine is a schedule 2 drug?

I have no idea, but I’m willing to bet it had a lot to do with the murders being committed surrounding smoked cocaine than it did race. I am ignorant to that specific reasoning I will admit.

That doesn’t mean the entire thing is racist because one law seems to affect a race more. Laws can be changed. Also personal responsibility, no one should be abusing cocaine regardless. Drugs are illegal and everyone knows that.


Is it sexist that men are 90% of the prison population because women commit less crime?

So to cut down on crack cocaine they don't make all cocaine as punishable? Cut down on the supply that way? You're right though. Publicly that was the racially undertoned narrative used by Presidents since Reagan and exemplified by the Clintons. Think "Super predator" when describing teenagers. Again a major problem. It's certainly a major problem.

How one person describes a group of teenagers isn't a major problem. The person who uttered the words "super predator" is a racist idiot......we can combat individuals but what groups are the groups pushing said racist idiot into office?


I don't want to get into the election but I hope you can see my train of thought.

Talk about a blanket statement.

Canada, Europe, Japan, and pretty much every other US ally. Those are all up for debate in comparison to the US.

Ha! Those places are way, way more racist than America man (maybe not Canada), have you ever left the US?

Yes.

As a matter of fact I did missionary work in some of these places in my younger days. Care to elaborate instead of making a blanket statement? Good luck trying to argue these places are more racist than the entire south. Oh see, another blanket statement.

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/community/20...r/#.V8cmlvkrKUk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-iRLmaZf4A



Those are just two examples aside from my personal experience. Japan doesn't even allow immigration! Ever seen anyone throw bananas on the American football field?

Question,

If trump were to be elected, what's the difference between his policies and what his base wants and the article you just posted?

Also, I'm shocked. Drunk sports fans yelling offensive stuff? Crazy.

Nice strawman, I am not a trump supporter.

Not really. Do you deny Trump having a large following? Do you deny a large group of individuals in the United States that want his policies put into place?

Also, I'm shocked. Drunk sports fans yelling offensive stuff? Crazy.

It is absolutely a strawman and I am done debating with you.

You're allowed to do that. Kinda glad you didn't take the Vers route.

Except Politicians don't just say random stuff and don't act on it, well, maybe not too long ago. Clinton calling children super predators was in response of her creating mandatory minimums. A move which helps strengthen gang ties more. Because if you thought you needed a gang in the street, well, you really need one in prison. Again, this isn't empty rhetoric. This is institutional racism.

We need a better diversity outreach program.


I would hope that pretty much everybody can see the connection between gangs and gang violence and police shootings and racism in general. It's all connected and it impacts EVERYBODY... and gang violence is connected to poverty, poor education, breakdown in family structure, etc... That's why these complex topics are so damn hard to discuss on a message board, because with so many participants, the conversations usually ends up going down a rabbit hole and being focused on one thing that somebody said that somebody else took offense to...

so we can all agree that gangs are bad... ok, what next? Do we want to talk about why gangs happen? The impact they have on society as a whole? What could be done to eliminate them or at least make them less attractive to join? Y'all tell me. I'd love to talk about, primarily because I don't know much about it.. so I'll offer my opinions and ask a lot of questions and try to learn some stuff...

Let's go. Who wants to start?

I kind of mentioned before why they form. People join gangs because they are either forced to or they need a sense of belonging.

Why don't we just go back to the last society that didn't have organized crime and see how they did it? We could just copy that.

And THIS is where a distincion and some definitions must be laid out before you'll understand where I'm coming from.

There is a difference between bigotry and racism. Bigotry is a set of individually-held beliefs. Racism is an institution (hence, the suffix: -ism). The two should not be used interchangeably as they are today. The sentence I quoted is a prime example of just that. Words (and word choice) are important when discussing important issues like this one.

The primary feature of racism is a system that places one group at a decided advantage over others. Race IS at the heart of it, BUT... it doesn't make every member of that dominant race bigots. In other words, a White American can have not a single bigoted bone in his body, and still be the beneficiary of a system that favors his kind over others.

Here's an example: In China, there are laws and social conventions that deny equal opportunities to people of Japanese descent. Members of the dominant culture (based on ethnicity) enjoy more freedoms and opportunities than do members of the social minority. No doubt there are good Chinese people who may even have Japanese friends/co-workers, but they still enjoy a social/economic/political advantage that is built-into everyday life.

You see... THAT'S why it was so easy for me to come up with that laundry list of evidentiary exapmles that your challenge requested. They are all here for all to see- in plain sight.

We still have housing discrimination. We still have residential neighborhoods that are off-limits to many who fall outside the 'preferred profile'
We still have banks refusing to extend loans to some, while green-lighting others with equal/similar credit profiles.
We still have police policy that targets some, while ignoring others

BpG: it's absolutely everywhere. The problem is that many can't see it, because it's part of the fabric of daily life. It's just the way things are/always have been. And as such, it's invisible to those who are not directly affected by it.

Invisible doesn't mean "non-existent."
Like I said earlier: words are important.

There are a handful of AA Dawgs who regularly post in these threads. To my knowledge, NONE of us have ever met. We've grown up in completely different homes, in completely different towns, and live completely different lives.... and yet, we all can plainly see this with no trouble whatsoever. Why do you think that is? Quick answer: each and every one of us has been effected by this system in a personal way at one time or another in our lives.

We aren't in a secret club; we don't have pow-wows to get our talking points straight before engaging in these discussions. We tell you the things we do because they truly do exist in our society. We aren't lying, our examples aren't 'opinion,' and the facts we've given to support our POV's have been backed by years of studies in both the public AND private sector.

Talks like these have left me exhausted, of late. In 2 weeks, I'm going to turn 60, and I've been preaching this gospel for more than 4 decades... often to deaf ears. I'm old, and I'm tired... and things are only marginally better than when I took up this challenge.

Personally, I'm happy to see young'uns like Swish and others continue this narrative. America is easily the best country on the planet (my opinion), but she isn't perfect- and this is one of the areas in which she could still benefit from improvement.

A rising tide lifts all boats... but some have been given boats with holes. It's harder to rise, when you're spending most of your time bailing and patching.


.02,
Clem

Clem, I almost always agree with you but in this case, I have to disagree.

I do agree, 100% with your sentiment.. but I think you just described the difference between racism and oppression. Racism is individually held beliefs.. oppression is a system that places one group at a disadvantage.. and not everybody within an oppressive system is necessarily racist..

Gimme a sec

I know that's why people join them.. I would add, quick money, lack of hope for a better future, and excitement to that.. but why they actually form? I think they form because there is power in numbers.. a gang of 30 can control more territory and have a lot more power and control over people than 15 groups of 2.

They can form out of family and friends going through what we described.

I hear ya. Like I said, I'm not that familiar with them beyond what I've heard, read, and the opinions I've formed from that..

J/C...

Imo... A young girl suffered and died in a tragic way...I feel very bad for her.. And my thoughts are of her...

People kill people... Evil doesn't give a damn about anything else...

A lot of gangs, mafias, organizations, whatever set, squad, or group you want to call them, is tribalism.

There's no way to point to one universal issue and solve a problem for all.

Each group has its own identities, own visions of what they are following or fighting for.

The overall goal of a Blood isn't the same as the overall goal of MS 13.

The reasons why people join the aryan nation isn't the same as why people join the Crips.

Completely different motivations. The only thing similar across the board is how they operate to achieve said goals.

And the tools they use to get there are also similar:

Drugs, money, bribery, kidnapping, sexy trafficking, real estate, government, etc,

All tools of the trade.

Some squads are rooted in turmoil, which means there's a chance to prevent more from being recruited by fixing the reasons why they join.

Others are generational based, meaning the crime life is everything.

And then, which is unfortunately MOST, they do the life style simply because that's who they are.

They saw it on a movie, to show, documentary, music video, video game, news article, news channel, wherever, and went "yea, that's how I wanna make moves"

I can go on and on and on,

Economics can fix a lot. But it isn't fixing everything. The culture of the community has to change. The culture on how the majority demographic treats its minority demographic has to change.

Tribalism will go from maybe 3 people, to whole religious groups like Christians.

The point of progressing as a society and becoming better overall is to knock down barriers at a more efficient rate than what we're doing.

We stand there with a sledge hammer, yet instead of using it on the wall, we decide to scream at it.

This topic is so damn deep that honestly, I wrote all that and still don't know where to even begin.

If y'all want real dialogue, we're talking psychology here. Why people think a certain way.

It's not gonna be an easy discussion. Which is why it's such a hard problem to fix. We keep pushing off the discussion and letting the problems get worse and worse.

I see this more as a richer, poorer thing not a black and white. Please correct me if I am wrong but don't people do crack instead of coke because it's cheaper? Don't folks who can afford the good lawyers or a team of lawyers get off or with lighter sentences than people who can't afford the good team of lawyers?

I wanted to talk about gangs and how destructive they are to their community AND how we might resolve the gang problem.

Instead, I got candy, King, and Swish turning this into a personal attacks while avoiding the issue. And then, the rest of the thread turns into it's the white governments fault for gang violence.

Meanwhile, the real problem/solution is yet again ignored.

I am so sick of the ignorance!

We United.


I thought that's what you wanted from whites and blacks.

Ok Vers...


I will give you that I think gangs ruin far more young black lives than the police... so they are 2 different, but important issues... so let's talk about gangs.

What can be done? Toss out an idea or two, let's talk about it.

Thanks DC.

I will submit a brief edition on how to curb gang violence. If people truly want to discuss it in-depth, I will expound.

My real goal was not to control the discussion, but throw in a few points and get others to offer their suggestions. There are some intelligent posters on this board [you are one of them] and I think trying to move from conversation to finding solutions is the intelligent course of action.


As you are aware, I am attempting to start a program in Columbia, SC. Funding is tough. Cooperation from elected officials is tough. They love the idea, but action is another story.


First of all, it's important to identify the at-risk youths. I am thinking between the ages of 11-16.

Cooperation is needed from government officials, local business, local police departments, and the families of those at-risk children. Taxes and donations would fund the project.

Recreational activities, tutoring services, and counseling would be given to our youths by a bevy of different people. Scholarships would be set-up for those that completed the program.

Once the parents signed their kids up for the program, there would be no tolerance for arrests, poor school attendance, school expulsions, etc.

The idea is to hold the kids accountable and then reward them for conducting themselves properly.

The key to the success of the program would be for the community [business, government, the police, rec departments, educators, and the identified neighborhoods to work cooperative to educate, support, motivate, and hold our at-risk children accountable while encouraging them all along the entire journey that they can indeed become successful.

I have a lot more, but that is enough to perhaps generate interest and constructive comments.

What do you guys think?

[quote=Versatile DogInstead, I got candy, King, and Swish turning this into a personal attacks while avoiding the issue. [/quote] What I said was not a personal attach, do you even know what a personal attack is ? You know, like when you tell everyone how stupid they are? that's a personal attack.

I responded to your thread, and I stand by what I said. It was race baiting crap, beginning with the thread title. What happened to that girl was horrible, but is it worse because it was a white girl? Your insinuation that gangs are a black thing is also a huge, ignorant, racist insult.

You have told me in other threads that I should shut up because you have way more knowledge and experience in that subject. Well now it comes back at you , you have no clue what you are talking about when it comes to gangs, and inner city street life. So as some of you like to say, kick rocks