DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Ray Horton out as Defensive Coordinator

Alex Marvez ‏@alexmarvez 8m8 minutes ago
Source tells @sn_nfl that @RamsNFL Gregg Williams has until Monday to decide whether he wants to accept @Browns DC job. Tick. Tick. Tick.

https://twitter.com/alexmarvez/status/817501350137331712

ugh what a horrible though.

j/c:

Could this point to the Browns focused in on Garrett as the #1 and wanting him in a 4-3 base, assuming Williams is the hire?

Perhaps but he was the HC not the DC in Jax.

1, we don't know if he let the DC run things or if he ran things
2, We know trying to be HC and a coordinator is not an easy jog.

Damn....again, I don't even like Ray Horton as a DC and I still feel bad for him. His DC jobs haven't produced in the past few years. I wonder if he'll have to go back to being a position coach?

so who would be the OLB?

That's great if they want to keep his hands in the dirt. I support that.

So we would have Collins, Kirksey in the middle, and......

The most overpaid 33 year old player we can find on the FA market! Honestly, who knows? Anything can happen.

REX REX REX!


lol

So, you're on record that this is a FO decision? You may end up being correct, I just want to be sure this is what you're saying.

yet our ST coach still hangs around...SMH

Did they ask Collins who he wanted at DC?

He has nude photos of somebody, bro.

Has to.

Probably, on this roster, Orchard. Doesnt matter? It will be a nickle most of the time, so the third linebacker wont be super important.

This is good news for Ogbah and Nassib. Both will be hand in the dirt full time now. Also, I would think this points to Garrett over Allen, but both would work.

With four down linemen full time, Shelton becomes a huge factor.

Still, why change coordinators? Why? I didnt like Horton but why hire the guy in the first place and only give him one year.

First really bad decision that makes me turn a side eye to Hue.

FO: what will it take for you to stay?

Collins: mega contract, let me choose DC.

FO: deal.

Well according to the article it's Hue's decision...lol. The wheels on the bus go round and round

Because he is good.

You could put Kirksey at WILL, Davis at MIKE, maybe. Cut Davis, plug in Schobert?

A few random thoughts with regards to this news:

It's hard to condemn Horton when we had no talent.

Getting Wade Phillips would be just about as good as we can get.

The Rams defense with Gregg Williams has been underwhelming even though they have had one of the best defensive players in the league (Aaron Donald) and one of the best edge rushers in the league (Robert Quinn).

Don't focus on what these guys run as their "base." Teams are in sub packages more than 60% of the time.

If we go to a 4-3 Schoebert might actually become useful.

For now. Tick Tick Tick.

https://twitter.com/twithersAP/status/817505401356877826

Withers is one of the most respected writers in Berea, IMO. The "no surprise" part MAY be a hint that there have been concerns for some time. But, maybe not.

Browns' Ray Horton could be fired soon; Greg Williams on the radar, sources say

by Mary Kay Cabot, cleveland.com
Follow on Twitter
on January 06, 2017 at 5:33 PM, updated January 06, 2017 at 6:00 PM
link
CLEVELAND, Ohio -- It looks like Ray Horton will be the fall guy for the Browns' disastrous 1-15 season.

And he won't be the only one. Sources have told cleveland.com that other members of the Browns staff -- especially on defense, will be let go.

Horton could be fired soon, and Rams' defensive coordinator Greg Williams has been discussed as his possible replacement, league sources told cleveland.com.

Alex Marvez of Sporting News first reported that Horton was his way out and that Williams has already been offered the job. He also reported that Wade Phillips has been contacted.

Marvez reported that Williams has until Monday to decide if he wants the job.

Sources told cleveland.com that Jackson has been talking about replacing Horton for the past few days, but that it hinged on several things, including finding the right replacement.

Browns running game coordinator Kirby Wilson is safe, but other Browns assistants are on the hot seat.

Jackson understands that Horton didn't have much to work this season, but still seeks to make a change.

Horton's offseason began with Browns' leading pass-rusher Desmond Bryant being lost for the season to a torn pectoral muscle. The Browns then parted ways with Paul Kruger and restocked the defense through the draft.

But some of the draft picks didn't pan out the way the Browns hoped. Second-round pick Emmanuel Ogbah lived up to his draft status, finishing with a team-high 5.5 sacks. But third-rounder Carl Nassib was a disappointment, failing to affect to the quarterback much and finishing with 2.5 sacks -- including one in which he didn't even touch Landry Jones until he was already on the ground.

Fourth-round linebacker Joe Schobert didn't get much playing time.

Horton's defense finished finished 31st overall, 31st against the run and 21st against the pass.

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/817505786725330944

Oof.

This is not a great way to treat Horton (if he hasn't actually been fired yet). I wouldn't be surprised to see him land in San Diego if he is indeed fired.

The beat reporters have been hinting at a move since the end of year press conference.

Is this a rumor like the coaches wanting a 'football guy' or does this have legs?

Anyhow...I think Wade Phillip is one of the best 34 DC in the league.

I am not a fan of Gregg Williams.

Without a doubt the defense lacked talent...I think the limited talent on the defense was used sub-optimally by Horton. I think if you can find a clear upgrade of Horton its a solid move but I wouldn't advocate for firing Horton based soley on performance.

TLDR: Upgrade Horton? Yes. Fire Horton? No.

https://twitter.com/alexmarvez/status/817504467302092800



https://twitter.com/AlbertBreer/status/817503526574260224

Which doesn't actually mean much.

I really don't like the idea of Williams. It's like going from the frying pan to the fire.

If it is causing problems and making things work less smoothly, yes.

Didn't think they would fire anybody. I won't blame Horton completely for the defense, but it reminded me of when he was here before. We were horrible on third down last time he was here,I believe.

Don't care either. I would love a 4-3 defense. I think personnel wise we are better suited.

All I know, is whoever they hire, they better get them a defensive backfield.

I'm probably wrong about this but Hue wanting Vance Joseph (if true), potentially hiring Gregg Williams, having a 4-3 D in Oakland when he was HC, being on the Bengals when they played a 4-3 for a very long time....it seems very contrarian having Horton here last year. I know 4-3/3-4 not as cut and dry as it may once have been, but one of these things is not like the other. Maybe he feels better with a 43, I don't know.

Gregg Williams defenses

2016: #9 overall

2015: #10 overall

2014 rams: #16 overall

2011: #9 overall

2010: #29 overall

2009 saints: #8 overall

Right. The dude is allegedly an ass, but can coach apparently.

I can't say that Horton got a fair shot, but his past doesn't do him any favors (more specific this is his 2nd go round' in Cleveland).

Few things irked me with Horton.
-He stays in the press box for the game. I get the advantage of seeing things up top, but I prefer someone who will be on the sideline either amping up the guys for doing a good job, or trying to motivate them (or rip them) for not playing well.
-I'm also under the assumption that he isn't a very good motivator for his players. His relationship and dislike of Mingo really rubbed me the wrong way. And I don't remember hearing from any defensive player any good things about Horton as being instrumental in their success in understanding the game or getting better as a player.

I don't know much about Gregg Williams, outside of his involvement with #bountygate.

Think I saw someone mention that his players don't like him. Hope that isn't true as I don't ever remember our locker room being so close knit.

I do like the 4-3 defense though because it simplifies things, and lets players think less, and use their athleticism more. It's dooesn't confuse offenses as much, but it can be successful.

I'd prefer we get Wade Phillips.

Well, our offense sucked just as bad as our defense, so is Pep Hamilton out? Is Hue going to give up play calling? Of course not.....

I'd like to see what Horton can do with some actual talent. However, if they do fire him then for F's sake GO TO A 4-3. I am SO sick of running the worst 3-4 in history and it doesn't seem to matter who the DC is. Under Romeo, Manweenie, Pettine, twice now with Horton.... the 3-4 does NOT work in Browns Town. Dump it and go back to a base 4-3. Best D we've had in ten years was under Jauron and he had VERY little to work with. Hey, there is a name..... I would not mind Dick Jauron coming back.

Why the hell aren't we interviewing the Jags ex Gus Bradley?

He might be attached to one of the head coaching candidates. Also, I read earlier today that Washington was going hard after him after they fired their defensive coordinator.

Just thought of this:

A bunch of our defensive assistants were brought from Tennessee with Horton. My guess is that they will be replaced as well.

Makes sense.