Us liberals think the conservatives should've picked Kasich. You conservatives thought we should've rolled with Sanders.
The problem is that those of us who aren't either too far right or too far left are stuck w/two candidates that are horrible.
Trump isn't too far right, he's too far gone. Dude is out of this world wacko. Hillary isn't too far left, she's too much about Hillary absent a moral compass. The witch is down right scary.
Totally agree with all of what you say in the above post, Swish.
Re: Political reform....Donald Trump's supporters believe he is the answer to changing things up. He says that he will "drain the DC swamp". 'er....ummmm....do those voting for him realize that the majority of "the swamp" are actually Republicans? LOL! Reform? Man oh man, Trump, Gary Johnson and Jill Stein are not it. All three are very bad, weak candidates. With HRC as the Dem nomination, with all her flaws, and even those of us who support her are well aware of them....it is like this election is being handed to the GOP on a silver platter and it is welcoming/ushering a viable third party to come in and truly challenge the entire system. It says a lot about our country when the best we can get to challenge the system and a polished politician w/flaws is Trump, Johnson and Stein.
I am socially liberal and fiscally conservative. Which makes the Libertarian Party even more disappointing.
Yes, for those who believe that either of these is a good choice it is their personal belief system. But dang. How did we get to this place. As a generalization not an absolute, it seems that Trump is the candidate of the bitter angry individual. And while I understand why people would get behind the Democratic party, Hilary is such a vile person that I cannot understand how people can just look past that. Even if they think Trump is a worse person.
My mention of the media was only to point out that my posts may seem biased against Hilary, but that is only because Trumps faults get plenty of media attention and I don't think they need rehashing because I think everyone is more than aware of them.
However, if you don't think the media is influential in the way many people think then you are kidding yourself. From telling what clothes to wear, to what is the appropriate way to act, to feeling that Kim Kardashian is a role model that should be emulated. There are a lot of people in this world unwilling or unable to think for themselves that will blindly follow along (not implying you or anyone in particular - actually you probably fall into the minority that will actual form an opinion which I respect, whether I agree or not).
The difference between Jesus and religion Religion mocks you for having dirty feet Jesus gets down on his knees and washes them
Mac - we all get your sentiment but to me, I don't care who obtained these or why they released them. I am more concerned with what they say and their validity.
So to your 1st point, I couldn't care less if it was the Russians, the RNC or some pimply teenage kid in his basement drinking a yahoo. Whether what they did was a crime is another issue altogether. If caught, should they be prosecuted? Probably. If it was Russia, should action be taken? Absolutely. Best I can tell, there is no definitive evidence that it was the Russians. I hear Clinton saying it was the Russians in order to try and discredit them but she offers no proof. As for the investigative agencies, all I have been able to find is that this follows Russia's MO. Of course I may have missed something or they don't want to release their evidence for some reason.
To the other point, were they altered at all? This is the important question in my mind. In the many times the Democratic party has addressed these emails not once have they said any of them were altered. They try to plant the seed of doubt by saying things like Russia did this, they may have been doctored. But they never say yes they were, here is the original. They only have to find one example to discredit all those emails instantly. Why have they not done this? I am no IT person by any means but I am pretty sure that anytime you edit your email or word document, there is an electronic time stamp that gets applied to it. All they have to do is show one time stamp attached after the time the original email was sent. That would make this whole email thing go away. So why haven;t they done this? Perhaps because they can't because there was nothing altered in these emails.
The difference between Jesus and religion Religion mocks you for having dirty feet Jesus gets down on his knees and washes them
i think the media excuse is overblown, especially in regards to Trump.
this is just my perspective, but people seem to think the media is rigged against Trump, but that's because Hillary has been in the political public eye for decades, Trump has not.
The way the media reports on celebrities is different than how they report on politicians. Trump is now getting the level of scrutiny that every single politician, especially those running for president, gets. The media is soft on celebrities. that's a fact.
For example, like i told DC on the phone, trump the businessman and the celebrity billionaire i have no problem with. hell, my favorite rappers always use to reference him as big money playboy. he was cool.
but guess what? before the media, i didn't know this guy was being sued for racial discrimination. i didn't know his dad was running with the KKK. i didn't know Trump university is a massive fraud case.
Those things are very important to know. yet conservatives are mad that the media is pointing that out?
that's the problem. you see, all of us liberals already knew about hillary's shenanigans. she's been scrutinized at a political level for 30 years now. there's nothing new. there's no new bombshells. She's a typical politician. Shocking.
Trump is now being held to the fire as a politician for the first time. and he can't handle it. because as a celebrity, these things didn't matter to the public. but as a potential POTUS, it absolutely does.
it's the same thing with Gary Johnson. His platform sounds good. but then his feet was held to the fire, and he started opening his mouth.
you see how quick that ended once the process started.
So while the media certainly has their flaws, i'm sorry bro, but conservatives are basically pissed because the media is doing their jobs.
like they do to every. single. candidate.
edit: and let me point something else out before somebody tried to pull this nonsense.
The hillary emails and wikileaks are absolutely reported on. I watch MSNBC and CNN and they are always talking about it.
the problem: Trump can't keep his mouth shut, and his policies along with all the other crap he says or is involved in keeps drowning Hillary's problems out.
Something gets leaked, but then Trump says something stupid. again, the GOP stays in a one-up competition.
That ain't the media's fault. that's Trumps fault.
Last edited by Swish; 10/23/1610:57 AM.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
NEW YORK (Reuters) - Donald Trump rode to the top of the Republican ticket promising a "big, beautiful, powerful" border wall with Mexico to stop the flow of undocumented immigrants. Along that border, however, Americans are more likely to call the wall a "waste of money", according to a Reuters/Ipsos opinion poll.
The results show that while the New York businessman may have expected his tough stance on immigration to fire up support nationally, it seems to be falling short in a state heavily affected by illegal immigration, and where he is now facing a surprising challenge from his Democratic rival Hillary Clinton.
Asked if a wall would be “an effective barrier or a waste of money,” 47 percent of Arizona residents picked “waste of money” and 34 percent picked “effective barrier”, with the rest picking neither, according to the poll. Among Republicans, 21 percent picked "waste of money” and 57 percent picked “effective barrier."
Most Arizonans also believed it is not realistic to expect Mexico to pay for the wall, something Trump has vowed would happen if he’s elected president on Nov. 8, according to the poll.
The results lined up closely with nationwide opinions of Trump’s immigration policy: 49 percent of American adults say the wall would be a “waste of money” and 31 percent say it would be an “effective barrier.”
“As big and powerful, as rich as this nation is, we cannot just leave the door open,” said Tony Estrada, Santa Cruz County Sheriff, who has served in law enforcement in the border county for 49 years. “But, we need a realistic and humane process. Donald Trump is … catering to people’s fear.”
Polls show Arizona, a state that has voted Democrat only once in a presidential election since 1952, has become competitive. The Real Clear Politics average of polls showed Clinton ahead there by 1.3 percentage points. Reuters/Ipsos polling shows Trump ahead there by 4 points.
Clinton’s campaign said last week it would spend $2 million more campaigning in Arizona before the election.
DRIVING LATINOS TO THE POLLS
Arizona’s border with Mexico is 370 miles long, covering an isolated desert terrain that has drawn millions seeking to cross illegally. The state's number of undocumented immigrants has fallen 35 percent from a 2007 peak to 325,000, according to the Pew Research Center, as Arizona cracked down on that population. Nationwide, the number has dropped 9 percent from a high in 2007 to 11.1 million undocumented immigrants.
Wendy Cornacchio, a 45 year-old Trump supporter from Phoenix, said she believes illegal immigration is still a problem – but she would rather see technologies like drone surveillance than Trump’s wall to address it. “I don’t think that necessarily building a wall will work, but the concept of closing the borders I agree with,” she said.
Florida is another closely-fought state that has seen large levels of illegal immigration, though by sea rather than by land. Some 41 percent of voters there said they believed Trump’s wall would be a “waste of money”, while 36 percent thought it would be an “effective barrier”.
Progressive activist groups in both Florida and Arizona have been using Trump’s hard line on immigration against him to mobilize Latinos for Clinton, who advocates a path to citizenship for some undocumented immigrants. Mi Familia Vota, for example, says they registered more than 15,000 people in Arizona this year.
The Reuters/Ipsos poll was conducted online in English and Spanish in Arizona and Florida. The Arizona poll ran from Oct. 5 to Oct. 19 and gathered responses from 2,600 people. The Florida poll ran from Oct. 5 to Oct. 12 and gathered responses from 2,610 people. Both polls have a credibility interval, a measure of accuracy, of 2 percentage points for the total group and 3 percentage points for likely voters.
_____________________
This says a lot, especially since it's from the state that is huge on immigration. Trump's ideas are just not....it's just not there. The place where border control is the heaviest ain't even buying what Trump is selling.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
I don't mean to imply that the media is trying to rig the election or even influence more than they normally do. Some stations are liberally slanted others are conservative. They provide their slant as they alway have.
I am just saying that unless you live in a cave you cannot help but know what's going on with Trump. So I don't want to waste my time and energy rehashing it to people.
You are right. If Trump would keep his trap shut, the email scandal might get some traction. One reason is that the email stuff requires a long drawn out discussion whereas Trump's stuff fits easily into a sound bite and is more "scandalous".
The difference between Jesus and religion Religion mocks you for having dirty feet Jesus gets down on his knees and washes them
Indians in the world series. Cavs season about to start. Hitting the gym so early in the morning!! Trump about to get smacked in the election. And conservatives crying their eyes out on the board!!
So early (hey!) so early (hooah!!) so early in the morning!!
God is good, y'all!!!
Not to be a downer, but the Browns are playing.
Vers, you gotta have faith bro!!! We can win today!! Besides we typically split games with the bengals. Cody is about to drop nukes like he's Russia today!!!
Like nukes they made with the Uranium she sold to them? And you're so happy with her?
WE DON'T NEED A QB BEFORE WE GET A LINE THAT CAN PROTECT HIM my two cents...
And it may only be me... but quite a few people that I know that are on facebook and other social media see to discount CNN, Reuters, AP, even some Fox stories as bunk and then are posting Breitbart, infowars or Milo as their news source. Even when somebody somebody posts a factcheck against their story, it quickly gets into a heated debate that MSM is rigged and out to get them.
Indians in the world series. Cavs season about to start. Hitting the gym so early in the morning!! Trump about to get smacked in the election. And conservatives crying their eyes out on the board!!
So early (hey!) so early (hooah!!) so early in the morning!!
God is good, y'all!!!
Not to be a downer, but the Browns are playing.
Vers, you gotta have faith bro!!! We can win today!! Besides we typically split games with the bengals. Cody is about to drop nukes like he's Russia today!!!
Like nukes they made with the Uranium she sold to them? And you're so happy with her?
about as happy as you was with Bush who let the opium boom happen in Afghanistan that is causing some of the problems with see with heroin in country.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Indians in the world series. Cavs season about to start. Hitting the gym so early in the morning!! Trump about to get smacked in the election. And conservatives crying their eyes out on the board!!
So early (hey!) so early (hooah!!) so early in the morning!!
God is good, y'all!!!
Not to be a downer, but the Browns are playing.
Vers, you gotta have faith bro!!! We can win today!! Besides we typically split games with the bengals. Cody is about to drop nukes like he's Russia today!!!
Like nukes they made with the Uranium she sold to them? And you're so happy with her?
about as happy as you was with Bush who let the opium boom happen in Afghanistan that is causing some of the problems with see with heroin in country.
Lame-I didn't know that was happening, are you saying you didn't know that Hillary sold 20% of the uranium mined in our country to the Russians?
WE DON'T NEED A QB BEFORE WE GET A LINE THAT CAN PROTECT HIM my two cents...
Wrong. The media(and liberals) have given Hillary a free pass on EVERYTHING. The media digging up dirt was all about Trump and nothing about Hillary. If they are doing their job, they should be digging up dirt on all candidates, not just the one they want to lose.
No, I'm not saying the media is the reason Trump will lose, he did that on his own. Hillary is as corrupt as you can get, and all the liberals just ignore that. It's disturbing to say the least.
It's supposed to be hard! If it wasn't hard, everyone would do it. The hard... is what makes it great!
If you want to have a decent dialogue, you should start by not making things up.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
If you want to have a decent dialogue, you should start by not making things up.
Got some links proving liberals haven't ignored?
You made the claim that liberals ignored it. The burden of proof is on you.
I'm waiting.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Too bad the only people that are going to vote for him are in that crowd.
How big were Bernie's crowds? Did they help him get votes in the primary?
Quote:
In 1984, Democratic nominee Mondale was trailing President Ronald Reagan, but took refuge in the size of his crowds.
"There's something going on in this country and the pollsters aren't getting it," Mondale said in San Francisco, according to The New York Times. "Nobody who's been with me for the last few days and has seen these crowds, seen their response, seen their enthusiasm, seen the intensity of their response, and how they respond to these issues ... can help but believe there is something happening in this country."
Mondale was correct. Something was happening. A landslide was brewing that would see him win only his home state, Minnesota, and the District of Columbia.
Four years later, Democratic nominee Dukakis was trailing Vice President George H.W. Bush.
"I smell victory in the air, don't you?" the Democratic nominee told a large crowd in Lexington, Kentucky, on his final weekend on the trail. His wife, Kitty, looked at steadily growing crowds and sensed an upset. "It's just intuition," she said, according to the Times. "It's something in the crowds. Something Is happening."
Bush won the election easily, finishing more than 300 electoral votes ahead.
In 2004, hopes soared on the Kerry plane that massive crowds just before election day -- 80,000 in Madison, Wisconsin, and 50,000 on Cleveland's waterfront, assured victory. But Kerry lost both Ohio and the White House.
In 2012, GOP nominee Romney was misled by crowds which swelled as election day approached.
"Look at the parking garage!" Romney gushed in footage aired in the documentary "Mitt" as he eyeballed a crowd on election day in Pittsburgh.
"Intellectually, I've felt we're going to win this and have felt that for some time, but emotionally just getting off the plane and seeing those people standing there ... I not only think we're going to win intellectually, I feel it as well," Romney told reporters, hours before losing handily to Obama.
Also, I like how when Trump is doing bad the mainstream media is the enemy, but when they are giving him free airtime to pontificate on air they not so bad (like they did during the primaries).
but when they are giving him free airtime to pontificate on air they not so bad (like they did during the primaries).
The media is not giving Mr. Trump free airtime out of the goodness of their hearts, they are just waiting for him to screw-up so they can be there for the benefit of his opponent. Remember the birther issue where Mr. Trump made fools of the media?
“Hillary Clinton and her campaign of 2008 started the birther controversy. I finished it.”
Trump punctuated his remarks by blankly stating:
“President Barack Obama was born in the United States, period.”
Then he was done. He walked off the stage, leaving the press furious.
Jake Tapper: That Trump press conference was a “political Rickroll”
As far as the "deplorable" crowd being the only ones voting for Mr. Trump, I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
here we go with the crowd size and yard signs again. lol
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
so because i dont have signs up, that means i'm ashamed?
do you know what false equivalency is?
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Feel free to correct me if I am wrong bro but wouldn't false equivalency be like you saying
All African Americans are voting for Hillary, or all Latin's are voting for Hillary, or All women are voting for Hillary, or Roe V Wade will NEVER be overturned?
Feel free to correct me if I am wrong bro but wouldn't false equivalency be like you saying
All African Americans are voting for Hillary, or all Latin's are voting for Hillary, or All women are voting for Hillary, or Roe V Wade will NEVER be overturned?
If you were attempting to compare those results, yes. If not, then your example is an example of hyperbole.
Most people I know who are voting Trump are pretty straight forward about admitting it. I wouldn't say that debunks anything. I'm just speaking from my own experience.
Imma tell you like I've been telling everybody else for a while now.
We all have to look in the mirror. We the people made these two the nominees. No one else.
But then, these two was probably the best of the bunch, from a base perspective.
Us liberals think the conservatives should've picked Kasich. You conservatives thought we should've rolled with Sanders.
It's all perspective. Y'all have your reasons for Trump. We have our reasons with Hillary.
And the third party candidates were terrible. It's not that they were good. It's that we WANTED to believe they were good. Big difference.
Every election cycle, people say "these two candidates suck".
The same lines will be repeated in 2020. Just like they were in elections prior to this.
NOT ME! I wanted Bernie. I have proof. lol
LOL.. Of all the candidates on either side, Bernie Sanders was probably the only honest man/person. Most of his plan wouldn't work well for America. But he had the stones to stand up and say them and defend them and did so in a very upfront and honest manner.
Bernie would have been fun, no question about it. He's a decent man that got steam rolled by HRC and her team. Which for me is another reason to dislike her.
I also admit that my vote for Johnson will probably help Trump more than Clinton. But I can't bring myself to vote for her. I also know that she's knows more that Trump will ever know.. Still, I just can't do it. Can't.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
Just why is it that everybody is so ashamed, embarrassed, disgusted, and contrite, that they won't put any signs in their yard supporting Hillary?
Hmmm
So does this debunk the theory that people are too embarrassed to admit they will vote Trump?
I wouldn't say it debunks it. That was a legitimate idea earlier in the election season and one that I think had some merit. It probably doesn't apply much anymore; it might even work against him at this point (i.e. there may be more people who will vote for Hillary but are too embarrassed to admit it.)
Imma tell you like I've been telling everybody else for a while now.
We all have to look in the mirror. We the people made these two the nominees. No one else.
But then, these two was probably the best of the bunch, from a base perspective.
Us liberals think the conservatives should've picked Kasich. You conservatives thought we should've rolled with Sanders.
It's all perspective. Y'all have your reasons for Trump. We have our reasons with Hillary.
And the third party candidates were terrible. It's not that they were good. It's that we WANTED to believe they were good. Big difference.
Every election cycle, people say "these two candidates suck".
The same lines will be repeated in 2020. Just like they were in elections prior to this.
NOT ME! I wanted Bernie. I have proof. lol
LOL.. Of all the candidates on either side, Bernie Sanders was probably the only honest man/person. Most of his plan wouldn't work well for America. But he had the stones to stand up and say them and defend them and did so in a very upfront and honest manner.
Bernie would have been fun, no question about it. He's a decent man that got steam rolled by HRC and her team. Which for me is another reason to dislike her.
I also admit that my vote for Johnson will probably help Trump more than Clinton. But I can't bring myself to vote for her. I also know that she's knows more that Trump will ever know.. Still, I just can't do it. Can't.
A vote for a third party really doesn't help either of the main candidates (unless your choice is between Johnson and Clinton, then yeah)
I agree with you about Bernie. I still think some of his ideas were a bit wacko but he seemed like a genuinely good guy. It's kind of sad to see how he was treated throughout the process, with protesters blatantly disrespecting him (crashing the stage, taking over the podium), the DNC conspiring against him, etc.
Imma tell you like I've been telling everybody else for a while now.
We all have to look in the mirror. We the people made these two the nominees. No one else.
But then, these two was probably the best of the bunch, from a base perspective.
Us liberals think the conservatives should've picked Kasich. You conservatives thought we should've rolled with Sanders.
It's all perspective. Y'all have your reasons for Trump. We have our reasons with Hillary.
And the third party candidates were terrible. It's not that they were good. It's that we WANTED to believe they were good. Big difference.
Every election cycle, people say "these two candidates suck".
The same lines will be repeated in 2020. Just like they were in elections prior to this.
NOT ME! I wanted Bernie. I have proof. lol
LOL.. Of all the candidates on either side, Bernie Sanders was probably the only honest man/person. Most of his plan wouldn't work well for America. But he had the stones to stand up and say them and defend them and did so in a very upfront and honest manner.
Bernie would have been fun, no question about it. He's a decent man that got steam rolled by HRC and her team. Which for me is another reason to dislike her.
I also admit that my vote for Johnson will probably help Trump more than Clinton. But I can't bring myself to vote for her. I also know that she's knows more that Trump will ever know.. Still, I just can't do it. Can't.
A vote for a third party really doesn't help either of the main candidates (unless your choice is between Johnson and Clinton, then yeah)
I agree with you about Bernie. I still think some of his ideas were a bit wacko but he seemed like a genuinely good guy. It's kind of sad to see how he was treated throughout the process, with protesters blatantly disrespecting him (crashing the stage, taking over the podium), the DNC conspiring against him, etc.
Well Haus, with all due respect, I'm a never trump kinda guy. So yeah, it is between Johnson and Clinton. If there was no Johnson, I'd go Clinton. I'd do it with clinched teeth and acid reflux and a bottle of Pepto at my side, but that's the way I'd vote.
And I'll let you in on a secret, if Johnson drops out, I will vote for Clinton.. Again, with extreme reluctance. But I will.
And if you want to blame someone, I blame the republican party. Yes, the republican party. They haven't had a candidate that I could back since George W. Bush who I voted for twice.
If you don't put up a good candidate, don't look for my vote. If you put up a lunatic, same thing, you won't get my vote. I'd vote for a potato before voting for Trump.
I would have voted for Sanders if for no other reason than he's a decent guy that has spent his entire career fighting for the people and the underdog. You gotta love a guy like that.
Others were turning themselves into Millionaires, his net worth is in the 300K range last I looked.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
I agree with you about Bernie. I still think some of his ideas were a bit wacko but he seemed like a genuinely good guy.
I don't know how much being "a genuinely good guy" should do w/being elected president.
I do know that socialism doesn't work. It sounds great, but produces terrible results.
I agree Vers. That is why it is so frustrating that such a large percent of people who will vote for Hillary will do so because of some perceived character flaw with Trump. It's rare to hear any economic/policy reason; it's almost always something like, "Trump said such and such" or "Trump is a...". very little substance.
yes, women should ignore the fact that Trump condones sexual harassment/assault, as it has nothing to do with how good of a president he will be.
This is one of many reasons why your boy is about to get smoked in this election.
you just don't get it.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
