DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Carson Wentz: After the Fact

I'm going to let Wentz play a few more games before I get as bummed out as alot of people seemingly are we didn't take him. He's not played against a very established defense yet.

He needs to face a few credible defenses and show poise and etc against them before I let this start dragging me down. There's already enough about this team outside of not picking Wentz that'll bum ya out as is.

Should Browns just pass in 1st round?

To say Cleveland hasn't received much from its nine first-round draftees during the past six years is an understatement.

here is a link to our misfortune in the first round:
http://es.pn/2cRXWbr

LOL Not bummed, but numb... to us not drafting QB's with our first pick. We've only picked one with our #1 pick in 17 drafts.

In two games Wentz has proven to be as tough and poised as most QB's in the league. He may still have a rough patch or two but he'll be just fine in the NFL. The Brown's missed another one.

And if he continues like he has during his two games, he'll be hurt again like he was in preseason.

Jacoby Brissett looking better than Wentz against Houston Texans.

I really hope Kessler has a big day against Miami and puts all the Wentz/Browns talk to rest.

By the looks of it, any Qb would look stellar playing against that horrible Texan defense.

where was Watt at?

Who's on first, Watt's on second! (Sorry, I couldn't resist!)

I have to believe with all the hate for the Browns FO, good game or bad by Kessler, the Browns will still get beat on for passing on Wentz. And it won't matter if Wentz has a good game or a bad game.

I'm getting to the point I want to see the (gags) Steelers (dry heaves) make Wentz look like Charlie Frye this weekend.

I wasn't going to type it out lol, but this is getting to about how I feel too.

Or Denver, where the secondary can hold up and the front is relentless with pressure. Some make it seem this rookie has already secured his spot in the hof after two regular season games about putrid defenses.

j/c

I like Wentz, but I wouldn't mind a nice collision between him and Harrison to get all this future HOF talk to die down a bit for awhile.

Nah. Wentz can go on to win the Super Bowl as far as I'm concerned. We passed on him, so what. We were lacking talent in so many areas, we would have destroyed his chances here, period. I'm happy for the kid.

We just need to build this team and forget the coulda, shoulda, woulda stuff.

2 games vs us and the Bears, Adam Shein thinks he is Joe Montana already, if we drafted him he would be on IR with our O line , I would rather take my chances with Watson but of course, Moneyball U will trade down for cheaper C level talent.

At least it's not Teddy anymore fickle fans.

The idea that a mid to late 3rs round selection needs to perform at the same level as the number 2 pick overall is absurd and sums up how ridiculous we can all be as fans sometimes

Kessler was never intended to see the field this year. Wentz is performing above all possible expectations. We have an injury to our center. Our #2 wr is out. Our #1 wr is suspended. The list goes on and on.

Oh well. The Harvard boys are obviously idiots if Kessler doesn't light it up..... that should be in purple but I'm on a phone.!!! Go Browns, go Kessler.

From my perspective, this is the first real test for Wentz. If he picks the Steelers D apart, you really gotta start believing this kid could be special..

The thing that's lost in all of the Wentz news is the Eagles defense; they legitimately might be in the top 10-15.

True dat

You mean like the hair line rib crack that didn't even slow him down against Clev. and Chicago?


It's all good bro...many here will never admit or say he's a good NFL QB even after he proves himself.

We should have drafted Wentz no Teddt no Wentz no Teddy Wentz Teddy

He threw for just over 100 yards, going 11/20 or so.

That's good?

He did have a good run for a TD ..... but still. The defense and run game won that game.

Heard the stat that Watt has played the Pats 4 times and has 0 sacks. Belichick is an absolute master at taking away what you do best and forcing you to beat him some other way.

Help me out here bro ..

On a thread somewhere u ripped Vers, this dude and 4 or 5 others for RUINING MULTIPLE THREADS cause of there 2 year old like posting ... And I agreed with EVERY WORD in it .. Like u, if I were a ref .. They'd all be in TIMEOUT until they learned to QUIT HIJACKING THREADS ..

And now here u are ... FEEDING THEM .. Why bro? ..

This is obviously a post with one purpose and one purpose only .. TO GET VERS STARTED ..

It's CLEAR .. No doubt ..

And even though u hate it .. As do MOST I would imagine ..

U FEED INTO IT ...

I don't understand .. And I agree 100% with everything u said ..

Why these guys are allowed to continue to hijack and DESTROY threads with there 2 year old BS is beyond me .

Not that any one cares .. I'm about done here once again cause like u .. It SUCKS when u see a thread that interests u and it has 30 replies since your last visit ... And 27 of them are from Vers or one of his "crew" just ripping each other .. That SUCKS .. And I'm not sure why ANY OF THEM are allowed to keep doing it ..

If I was a ref .. As much as I like Vers .. He'd be WARNED, SUSPENDED and if it kept up .. BANNED ..

Seems like Vers is gone .. If it's self imposed .. Good for him .. If he got booted and the rest were allowed to stay .. *LOL* .. HYPOCRACY at its FINEST ..

This seems to be a popular narrative. I'm not buying into it.

Mac,
We tried building our offensive line first. We did a good job of it. How did it work out?

Daman,
I don't necessarily see a lot of "Hate" for the new FO on the board. Specific questioning of very debatable decisions is our right, is expected. "Hate"?

I'm not saying this is the absolute final most important word on the subject, but ... Mayock, Jeremiah, Brooks all of them had Wentz rated above Goff as the spring wound down. Many had him rated much higher. As time went on, Wentz's stock continued to rise and it didn't regress. Who he and Goff were started to become more obvious. Obvious to everybody but Hue, Pep, and the Rams.

Hue and Pep obviously decided that Wentz wouldn't be able to process quickly enough, or correctly. The ability to mentally process, post-snap, quickly and make the correct decisions. In choosing current QB's it all comes down to predicting future processing speed. We have to predict, cause the college game doesn't develop it anymore. Whether the QB will be able to process like a Brady, Manning, Brees, Rodgers, or whether he will end up processing like a McCown, Weeden, Bradford, Tannehill, etc.... I think it must of came down to Hue and Pep believing that Goff would develop the ability to process better and decided that Wentz would be of latter group. Wentz showed, in the combine and Gruden camp, that he was as accurate as Goff, had more velocity, had good footwork and a quick release. His work rate and coachability was off the charts. So, I assume it must have came down to perceived football intelligence.

Can we blame the FO if Wentz develops into a solid NFL QB. My opinion is that the decision is completely on Hue and Pep.

So, we move on.

As mentioned, we are looking at perceived future processing speed. Right now, Kizer is the only guy who really generates any interest in me.

Watson has upside, and could develop into a good NFL quarterback. The problem is that he doesn't do anything really well (great) with the exception of competing. He could develop into a good passer, but he isn't one yet. He could develop into a great runner, but I think he is currently overrated. When you look at recent guys coming out, and then compare Watson with them, its not even close. If dawgs are right and that is Hue's plan, then he's seeing something many of us aren't.

Us criticizing the FO or questioning Hue and Pep's decision making isn't going to prevent any of them from eventually becoming great at what they do. I don't feel a lot of hate. Honeymoons eventually wear down. Its time for reality. Pretending gets us nowhere.

Sorry if this sounds weird, but I'm convinced its true: The only way this curse is ever going to be broken is if Hue or some other coach, coaches his a$$ off and exorcises the ghost (demon) of Paul Brown off of the sidelines once and forever.

This thread really cracks me up.

Maybe people need to go back to the QB draft thread and read what you thought were the weaknesses of Wentz before the draft. Maybe you need to look at what you predicted he "couldn't do".

Maybe you should go read how stupid you thought Philly was for starting their third string QB with less than 30 snaps in pre season. How you felt we would beat Philly because of Wentz inexperience. How our first round draft pick we got from Philly would be as high as ours or even higher.

Well you were all wrong!

Now does that mean he will be a great franchise QB? No it doesn't. Does that mean he's far enough in his development to beat some of the NFL's great defenses at this time? No it doesn't.

What it does mean is that Wentz has several of the most necessary ingredients to become a franchise QB. Pre snap and post snap reads, a strong and fairly accurate arm. Tenacity to stand in the pocket and deliver. Command of the huddle. The speed of the game does not overwhelm him and he's by far further along than almost anyone on this board though he would be at this juncture, including me.

So make fun of people all you like. It seems that's all the rage these days from politics to sports. Refuse to look at facts ad just try to downgrade anyone who disagrees with you. Use hyperbole to try to insinuate things that people haven't even said.

It's what you guys do. As of now, Vambo is at the top of that list. You were wrong Vambo, and you're still wrong. Maybe Wentz won't become a great NFL QB. But he's far more at this juncture than you ever thought he'd be and you can only use sarcasm as a weapon against the facts.

I know who you are.

I didn't think I was feeding anyone ... just wondering why someone would say that. I have seen several people speak of the Pats 3rd stringer like he did something amazing. It made no sense to me, and I wondered if maybe they just looked at the final score and assumed that he did a great job.

Please show me where I was wrong.

Y-Town - it's obvious why he said it .. Same reason he brings up Bridgewater all the time ..

Hence, why I think your feeding him .. ..

Like when people bring up Mack and Schwartz and Benjamin ...

j/c

It's like the OK Corral on here tonight. Gunfights in every thread. It's Friday night, guys....time to live large!

Naaaa ;... Not a gun fight when ONCE SIDE has ALL the BULLETS ...

They can have all there fun now .. As I won't reply to any of them on the two threads again ..

I'd say he is on the right track to prove his worth. but the beating he took playing the Bears, he can't continue to take hits like those and make it much further.

so far he has proven me wrong...

Rothlesburger has been able to for the most part. Wentz was compared to him, so you never know if he can hold up or not.

true that. but a few of the hits made me cringe, and I was at home on the couch. Not playing lol...only time will tell.

Another thread ruined by the instigators. Guys like Vambo and company start crap on almost every thread. Pick, pick, pick. I respond after about 20 or so attacks and then I get suspended while they still get to keep posting pure crap that is only intended to incite.

Back to the intended topic for just a second:

I clearly stated in my OP that it was early. I clearly stated things could change. I did not say Wentz's numbers were the reason for my praise.

I tried to talk about his poise. How he was changing protections. How he was displaying accuracy. How he was calling audibles. His toughness.

I was admitting to being wrong about him BEFORE the draft and giving credit to the guys who had him ranked high. But no, other posters turn it into a war about the FO.

And no, Daman...............I DO NOT HATE THE FO.

In fact, I support them. I try to evaluate each move based on it's own merits. That isn't "hating the FO." It's called trying to be fair, which obviously doesn't have much of a place on this board.

I hate how people think wentz would be playing just as good if we drafted him. Players will play differently in different systems. For all we know if we drafted him he could have laid an egg. Or its possible he could play better I guess, but my point is you really just don't know about any player till you draft him and put him in your system. Drafting players is by far an exact science. Anymore I think its just luck rather than scouting talent.

While I agree with some of what you are saying, I disagree with the luck part.

It may be more art than science (perhaps as much art as science), but it takes more than bad luck to draft as bad as we have in the past.

Luck may play in in regards to injuries, but there are things you can scout.