DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2017 NFL Season 2017 NFL Draft Who should we draft in 2017?

Agreed
Ridiculous how often potential 1st round draft picks last to the 3rd round

Yeah. What dumb posts. We all could go make fun of mac.

That's a lot more meaningful!

Just because Peppers hasn't really been asked to play safety doesn't mean he can't. People forget that the B1G is still a run heavy conference. It wouldn't make a lot of sense to ask him to try to cover a lot if teams are going to run it at you more.

Can Peppers be Kam chancellor great?

Maybe not more meaningful, but definitely more fun
I take that back. Neither is fun.

The #2 player in the league with total pressures (sacks/QB hits/QB hurries) is an interior DL.

Aaron Donald

https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-3-highest-graded-nfl-edge-defenders-entering-week-14/

That settles it. Draft Allen!

Wait. Who is number 1? What about the rest of the top ten? Shall we ignore them so you can prove some dumb point?

Maybe...who knows what the prospects will become though? I believe more in evaluation then projection.
We can know what the players are as prospects, their skillset their production etc. But, I haven't the slightest clue what they'll become.

If we're playing the projection game I could say that Allen could be generational player etc and follow up with Miles is good but not a Kerrigan or even a Jaabal Sheard.

You know?

IF we are going to project what players will become I think the only fair way to compare 2 prospects with similar grades but different position is to project them both reaching the same level at their given positions. Or for me, I try to stick with the evaluations not the projection aspect.



Agree 100%. But the converse is even more true though there is much less of a guarantee that you'll be able to find an interior lineman that can pass rush/penetrate.

Agreed 100%. Plenty of areas that need to be addressed and only 4 "premium" picks to get it done.
And after the top 2 picks there is much less certainty that you'll be able to draft the player you target. After that its BPA.

This is where self scouting and team building philosophy come into play. Draft is part science part art.

Agree with a lot of your scouting on Allen.
But I thought his hand work was a strength, uses them to keep blockers from getting on him.

Here's my quick scout from Allen in another thread:

He is a hybrid player which can be very valuable with how much teams are in sub packages. He can cover some wide receivers, some tight ends, and running backs out of the backfield. He's also not a liability against the run.

I wouldn't be against trading out of #1 in this draft at all. Any offer would mean that there is a QB needy team who has found a guy they like enough to sell their house to jump in front of the 49ers. There's a lot of value to be had there. I'm all in on the complete rebuild obviously but it is,after all, something the Browns have not yet FULLY committed to up to this point. You know who we have to blame?? Kevin Costner. No seriously KEVIN FRIGGIN COSTNER! Think about it, Pettine was COMPLETELY in love Khalil Mack early in March of 2014. The front office was poised to trust his opinion and put his name on the card at pick #4. He was there on a SILVER PLATTER all they had to do was sink their fork in him. Then April came, and "Draft Day" hit the box office. It must have gotten Farmer all hyped up thinking he was the second coming of Sonny Weaver Jr. because he traded back so the Bills could waste the pick on the injury prone Sammy Watkins and handed the meat and potatos of that draft over to the Oakland Raiders. Very sad. Very sad indeed. There won,t be a linebacker as versatile as Mack come out for MANY years to come. Garret could become a NIGHTMARE screamin' off the edge at 260 if he runs an expected middle 4.6 at the combine, but he's not the same kind of lock Mack was. Drafting him 1st overall wouldn't be a bad idea, but considering what another team would be willing to give up if they want to trade picks, it would be an offer that we would ALL be pissed off about if Sasha Brown turns it down. The meat and potatoes of this draft is on the back end, and the kid out of Louisville will come available in two years...if we were to have a couple 1st rounders to burn in that draft we would be in a PRIME position to land him and have a decent team waiting for him to take the reigns. Lots of interesting choices to come this year. My TRUE hope this draft though is that we take Garret, hope the Niners don't take Trubisky, and then use our extra picks from last years draft to move up from the Eagles pick that I'm predicting as 7th overall to land Trubisky. We have the firepower to make that happen...but do we have the balls? He's gonna go top five so we would prolly have to move up 4 spots into 3rd overall to get him. I would support it 100%. Get us a center in the second round.

Peppers is the most overrated College athlete I have ever seen ... JMHO

No bro. Peppers a genetic freak that will play multiple roles in the NFL. He is a major factor returning kicks. He could be a safety with the ball skills of a young Ed Reed. Not saying he will be as good in coverage, but we know all to well about what Ed Reed could do once the football was in his hands. If his weren't big enough he would lateral it to somebody and get the score. Peppers has those same type of instincts. Don't hate em cause he is from Michigan. That's over now. If falls to our pick from the Eagles, and Trubisky is off the board they gotta call his name.

No bro. Peppers a genetic freak that will play multiple roles in the NFL. He is a major factor returning kicks. He could be a safety with the ball skills of a young Ed Reed.

Really you would use a #1 pick on a special team player and Ed Reed he isn't je just got His 1st INT. on a tipped ball right to him against the Buckeyes

Did you read my comment? Loll.I compared his ball skills to Ed Reeds. As in what he can do once the ball is in his hands, and I specifically made a point not to compare his coverage skills because that's the weak spot in his game. And I said with the Eagles pick, IF Trubisky is off the board. Which will end up being around 7th overall.

Peppers is a tweener who won't make it in the NFL because he doesn't have the coverage skills to play in the secondary or the size to play linebacker.

Peppers is not even CLOSE to Ed Reed. Come on. He has, what, one INT in his career? And I dont think he has the ability or size to be a LBer.

"Coverage Skills" as a Safety 75% of the time translates to simply reading the play and being in the right position. Man to man coverage I agree is something that more often than not just comes naturally. But the notion that Peppers shortcomings at the position can't be improved with a little coaching is kinda absurd. The MOST important thing on today's football field is athletic ability and that's something this kid has a Hefty bag full of. Peppers around 7th overall wouldn't be the disaster you're trying to paint it as, I assure you.

No bro, that would be Leonard Fournette or Derek Barnett - JMO

Your Picks:
Round 1 Pick 1: Myles Garrett, DE/OLB, Texas A&M (A+)
Round 1 Pick 11: Deshaun Watson, QB, Clemson (A+)
Round 2 Pick 1: Marcus Maye, FS, Florida (C+)
Round 2 Pick 14: Jake Butt, TE, Michigan (A)
Round 3 Pick 1: Tyler Orlosky, C, West Virginia (A)
Round 4 Pick 1: Erik Magnuson, OT, Michigan (C)
Round 5 Pick 30: Sean Harlow, OG, Oregon State (B)
Round 6 Pick 1: Channing Stribling, CB, Michigan (B)

Nice draft. I think you're giving the Eagles a little too much credit considering their current slump though. I also am very weary of Watson considering the climate of the AFC north and his lack of NFL size. He could be a good QB in the right situation, but I don't think he's cut out of the right mold to throw the ball deep, in Cleveland late into November through December. I like the kid out of WV at center a lot, he comes in and competes right away. I also feel like we are set at TE so I'd prefer that second rounder go on the defensive line or at corner back. I wouldn't be taking to the streets to protest though if this mock draft was to become our reality.

He could be like Deone Bucannon.

What else can we do at this point in an 0-12 season?

Crappy mocks are almost a tradition for this team at this point in the season.

I think Allen can be a good hand fighter, it doesn't take much, but just does the basic moves. I think I saw a video of Joe handfighting with JJ Watt or someone, and it was beautiful. Wanted to make me cry. I grew up on Samurai films, mainly, but also a fair amount of Kong Fu movies. And man, did that video make me cry. Had to shout out Wu Tang afterwards it was so beautiful. Like I was watching IP Man. I digress, I think he can't handle 99% of tackles or guards in the league, just by hand skills alone. That's all I mean. I think his athleticism would be near the very top of the league from the get go. I thought Bosa could be a special 3-4 end, but I think Allen is way above that. fwiw, i also think that Garrett is in the top of the NFL with athleticism and bend. I think they'll both make great NFL players, you can't go wrong with either.

Except Peppers is bigger, stronger, faster, quicker and just gets the game a little bit better.

I want a Von Miller / Khalil Mack / Justin Houston. Give me Myles Garrett.

I'm not sure why you guys feel like we need to address the TE position in the second round of this draft to be honest. We have a reliable one already and a few good prospects coming up behind him. I understand that you can never have too much competition at any position on a football team (including the punter lol) but we have much more important issues to address than our run blocking on the edge and prowess down the middle of the field. We should be loading up on lineman, CB's, and pass rushers in my opinion.

If we draft Myles Garret it allows us to play Ogbah at DE and slide Collins back to inside linebacker where he belongs.

You like him because he's scrappy, exciting and old school. However, that's a STUPID reason to draft a guy.

He has waaaaay too many shortcomings. Fans need to separate their emotions of seeing a guy like Peppers and look at how he translates to the next level. He's too small to be a linebacker. He has 1 career INT. He's never been great defending guys in coverage. He's going to be the biggest bust in the draft. I wouldn't draft him in the first round. He's getting the Johnny Football type of hype train from fans and the media.

When I hear cliches such as "he's just a football player" that sends red flags to me. Peppers would be a Haslam pick to sell tickets.

Did you happen to watch the OSU game? I think Jabrill plays a rather great game against some amazing talent. I think he does a bad job on about 7 plays through 2 OT's. Straight off the bat, that's amazing for a player playing against NFL ready talent. Compare that to anyone else in the draft this year. Second, the plays that he does give up are usually because he's too aggressive. He'll give up big cut back runs because he expects the RB to go outside, and tries to meet them there (See Curtis Samuel's GW TD). He also has a tendency to line up too far to the inside while in the slot. Trying to stop the run. But if you watch that OSU game you'll see him covering the biggest mismatch in the games (Marcus Baugh and Curtis Samuel), them doing relatively little against him, and them running away from him a lot. To pretend OSU had a great game against him is crazy. We made a few good plays against him. Marcus Baugh pushes him during an in route on the last drive to create just enough separation for JT to sneak a ball in, and Curtis Samuel catches a swing pass in the backfield, sees Jabrill baring in on him, and decides to cut it across field to make it a short 4th and 1, again on the last drive.

When the dude is asked to cover, he can cover decently well. It's not like he doesn't have the athleticism for it.

His claim to fame in that game is covering Marcus Baugh.....? We also do a horrible job of using Curtis Samuel at times.

I'm not saying he's a complete slug, but I won't be shocked when he disappoints at the combine.

While Marcus Baugh is far from our best player, who else is going to cover him, Jourdan Lewis's small body? He did what he was asked for. He didn't cost Michigan the game, but it's not like he won it either. He did above average however.

I doubt he runs the 4.3 40 that he claims to run, but I'm not sure why people think he can't cover WRs. If you were playing Iowa, Michigan State, Wisconsin, Ohio State, and Penn State would you want your best player to cover a WR or hit a RB in the mouth? If he was in the Big 12 or went to USC and the Pac 12, he'd be sensational. He's not nearly as fast as Adoree Jackson, but he's probably just as quick and much stronger. The kid will be a freak in the NFL.

I wish you guys would STOP with this Allen crap at #1 already.

In Garrett you're looking at a dude that can change your entire defense and the way any OC plans to attack it. Every snap Garrett is the one every OL and QB will be looking to identify. Not some END in a 3-4.

Vers. You mentioned Des Bryant. At 30, do you think he'd be back for his last contract year? I doubt it myself.

Across the league for YEARS, the best 3-4 defensive fronts have been made up of a STUD fatty in the middle (Shelton looking good) and Ends that were Collegiate Tackles like Allen. NONE were #1 overall picks in any draft. These guys can be found elsewhere.

That Draft article has me thinking. I like Trubisky, but hate that 12 games experience. If he goes back, next year's draft could have FIVE top tier QBs coming out. If I'm Trubisky I'm staying at NC for another year.

For that reason I could see us going this route. Also considering Hooker may stay at OSU. I choose to wait on him and see. How he feels after the playoffs and his being told he'll be a 1st round pick. He may change his tune and come out.

Regardless, we can do some damage with our 1st 4 picks.

1a) MUST be MYLES GARRETT. OLB
1b) Jamaal Adams S
2a) CB (A solid one should be there)
2b) Pat Elfrein

And get a solid DT to move outside in our 3-4

If Hooker comes out, I'd move DOWN further Philly pick and snag Hooker instead of Adams for FS and go with a 2nd year Kindred at SS.

Aren't the Browns a QB needy team?

Oh, and btw-------you were talking about Peppers earlier and mentioned ball skills. Someone corrected you and you said something like "did you read what I wrote." He obviously did because when referring to a db w/ball skills, one isn't talking about their running ability. It's how they play the ball on defense and their ability to knock it down or intercept it. Just a heads-up.

I'd bring him back in a heartbeat, but you are probably right. This FO probably won't. Creating needs and spending picks on those needs is high on their list.




I would be thrilled if we took Garrett, Adams, and Sidney Jones w/our first three picks. I would not draft a center, though. BPA is the ticket and hopefully there is a FS there worth taking.

Of course, we'll probably either trade down or wast the first pick on Watson. That's how we roll.

Or we can grab garret, and use the second 1st on Watson.

My dream.

My preference is for Garrett, but I'd be happy with either guy (him or Allen.)

No one is drafting a RT ???????????

Not in the first round.

Yep. The right tackle spot needs to be thought as "Replacing Joe Thomas in 5 years" not "Replacing Schwartz". Once you do that, the prospect list becomes a hell of a lot shorter.