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June 18, 2007 4:45 PM Brian Ross Reports: Large teams of newly trained suicide bombers are being sent to the United States and Europe, according to evidence contained on a new videotape obtained by the Blotter on ABCNews.com. Teams assigned to carry out attacks in the United States, Canada, Great Britain and Germany were introduced at an al Qaeda/Taliban training camp graduation ceremony held June 9. A Pakistani journalist was invited to attend and take pictures as some 300 recruits, including boys as young as 12, were supposedly sent off on their suicide missions. Photos: Inside an al Qaeda/Taliban 'Graduation' The tape shows Taliban military commander Mansoor Dadullah, whose brother was killed by the U.S. last month, introducing and congratulating each team as they stood. "These Americans, Canadians, British and Germans come here to Afghanistan from faraway places," Dadullah says on the tape. "Why shouldn't we go after them?" The leader of the team assigned to attack Great Britain spoke in English. "So let me say something about why we are going, along with my team, for a suicide attack in Britain," he said. "Whether my colleagues, companions and Muslim brothers die today or tonight, every drop of our blood will invigorate the Muslim (unintelligible)." Video: Watch the Taliban's 'Graduation' Ceremony U.S. intelligence officials described the event as another example of "an aggressive and sophisticated propaganda campaign." Others take it very seriously. "It doesn't take too many who are willing to actually do it and be able to slip through the net and get into the United States or England and cause a lot of damage," said ABC News consultant Richard Clarke, the former White House counterterrorism official. http://blogs.abcnews.com:80/theblotter/2007/06/exclusive_suici.html
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unbelievable, just unbelievable why why cant they find these ceremony's and bomb them? where are they holding them? if 1 is successful it will be huge.
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You mean that "fighting them over there" won't prevent us from having to "fight them over here"???? Well,so much for that theory huh? I'm shocked! 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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also i forgot to add in... they cant bring there bombs into the country so they will have to make them here so everybody has to be on extra alert
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I don't recall ever having that theory but when people that hate you as much as these do, It's inevitable that they are gonna attack with or without us being at war with them.
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I didn't intend to imply that "you" had that theory. Sorry if that's how it came across.
That's just one of the many "propeganda lines" that have been spoon fed around. My assertion all along is that as far as terrorist acts go,the war in Iraq and Afghanastan really hold no bearing on that.
If anything,it may increase terrorist attempts,not reduce them.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I recall prior to 9/11 we weren't at war, and what happened?
Do nothing isn't gonna keep people safe. People in our country make no sense...
When 9/11 hppened the whole coutry went into a frenzy about what we should do to these people. Our military has been trying to get it done, and now the citizens think its a waste of time and all it does is cause more problems.
its amazing how quickly people jump ship when things aren't going with ease.
We need are military over there to try and foil plots against us and the rest of the world. Okay I'm done ranting now
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Could you please clarify who "these people" are where they were located at? And can you then tell me what that has to do with turning pretty much an entire generation of Iraqi's into our enemy had to do with 9/11? I'm really interested in how that applies to any of this. The fact of the matter is,we're "creating more terrorists" by being in Iraq,than were ever in Iraq to begn with. How does that help us again? And since we "laid in bed with the enemy" by dealing with Pakistan to begin with,guess where the terrirists are now hiding? That's right,with our "friends" the Pakistani's. BRILLIANT! 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I'm not convinced that 9/11 is a result of us NOT going over there and fighting them, whoever and wherever "them" would be, as much as it is a lack of awareness on the part of us as Americans.
For so long we felt we were impenetrable, we felt secure, there was no way a terrorist could do anything on American soil, even though they did just 8 years earlier at the exact same location.
WE FAILED, we let them pull off 9/11. We failed us, our government failed us. We were too smug, and got caught.
I still don't think it's "the' terrorists we are fighting in Iraq, just another set of terrorists. Afghanistan is where we think "the" terrorists we are looking for are, and we seldom hear about anything going on there.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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We need are military over there to try and foil plots against us and the rest of the world.
That's a great idea. Foil plots overseas 24/7 LMAO 
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the war in Iraq and Afghanastan really hold no bearing on that
Sorry, I wasn't clear on my point of view. I was referring to Afghanastan...
Your Iraq arguement has no bearing on what I said. And by creating enemies...
we're doing so by supporting Isreal too. So should we step back and just let the entire middle east destroy that country?
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I'll pose a question for you...
Can you plan attacks when your on the run? Maybe yeah but not as easily as if you can do it from a sustained base.
I'm done arguing...
If you guys hate our country so much than leave it
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Well yea, Prime Minister Attlee of England, Harry S. Truman, and the UN are the founders of the modern terrorist movement...
yebat' Putin
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If you guys hate our country so much than leave it
That is the same line everyone uses when they can't support their argument. We all love this country, it doesn't mean we have to agree with everything this gov't does. I was all for Afghanistan because that's where Osama is located. I never supported the war in Iraq because it was started on shaky ground. All connections between 9/11 and Iraq have been proven to be nonexistent time and time again but that doesn't change the opinion of the supporters of the war. When called on it, people resort to "You don't support our soldiers", "You're emboldening the enemy" and other empty propoganda to try to further their opinion.
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Sorry, I wasn't clear on my point of view. I was referring to Afghanastan...
I fully support the war in Afghanastan. Even though we went there with far too small of troop strength because someone "sidetracked" into Iraq with the majority of our military might,rather than truely "go after those responsible for 9/11 100%".
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Your Iraq arguement has no bearing on what I said. And by creating enemies...
It's VERY relivant when you think about it. Not only do we have the terrorists we were originaly going after,but now? We've created even more by using "unnecassary war" against their nation. Killing tens of thousands of their citizens. But I guess they "don't count"?
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we're doing so by supporting Isreal too. So should we step back and just let the entire middle east destroy that country?
As of now,we're running our own wars half assed and using VERY faulty strategy. The only way we can "help Isreal" is with money. Because the way WE fight wars? All we would do is get in the way. They fight to "win wars". We fight to "win hearts and minds".
We need to stay out of the way of people who know "how to war". Our leaders have forgotten how.....................
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I'll pose a question for you...
Can you plan attacks when your on the run?
Did you even read the story? They weren't "running". They had a terrorist training camp with 300 graduates. Does that sound like "running" to you? They even had media coverage of the event! Yep,they're running like hell all-right.
Look,lots of them are in the mountains of Pakistan and have very little "fear" of staying there. We teamed up with a terrorist nation by using Pakistan as a launching base to attack Iraq. Now? We're paying for that mistake.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Did you even read the story?
Read the story so you become informed on what you're talking about..that's just silly Pit. 
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We need to stay out of the way of people who know "how to war". Our leaders have forgotten how.....................
I agree with most of your post, however, instead of blaming this administration, perhaps we should look at the entire population of the u.s. if we are looking for blame. Why? Because we are a microwave it now, fast food, 30 minute sitcom nation that doesn't have the patience to deal with war.........AND the u.s. as a whole doesn't have the nerve/stomach/heart to do what needs to be done to win a war.
Now, I'm not calling you out, pit - I replied to you since you brought it up - but I didn't mean to "directly" reply to you. Imagine the outrage that would occur - and does occur, when innocent people are killed as a result of an attack - it's horrendous!
The administration, just like recent ones before it, is running the war not to win, but to avoid innocent deaths............and it won't work, but it is done to keep the public backlash as low as possible.
And on a sidenote - if the suicide bombers come here and start having at it, how many others are surprised that it took them this long to do it? I know I've thought for years (before Iraq or Afghanistan), "why don't they do it here"? In all honesty, I'm surprised it hasn't happened yet
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Because we are a microwave it now, fast food, 30 minute sitcom nation that doesn't have the patience to deal with war.........
I really don't like this argument, as it attempts to summarize those against the war as people who were for it and began to change their opinion as time goes on. And it's not to say that those people don't exist, but the outcry against this war isn't the result of a 'fast food sitcom' nation, but common sense prevailing. This whole thing was doomed from the start, and this whole progression of arguments is just wearing thin on me.
I was here, saying that we most certainly wouldn't be greeted by liberators, and everyone had some argument as to why I was wrong (probably something to do with me hating America or something bright like that). When I said that Bush shouldn't wear the flight suit and that w would- need more troops because it wasn't going to be a cake walk, everyone said I was bitter about Bush's success. When I said there were no WMD's found, everyone said I was wrong, and when I was right people still ignored that for awhile. When I said that the insurgency most certainly wasn't in its last throes, when I said violence wouldn't stop after elections, or when we got Saddam, when I said that a civil war was certain to break out, most of you said I was wrong and had some convoluted answer. And here I am facing a new convoluted answer, and this time it's that I'm not patient? I think I've been patient enough.
Look, I'm no genius, either...I don't know wae strategy or how many troops are needed, but when I read countless reports, essays, criticisms from men in the know who say 'we need more troops' or 'they'll probably break into civil war if Hussein is removed'...I mean, all of this stuff is out there. Just read.
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That was a nice reply, but just as I was not referring to Pit in my initial post, I was not referring to you in particular either. In other words, what I attempted to get across is the fact that NO war, in today's u.s. society, will succeed due to the fact that there are too many that would oppose it...........and yes, even if the u.s. were invaded, my feeling right now is that sooner, rather than later, "society" would say "we give up".
The u.s. citizens are used to "here, now, handy, and perfect". Fix it in, not a new york second, fix it now............our attention spans are terrible, and if we can't hit the goal in "x" amount of time, forget it. It must not be worth it. Just my opinion.
And as I stated, I was not talking just Iraq and Afghanistan, nor was I singling out any poster on this board.
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what I attempted to get across is the fact that NO war, in today's u.s. society, will succeed due to the fact that there are too many that would oppose it
I think you're wrong. I will agree with you in saying that the American people will generally support any war effort so long as it's quick and the American casualties are low. But, I don't think we've faced a legitimate effort in a long time. I don't think Vietnam was a war we should have waged, and I think the people agreed. I think Iraq is a war we shouldn't have waged and I think the people are starting to agree. World War II I think was a valiant, noble effort that the people were behind, and that's why sacrifices were made. Now one could cite a different era or timeframe, and it's a valid argument, but I'll stand by my assertion that the people will support valid causes.
This is a very tricky thing we're dealing with here, and your other assertion that insinuates that we're fighting with a hand tied behind our back so to speak, holding back force, etc. I don't think that makes any difference. In fact, I think it's a big part of the problem....we're trying to solve this with military force and it's not going to work because we're not necessarily fighting an army. We're fighting pokcets of a twisted idealism...dozens or hundreds or sometimes even only a handful of men...it's more of an intelligence matter than a military one.
IMO fighting in the streets of Iraq is not stopping terror. It's inciting it.
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Sorry, on my way to my daughter's softball game - I'll reply later - hopefully tonight, as I have some things I want to mention.
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Two ways to fight this war:
1.(and the biggest) Cut off their money supply. Check your 401's to see if anyhting your investing in invests over there or does business with Mid East companies. It's a start and in our control. Their ability to continue operations depends on funds, dry them up and terrorist incidents begin to decline.
2. The type of soldiers needed to wage combat here are quick strike and reactionary teams of SF units. If intelligence (we have that?) indicates a meeting such as in this story or other activity it's in...out, kill them all and violently so. War is hell as Sherman said and he waged hellish war. I've had it with our soldiers being blown up by roadside bombs! I DO NOT want to lose a single soldier but if it has to be I want it kicking enemy arse and kicking it badly! There are NO niceties in a war, been there!
As far as telling fellow Americans to love it or leave it...well, our attitudes and
abilities to sit down, talk and even differ in opinions BUT always come to common ground and understanding to what's best for America seems to be dwindling rapidly. This scares me! This makes us no better than the hammerheads we're fighting! They can't rationally discuss squat without whipping out the AK's and lighting the joint up! We don't do that thank God, but it seems a great divide is growing even greater in our Gov't and the citizens! Someone has to unite! I don't see that someone currently wanting to
preside over these great states! We could use to stand shoulder to shoulder for a change and send a message to both sides of the isle that we want change! I now step off of my soap box!
Thanks for the ear brothers!
Last edited by 1oldMutt; 06/19/07 05:26 PM.
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The problem,IMO Arch,is IF we actually "fought wars to win" with hard nosed strategies,overwhelming troop numbers and aggressively,The war would have been over years ago. This isn't "Germany or Japan" we're talking about here.
If I'm not mistaken,your theory is that "over time,the American people grow weary of war". Then why would we play the "greeted as liberators/win their hearts and minds" card? If you want a "short war",fight it and win it decisively.
The reality is,Bush can't be re-elected to another term. So what would he have to lose by being aggressive and fighting an "overwhelming,devistating" type war?
No matter how you slice it,the American people supported this war predicated upon the "imminant threat" that Iraq was claimed to be. That proved to be false. So now,they simply don't. They saw a "dire need" for war based on the reasons given. Or do you somehow feel the FACT that there was no WMD,no nuclear program and NO ties to Bin Ladin have nothing to do with how our citizens feelings have changed?
I feel your ideaology on this issue is not realistic. When people find out that "the reality of the situation" is NOTHING remotely close to the picture portrayed to them,they will change their minds.
Much like anything else people sale. The "pitch" may have you excited about buying it. But when you look into the product and figure out that it was NOTHING like it was portrayed,you're not going to buy it.
That's quite simply what has happenned here. I know many refuse to accept it,but that's what happenned. And I feel history will show this.
JMHO
People blame the media,the public and everyone else accept the guy who stood in front of our nation and made these false claims which created our "willingness" to go to war. Let's be realistic and quit blaming everything and everybody else shall we?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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You mean that "fighting them over there" won't prevent us from having to "fight them over here"???? Well,so much for that theory huh?
I'm shocked!
I am one who largely agrees with that view.
However....it doesn't mean we are insulated. We should know that by now.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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The problem,IMO Arch,is IF we actually "fought wars to win" with hard nosed strategies,overwhelming troop numbers and aggressively,The war would have been over years ago. This isn't "Germany or Japan" we're talking about here.
If I'm not mistaken,your theory is that "over time,the American people grow weary of war". Then why would we play the "greeted as liberators/win their hearts and minds" card? If you want a "short war",fight it and win it decisively.
The reality is,Bush can't be re-elected to another term. So what would he have to lose by being aggressive and fighting an "overwhelming,devistating" type war?
No matter how you slice it,the American people supported this war predicated upon the "imminant threat" that Iraq was claimed to be. That proved to be false. So now,they simply don't. They saw a "dire need" for war based on the reasons given. Or do you somehow feel the FACT that there was no WMD,no nuclear program and NO ties to Bin Ladin have nothing to do with how our citizens feelings have changed?
I feel your ideaology on this issue is not realistic. When people find out that "the reality of the situation" is NOTHING remotely close to the picture portrayed to them,they will change their minds.
Much like anything else people sale. The "pitch" may have you excited about buying it. But when you look into the product and figure out that it was NOTHING like it was portrayed,you're not going to buy it.
That's quite simply what has happenned here. I know many refuse to accept it,but that's what happenned. And I feel history will show this.
JMHO
People blame the media,the public and everyone else accept the guy who stood in front of our nation and made these false claims which created our "willingness" to go to war. Let's be realistic and quit blaming everything and everybody else shall we?
Okay. You win. It's Bush's fault.
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On the lighter side we have this song about a school for suicide bombers, Life will be great when we're dead: http://www.youtube.com/v/mOajJLW_9hM
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So you don't believe that many of the assertions he made to the American people,that later proved to be false,has NO bearing on why people now do not support the war?
Let's put it this way,had they found "stockpiles of WMD" a nuclear weapons program being built,and direct ties to Bin Ladin and Saddam,that the Amaerican people wouldn't be supporting this war by a much larger margin?
You really do not think these factors have any impact on our citizens support for this war? Say that isn't so Arch. Surely you don't sincerly believe that tripe do you?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Why ask what I think, pit?
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I'm really interested in your perception about that.
I mean so many assertions were presented that many people felt "were legitimate reasons for war".
And you seem to indicate that you feel the fact that these assertions that proved to be false have absolutly no bearing on why now people have had a change of heart.
I'm not saying that "everybody" that has changed their minds made that decision based on these things. But it only stands to reason,IMO,that when you find out the very reasons you supported the war simply didn't exist in the first place,that may have a HUGE bearing on how and why you might no longer support it.
I do know that it is my feelings on the subject and I'm sure I'm not alone in that. I mean if these assertions had proven to be true,I think we would have had every legitimate reason to go into Iraq. But with those allegations having been proven false,I see nothing of substance to have gone to war there in the first place.
Surely Arch you can understand that not all of America aren't "swaying their opinion just because of the media" or "expect results in microwave time". When there are other VERY legitimate factors to consider based on what we were told compared to the reality of the facts as we know them now.
I would hope you can see a shread of logic in that thought process.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Screw the WMD's and all the politics involved fact is we have our troops over there regardless of the reason, and as an american we as U.S. citizens need to support them. These are our people and remember they are only doing their job. The reasoning for us being there doesn't matter anymore, fact is we are there and we should just kill alll them hating bastards.
Hamas is next , hopefully Israel steps up and shows us how to fight a war in the right way again. This politically correct BS is not working. Kill them all and start with the children and women, hell let's even just televise the killings to show we mean business. Nuke these scumbags to hell and let them deal with choosen their maker.
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So you don't believe that many of the assertions he made to the American people,that later proved to be false,has NO bearing on why people now do not support the war?
Correct. As was previously discussed, support for the war in Afghanastan has declined as well. It dropped below 70% before we even went into Iraq. Arch is right, the American people will not support a war that takes longer than a month and is not fought at 30,000 feet.
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I feel both you and Arch are avoiding admitting the simple FACT that our citizens were duped into supporting this war. Well,when the FACTS came out,they no longer support it. You dismiss the falsehoods perpitrated on the American people and blame THEM rather than the person responsible for this mess. I guess maybe you sleep better at night by avoiding reality. This same group that supports taking "personal responsibilty for what one says and does" seems to blame everyone but the perpitrator of these falsehoods that created the support and once the truth came out,he has created the very reasons that people no longer support the war. So much for "personal responsibility and being accountable for your actions when it's "one of your own". Just a double standard that you expect everybody BUT your "hero". Then? It's everybody's fault but his. How noble of you.  Hypocricy rears its ugly head. Quite sad really...............  .
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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We were lied into going into Afghanistan?
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I agree with most of your post, however, instead of blaming this administration, perhaps we should look at the entire population of the u.s. if we are looking for blame. Why? Because we are a microwave it now, fast food, 30 minute sitcom nation that doesn't have the patience to deal with war.........AND the u.s. as a whole doesn't have the nerve/stomach/heart to do what needs to be done to win a war.
Till the next Pearl Harbor or 9/11 happens. Then America wakes up and kicks ass. But with 9/11 it gets old and most people don't want to deal with it b/c it gets dirty and they move on. Thank God our military doesn't.
The worst thing these guys can do is attack again IMO. It's going to give the Americans another chance to rally behind something and get things done. Sure Bin-Laden isn't in custody yet, but when was the last time anyone heard from him since we hit Afghanistan?
And this tape,,I wonder how much of it is BS. Gee lets introduce terror on a level Americans can understand,,like a high school graduation. I don't buy it at all.
Our honor defend, we will fight to the end, for OHIO! GO BUCKS!
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465 |
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Kill them all and start with the children and women, hell let's even just televise the killings to show we mean business. Nuke these scumbags to hell and let them deal with choosen their maker.
Terrorism in the name of ending terrorism?
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 75
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 75 |
You have no clue. Go pick some more flowers and "wish" issues that have been going on for years would go away. Fact is in the long run you are clueless, but like to pick and choose what to answer too. How many more real americans need to die before you really care? From the looks of it, you support the enemy moreso then your own people and for that, your pretty much useless, but I bet you feel good aiding the enemy, it's people like you who give our country a bad name. I am an american and will kill whoever and whatever I am told to so people like you can speak. Remember that next time you attempt to babble about your agenda.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,276
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,276 |
hahahaha.. you sound like a nazi in training. Lets slaughter women and children! GOOD IDEA!
Last edited by Kingcob; 06/20/07 01:25 AM.
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 75
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 75 |
damn right kill the women and children and stop the breeding of hate towards america. Hell read the damn article these people are sending children to try and kill us. Do you find that funny?
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,276
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,276 |
You are either a troll or a complete moron. To clarify, the percentage of people who are terrorists in the middle east is very very small, and to kill everyone to protect us against terrorism (which has killed about as many Americans as lightning), is outrageously offensive to suggest.
Last edited by Kingcob; 06/19/07 11:46 PM.
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