DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Carson Wentz: After the Fact

We have a lot of debates on this board and personally I get real tired of the same people acting like I am clueless each year even AFTER things play out and they were dead wrong in their takes.

Thus, I am going to own up and admit to the posters who pimped Wentz that they were right and I was wrong.

Before the draft, there were a ton of posters who really liked Wentz. Guys that stick out in my mind are bonefish, Grimm, KWhip, DJ, and tab. I realize that there were many more of you who loved the guy, but those guys gave me the most crap for not buying in.

I never said he sucked, but I was unsure about his ability to process information quickly enough and make good post-snap reads. I would have taken him in the mid to late teens, but not at 2. We had some ferocious arguments.

I was wrong. You guys were right. I apologizes and acknowledge my mistake and that you were right.

It is still early and he played against two bad defenses. He could still bomb, but I really doubt that.

We ALL saw his physical attributes. We ALL notices his arm. We ALL saw that he was pretty athletic. Most of us knew he was smart on chalkboard talks.

Wentz has displayed all those traits, but what has impressed me the most is his poise and command of the offense. This guy hardly had any reps w/the first team during camps. I mean...........almost zero!

What he is doing is absurd. I watched him last night and this guy is changing protections at the LOS. He is calling audibles. He is making sight adjustments and hot reads. Are you freaking kidding me??????????

And his accuracy has been outstanding. If his receivers don't drop all those balls, he has a monster statistical night last night. But, for me, it's not about the stats..........it's about his poise, toughness, decision making, intelligence.

I question the character of those who act like I am whacked year after year even though they are proven wrong year after year and my takes are correct. They never own up and instead start w/a new attack...............thus, I am going to own up and tell you guys that I was WRONG and you were right. Kudos to you guys!

I hate to say it but if we did draft Wentz he would have been ruined, we don't have any supporting cast around him. We have sooo many holes to fill, so if we hit on the eagles picks then I think it was good trade.

So, you are saying we should pass on a franchise player because our talent sucks?

Come on, man!!!!

And btw----------our OL was one of the top lines in the league the last couple of years. We had a ton of cap space. We could have gotten him some weapons.

Hue is supposedly a QB Whisperer...........I ain't buying this "he would have been ruined" BS.

Look, I was wrong about the guy. I am man enough to admit it. Wonder if the Browns are?

yep. his command of the offense, his ability to manipulate the pocket, and his command of the huddle is very apparent. he carries himself like a seasoned pro already.

I agree he wouldn't have been ruined.

To your post, no problem man, it not about what you or I think about a player.

It's about what the decision makers do.



My attitude is they have a target next year. If they make that selection and he sucks, or we don't even select a QB and "Trust Me" Kessler isn't playing with real promise, then yep, we are set back another decade.

Yeah.............I really don't wanna make this a "FO messed-up" thread. I'll do that in other threads....LOL

I am just simply amazed at what this cat is doing. It's incredible.

Like I say............I was wrong and all you guys who wanted him were right. I can admit that..........and guess what, guys? I'm still breathing. Y'all might wanna think about admitting when others are right and you are wrong once in awhile............... Eh???????????

Vince young also had a really good first year.

So did rg3.

Hell, Colt mccoy's first few starts were wonderful. Remember his second game against the patriots?

It it's way too early to make calls after the first game, that also has to apply to the second game, and the rest of the season.

I don't wish bad at all on wentz, so I hope it doesn't come across that way.

All I'm saying is that you never know. Flash in the pan players in the NFL come all the time.

Like Brian hoyer.

Besides, if they don't pick a QB with our clearly 1st or 2nd pick in the draft, then we can really say that they screwed the pooch on wentz.

I don't see a franchise qb coming out this year. Do you?

Once again, I liked Wentz the best of this year's group, but I would not have drafted him before the mid-teens. I was dead wrong.

I never like Goff and I might end up being wrong about him, too. LOL

I did like Lynch and was hoping we could get him at the bottom of the first or top of the second, but Denver took him.

This year? Heck, I like the guys who are not eligible better than the guys who are. But, it's early...........things can change.

And again...........I forgot about you liking Wentz. You win this one, peen. I'm good w/admitting that. It's about the only time you were right and I was wrong.

It bothers me that he was good enough for Philly but not Cleveland. I just don't understand it.

Jackson had his heart set on RG3 and nothing was going to stop that. It wouldn't even surprise me if he subconsciously looked for reasons to not like Wentz.

I like Hue as a coach. I really do. But I don't trust his judgment. At all.

You are correct. However, I thought I put some things in my OP that somewhat circumvented what you are saying.

I have a question for you..........and others.

Rish, I know you get that insider stuff. On the way down today, that MadDawg guy was saying that to not draft Wentz was Hue's decision. He was interviewing Peter King and he kept asking him that. King eventually said he was right, but it was kinda lackluster and I got the impression he wasn't sure.

So, here is my question......................does anyone have any "real" information about whether it was the FO [DePo and Sashi] or Hue who was/were the driving force behind the Browns not thinking Wentz was a top 20 QB?

I was really pissed that the new FO didn't pull the trigger on Wentz with the number two pick. This was before watching him play. They completely wussed out. To trade down from a pick in the top 3 when you need a franchise QB as bad as the Browns do is just absolutely gutless and strengthens that perception of being forever losers. It's cheating the fans that are paying damn good money to watch this team. How freaking long are we going to have to watch third and fourth tier QB's start for this team. It's getting old, very old. What's the bottom line? Well if Wentz turns out to be a franchise QB for the Eagles and the moneyball group passed that up for RG3, you could see yet another quick reboot. When the hell are they going to figure out trading down all the time is not the answer? It's very very frustrating.

Well, I will apologize to you, too.

I really supported the trade when the FO made it. I ain't gonna lie about it.

LOL............I am kinda pissed I was so wrong.

is just me? anyone else watch the Bears vs Eagles game? seemed to me watching the part of the game and some highlights, Wents was getting killed. granted he kept getting up and won the game. But watching it, I kept saying damn that boy won't last the year taking a beating like that.
just curious.

He did take a lot of big shots. That's why I added the toughness part in my OP.

That's tricky. Andrew Luck has taken way too many shots and it has adversely affected his play.

The Eagles have Howie Roseman, though. He's going to win NFL Exec of the year, guaranteed. The Colts have some dumb ass who should have been fired last year. Roseman will probably get Wentz what he needs.

I'll say this though. I was not upset they finally took a WR and I didn't know anything about Coleman and now looks like he has potential.

I just don't know. I really thought our pick just had to be Wentz after the Rams took Goff.

How dare you question a HOF like Wentz just look at the last guy they debated about last season what was his name ??? Oh yeah Teddy Bridgewater but no one is talking about him any more.

I wanted to take wentz but at the time understood why we made the trade... But so far he looks unreal... Of course he played two very bad defenses.... But if he keeps playing this well then the decision to pass on him could haunt this franchise for years...

Do you have to ruin every thread?

Most people were predicting a great year from teddy and the Vikings were an early pick for the Super Bowl before he got hurt...

Hue was hopeful to "Before RGII got hurt" We will never know if he could have progressed as Hue was thinking.

Are you trying to say I can't express my opinion on the threads I chose to?

The talent around wentz isn't the greatest, either. His line has question marks, as well as the wideouts.

So that fact that he still led his team to a 2-0 start says something.

Man, if Philly would've kept desean Jackson and shady?

Playoffs, especially being in the NFC east.

Not at all.........I am simply asking you to not make fun of other posters on every thread, like you just did right here:



Look man, I have admitted to being wrong.........yet, you still wanna throw the hammer down. What gives?

What other posters did I make fun of?

Not me. I think that he is incredibly overrated by a lot of people.

Really he has proved me wrong. Thought starting him despite playing only one preseason game would be the downfall of Philly. And when Sam Bradford was traded. But they are proving me wrong!

He was incredibly underrated by stat freaks who don't watch games.

No, he is a QB who almost always takes the safe play, never trying to attack the defense. He was very cautious, very careful, and rarely took chances in order to make big plays at all. You complained about the talent around him, but man, look at Johnson, Diggs, and Petersen, and he had a solid TE in Rudolph. The Vikings also have a great defense, that took much of the pressure off of the QB position. Yeah, I expect more out of a "franchise QB" in a situation like that.

I know you disagree, and that's fine ..... but that's how I see it, and I have been consistent in my concerns about him. If he ever shows that he can be more than a game manager, I'll be surprised. Right now he looks a lot like a Christian Ponder. Give him the right circumstances and he can do OK, but I don't see him as a difference maker. I see their defense, and AP, as their real difference makers.

I have watched him way more than you. His teammates and coaches all think the world of him. I am frankly tired of your stat-boy takes on him.

And this thread is about Wentz, not Teddy. Vambo switched it over to that just because he is being Vambo. Please don't feed the trolls.

Vers, twice in this post alone, you did exactly what you constantly rail against.

You called Ytown a "stat boy", and you called vambo a troll.

3..2..........1 And next, I'll be labeled as "ganging up on you."

Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog

Not at all.........I am simply asking you to not make fun of other posters on every thread, like you just did right here:

But yet it is OK for you to do?

I know that you really like him, and that's fine.

I am curious as to what stats I used in the post you replied to?

I would also remind you that the players on this team loved Colt McCoy, too. That doesn't mean that he was a franchise caliber QB. Bridgewater would be better than any QB we have put on the field since he was drafted, but that's damning with faint praise.

I just don't see this franchise QB you do.

I think if one of our players had two above-average games we would all be very cautious in anointing that player.

I will do the same for a player on a different team.

Wentz has looked good. There are many rookie QBs who have had two good games to start their careers. Some turned out to be good, some did not.

Can we get back to Wentz, please?

Lets see how he looks when he plays a tougher opponent and now that there are two games worth of film to watch/prepare for. Pittsburgh roll into town on Sunday. Interstate rival and a significantly better defense than Cleveland or Chicago. I will be more impressed if he puts up similar numbers against them.

I knew this type of post was coming. Let me ask you this.............do you think that there won't be ups and downs for any qb, never mind a rookie qb?

Has Peyton Manning ever had a ad game? Brady? Big Ben? Rodgers?

Did any of them have bad games when they are a rookie?

Guys like cfrs will slay Wentz when he has a bad game this year, but he is a rookie. You guys get that right.........or is it that you will defend the FO and Hue no matter what?

Just asking?

I don't think we will draft a QB in 2017. Deshone Kizer is the only guy worth it, but I think Chicago is going to nosedive and draft him to replace Cutler. I can see us trading for a guy. Keep an eye on Brett Hundley from Green Bay,

I am not ready to get overly excited about some rookie after only two games against not particularly brilliant teams. He has had a good start. Great start, even. But, there are 14 more to play and significantly better defenses to boot for him to face. If he continues to be fab I am more than happy to eat humble pie. That said, I am sure you will continue to insult or fire off angry tirade posts directed at everybody and anybody who doesn't agree with you. It's just what you do.

What? Like this statement I made to start the thread?