DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... The Great Divide: A west coast liberal's perspective.

As I mentioned earlier in the thread ; Seems to me that he left will not be happy until they have one size fits all and they will be the ones who size you .. They love free speech as long as THEY get to talk , don't want any of your mouth !

The Country was built on the concept of ( eventually ) 50 States all with their own legislators and judicial system .. You want to be a moralistic , bible touting , individual thinking , entrepreneur , family man ------ Live in the Middle States .. If you hip and a free spirit live on the coasts ..

Leave each other alone to enjoy their life ..

Funny how Republicans want freedom of speech unless it's in a foreign language.

I think one of the most important pieces about free speech, post-holocaust was from Noam Chomsky a highly decorated leftist.

Thanks DevilDawg. I am listening and I will respond once I put my thoughts together. There's a lot there to think about.

I agree with the above. I do wonder just how influential Ivanka will be. He holds her in high esteem and regard. She is a very bright lady so, I can imagine if she feels for a specific issue or that Dad is going too far in one extreme she might bend his ear. That said, I thought the same during the campaign and he continued to say ridiculous things. So, who knows. Part of me also sees Trump a lot more moderate Republican than many on the far right do. He said a lot of insulting things and he was insensitive to many but, how many of these things were said for effect to appeal to the "common man" to gain their trust and vote? If so, then yes, he is no better than the Clinton's that the common man felt so disgusted with. In other ways, you could call it a brilliant move as it all played out with the common folk eating out of the palm of his hands. Again, we will see and time will tell.







I will say the misunderstanding and unfair labeling of the LGBTQ community is no different than assuming that every old white guy on the park bench near a playground is a perv, the teen black male on the street is a gangster, the latino family in your neighborhood are illegal or the muslim on your street is a terrorist. I teach at least 10 transgender students and all were born girls who now identify as male. They don't want to use the male restrooms because they worry for their own safety. They choose to use the "all gender" restrooms we designated this year. So, I think the immediate reaction of the bathroom bill allowing for pervs to shower with your daughter is totally unwarranted and completely over the top. Does that mean some crazy person will exploit it? I am sure there will be. But, as the 2nd amendment folk say....just because some abuse it don't assume everybody will. THAT SAID, I DO NOT want to get into endless circles of arguments about all-gender bathrooms. I am exhausted with that. We have done it for over a year now and I really do want to understand and listen & not continue going in circles. I have come to the conclusion that for some moderate dems and the republicans, the bathroom bill and other progressive 21st century social changes and issues may have been a tipping point and definitely played out on Tuesday. Enough said on that topic for now.

I will also say that if Dems/liberals expect people to not condone acts of racial hatred being committed by some on the outer right fringe then it is feasible to think that the Dems/liberals etc. need to stand up and speak out against the rioters from the outer left fringe. To riot is not going to solve anything and it just brings all of down to the same level that we say the other side is stooping to. I have said this over and over. Those rioting are a disgrace and many are anarchists who do the same on May day protests while others are joining along for the ride. Those liberals and Dems who organized the protests and maybe even Hillary need to stand up and speak out about it just as much as they call for Trump to speak out and distance himself from any far right reactions to the election (vandalism, graffiti, KKK marches etc.).

Since Tuesday little else has consumed my thought but, I will be honest, I feel sickened by my party and honestly this election has confirmed my thoughts that the Dems are no better than the Republicans. They have a long way to go to earn my vote again. The Pacific Green Party is looking more and more better for my own morals and conscience. I have argued for years that we need a viable 3rd party but, if one feels disgusted by their political party then it is time to seek options and as of today I am at that point. We will see in 2 & 4 years time. I have always invested as much into my local/state politics as I have my federal as I know my city and state is what immediately impacts my day to day life.

Welcome to the middle PDX It's where I have spent my entire adult life. I idea of voting for somebody just because they were a member of either party always seemed stupid to me. I have always voted on each individual on their own merits.

I don't know if I would say I am in the middle. I am def more left than right. But, I am not so extreme that I am going to vilify my party's candidate and then riot in the streets because the other guy won. This election has made me disgusted with a sizeable portion of the Democratic party and it has made clear just how arrogant and lazy we have become, which I want no part of. If I were to vote 3rd Party my politics, morals and conscience align with the Green Party.

Much of it will depend on where we are at in 4 years time as a nation and who the Dems produce. Right now though they will have to work hard to earn my vote back.

What would Trump have to do, to earn your vote in 4 years?

Not increase the national debt. That's it.

To name a few and off the top of my head at 6:45 am:

Be the "great uniter" he claims to be.

Not get us involved in a messy war we have no business getting in.

Conduct himself professionally

Grow the economy

Reduce the national debt

Appoint sensible SCOTUS judges who are more to the middle rather than far right (or left)

If he repeals ObamaCare then replace it with something that truly is better for all, especially our vulnerable

Sensible approach to guns

Leave Roe V Wade alone.

Don't pull out of a Paris Environmental protection act

Don't appoint Ben Carson as Sec of Education. I will accept his nomination as Surgeon General but not Education.

EDIT: Don't pull out of NATO. That would be a disaster!

I am far right when it comes to abortion, and gun control, far left when it comes to gay marriage, laws, and drugs. and pretty much in the middle on most other things. I guess I must swing both ways LOL

All you need now is a skittles flag.

Do you have one cutie

I hate that the far left is politicized as hating guns. I mean, it's completely fair to say that we hate guns. But I still don't like it. I wish the left could come to terms with their gun hate, but I doubt that will ever occur.

I think there's a lot less people on the left that hate guns than what you think.

People are just tired of seeing mass shootings all the time.

However, they probably aren't gonna come to terms with guns now that word on the street is trump wants a national conceal carry policy or something like that.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/11/09/national-reciprocity-reality-president-trump/

I guess this website is straight from the source, now that their owner is a top dog in the WH.

As far as the topic of this thread, these kinds of things bother me. These guys are feeling empowered now:

Black veteran says he was refused free Veteran's Day meal at Chili's after man in Trump shirt questioned his service

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/black-veteran-says-refused-free-160950540.html

Dude provided proof of service and everything too...that pencil neck Eddie Haskell looking manager would've better served his company just to let it alone and not cause a scene.

What else I'd like to know is how this old man that served in Germany knew that this obviously much younger man didn't serve just because they didn't let blacks serve in Germany?
Did this old man provide any proof of service himself so as to claim any credibility in calling the black mans service into question?

I served in the 80's along side the whole spectrum of humanity as far as colors go. Even had a Korean guy in my platoon.
The old guy had no business doing that, we all were serving everywhere by the 80's.

If I'm Chili's and I wanna save face, this fella would be eating there free every time he walked in for a year even if he came in for lunch and dinner for the duration.

Trump deserves the same level of respect given to Obama.

I saw this item too yesterday.

I'm going to make a prediction, based upon Human Nature: incidents like this will climb throughout the coming year, and won't level off or begin to subside until Trump supporters (or better yet, Trump himself) begin to call them out- every single time. It's the only action that will carry enough weight to actually make a difference.

This is a golden opportunity for all those Trump supporters who say that bigotry had no factor in their POTUS choice to separate themselves once and for all from the ~% (who knows the number?) of "deplorables" that are emboldened right now. It's a triple-win if they do this:

1. It will force these Stormfront/KKK/wannabee types back under the rock they crawled from
2. It will remove them from the ranks so that Hillary Clinton's claims lose their legitimacy
3. It will help to keep fellow Americans safe.

If you Dawgs are the type of folks whose words I can believe in, you'll be on the front lines protecting anyone who is threatened by this kind of bullying. I'll put it this way:

How differently would this story have read if someone wearing a red "Make America Great Again" ball cap stepped up in this soldier's defense?

How cool a story would that have been?

If behavior like this is something you personally find unacceptable, then your help is imperative. It will take ALL of us to fight against this ugly element of our society that we all know exists.

These folks are nearby, and for the time being, they'll be much easier to spot. Time to put on your deputy's badges and "make America safe again."

.02

You're so adorable in thinking they'll call each other out.

I'm not ready to paint every single Trump-supporting Dawg Talker with that brush. Maybe it's easy for you... but I can't roll like that.

I've met some of these people. I've broken bread and tipped glasses with them. I'd like to think that if I got hassled at a Browns tailgate, they'd have my back.

And if our guys would do that at a Browns game, there MUST be someone in Oklahoma, Wisconsin and Tennessee who'd be willing to do the class/character thing, as well.

If that's adorable to you, well- I don't really mind coming off a little bit 'precious.'

.02

Blocks Of Anti-Trump Protest Buses Caught On Tape

Earlier today we showed that, contrary to USA Today's claims that the anti-Trump protests across the nation are "spontaneous, involving people from all walks of life", according to Wikileaks documents at least two of the people profiled by USA Today have a history of being professional agitators for the Democratic party, whose task is to stir up popular protests and - in extreme cases - unleash rioting, such as the following clip showing the latest day of violent protests in Portland revealed.

Now, courtesy of a Zero Hedge reader, we have visual confirmation of how a substantial portion of these professional, paid protesters arrive at the site of the protest, in this case Chicago.

As our reader notes, "I have a video of 5 city blocks on the West side of Chicago lined with busses from Wisconsin (Badger Bus Lines) bringing in protestors. The Sears tower is visible in the background."

The video was taken at 3:30pm on South Canal Street in Chicago on Saturday. As our reader points out, hundreds of the participants that took part in the downtown Chicago protests from November 12 were bused in using these vehicles. Other arrived by train.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-11-13/blocks-anti-trump-protest-buses-caught-tape

What bothers me about the protests is that I guarantee these people probably weren't as active for Hillarys ground game.

Right is Right ... Wrong is Wrong ...

I'd of stuck up for the guy in a heartbeat ...

Nancy Pelosi said tea party protests are “not by any means an organic grassroots movement. Rather, she said, they are a deliberate astroturf campaign organized by two well-funded right-wing think tanks.”

Because that’s what they do.

The left always accuses us of what they are guilty of. Here’s what they don’t understand — we know the enemy. We have been fighting this evil for eight years. We are battle-hardened. They don’t have a chance.

My statement wasn't directed at every single Trump supporter here or anywhere for that matter. I simply don't expect many if any including Trump himself to call out others on their racism, bigotry, and hate. Maybe I'm wrong. We'll see.

Well for now we are too busy dealing with your Racist, bigoted and hateful lot marching through America's streets.

George Soros must be proud of his puppets.

That's not exactly calling out the Trump supporter at Chili's as the racist he obviously is like Clem suggested. But I do believe you would stick up for the other guy in a heartbeat.

Screw you. It's not my lot, I work for a living.

The crying baby ass protesters need to get back to class.

I agree with what u said Clem ...

If u watch the 60 minutes show .. Trump did more last night than oBUMa did in the last 8 years ...

WHERE IS HE AND HILLARY on this one? ... its OK for the libs to be criminals (cause thats what there doing .. breaking the law) and oBUMa and Hillary get a pass while Trump is held accountable? ...

PLEASE let me know what your doing about your peeps .. u know .. the ones destroying property and stopping traffick ...

The more i read of what u say .. unless I'm missing something .. the more I think your as hypocritical as Swish ...

U certainly call the trump supporters out in every post ... your peeps ... i haven't seen it yet ... if i missed it, i apologize ... i don't re-call seeing it at all .. so far to my recollection you've been a one way street on this one ...

And trust me .. if i saw one of your peeps getting harassed by a trump supporter .. i'd help out the lib in a nano second ...

RIGHT is RIGHT ... WRONG is WRONG ... no one should be harassed or hit for their beliefs .... no matter how wrong your side is .. *L* ..

Oh so you think they are Conservative Whites marching and rioting?

No, they are Liberal/Progressives, like you, protesting American Democracy. Own it!

I could care less what u think of me .. u don't know me one iota ..

What i do know is if i classified u in the manner in witch u did me .. you'd say sumptin like .. SCREW U ... *L* .....

And there your lot as much as the racist a-holes that support Trump are my lot ...

One of the problems with you LIBS and its being proven EVERY NIGHT now ... your tolerant and inclusive as long as everyone agrees with u ....

U just proved it by saying I didn't respond the way u wanted me too on the above post .. then u told me how I'd behave and called me a racist when u said "U would stick up for the other guy in a heartbeat" ... so glad U know whats in my heart ... and I'm the problem ..

1 + 1 = 2 ....

40 - U didn't get your 1,500 and new i-phone yet? ...

*LOL* ...

"There's right and there's wrong. You gotta do one or the other.
You do the one, and you're living. You do the other,
and you may be walking around, but you're as dead as a beaver hat."
-John Wayne

Speaking of the great divide.

Let's play trivia. When was the last time the GOP had the house, senate, and WH?

1928

If you got hassled by anybody Clem I would be willing to sit on your porch 24/7 to have your back bro

I'd have your back clemmy. Even swish's.

Right is right, and wrong is wrong.

And do you know what happened the following year?

/Tin foil hat.

I think that there are a lot of people, many of whom voted for Trump, (and others who didn't) who believe this ..... and with good cause, IMHO.

Free speech is for everyone on a college campus ..... unless it isn't the opinion of those in power .... then just STHU, (heck) don't dare say anything controversial (meaning, against the opinion of those in power)in a "safe zone" ..... and so forth.

I'm not doing anything, Diam- but it's not because I'm a hypocrite. It's because nothing like this is happening in my town. I'm sure you aren't suggesting that I take a leave of absence from my job, fly to one of these hot spots and do the police's job for them, are you?

Now- if I'm sitting at a Red Lobster and I see some Af/Am hooligan harassing an old white couple over this election, that kid has a real problem on his hands... and I'll personally be that problem. I was raised right- in the Baptist church, by my town's Top Cop. (Yeah... didn't know that about me, did you?) Part of my upbringing was standing up to bullies and sticking up for the powerless. Like you said, right is right/wrong is wrong.



See- this is what you don't get about me- I don't have 'peeps.' There are things with which I agree, and I'll say so. I speak my own mind, whether you think I play for a'team' or not. You have never- never once, seen me 'gang up' on another Dawg over politics. And in case you missed it (which you most obviously did) I just finished disagreeing with Perfect Spiral not 2 posts [u]before[/u] you launched into me.

If your mindset is to expect some sort of 'even-handedness' from me regarding my political views, you can 'pound sand' on the beach (without using your hands). If you expect me to be honest with any other poster, including you, then you'll get what you want from me. I'll agree, I'll disagree... but I won't sugar-coat stuff to make you feel better about me, and I won't lie.

So.... here's where we stand. I've been pretty respectful of you despite our differing political views- at a time when you're hinting that I might be a hypocrite. The evidence that I don't play on teams is right next door to you in this thread- so you did miss it.

Apologize or don't. The choice is yours. But if you're trying to call me out in front of the entire board, please keep this fact in mind:

Your character is on public display, as well.