DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns trade for Patriots linebacker Jamie Collins

like this trade 3rd round for collins is lopsided are way.
2 point collins is 27 years old if he does not sign a longterm deal this year he may only get 30 million for the rest of his career a significant down grade from 50 million that I figure the browns will offer.
3 If the browns franchise him he would be payed well but maybe he gets nothing at 29.

As always Browns fans want to look at it and say ! 100 percent great move, or 100 percent stupid move. As always the truth is going to come out 1 to 3 years down the road. As a diehard Browns fan I pray this works out. As a lifelong Browns fans I have my doubts.

I expect Collins to be primarily used inside. He just doesnt have a lot of pass rush moves from the outside but he can fill the gap like few in the NFL. He played both inside and outside for the Pats but I feel he is more effective when playing in the traffic inside.

Ogbah will make a good backup for Garrett Nassib is at home LDE. Probably our best pick out of this draft.

So do I.

J/c haven't read the posts yet. But without exaggeration Jamie Collins is one of the best LBs in the NFL. Getting him for a 3rd round pick is a steal.

Hopefully they already made contract stipulations/guarantees as part of the trade because this is only a great trade IF they can sign him.

In the current base 34, JD could play R/LOLB and either ILB spot.
In nickel packages can literally play anywhere except for deep S or interior DL.

Not strange IMo. If the Pats don't have the cap space to sign him without blowing up another position or two, it makes sense to get a decent pick and move on to the next guy.

got a question for you due you think he will be used primarily inside or outside?
.So if you look forward the browns may draft a middle linebacker high giving us shelton ,collins plus maybe a stud middle linebacker.

If the browns win one game because of him this is a excellent move.

I believe Kirksey is likely to push Davis to the Bench and Collins takes over Kirksey's wil/ mike tendencies. Davis is absolutely horrid. never seen anyone take themselves out of the play the way he can.

Collins can thump in Ray Lewis fashion. He just isnt much of a pass rusher.

By Mary Kay Cabot, cleveland.com
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on October 31, 2016 at 6:13 PM, updated October 31, 2016 at 6:14 PM

BEREA, Ohio - Hue Jackson made it clear the winless Browns didn't trade for Jamie Collins just to help them survive these last eight games.

"No, I don't think we want to try him out,'' said Jackson. "We'd love to keep him, obviously. But it's got to be mutual. And hopefully we can move in that direction. But it's getting him here, having him get to know us, us get to know him. We know what he is, we know what he brings to the table and I don't think we would've done this if we don't think there is an opportunity to move forward with him.''

That means the Browns have either already started extension talks for Collins, 27, or they will soon. They acquired him Monday in a trade with New England for a conditional fourth-round pick in 2018, but it's expected to improve to a third-round compensatory pick in 2017 if the Browns are awarded one that high, based on the amount and caliber of free agents they lost.

But Collins won't come cheap. Set to become a free agent after this season, Collins was looking for "Von Miller money'' out of the Patriots, according to ESPN's Adam Schefter.

That's an average of about $19 million a year. The problem is, Collins has 10.5 sacks over the past 3.5 seasons, while Miller averages almost 14 sacks a season when healthy.


Thoughts from Browns on Jamie Collins trade
"We added what I think is a tremendous football player to our team today in Jamie Collins,'' said Jackson. "It's another sign of I think where we're headed. I always think we're looking for ways to improve our team and I think we truly did so here today. Had an opportunity to talk to Jamie on the phone, it was a great conversation. He's going to come here with an open mind and come here and play football.''

"He's kind of a quiet young man who the most important thing to him is playing. That's what's important to him. Looking forward to meeting him and spending time with him and getting him acclimated here as soon as we can, getting him to know his teammates and learning our system and what we do.''

Browns acquire Collins in trade with Patriots

Jackson, who needs big playmakers on a defense that has blown four second-half leads, isn't worried about Collins freelancing, which is what former Browns general manager and former Patriots personnel executive Mike Lombardi said bothered Bill Belichick about Collins.

"Hey, the way he freelances is okay with me,'' said Jackson. " What happened there is not what's important for us here. We see a player that's very talented and has a tremendous skillset that fits in with what we do. So he's a Cleveland Brown now.''

Collins (6-3, 250) was originally selected by the Patriots in the second round of the 2013 draft out of Southern Miss. He's started 41 of his 50 games, totaling 285 career tackles, 10.5 sacks, five interceptions, 10 forced fumbles, four fumble recoveries, one defensive touchdown and one blocked extra point.

In 2015, he made his first Pro Bowl selection and was named to the Associated Press All-Pro second team. He led New England in tackles and played every defensive snap during the team's win in Super Bowl XLIX. He also led the Patriots in tackles in 2014 and 2015. This season, Collins started six of seven games, registering 43 tackles, two interceptions, one sack and one forced fumble.

"He's a tremendous pass rusher, he can play linebacker, there's several things he can do,'' said Jackson. "He has a real versatile skill set, because he's done both there at New England. We'll definitely find ways to plug him in and have him be a contributing member to our defense.''

As for whether he'll play inside or out, Jackson said, "we'll see. Let's get him here. It's where his comfort level I think is what's most important. And then we'll kind of work around that.''

Jackson also said he doesn't think Collins, who will debut for the Browns Sunday against the Cowboys, will have struggle going from a Super Bowl contender to a winless team.

"This young man is, I think he gets it,'' said Jackson. "There are decisions sometimes that are out of players' hands and I think what's most important to him, he's just excited to have the opportunity and we're excited to have him here.''

was just stated on NFL Network that it is a conditional 4th pick in 2018

those that are arguing that the pats did it to get "something" for him before he hits FA (in other words, they wouldn't re-sign him) ... they would have acquired a 3rd round pick anyways when he signed elsewhere PLUS they could have kept him through their Super Bowl run this year.

something about this trade raises a red flag to me

If i'm Horton my 1st choice for base 34 is to I play JD at SILB next to Kirksey

my 2nd choice for base 34 is OLB opposite Ogbah

In nickel I'm playing him at ILB

But, i'm also blitzing him and bringing him off the edge at times

My guess is that he starts out inside, but then eventually ends up moving all over the place. He's now our best defensive player and I don't think it's close.

I talked to a bud of mine that lives in NE and he knows football .. we grew up together ...

Him and Billicheck didn't get along .. he wasn't a team player in that it was all about him and his PT ... didn't care that Billicheck may know what he's doing and he didn't like his role ..

He says we got a very good football player that is HIGHLY MOTIVATED ..... his exact words ... "hopefully he matures or whoever signs him long term is GOING TO REGRET IT" ..

Take it for what its worth ... i think its a hell of a move .. lets see what we got and worst case .. we have him MOTIVATED for two years .. and maybe he will mature .. prolly not .. but one can hope ..

i almost spit out my drink at subway when i read we got him for a conditional pick. He's literally the first LB we've had here that's worth a damn since probably Jamir Miller. I just hope Horton doesn't ruin him. Our run game just got tremendously better

Don't forget our coverage as well. He has 2 picks this season so far.

he is literally a 250lb safety that was converted to linebacker in college. That just has tremendous value as they just get used to seeing things differently.

And pass rush and special teams.

Did anyone else see him hurdle the snapper and block a punt?

250 lbs and 4.64 40 yd
Broke the record at broad jump at the combine and forced them to add another line on the ground.

He has got all the measurables that the FO is looking for.

I wonder how many people that are upset, would of been upset if a different team made this exact same deal..

to me a conditional 4th in 2018 is a steal for this guy...but what do I know? lol

I guess it depends on if we lock him up long term on how good of a trade this is... If we get him for openly this year it's a waste... Eve a. Fourth rounder isn't worth it... If we can lock him up long term then it's a steal...

I am sorry, not trying to be disrespectful. but not sure what that means. to me we get him for 8 game minimum. most likely 4-7 years...and only a 4th in two years from now is a steal...but we will have to wait a see how it pans out.

BELICHICK CONFIDANT LOMBARDI: PATRIOTS WERE TIRED OF COLLINS FREELANCING
By Phil Perry October 31, 2016 1:05 PM Link

Jamie Collins was a freelancer on the field, and the Patriots weren't going to continue to put up with it.


That's how former assistant to the Patriots coaching staff Mike Lombardi explained the team's decision to trade Collins, a Pro Bowl linebacker last season, to the Browns for a compensatory third-round pick.

"Not surprised by the Pats trading Collins," Lombardi tweeted on Monday. "Not been playing well at all they need to get the defense fixed. This will get their attention."

Lombardi added: "Collins on the second play of the game [versus Buffalo] does whatever he wants and Bills gain 28 yards. Been happening all year. It was not going to continue."

The play Lombardi referenced was Bills running back Mike Gillislee's 28-yard run in the first quarter. Collins crept up to the line of scrimmage and shot a gap between the guard and tackle anticipating an inside run. Gillislee instead bounced outside and had plenty of room to run. Had Collins remained on the defensive right side of the formation, he may have been in position to make a play.

Collins' athleticism is what has made him one of the game's most impactful linebackers over the last season-and-a-half, but Lombardi insists that his eagerness to go off-script was not going to be tolerated any further.

"You are either coaching it or allowing it to happen," Lombardi wrote. "Belichick decided he was not going to allow it to happen. Colllins talented but..."

Collins played 47 of a possible 69 defensive snaps in Sunday's win over Buffalo, which came as somewhat of a head-scratcher since he is usually close to a 100 percent participant when healthy. Sixth-round rookie Elandon Roberts saw time in place of Collins in certain packages, playing 28 snaps total.

Lombardi worked in New England during the 2014 and 2015 seasons, and he worked with the team into last offseason before he and the Patriots mutually parted ways. Lombardi, who worked under Belichick during Belichick's head coaching tenure in Cleveland, now serves as an analyst for Fox.

is it a 4th in 2018 or a 3rd because on tv they're reporting as a 4th in 2018...and Hue said he doesn't really care about the freelancing...just curious

As I understand it, the Browns traded a contidional 4th round pick to the pats for Collins. If he leaves and the Browns get a compensatory 3rd round pick the Pats would then receive that pick instead. If he remains, with the Browns, I believe it remains the 4th rounder.

thanks for clearing that up for me. man I hope he pans out we need it. our DB's worry me the most

I don't believe this is correct. I think that it is a conditional fourth rounder because the Browns can't technically trade a compensatory pick that they don't actually own. If/when they get the compensatory pick, then that's what goes to the Patriots. If, for some reason, the Browns do not get that pick, then the Patriots get the Browns fourth round pick.

Anyway, I am excited that we got a very good player. Here is a pretty good article laying out all the possible factors behind the trade:

https://theringer.com/five-unsatisfactor...7a33#.vt6whm6j5

It may be a difference of 1 or 2 spots around 96 to 100 when it is finalized. So the Pats get the 3rd rounder comp pick, if awarded or the Browns 4th round pick if a 3rd rounder is not awarded to the Browns.

sooo...it's a late 3rd or early 4th? I think either way is good. then we can use all 13 picks on DB's and hope 3 or 4 of them stick...well maybe one on a O-line guy and one on a NT

Ok i got clarrification on this one. its a 4th rounder unless or until we get our 3rd round compensatory for Alex Mack. Once that pick is handed out, the pats get it.

I think that he will play outside, because we have sucked at setting the edge, and Collins is supposed to be very good at doing so.

got it. thanks for the research.

Even if he does play outside it won't be very often. We mostly play a 4-2-5. He would be among the "2."

I think that he will play outside, because we have sucked at setting the edge, and Collins is supposed to be very good at doing so.

If it's our 4th round comp pick, we basically just traded a 5th rounder for Collins.

Like the pick and your explanation. Passes the sniff test for me. Unfortunately, how he gets used in Horton's D is concerning. Want to see this guy play. The money can happen later; pay the man if he performs. But the proof is in the pudding. Unleash him.

If we lock him up long-term, this is WAY better than the unknown of a third or fourth-round draft pick. I'm cautiously optimistic about this move as it pertains to beyond this season, but Collins might now be our best player on D and fills a glaring weakness.

Might be?? .. *L* ... its not EVEN CLOSE ...