DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2016 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 10 Eagles 29 Schobert gets the start!! Browns depth chart

I don't think Shelton is soft. I think he plays w/poor technique and was in poor shape.

I don't believe Erving is soft. I believe he was thinking too much. Hopefully he's settled in at center.

Mary Kay Cabot ‏@MaryKayCabot 6m6 minutes ago
All #Browns will play vs. #Eagles except for DB Marcus Burley. Means OLB Ogbah (hammy Thurs) will play.

My take on Shelton is that he is right where I expected him to be when we drafted him. he was the best player on board when we took him but he needed time to develop. Physically he wasnt there and his hand technique was horrible.

Shelton began last year as a 3, finished season as a 5, probably playing at about a 7 right now which is not great but above average at nose. He is making slow steady progress and if we are patient with this kid he can be a beast for us. Right now he can hold the line and force the double but he hasnt gotten to where he can defeat the double and still make the play.

Shelton is about where i expected him to be. Thats not a negative. Kid will be beasting before you know it.

Probably for Arizona.

Im sorry but Shelton is proving to be exactly what I said he would be. A quicker but nearly identical otherwise version of Rubin. Such a waste of a 1st

I want to see rotations of Paea and Meder. They might be the strongest players on the team and our best run defenders.

I don't recall, has Paea been mostly a 43DT and does he have experience in the 34? My guess is he'd be better suited as a 3-Tech than a nose tackle. I'm assuming he's behind Hughes on the depth chart at this point but I could be wrong.

Personally, I'm not all that enamored with Meder. I think the middle of our line will live/die with Shelton. I've been 'ok' with his growth but admittedly would like to see more this season.

Shelton does what he's supposed to do: clog up the middle.

I think Nassib and Ogbah are going to get owned against the run and that most fans will blame Shelton for their lack of discipline.

This is where we miss some experienced LB/DE the most ... our rush d will be very bad IMO

The entire defensive front seven will probably get owned by the run. Horton's attacking, one gap responsibility (at least his past indicated this) will expose us, probably the line more than anything else. I don't know X''s & O's enough to say how to combat this but my guess is ILBs will have to play a role in plugging some holes. I hear that is what Davis is good for and Kirksey has shown growth in all phases as far as I'm concerned.

It's unfortunate Bryant is out. This 34 style would have been very good for him, IMO.

I agree w/your post.

I just saw a lot of undisciplined play from the two rooks.....and that is to be expected.

Yeah, and I forgot to mention this when replying to Memphis, but I am not impressed w/either Davis or Kirksey on the inside. Neither guy is good at getting off of blocks and they have to rely more on "guessing right."

And speaking of guessing.........Nassib. LOL. He will flash and everyone will say how great he is, but he is going to get owned against the run. He has no clue right now.

And I actually pimped him before the draft.

I was hoping he would only be used as an interior rusher in nickel situations this year while he learned the intracasies of playing on the edge.

It's going to be a rough year.

And I know everyone will blame Horton...and I am not even a fan of his.......but, it won't be his fault, just as it wasn't O'Neil's fault last year.

This is a legit question rather than a rhetorical one. Does anyone remember the last time we were good against the run?

Bob Golic was at NT.

I think Nassib is best at rushing the QB, not run stopping. at least that is what I saw from him in preseason. could be wrong tho.

1992 - we ranked 7th in the NFL against the run at 100.3 yds per game. Actually most of the Belichick years weren't too bad, we were usually ranked in the top half of the league.

1992?

Well the Belichick era in general, in 1994 we gave up 104.3 yds per game rushing.

It's depends on where they play and how they are used.
If they are used 34 DE 5-tech I agree they'll get worked in the run game. But as Edge players OLB/43 DE I think they'll be fine.

I am seeing something very different then you are in Davis/Kirksey. Over the course of the preseason they've shown better then I expected in the run game. They're getting downhill and doing a good job getting off blocks.

I even posted screen caps of Kirksey take on, shed and make a stop.
.................................

I think the run game in base D is gonna come down to the front 3. Mainly Shelton.

The 4 man DL we saw vs Bucs played stout against the run. Nassib, Cooper, Shelton, Ogbah.

The LBs and Ss have looked good to me.

I saw some plays from both Kirksey and Davis where I really didnt like the angles they took and just seemed to put themselves into clutter instead of in a position to make a play. Both did some good things as well but I have a lot of questions regarding their play especially Davis. The only hit your thumper really made in 4 preseason games was a late hit out of bounds that wasnt called.

I believe our best inside backer may very well be the undrafted rookie Alexander and dont sleep on Scooby either. He is getting more and more comfortable with this scheme and continues to get back to full strength physically.

It is gonna be something to watch as the season goes on. Same with Poyer getting the nod over Kindred, it is just holding the position until Kindred takes over.

Now if I am the Eagles based on what i saw in preseason, I really just wanta create bodies on the floor and make these inside backers play through the clutter trying to find a Sproles. I am gonna use this youthful excitement against the young Browns defenders. Screens, Draws, maybe an end around.

First play though, I am looking to find out if haden really does wanta play football. Swing pass over to mathews and make Joe tackle. the eagles are watching our footage thinking damn, is there anything we cant do against this defense. lol

Alexander had a good pre-season, I agree.

So, you are predicting the Browns will be good against the run this year?

Vers I only disagree with you in regards to Kirksey.

I think people like Kirksey because he "flashes." He is a pretty fast guy and runs downhill well. Those are good attributes.

When he guesses right, he can make big plays due to that athleticism.

The problem comes is that he is not very good of negotiating his way through traffic on a consistent basis. He gets swallowed up way too many times. He also struggles w/lateral movement in the flat and often over-runs tackles.

At some point soon.........he will be upgraded.

Outside of Joe Thomas couldn't you say the same thing for everybody when it comes to upgrades?

LOL...........well, yeah.

Haha no, but we actually voluntarily downgraded at Punter so

Inactives Today:



Lemonier active of the post cut pick-ups.

edit: and Atkinson

Louis over Payton interesting

He's trying to prove my Boom pick right.

I was speaking very specifically about what I saw in preseason.
You and others say Kirk/Davis aren't good inside players. I saw something very different.

But the run game will ultimately come down to the base defense front 3 and the front 4. (and how they are used)
A lot of the run game will depend on Shelton, Hughes,Cooper and Paea

I didn't think he improved all that much.... I thought he got fatter.... He looked like he was a couple Big Macs shy of 400# He suppposedly lost 30 pounds in the off season and he still looks like the fattest guy on the field.... He needs to get in the gym and stay there. Turn about 50 pounds of that blubber into muscle. Hard to do when his Twitter handle is "The FEAST Mode". Feast mode needs to work. Man it would completely suck if we needed to draft another nose because he can't get it together.

I don't think we downgraded all that much and we saved a ton of money. Also, perhaps he demanded a trade and we obliged..... What went on in the lockerroon and behind the scenes is unknown.

He would look slimmer if he would not insist on wearing medium pants and jerseys

I don't think you should be so quick to criticize. His uniform is clearly a boys Husky!

But it's very well made. He didn't rip out any seams at all.

Anyway what did everybody think of Schobert's play yesterday?

Browns' Offensive Snap Counts and Stats vs. Eagles

By Chris Pokorny  @DawgsByNature on Sep 12, 2016, 7:56a



Looking at the offensive snap counts in the Browns' 29-10 loss to the Eagles.
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Below, we analyze the snap counts and stats on offense for the Cleveland Browns' Week 1 game against the Philadelphia Eagles.
Quarterback

Pos Player Plays % Stats
QB Robert Griffin III 51
100% 12-of-26 (46.2%) for 190 yards, 1 INT. 5 carries, 37 yards.

I am usually willing to give quarterbacks the benefit of the doubt after a bad performance, but this was a terrible outing for Robert Griffin III that saw him get completely outplayed by Carson Wentz. Yes, it's true that Griffin had three early dropped passes, the the snap way over his head ruined a chance at taking the lead. However, he had too many negatives.

After the triple coverage prayer to Corey Coleman to second half, there were back-to-back plays in which Terrelle Pryor and Andrew Hawkins beat their defender for what should've been an easy touchdown throw to the corner. Griffin overthrew them both times. His interception in the first half came when he failed to see a zone linebacker in the throwing lane. He also changed a play way too late at the line of scrimmage that led to a negative running play. I should add that Hue Jackson should share equal blame as Griffin, because this was a poor offensive gameplan he gave his quarterback to work with too.

Running Back

Pos Player Plays % Stats
RB Isaiah Crowell 30 59% 12 carries, 62 yards, 5.2 avg, 1 TD. 2 catches, 16 yards (2 targets).
RB Duke Johnson
22 43% 3 carries, 22 yards, 7.4 avg. 3 catches, 28 yards (5 targets).
RB Malcolm Johnson 10 20% 2 catches, 9 yards (2 targets).

With the game at 29-10 and about a minute to go, the Browns should've just taken a knee. Instead, they handed the ball off to Isaiah Crowell three times, allowing him to pick up 40 yards. Before that, he had 9 carries for 22 yards (2.4 YPC). I didn't think Crowell was bad, but the commitment to the run and the type of runs being called were not what I anticipated. Duke Johnson made some nice moves in the open field after catching passes to move the chains. Malcolm Johnson had 4 catches all of last season; he's got 2 already this year.

Wide Receiver

Pos Player Plays % Stats
WR Corey Coleman 47
92% 2 catches, 69 yards (5 targets).
WR Terrelle Pryor 46 90% 3 catches, 68 yards (7 targets).
WR Andrew Hawkins 33 65% 0 catches (3 targets). 1 carry, -1 yards.
WR Ricardo Louis
1
2% No stats registered.
WR Rashard Higgins 1 2% No stats registered.

Besides a bobble (which he still held on to), Terrelle Pryor was a bright spot on offense. His leap over a defender for a catch downfield was sound, even though it included a subtle pushoff. He also ran a nice route to get open in the end zone on a fade, but was terribly overthrown. Corey Coleman dropped a pass early but came back in the second half with two nice grabs. Andrew Hawkins got open a couple of times, but again was way overthrown by his quarterback. The other rookie receivers only got one snap each.

Tight End

Pos Player Plays % Stats
TE Gary Barnidge 50 98% 0 catches (2 targets).
TE Randall Telfer 10 20% No stats registered.
TE Seth DeValve
3 6% No stats registered.

It was stunning to see Gary Barnidge with two dropped passes in the first three series. Given how poorly the Browns played in general, I hate to think about the butterfly effect, but those dropped passes came during a stretch in which teams usually script plays to get into a rhythm. Barnidge wasn't targeted the rest of the game.

Offensive Line

Pos Player Plays % Stats
OL Joe Thomas 51 100%
OL Joel Bitonio 51 100%
OL Cameron Erving 51 100%
OL John Greco 51 100%
OL Austin Pasztor 51 100%
OL Spencer Drango 2 4%

The offensive line allowed 3 sacks and 5 quarterback hits. The biggest blunder of the game involved C Cameron Erving, whose snap over the head of QB Robert Griffin IIIfor a safety completely swung the momentum in favor of the Eagles again. Erving also snapped the ball high on the fake punt attempt.

http://www.dawgsbynature.com/2016/9/...tats-vs-eagles



- - - Updated - - -

Browns' Defensive Snap Counts and Stats vs. Eagles

By Chris Pokorny  @DawgsByNature on Sep 12, 2016, 8:12a


Looking at the defensive snap counts in the Browns' 29-10 loss to the Eagles.
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Below, we analyze the snap counts and stats on defense for the Cleveland Browns' Week 1 game against the Philadelphia Eagles.

Defensive Line

Pos Player Plays % Stats
DL Carl Nassib 54 70% 3 tackles (3 combined). 1 sack, 1 TFL, 2 QH, 1 pass defended.
DL Xavier Cooper 47 61% 4 tackles (4 combined).
DL Jamie Meder 44 57% 2 assists (2 combined).
DL Danny Shelton 42 55% 3 tackles, 1 assist (4 combined).
DL John Hughes 22 29% No stats registered.
DL Stephen Paea 16 21% No stats registered.

If there is one Browns player who received universal acclaim for his efforts against the Eagles, it was DL Carl Nassib, who is basically a starter. Credit to defensive coordinatorRay Horton for recognizing his work in the preseason and putting him on the field. His stat line is somewhat impressive, but it doesn't tell the full story. Nassib played the role a few times of helping drive Carson Wentz toward one of his teammates to make a hit. He also stayed home with Wentz a few times off of a playaction fake. Danny Shelton had an OK game -- I was happy to see he wasn't being blown off the ball left and right. Even though Cleveland allowed 133 yards rushing, they kept the yards per carry to 3.9 for the Eagles.

Outside Linebacker

Pos Player Plays % Stats
OLB Emmanuel Ogbah 56 73% 1 tackle (1 combined). 1 pass defended.
OLB Joe Schobert 29 38% 1 tackle (1 combined). 1 pass defended.
OLB Nate Orchard 26 34% 2 QH.

Playing in nickel defense, that often meant that only one outside linebacker was on the field, with that being Emmanuel Ogbah. He did a nice job batting away a screen pass early, and Nate Orchard got a couple of nice hits on Wentz. I'd rather see these young guys fight their asses off, as opposed to watching Paul Kruger and Barkevious Mingodrone on for another year, so that's a positive.

Inside Linebacker

Pos Player Plays % Stats
ILB Christian Kirksey 77 100% 4 tackles, 2 assists (6 combined). 1 sack, 1 TFL, 2 QH.
ILB Demario Davis 75 97% 6 tackles, 1 assist (7 combined).
ILB Tank Carder
2 3% No stats registered.

I thought Christain Kirksey had a heck of a preseason, and he continued to play well in Week 1, including getting to the quarterback a little more than I thought he would. Kirksey was used as a rotational player his first two years in the NFL, so it looks like he's finally being given the keys to being a leader of this defense. His all-around ability stands out.

Safety

Pos Player Plays % Stats
S Ibraheim Campbell 77 100% 5 tackles (5 combined). 1 QH.
S Jordan Poyer 58 75% 6 tackles (6 combined). 1 TFL.
S Derrick Kindred 23 30% 5 tackles (5 combined).

I like the way Ibraheim Campbell finishes tackles, and he had a punishing hit on Wentz that even even I could feel through the TV, knowing Wentz is coming off of a rib injury. We saw a lot of Derrick Kindred early, and he was all over the place, logging 5 tackles in just 23 snaps. Unfortunately, he suffered an ankle injury and missed the second half.

Cornerback

Pos Player Plays % Stats
CB Joe Haden 73 95% 3 tackles (3 combined). 1 pass defended.
CB Jamar Taylor 67 87% 5 tackles (5 combined).
CB Tramon Williams 56 73% 2 tackles (2 combined). 1 QH.
CB Tracy Howard 3 4% No stats registered.

The Eagles didn't target Joe Haden in the first half, but he was fair game in the second half and Carson Wentz got several completions on him. The throws were very nice, but again, it's discouraging to see Haden be on the losing end yet again against a team not known for their prowess at the receiver position.

Tramon Williams had a really bad start to the game, committing a holding penalty (admittedly ticky-tack) and allowing a touchdown pass. His coverage wasn't terrible, but it's also not a good look when you're already demoted from starter-to-nickelback, and then you don't come through in your new role. If we were going to have someone get beat in there, I would have rather it been a young guy like Justin Gilbert (yes, I still wish he would've panned out a little), or Trey Caldwell (currently on the practice squad). We'll see if one of the Browns' waiver claims takes over the nickel spot before long.

http://www.dawgsbynature.com/2016/9/...tats-vs-eagles