What's wrong with wearing a Castro and Malcolm X shirt? Shows me you're more down with the cause than most. Castro is a pretty polarizing figure and certainly has done some horrific things, but also some great things. Granted Cuba will be much better once the Castros are gone.
i NEVER took a shot at you for your kid being gay.
i specifically said i dunno why you feel the need to go after the personal stuff when i was DEFENDING your son.
you and Vers....wow.
again, i don't give a damn about the shirt. the shirt is stupid. the socks is stupid.
i already said that. it's not helping his cause whatsoever.
but talking about a shirt and talking about some socks is deflecting from the issues he's addressing.
and the actions he took to address those.
i am NOT equating Colin to MLK, but that kind of rhetoric reminds me of history, when MLK was marching and speaking, yet the other side tried to discredit what he was doing by bringing up his affairs.
like, what does that have to do with what he's saying?
I'm a combat vet. what if i decided to not stand for the anthem? how would yall try to discredit me?
this idea that somebody has to be squeaky clean to have any sort of credibility in protest is laughable. everybody has flaws. everybody don't make sound decisions in the heat of battle.
at least this guy is trying to stand up for what he believes in. i rather be surrounded by people like that then a bunch of fake patriots who only want people to exercise their rights as long as it's something THEY agree with.
Last edited by Swish; 09/06/1610:11 PM.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
First, I don't care if you stand for the anthem or not.
Second, yeah, you did take a shot at me for my son. But, in fairness, you may have done it out of anger, because you have defended gays. So, maybe the shot you took wasn't about gays, but about me?
About Colin? He can do what he wants. He's got the money to do whatever he wants for the rest of his live, his kids too, if he has any.
He can disrespect the country. It's his right.
Others can comment on it, it's our right.
He's set for life. But, he makes it seem like cops are out hunting blacks, and you know that's not true.
his overall point is the injustice and inequality within the justice system.
that is absolutely true.
and because he's set for life means what? he can't speak out for others who aren't set for life? he can't speak for others who have very little voice? he can't speak out against inequality?
Last edited by Swish; 09/06/1610:19 PM.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
But as more info comes out, he's looking more like a pouty butt. Why? Because what has he done? And what do his job prospects look like? For him, personally, it doesn't matter.
But, to basically proclaim cops are out hunting blacks, while wearing those socks, and the shirt he had, well, he looks kind of weird.
But as more info comes out, he's looking more like a pouty butt. Why? Because what has he done? And what do his job prospects look like? For him, personally, it doesn't matter.
But, to basically proclaim cops are out hunting blacks, while wearing those socks, and the shirt he had, well, he looks kind of weird.
Did he say cops were out hunting blacks??
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
your comments about other minority groups is laughable,
I do way more to help minorities than you do. Hell, you can't even comment when I proposed how to help the problem. I had a series of things to help minorities. I posted just one example and DC was the only one to comment on those.
king bashes me right afterwards. Then Lurker makes some stupid claim and the little cheerleaders [you, king, and Rocket] like his dumb-ass post.
You don't wanna move forward. You wanna wallow in self-pity and blame others for your own stupid, pathetic life.
What's wrong with wearing a Castro and Malcolm X shirt? Shows me you're more down with the cause than most. Castro is a pretty polarizing figure and certainly has done some horrific things, but also some great things. Granted Cuba will be much better once the Castros are gone.
This is a bizarre post.
Are you insinuating that our government and police officers don't ever do great things?
Here is what I think. Kap is a mental midget who was influenced by his girlfriend. He made a stand that wasn't based on intelligence or research. He got a ton of attention and Black Activists took notice and are now making him out to be some sort of crusader or martyr.
I get why they are doing that and applaud their message, but choosing Kap as your spokesperson could backfire due to the fact that he has always been a pouty, moody, mental midget.
I'm know for a fact people who banged in east cleveland don't use weak insults like that.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
What's wrong with wearing a Castro and Malcolm X shirt? Shows me you're more down with the cause than most. Castro is a pretty polarizing figure and certainly has done some horrific things, but also some great things. Granted Cuba will be much better once the Castros are gone.
This is a bizarre post.
Are you insinuating that our government and police officers don't ever do great things?
This is why no one likes you Vers. You're always looking to start fights. How'd you even end up there from my post? Are you trying to insinuate that police officers never do great things?
Kap is making his stand because people are being oppressed. Castro is far worse in regards to oppressing people than our government and law enforcement. You do realize that people have faced tremendous danger to escape from Cuba and come to the USA, right?
Yet, you say Castro has done some great things. Hasn't our government and law enforcement ever done great things?
Heck, did you see how many police officers were surrounding Kap last week. You know........to protect him.
The guy is not a hero. He's a privileged, hypocritical ingrate.
At this point, you aren't addressing points and have lowered yourself to non stop personal attacks.
Last edited by Swish; 09/07/1612:22 PM.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
You constantly complain about how bad you have it. It's what you do!
So bringing up relatable experiences to give my opinions credibility on the topics at hand is now complaining?
I don't complain about my military service nor what happened to me during the deployments.
What I do try to bring to light on EE is a different perspective on what life is like in the inner city, and how it ultimately ties into my life as of recently.
But see, this is the problem. If I share my experiences, it's me complaining.
If you share your experiences, it's you trying to teach people, right?
Last edited by Swish; 09/07/1612:26 PM.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
And once again, the focus has been shifted from Kap. Constant deflection.
Well, I was addressing Colin, and then you started making things personal.
You started the deflection. Everybody else was on topic.
Last edited by Swish; 09/07/1612:26 PM.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
I haven't replied to this topic because I simply think giving attention to such a thing only encourages it. I can't deny that any American citizen has a right to peaceful protest, but I sometimes either disagree with the message or the way the message is delivered.
Well for those who did not like the way he went about it, we're on page 7 now. It appears the objective of bringing attention to it worked. And IMO, everyone who contributed to it helped him succeed.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Kap is making his stand because people are being oppressed. Castro is far worse in regards to oppressing people than our government and law enforcement. You do realize that people have faced tremendous danger to escape from Cuba and come to the USA, right?
Yet, you say Castro has done some great things. Hasn't our government and law enforcement ever done great things?
Heck, did you see how many police officers were surrounding Kap last week. You know........to protect him.
The guy is not a hero. He's a privileged, hypocritical ingrate.
It wasn't a come back, homie. It was me trying to get you off of bofa.
I'm not going to get into an argument over who did Cuba more dirty. The CIA or Castro. All I will say on the matter is that it's a shame that Che did not stay. It's a shame that so many bad things happened in that country. It's a shame that they call themselves communists.
Also, I don't think police officers are bad! I think they're good people. If not, they wouldn't be protecting and serving us voluntarily. What I have qualms about is police unions that have turned into de facto fraternities. You know what fraternities get into. You know they're for life. My qualms are that their is not enough objectiveness within their ranks to properly deal with misconduct. Granted there isn't that objectiveness anywhere. But the police need to be held accountable because of their position of power. The entire government does, for that matter. Who guards the guardians homie?
I've heard Kap talk about policeMEN and WOMEN, and he's very grateful for their services. He's against the fraternity and how they operate.
I haven't replied to this topic because I simply think giving attention to such a thing only encourages it. I can't deny that any American citizen has a right to peaceful protest, but I sometimes either disagree with the message or the way the message is delivered.
Well for those who did not like the way he went about it, we're on page 7 now. It appears the objective of bringing attention to it worked. And IMO, everyone who contributed to it helped him succeed.
Kind of depends doesn't it? If his intention was to bring attention in order to open a discussion or change things, he doesn't appear to be all that successful considering not a single person has changed their mind or had an epiphany because of it.
But of his intention was to bring attention to himself, yes, I agree he did certainly succeed.
Frankly as far as socio-political statements go, think what Colin did was rather sophomoric. I mean the socks? I don't think there's been a cop since 1974 that has been offended by the whole "pig" thing. Hell, I wear a pig tie tack to court
And as far as the anthem goes, I too am a Vet, and like Swish it doesn't bother me. I really don't think there is a right or wrong answer to it honestly. Speech we disagree with is exactly the speech that needs protected the most. But I do understand why his (in)action would evoke such a strong feeling in people. Not just Vets, but the families of Vets.
"Hey, I'm a reasonable guy. But I've just experienced some very unreasonable things." -Jack Burton
-It looks like the Harvard Boys know what they are doing after all.
Kind of depends doesn't it? If his intention was to bring attention in order to open a discussion or change things, he doesn't appear to be all that successful considering not a single person has changed their mind or had an epiphany because of it.
Very few, if any, protests invoke some kind of Damascus Road experience where some people just completely change their opinion about something. It's just a part of the process. It's hard to say his protest is starting a conversation, there had been a heated race conversation going on for quite a while. His protest is just another step in that process.
Quote:
I don't think there's been a cop since 1974 that has been offended by the whole "pig" thing. Hell, I wear a pig tie tack to court thumbsup
Do you have a donut tie tack too?
Quote:
But I do understand why his (in)action would evoke such a strong feeling in people. Not just Vets, but the families of Vets.
Most of the people I see getting the most offended about him disrespecting vets... aren't vets. They are just offended on their behalf.
But it sure has brought out a lot of angry, nasty discourse from both sides.. so it's hard to say if it is actually advancing the conversation or just deepening the divide...
I will not have the option to kneel this Sunday while the National Anthem is being played. A week ago, in what would prove to be my last pre-game opportunity of this 2016 season, I stood with my right hand over my heart as the anthem played. And if I am fortunate enough to ever be dressed for another game day I imagine I would be doing the same thing I did in my last. Standing. Not because America is ALL I desire it to be because most assuredly it is not. Racism still stews, families are fractured, the unborn are trashed, schools are struggling, religious freedom is increasingly under attack, violence pollutes our cities and our suburbs, and there is a growing divide between law enforcement and the community.
I stand, however, because I grew up in NAVY town USA and traveled overseas to support members of our armed forces who follow orders regardless of their personal sentiments. I stand for those who were forced to give their lives building the country that confined them to the tobacco fields and indigo plantations. I stand because as a child, I saw my father stand. A man who lived the tumultuous transition from "separate but equal" to the times surrounding the Civil Rights Act when angry people who held signs at his new school viscously screamed "[censored] GO HOME!" I stand because on the contrary, no one held such a sign when I walked into my grade school.
Before competition, as I stand in shoulder pads and cleats, my helmet in my left hand, adrenaline flowing and my heart raging under my right, I never forget the ills of America but for a moment I envision its potential, remember its prosperity and give thanks to God for the land He has placed me in and the people I love who live in it. I stand, because this mixed bag of evil and good is MY home. And because it's MY home my standing is a pledge to continue the fight against all injustice and preserve the greatest attributes of the country, including Colin Kaepernick's right to kneel.
His actions and similar actions by figures of the past and present are a vital part of our journey and a key component of the equation for social change and should be respected as such. From the country's inception, such displays against the status quo are distinctly American. My hope, though, is that these actions bring more attention to the PROBLEM than to the PROTESTOR. And that ensuing dialog discover truth and that truth give birth to justice in legitimate situations where there is none. My hope is that in this time of toil and discord we collectively use our positions in public and private life to take responsibility for our role and collectively seek solutions, not because we HAVE to but because we CARE to. Sometimes listening is of greater value than speaking. As elusive an aspiration as it may be, our goal, especially in the arena of race, should continue to be to create an America where eventually everyone can, in good conscience, stand. No matter the historical context or the present circumstance that is the unity I, perhaps naively, imagine when I see our flag and listen to our anthem.
Conflict when handled correctly strengthens. Conflict when mismanaged destroys.
Benjamin Watson is a very, very good writer. That was incredible, and really summed up his feelings well .... and managed to wrap up a lot of my feelings, even though I come from a completely different background, into it as well.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Mr. Watson is a stand up individual worthy of respect.
I have observed him in interviews on a variety of topics. It is most unfortunate that he is not a spokesman for those complaining about social injustice, inequality and bias. He understands and holds the key to a positive path forward.
Wish he, and others like him, would step to the forefront more often. That is what this country needs. And yes, it is about the country, not subgroups of this country.
[quote] king bashes me right afterwards. Then Lurker makes some stupid claim and the little cheerleaders [you, king, and Rocket] like his dumb-ass post.
You don't wanna move forward. You wanna wallow in self-pity and blame others for your own stupid, pathetic life.
Just reading this.... I am not sure what stupid claim I made but saying the comment was stupid already shows that you have zero intention of having any meaningful conversation.
Me and Devil disagree all the time, I don’t think he would ever think my comments are stupid, we may not agree (which we usually don’t) but we have 2 different perspectives that help produce meaningful conversation. At the end of the day we are both learning from each other.
This is why no one takes your serious and a person like me thinks your claims are false, phony and plain old trolling. I don’t think you are genuine.
I always keep everything 92 + 8 So take this however you want /shrug
I will submit a brief edition on how to curb gang violence. If people truly want to discuss it in-depth, I will expound.
My real goal was not to control the discussion, but throw in a few points and get others to offer their suggestions. There are some intelligent posters on this board [you are one of them] and I think trying to move from conversation to finding solutions is the intelligent course of action.
As you are aware, I am attempting to start a program in Columbia, SC. Funding is tough. Cooperation from elected officials is tough. They love the idea, but action is another story.
First of all, it's important to identify the at-risk youths. I am thinking between the ages of 11-16.
Cooperation is needed from government officials, local business, local police departments, and the families of those at-risk children. Taxes and donations would fund the project.
Recreational activities, tutoring services, and counseling would be given to our youths by a bevy of different people. Scholarships would be set-up for those that completed the program.
Once the parents signed their kids up for the program, there would be no tolerance for arrests, poor school attendance, school expulsions, etc.
The idea is to hold the kids accountable and then reward them for conducting themselves properly.
The key to the success of the program would be for the community [business, government, the police, rec departments, educators, and the identified neighborhoods to work cooperative to educate, support, motivate, and hold our at-risk children accountable while encouraging them all along the entire journey that they can indeed become successful.
I have a lot more, but that is enough to perhaps generate interest and constructive comments.
What do you guys think?
And you responded w/this gem:
Quote:
First.. Vers you are race baiting and it sad, you came to start and force a fight everyone knows what you are doing. I've learned from DC sometimes their is no point in jumping in battles so i will stayout this stupid race baiting fight.
You are equating gangs with blacks, in that thread everyone agreed that those guys needed the worse treatment in life. What more do you want? It was a general consensus that those guys were the scum of the earth. However, you kept making the point about these black gang members and making it about race..... not the individuals who committed the crimes.
If you wanted to talk about gangs(which you claimed), make a thread about it, but remember gangs come in all races, and all of them can do terrible crimes. Gangs are linked to poverty, so poor people are going to be in gangs across the nation in every poor area.
I have worked w/gangs. I KNOW they aren't all blacks. You are so full of hate, you would rather turn that hate on me rather than work w/me to find solutions. Thus, that is why I said your post was "stupid."
I thought it was a National Anthem, not the "veteran" anthem.
I don't think it is all about veterans.. some are making it out to be. The flag is my symbol as much as it is a veteran's symbol.. Sorry if what I said wasn't clear.
I thought it was a National Anthem, not the "veteran" anthem.
I don't think it is all about veterans.. some are making it out to be. The flag is my symbol as much as it is a veteran's symbol.. Sorry if what I said wasn't clear.
I think it's leaning towards being "about veterans" because when they play the Anthem at sporting events, the PA announcer usually says in some form "And now will everyone rise as we pay respect towards the soldiers who have fallen with the National Anthem"
And because of that, people associate "National Anthem" with "Veterans"
I don't believe Kap or Lane or anyone who's not standing is trying to disrespect veterans.
Just like I don't believe that every veteran that died served in the military because they "love their country"
That's not why I joined. In 2016 you'll find more kids that just wanted a job, or to be able to go to college, and couldn't really give a crap about the country..
It's not as if Kap sat on the bench waving his arms yelling "I'M NOT STANDING AND THIS IS WHY.."
It just so happened in that moment someone noticed. He gave his reasons, the problem most have with it is the correlation between what the Anthem stands for in that moment.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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