Yeah, fans are a great judge of talent. Just look at you.
Schwartz is a good RT and no amount of rhetoric from the likes of you will change that.
In fact, if he were still here, you would be singing his praises. Your opinions are completely biased and not grounded in fact.
Now, you can have the last word. And my post warrants a rebuttal from you. But, I'm done w/you for the night.
Schwartz did seem to take a few games to acclimate to a new system, every time we changed systems, when he was here.
It would not surprise me if the same was happening there.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Schwartz is one of the best right tackles in the league and it sucks he is not with the team. I think its rather apparent that the FO probably could have handled the situation better. However, I will add I don't think it's fair to put all the blame on the FO. I think Schwartz's agent is to partly blame as well. But, in the end, he's gone and many are upset because of it.
But to say that he is only a top 20 RT makes me think this is only being said because he is gone. And after one (assumed) bad game, it warrants a claim that he's never been as good as we thought and we're better off with out him. This is not true. This is a revisionist stance, IMO.
This reminds me so much of those claiming Schwartz is so good now that he is gone, but bashed the hell out of him while he was here. I don't consider you in this group but it's funny how similar the dynamic is.
Schwartz is gone. He was always good when he was here. Our line is downgraded because of it. That's not to say we'll never find a better option, but for now, we are behind at that position.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
Fans expect perfection on every play from every player. If they don't provide perfection it skews the fans view of that player. This type of mentality is normally applied to our own guys but gets extended to former players to back up an opinion.
One little nit with your post. Schwartz wasn't necessarily good from day 1. Heck, neither was Mack. But they grew into the position. This underscores two points - you have to let guys develop and this isn't always a plug and play thing. I think the FO screwed the pooch on this and I hope they learn from it.
Last edited by Rishuz; 09/29/1609:03 AM. Reason: Fixed angry icon.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
One little nit with your post. Schwartz wasn't necessarily good from day 1. Heck, neither was Mack. But they grew into the position. This underscores two points - you have to let guys develop and this isn't always a plug and play thing. I think the FO screwed the pooch on this and I hope they learn from it.
My comment in that regard wasn't specific to his first ever start, but to speak in more general terms that while he was here in Cleveland for 4 years, he was very good. Yes, he definitely developed each year, as most players do. I didn't necessarily mean from the day one, but can see how I might have projected that in the last post.
You have that angry icon in the post again.....what did I do now?!
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
One other thing I'll mention. When you have home grown players that develop over time AND have little to no injury history that makes it even more important to sign these guys.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
Couldn't agree more. Hopefully we've found the combination of FO/HC that provides the continuity and relationships that will (1) encourage players to remain here and (2) get long-term contract locked up ahead of time for those worthy player before FA.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
Key stat: The number of pressures Eric Fisher has allowed each season has decreased from 47 during his rookie year to 37 in 2015.
There is a big drop-off from the teams in the top half of the league to the bottom half in terms of quality offensive-line play. The Chiefs’ best offensive linemen is now right tackle Mitchell Schwartz, a player they added via free agency from Cleveland. Schwartz earned an overall grade of 86.6 last season, second-best among right tackles. Mitch Morse graded like an average center in 2015, which is good for a second-round rookie. Eric Fisher has been improving, but still hasn’t been close to reaching his first-overall-pick potential. Kansas City’s line is very young, so ideally there is a lot of improvement across the board in 2016.
I think there has been a wide variety of opinions on Schwartz over the years. I do think most people liked him when he was here. He was a guy I was pimping before the draft because I thought we needed a RT at the time. I did have a 3rd round grade on him, though. Not a second.
I thought he had a very solid rookie year. However, I thought he really struggled in year 2 at times. I thought he improved dramatically after that year.
I never understood those who thought he sucked. On the other hand, I think there were several posters who really overrated the guy. Bottom line is that he is a very good RT who shows up each and every day. He is an asset to any team.
The Chiefs’ best offensive linemen is now right tackle Mitchell Schwartz, a player they added via free agency from Cleveland. Schwartz earned an overall grade of 86.6 last season, second-best among right tackles.
Ok, he was the 2nd best tackle in the league last year. That places him in the top 20, no?
This reminds me so much of those claiming Schwartz is so good now that he is gone, but bashed the hell out of him while he was here. I don't consider you in this group but it's funny how similar the dynamic is.
memp...Schwartz did not start out as a top talent from day one...he was a RT with potential and he worked on his game, improving every year.
Schwartz deserved some of the criticism he got, especially in first and second seasons. By his third season, he began to show improvement and his fourth season was pretty damn good. The high point for Schwartz was the challenge he was faced with in the Denver game against Von Miller.
The Denver game showed that Schwartz had come a long way since he was a rookie, proving by his performance against Miller that he was among the top RTs in the NFL.
Schwartz was not a one game wonder either..he played well in 2015. Also, Schwartz was likely going to get better because he was that type of guy, always working on his game to improve his performance on the field. Schwartz also had two of the best teachers during his time in Cleveland...Mack and Thomas (the veterans)who were considered among the best at their positions. Joe Thomas took Schwartz under his wing and worked with the kid.
The Browns did have a closely nit OLine group who took pride in their performance on the field. Another FACT that few consider is the challenges created by the Browns owner and front office. Schwartz and the rest of the OLine were forced to play in 4 different offensive systems in 4 years. ...2012-Shumur ...2013-Chud ...2014 Shanahan ...2015 DeFilippo ...2016 Hue Jackson...and this season will be the 5th different offensive system for the offensive line in as many years.
Now I'm not basing my assessment on "any stats" or other opinions...I actually watched the guy play during the 4 yrs that he was here...being an old Oline guy myself, that is what I saw..
Analytics will only show the results, reduced to numbers and letters written on paper or a computer screen. How much value one places on those "paper results" comes down to the "experience and understanding" of what it is like to actually play in a game..to play that position.
I think there has been a wide variety of opinions on Schwartz over the years. I do think most people liked him when he was here. He was a guy I was pimping before the draft because I thought we needed a RT at the time. I did have a 3rd round grade on him, though. Not a second.
I thought he had a very solid rookie year. However, I thought he really struggled in year 2 at times. I thought he improved dramatically after that year.
I never understood those who thought he sucked. On the other hand, I think there were several posters who really overrated the guy. Bottom line is that he is a very good RT who shows up each and every day. He is an asset to any team.
Sorry to do this again, but all I remember is you trashing on him year after year after year (Heckert pick bias). You wanted him replaced/upgraded every offseason and now after the fact you rewrite history again? (and don't go there, I already checked, you post history is FULL of Schwartz hate, especially in the offseason)
Seriously, what is it with you?
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
Schwartz is one of the best right tackles in the league and it sucks he is not with the team. I think its rather apparent that the FO probably could have handled the situation better. However, I will add I don't think it's fair to put all the blame on the FO. I think Schwartz's agent is to partly blame as well. But, in the end, he's gone and many are upset because of it.
But to say that he is only a top 20 RT makes me think this is only being said because he is gone. And after one (assumed) bad game, it warrants a claim that he's never been as good as we thought and we're better off with out him. This is not true. This is a revisionist stance, IMO.
This reminds me so much of those claiming Schwartz is so good now that he is gone, but bashed the hell out of him while he was here. I don't consider you in this group but it's funny how similar the dynamic is.
Schwartz is gone. He was always good when he was here. Our line is downgraded because of it. That's not to say we'll never find a better option, but for now, we are behind at that position.
whether or not Schwartz is a top RT is up for debate to me. Nothing really against him, more just tired of the same darn topic. imo he is decent. top 5 no, top 10 idk maybe.
I really think at this point that it does not matter if it was the FO, him, or his agents fault. he is gone and that's that.
at this moment, yes we would be better with him. (not to say that is what I want or don't want).
To me this topic is nothing more than to circle around to bash the FO more. and it sucks to read and reread the same thing over and over. Not saying this is you but I am sure you can understand where I am coming from...post more out of frustration at the topic than anything else....cheers
I bet you're wondering the samething I did, why O' why didn't I take the...blue pill
The Chiefs’ best offensive linemen is now right tackle Mitchell Schwartz, a player they added via free agency from Cleveland. Schwartz earned an overall grade of 86.6 last season, second-best among right tackles.
Ok, he was the 2nd best tackle in the league last year. That places him in the top 20, no?
not trying to quote you CapCity, just don't feel like going searching for the qoute I am looking for.
Schwartz, who is listed at 6 feet 5 and 320 pounds, was among the top-graded tackles in the league last year, according to ProFootballFocus.com. His mark of 86.6 was the sixth-best in the league and is 19 points higher than the Chiefs’ highest-graded tackle last year, Eric Fisher (67.2).
Schwartz figures to be a plug-and-play option at right tackle for a Chiefs team that surrendered 46 sacks in 2015, tied for the sixth-most in the league. Schwartz’s pass-blocking grade of 86.8 in 2015 was the seventh-best mark in the league.
so not 2nd here it states 6th and 7th...so yea I guess top 10 last year according to this...Just wish we would move on from him already ...
Schwartz played well but that doesn't mean he fit with our new scheme and way of doing things. Mack was always going to leave. He hated it here. Losing those guys did hurt our line. It will take time to rebuild our line and time for the guys to play as a unit. One of the many areas we need to improve. We are in year one of a complete rebuild. I would suspect Joe Thomas to be gone soon as well...... Just one of the things that happens during a ground up overhaul.......
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Jeudy is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Tillman is flanked out wide to the right. Judkins and Ford are split in the backfield as Flacco takes the snap ... Here we go."
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Jeudy is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Tillman is flanked out wide to the right. Judkins and Ford are split in the backfield as Flacco takes the snap ... Here we go."
