DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2017 NFL Season 2017 NFL Draft Browns Want Garrett

I was hoping we could get Aaron Rodgers in the seventh round.

Yes, he's playing more snaps.

And again no doubt Bama has talented players. But its pretty absurd to me to pan Allen or any prospect for playing at Bama or any school that produces NFL talent when those players are having success in the NFL. If you are gonna pan a prospect it should be for skillset reasons, but I guess with Allen those are gonna be hard to find.

Reed and Robinson were drafted early in the draft and are both having success. Those talented players are gone from Bama's current DL yet Allen should be graded down because of playing with talent?

I don't get it...but that's just me...

Good luck on your finals, knock em out...then knock out some keg stands for me...we'll be interested in your draft views when you get the time

That would remake the defense....but its probably gonna require having 2 picks in the top 5 at least...maybe higher.

What are the mocks saying about Malik McDowell? Where is he going? I think I slept on him a bit during the season, but I've been watching his games this past week, and I've been blown away on a few plays. Not another D-linemen is close to Allen, but Malik would be up next. He's got a great frame too.

Malik is in the top 10-15 range. He has the 2nd highest ceiling in the entire draft only behind Myles.

I'm not trying to knock Allen, just saying the surrounding talent muddies the water a little bit. I'll have to dig in on the film more and see how much/if I think it factors in. I'd honestly been focused more on the rest of the D, and they pretty much all stand out.

Sorry, no more keg stands.

No keg stands? ;(

Just an fyi, If you want to see Garrett at his best from this year, check out his UCLA tape. That poor tackle will never be the same.

Was that against Conor McDermott? McDermott will play on Sunday's too.

I wanna draft Garret, and also keep Joe Thomas.

And I want them to practice against each other, every day.

Sadly, I think practicing everyday is against the rules. Plus, Joe needs his rest.

No idea, but he wrecked the poor kid. Garrett absolutely destroyed him with power and speed. His spin move was a destructive force in this game.

myles vs UCLA

Look at how Myles played against Tunsil last year.

Yeah he made tonsil look undraftable.

So did Courtney Brown make great OL look that way in College

Courtney Brown, like Garret, was super talented.

He just happened to be made of glass.

Greg Gabriel: ESPN report on Myles Garrett a reminder it's way too early in NFL Draft process


Lying season has begun for NFL teams with four months to go until the draft
By GREG GABRIEL — @greggabe


Published: Dec. 14, 2016 — 12:25 p.m.





Last Sunday as we were preparing for the weekly NFL games, ESPN came out with a report that the Cleveland Browns are locked in on Texas A&M defensive end Myles Garrett. When I read it, I had to laugh because it was such a ridiculous article.


First, Garrett has not yet declared for the Draft. He has until January 16 to do so. Even if he does declare, the Browns nor any other team can make any statement about an underclassman until after the league has accepted him into the NFL Draft. That won’t come until three days after the declaration date. So if the Browns made comment to an ESPN reporter about any underclassman, they are breaking NFL rules and can be fined or lose a draft choice because of it. The league is very strict about those rules and don’t think for a minute they won’t quietly look into the information that was in that article.


That said, the Browns have some baseball people making football decisions so they might not know or understand the rules of the NFL Draft.


Also, I am not saying Garrett or any other player isn’t worthy of being a top pick - he is - but we are still very early in the process. There are over four months to go before the draft. Grades in December are still preliminary and aren’t close to being finalized.


Scouts' grades are part of the process, but not anywhere near being all of the process. There are still games to be played and these games will be graded. There are some cross-checks to be done and the coach’s grades haven’t been factored in. In fact, the coaches won’t even start doing their work on draft prospects for at least another month.


There will be a position coach’s grade, a coordinator's grade and perhaps the head coach’s grade added to the other reports. Then we have Combine results factored in as well as the results of the medical exams and interviews. I can’t tell you how many times a player we had high grades on was taken off the board because of a poor medical, poor testing, poor interviews or a background check. It happens every year and all these things factor into a final grade. It’s usually early April before a club actually has a final grade on a player.


Don’t forget, the lying season is just starting. Clubs will tell reporters anything about a player and usually it’s a lie. Just remember, anytime you read that a certain club wants a certain player or a certain player is a lock to go to a certain team, don’t believe it. Half the time it’s clickbait and the other half it's BS.

http://www.profootballweekly.com/201...ocess/a2lprac/

They won't get in trouble. All they will do is say they lied.

Article is spot on all around, although I think I beat him to punch announcing that "lying season" for agents, scouts and media had begun.

Any player can get injured, at any time. Hard to factor that.



Brown was a good pick. It just didn't work out.

I was locked in pretty early on Garrett. He has athleticism that comes around once in a decade and would have been drafted over Bosa if he came out last year.

The more I see of Allen, the more that I like him though. He is also extremely athletic for a 300 lber and would be a better fit for our defense. I was huge on Buckner last year and like Allen better.

Honestly if we pick either one, I'll be happy. They are both really great picks.

I'll be watching Allen closely during the bowl game.

You'll be watching him during TWO more games . . .

I have just watched some clips and read around but I am coming around to the notion that Allen would make more difference to the defense as a whole.

In a 4-3, we'd finally have a partner for Shelton inside; Ogbah and one of Nassib / Bryant at end. LBs would be Collins (please keep him), Davis (see below) and Kirksey. In a 3-4, you have Allen, Shelton and Bryant / Nassib. on the line with Ogbah, Kirksey, Davis and Collins as LBs.

Now, if you somehow manage to get Reuben Foster or Zach Cunningham with our 2nd pick. That means we can eventually replace Davis at the ILB slot and it allows Collins and Kirksey to slide into positions where their speed can help.

I'm beginning to think Allen and Foster / Cunningham with our 1st 2 picks would improve the defense by upgrading multiple positions in multiple looks. Then look for safety, CB and OL help next 3 picks.

I am also intrigued by D'onta Freeman - man, the guy is a load. Ideal AFC North back.

I'm waiting on next year for a QB unless someone really stands out to our scouts and staff - they know better than any of us (I hope :)). I know I may be in the minority but I wonder how much better Kessler might fare with an offseason in the same system. If you picked him, you need to tailor the offense to him and not the other way is my view. Or would someone like Brad Kaaya (sp) be an option to sit and take the reins?

We can really build the defense up with this draft, last year's rookies have a year under their belt, I'm really hopeful that if we choose wisely the defense will really make some big strides in the next 2 years :praying emoticon:

My concern with Bama players: How much are they product of Saban, his scheme, and the talent around them?

That's true, but at least Allen would have talent around him on this defense with Shelton.

That's why I work 9-5 and evenings; the football guys get paid to know this stuff It's a great question but I read a post where someone said Allen's production improved this year after losing guys to the NFL. I don't really know the answer is all I can say. I'm just looking at gaps and means to address with a (very) limited knowledge base.

Ultimately, the draft is a crapshoot but you need to ensure you have a decent % chance at not being the sucker in the room. I've gone back and read lots of articles, reports on Schobert, Shonn Coleman, Drango, etc. We made some good picks there, I can totally see the logic. Sometimes, like cooking, something either takes longer to taste good or it won't. You need some luck, some things to go your way.

You watch, we draft <insert QB name> at #1 now...... (don't even joke, me)

I wonder why this is levied against Allen and 'Bama in particular and not other teams/players in similar situations?

Haha one name comes to mind...Trent Richardson.

I actually worry about taking Garrett because he has streaks of laziness that remind me a lot of gerard warren. Lots of talent but will he be dedicated enough to push himself at the pro level if he is on a bad team. Sometimes no matter how much talent you have it can all go to waste with a bad attitude or lack of effort.

I would not be opposed to moving down if we still stay in the top 5.

Fair point. But Alabama does recruit athletes too. I see him make just as many, if not more, hyperathletic plays as Garrett does each game. I would also say that Saban asks Allen to take on a lot of double teams in stunts.

j/c:

A few points about recent comments:

--I don't agree that 'Bama's players look better because of the system.

--I DO AGREE that having all that talent around you makes your job way easier. That was a great point by Candy.

--ed asked something about other teams. Well, other teams, such as Ohio State last year, did get the same questions. There is no denying that a lot of Alabama players have been somewhat disappointing in the NFL after stellar collegiate careers.

--There was another mention of Garrett being lazy. I would really like some proof. This rumor was started by mac on this board. I haven't read that or heard it from any of the analysts. I don't like false information.

--I think that Garrett is by far the better candidate to become an impact player. He could be a Von Miller or a K. Mack. He could be a guy that teams must game-plan against.

--I think Allen is a safer pick. Garrett might bust. Allen most likely will not. I just don't think he is a huge difference maker. I would pick Garrett if I was drafting for the Browns. Not w/out reservations, but this team desperately needs impact players at impact positions. I've been saying that for awhile now.

One thing to consider is if we keep Garrett with his hands in the dirt is that his bust potential is lowered since we actually have a good NT. With Shelton eating up blocks, Garrett would see a ton of 1 on 1 matchups.

The same could be said about Allen of course, but just going along with your impact comments.

Do any scouting reports mention anything of Garrett's run defense?

J/c

I think either player can be an impact player. They're both great prospects. I think people will gain greater appreciation for Allen during the draft process.

Allen plays interior defensive line, a position that the Browns defense desperately needs. He's solid against the run, which these D obviously needs. And Allen was actually more productive then Garrett this year (sacks, hits and hurries) with 60.

Also, there isn't another ID graded near Allen where conversely there are a few Edge Defenders graded near Myles, heck Greg Gabriel has Barnett and Myles neck and neck.

I think plugging Allen in at 5-tech in base and 3-tech in nickel really boosts the defense.

Both are worthy of being top prospects, I just think Allen is a better choice for the Browns.

Barnett and Garrett arent even close. Garrett is a 6'5" 270lb, 4.5 beast of a human with good bend and freaky strenght.

With all due respect, Ed, the fact that Garrett would even be close to Allen while playing with a high ankle sprain is enough for me to take Garrett.

Lol, whether you agree or not fact is draft people rate Myles and Barnett close.

Don't take my word for it look it up. Check out Greg Gabriel's timeline from 17 Dec on Twitter. He actually has Barnett ahead.

Oh, and Allen's pass rushing this year was also better then Myle's 2015 w/o the high ankle sprain.

3. Derek Barnett, Edge, Tennesssee

It’s an SEC 1-2-3 at the top of this draft class, with Barnett pushing Myles Garrett close for the nation’s top edge defender in each of the past two seasons. His 62 total pressures, including 12 sacks and 18 hits, from the defensive end position give him a pass rushing productivity rating of 14.9, good for the sixth-best mark at the position in college this year, while he has been a solid run defender in each of the past three seasons too.
-----------------------------------
https://www.profootballfocus.com/draft-college-football-top-32-prospects-for-2017-nfl-draft/

Im not insinuating that Barnett isnt good. He is, probably will be very good.

Garrett is better, IMO. Just because one guy thinks Barnett is better doesnt change what I see.

I don't know what your first sentence here is in reference too. You're arguing a point I haven't made at all.

All I said is that the draft rankings have Myles and Derek close. You said ~'they're not even close'in response. All I did was back up my statement that shows where they're ranked from pff and gave an example of a former scout who actually ranks Derek higher.

It's fine that you dont think they're close. My point remains that in this years draft ranking they are close and they're much closer then any DL prospect is to Allen.