DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Indians World Series Thread II

Yep,
Too many walks, only getting on base with 2 outs, etc

ouch

We needed hats for bats. Keep them warm.

Terry Francona at podium

Q: How was the weather?

A: "It was so cold I tried to go to the bathroom in the 4th inning and I couldn't go."

Cleveanger looked tough out there tonight

suddenly, i don't have a great feel here. Gotta win 1 in CHI (kluber pitches game 4 luckily).

I just don't know if we have the bats honestly

and i literally can't watch tv now ... the schwarber love is sickening

j/c:

Rough game. It seemed like a lot of our baserunners reached w/two outs. That's tough.

I have a question about Bauer. How is he perceived? I didn't really like how he talked a lot of smack after the Tribe beat Toronto, especially considering he didn't contribute in a positive way and he came across as kind of a d.... last night.

He's an immature, no talent idiot. Rumblings are the management are pissed at his stupidity. Compound that on top of his inability to help the team in any capacity, things aren't good for him

I'd say Bauer gives us no chance to win when he pitches .. he's not mentally tough and isn't made for the big game IMO

Okay, thanks.

Now I have another question [and again, I just started following the Indians again and am unfamiliar w/the most of the players.] Why do you guys think he started Game 2?

Because he can't hit at all. Otherwise he would have started game 3

Plus the fact that Our number 2 and 3 starters have been hurt.

Thanks.

You guys can be so emotional but not as bad as the GameDay chats. Lol. If someone told you in April - or September - you'd be tied 1-1 in the WS headed to Chicago, you woulda taken that in a heartbeat.
Relax fellas, the really BIG game in this series is the next one. Win that and pressure is on Chicago.

He did only give up 2 runs and 1 of them shouldn't have scored if a proper relay throw was made. Ultimately, I think he did his job. The bullpen gave up 3 more runs (only 2 earned).

Meaning, had the bats shown up at all, and that might be a "tip of the cap to Arrieta" situation, the game should have been right where we needed it.

If that was the worst case scenario, we should be okay. Assuming we can get game 4 with Kluber, we just need to split one of the other 2 games in Chicago. Easy.

The other thing I noticed was that the RFer is really shaky. I thought so in an earlier game, but he showed it again last night w/a dumb throw to second base instead of hitting the cut-off man and then misplaying that liner later in the game.

I asked this before, but only got one reply. How is regarded as a defensive right fielder?

Great arm, but he doesn't always throw it to the right place. I think he's about average as a fielder.

Speaking of which, Maddon is thinking about putting Schwarber in the outfield for the games in Chicago. That really helps us. He was a disaster in the field during last years LCS. I hope Maddon does this.

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/cubs-i...eld-at-wrigley/

Thanks.

Bauer was rough but, I thought Shaw was worse than he or McAllister.

Everyone who pitched last night for the Indians looked pretty much how we worried they would look - rusty. Its good they got the stink off of them, and I expect we'll see better outings next time they pitch. Bauer for instance didn't throw his curve for a strike until the 3rd or 4th inning last night. He can be exasperating to watch, but when he's on his stuff is electric. You just can't give up on a young arm like that. Plus, with Carrasco out and Salazar limited, we don't really have a choice.

Biased to Cubs and that guy. Guess we have no stories worth sharing. Hope we win a pair over there. Our bats sucked. Not sure Bauer was the best hope, but we need to get some innings elsewhere. Bats.

Go, Tribe!

80+ pitches in 3 innings is telling that's he's erractic. He's been erratic for awhile, but as I've said, we can't put the pressure we do on our pitchers with our pathetic offense. Regardless we need to address the bats in the offseason. Might have to give up an arm

Do we Salazar start?

You guys are too rough on Bauer.

He's a fourth starter. He had decent regular season stats.

4.26 ERA, 1.31 Whip, 190 IP, 168 SO, 70 BB, 12 Wins.

Those are decent numbers to get out of your 4th pitcher. I'd take that right now for next year from the 4th spot in the rotation.

And he only gave up 2 runs yesterday. It's not like he was shelled and alone lost the game.

I ......don't fully agree with that.

When he was with Arizona...well even before Ari....he had his own routine. They touched on it last night in the game. He wanted to keep his routine - the odd cross fit-like warmup exercises, the long toss....(he use to do the long toss from foul pole to foul pole) , and the between innings warm up pitching of firing as hard as he can to the catcher. During that time with Arizona, he wanted his way...the organization wanted their way. They had a bunch of issues with that during that time. It's one of the reasons why Arizona let him go.

They didn't want to part with him, but if a guy isn't going to buy into your system...what do u do?

The guy is talented, was one of the top prospects ....the guy was drafted #3 overall in his draft and was one of the top prospects in baseball in the minors. So the guy has talent.

Now this is going off the top of my head so don't take it as gospel, but I remember Hammy talking a few years ago about the guy had a ton of different pitches in his arsenal, which is good but that's not how Major League baseball works. You need to be able to master 1-3 pitches only, having that one top of the line pitch. Look at Miller...has great fastball, but has one of the best sliders. Same goes with Kluber. He's one of those guys that loves his craft, but his issues has always been being coachable and control.

Since he's been with the Tribe, he's changed a few things (so he has listened at least some to the coaches, can't comment on how much). When I took in a few games last year and the one this year. He still does the long toss but now it's from about warning track CF to LF foul line. I truthfully don't remember if he's stopped the firing to home plate during warmup toss. I remember he did it a few years ago, but I haven't seen it this year (maybe just didn't pay attention).

The drone thing wasn't very smart (my nice way of putting it), but it still was a freak accident. Like I said last night during the game and also the announcers made it known....his issue is that first inning. He has some crazy numbers like 5. something ERA in the 1st and way lower (i think it was 3 something) in the rest of the innings.

The guy has great stuff and his issue has always been walks. Heck, i've seen games where he has 8 walks in a game. I know some of it is mechanics, but I wonder if some of it is mental. He sort of reminds me of another pitcher we have in Carlos Carrasco.

He was a top pitcher in the Philly Org before he was traded to us. The guy was up and down. Have a good solid game then the next game would give up a ton of runs. But he always had top of the line stuff. The past 2 years (maybe was year and half) he's finally put it together and has/was been one of our top starters. I'm sort of hoping the same with Bauer. I'm hoping that light will kick on and will be a top of the line pitcher for us....at very least reach that #2 starter stuff.

Bauer had a nice first half for us this year. The guy was in the 3's in ERA, now what happened after that...i don't know what the issue was I can't give you an answer for that.


So overall, he's matured some since coming to Cleveland. I think they both compromised on his routine. They said he's changed his mechanics (how much, I don't know that answer) little bit. So he's taking to instruction at the very least a little bit. And it's hard to disagree with management about being upset about the Drone thing. I'm sure they weren't pleased by that.

I agree with what GM said and other on why he started game 2.

I think another thing to keep in mind is Game 3 starter is Josh Tomlin. I THINK they had Bauer go at home b/c it would be less pressure at home (sounds funny to say b/c it's the WS and its a ton of pressure either way)

I think they went with Tomlin for Game 3 since it's the first game at Chicago. He's very calm pitcher and doesn't get rattled as easily. Josh almost never shows emotion on the mound and I think combining that crazy environment with Bauer would be disaster. In my opinion they believe that Josh can handle that situation.

I'm sorry for all the back to back replies but i'm going from comment to comment down the line.

I agree with you Punch. Bauer really didn't pitch that bad....by that, I mean what you just said about the runs.

The issue OVERALL last was:

- Getting behind the batters in the count
-WALKING batters (we had ...what? 9 walks i think?)
- walking that lead off batter for the inning

US:
- not getting runners on till there was 2 outs.
- Being more patient
- getting the bat off our shoulders
- Arrietta getting ahead in the counts


I'll read the rest of the comments tonight when I get back from work.

A part of the decision to pitch Tomlin at Wrigley is that 1.) he's supposed to be a pretty good hitter and 2.) they didn't want Bauer having to swing a bat with that finger still healing.

Thanks for all the information. I like hearing different perspectives and opinions. I know next to nothing about the current team specifically and about the current teams and players in MLB. Unlike a lot of the guys on the football threads, I like to be educated on things I don't know and don't believe that everyone has to think the same way. I appreciate you and lead seeing things differently. It paints a more clear picture. Thanks again for all of you who are trying to educate.

Now.........I have a couple of comments on how MLB handles the World Series. Hope they don't upset anyone.

--I think the games are played too late in the year. The weather in places like Cleveland and Chicago can be terrible in late October and early November.

--I don't like how MLB awards home field advantage. I get they want interest in the All Star game, but I believe the team w/the best record should have home field advantage. I understand that might upset some of you because that would mean we wouldn't have home field advantage, but man, you play 162 games and ignore that? Weird.

--I don't like the 2-3-2 format. I hated it in the NBA and loved when they changed it. Baseball should change their format, as well.

Yep.

We're getting Cleveland's weather system last night here in Connecticut right now.

Except here it's our first snowfall of the year.

If the wind is blowing in, Tomlin being a fly-ball pitcher would work well for us. If the wind is blowing out, no comment.

Also, in regards to the cold weather and hitting discussion, I think a bigger factor is the air (not wind, though that's a big deal in it's own right). Meaning, if it's humid out, there's more water vapor in the air than normal. With that, there's less Nitrogen per area, and since Nitrogen is heavier than water vapor that makes the air less dense and the ball will move through the air with more ease...alas, more homers.

I used to find that to be counter intuitive, more water in the air makes it less dense, but hey, that's how the physics of baseball works.

Speaking of, I read this book a long time ago and I learned a lot. Knuckleballs, rising fastballs, corked bats, humid air, etc. The Physics of Baseball

The Physics of Baseball

That looks like a book I'd like a lot.

I'm ordering it now for my reading list next summer.

Right, this is why the league should drop to 154 games per year. Only 8 games, but that's a whole week chopped off the postseason schedule.



I can't stand this, even with it helping us this year. I know MLB got what it wanted, by making the All Star game more important, but it also makes it too important at the same time. Should game 7 be in Cleveland and we win, I'd actually feel a bit bad for the Cubs because they rightfully should have hosted game 7. To me, MLB turned HFA into a gimmick.



Yeah, 2-2-1-1-1 has such a better flow for some reason. Maybe because of the extra travel, we get better games due to the players getting more rest. Although, the 2 off days before Game 7 of the NBA Finals was too much time, I was unable to sleep.

the 2-3-3 format is so antiquated. It used to be done to help the press, but that's unneeded anymore

These are good points. Also, Bauer expressed a great deal of concern about batting, because he has not done it very often in his career. I think that the Indians also hoped that giving Tomlin an extra couple of days rest would be helpful for him. He wpre down near the end of the season, sat fr a while while his arm recharged, and then was really good at the end of the season, and into the playoffs. That extra rest probably can only help Tomlin.

As others have said, I also don't think that Bauer pitched that badly last night. He wasn't Kluber, but who is except Klubs?

It's too bad we couldn;t have swapped our run production in the 2 games ..... and scored 1 run in game 1 .... and 6 yesterday.

I have another question for you guys.

How good is Salazar when he is healthy? I get the feeling he is really good. Is that true?

I know a lot won't agree with me, but I think MLB should consider going back to day baseball for the World Series - at the very least for the weekend games. Yesterdays game could have been played in 50-55 degree weather instead of the mid 30's, if it had started at 3PM. Its nearly November - its going to get cold at night in the northern climates. They also need the season to end about 2 weeks earlier. I think a 144-150 game season would be quite representative. All they'd have to do is eliminate interleague play (and raise prices proportionately to offset the $$ loss, LOL).

He was on a VERY good pace till he got hurt, That is why I believe we see him pitch.

Did anyone else hear that Schwarber hurt his knee and hasn't faced MLB pitching for 6 months?

I don't want to start Salazar in this series he was wild last night and has been pretty poor since before the all-star break. I wish we had cookie. I would go: Tomlin 3/6 Kluber 4/7 Bauer/Cleavinger combo game 5 with short leashes and maybe czar too.