DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Cole: Browns, 49ers could be destination in trade for Kirk Cousins

No different trading picks getting a QB waiting two or three years until high end talent is obtained.

Or, drafting a young QB who can't grow quick enough because support staff isn't all there yet.

What's wrong with 8-8? I'd take it over what we watched these last several years.

We waited this long lets get the right QB. Why get an unsure and try making him something. Browns done it failing many times.

Sounds like an apologist.

There is an old adage. If you don't have a franchise qb, you do what you have to do to get one.

So how long do you believe Haslam is willing to wait for this thing to turn around? You do realize these guys are making millions every year and the top priority is to find a QB, right?

They passed on Wentz last year, took Kessler over Prescott. So exactly how much rope do you think they have left to solve it?

If teams knew how Prescott would have developed and played as a rookie, they would have spent a 1st round pick on him, even if they already have a franchise QB. Everyone passed on him.

It's like castigating teams for passing on Tom Brady back when he was drafted. He simply wound up being much, much better than anyone thought he'd be. Also, let's not forget the team that was in place around him in Dallas, that helped him a great deal.

took Kessler over Prescott.

Just to be fair, All other Teams also passed on him.
Even the "Boys were said to have their eye on another QB but he went right before Prescott, so they settled for him. Lets not leave out the facts that you try and make us look bad.

I'm not doing anything but presenting the facts. The fact is both Kessler and Dak were on the board. The fact is that Dak has a much better skill set than Kessler. The fact is we drafted Kessler while leaving Dak on the board. And the "Boys were said to"? Yeah that's a factual statement. lmao

I don't pile on to this FO. They make some good moves and have made some bad moves.

But no matter how hard you try to spin it, they left a much better QB sitting on the draft board in the mid rounds when they drafted Kessler. These guys all make millions of dollars to get this right. It's their job.

Dak has a better arm, better pocket presence and can process things well post snap.

Now you can make all of the excuses you wish for this but that was a bad decision. We're not talking about all the teams that passed on him. We're talking about which was the best QB left on the board when Kessler was selected. There's really no question about it.

All I'm saying is if he had the skill set that you claim to know then why didn't every Team jump all over him? Heck if thats the case he should have been a first round pick. But Noooo lets ALL wait till the 4th....Yeah thats the ticket

Dak was just arrested for a DUI and we were neck deep in the Manziel and Gordon messiness. There's no way they were going to draft him.

Yet, the Browns brought in Art Briles and now have hired Gregg Williams. They also signed Kenny Britt in FA this year. Furthermore, they are one of a handful of teams to recently interview the despicable Mixon.

They also wanted Paxton Lynch.

How many times do they draft Brady Quin and Weeden hoping something works? Sometimes it is simply wise building a football team instead of hoping you get a QB. I'm not saying wait. I simply want a legit chance a QB succeeds.

If you have one shot picking a QB, who do you take? Wentz? He was not a division 1 but North Dakota State. He played 3/4 of a year because he was injured. He did not start until his senior year. He is similar to Big Ben in measurements.

Looking at this years class. You have Trubisky, Watson, Kizer, and Mahomes. Next year's choices are Darnold, Rosen, and Allen. You have one chance getting right.

You noted trading down Cleveland misses out on top choices. Are you not doing the same picking a "maybe" at QB? Are your odds better taking a QB in the second and third round?

Looking at Jacksonville, Miami, and Las Angels, which team looks promising? Does Arizona or Houston look more promising?

j/c

I think it's a given that you take a FQB when/if you can. If you can't, you build the team rather than taking a top draft pick flyer on a guy. Flyer could be defined however you wish.

Once you've got a solid team...and IF the FQB isn't there...whatever flyer you then take has a much better chance of succeeding due to having a real team around him. See Andy Dalton for an example.

I don't think 'building a team around a future QB' and 'getting that FQB whenever you can' are necessarily mutually exclusive acts.

You can't draft every position in the first round.

The job is to draft the best player at the position in which you draft him. The BPA at that position no matter which round you draft them in. Kessler was not the most talented QB left on the board when he was drafted.

That's a mistake no matter how you slice it.

Are you saying Prescott was the best pick? If so that means both Cleveland and New England got it wrong. Not sure that proves anything other than signs were not very clear. I think Dallas got pretty lucky or they know the leagues tendencies like nobody's business. They not only waited they took with a compensatory pick.

I have never understood excusing a mistake because "he did it, too." Sounds whiny.

Not my intention. Nearly pointing out Prescott was not an easy talent prediction.

I think it is debatable whether Prescott equally performs for Cleveland. There is a lot to be said having a well round team established which is my argument.

I was referring to the substance abuse issues of Gordon and Manziel as the reason they shied away from drafting Prescott who had just had a dui arrest. I wasn't aware that Briles, Williams and Britt had drug/alcohol problems.

Gotcha.........drinking and drugs are worse than covering up rape.

Yea, that's exactly what I said. Your cipherin' skills are amazing.

No, I know exactly what you were and are saying. My BS meter is working very well, thank you.

If you remove "meter" from that post, I'd be in 100% agreement.

Okay. Will you please provide a link where Sashi or another member of the Browns says they didn't take Dak because of his DUI?

I'm saying you can't. I'm saying you are making up lame-ass excuses to protect the FO for making a bad move. I'm saying that Hue said, "trust me on this one," after the Browns selected Kessler. And yeah........I will provide a link for that if you can't remember that comment.

Someone is spouting BS here.........and it ain't me, tough guy!

I don't understand the fixation with Dak.... no-one thought he was the player he has shown himself to be so far. End of story. All the teams in the NFl thought he was a 4th round 'talent' ... because that is where he was picked. Darn nearly a 5th round pick at #135.

Dallas got LUCKY.

You can argue that the Browns should have picked Dak instead of Cody ... that's fair. You can argue that Dak should have been selected #1 overall - after the fact. The rest is just re-writing history with the benefit of hindsight, which is really pretty pointless. . . It's like the articles that are pretty prolific this year - "who is this year's Dak Prescott?" .... well the odds are that there is no Dak in this years draft.

It should be plainly obvious to anyone with half a brain that there would have been an uproar if they would have selected a qb fresh off a DUI arrest given the Manziel/Gordon situation. Probably most loudly from you and mac, lol. No, they didn't announce it to the press.



Then you're totally full of BS. I'm no apologist for this front office and I have a lot of doubts about them. I didn't like the Kessler pick and I think we'll be lucky if he turns out to be a serviceable backup. I also don't like the Britt signing, and I don't have a lot of confidence that they'll get this draft right.

Eh, if you're looking for a link, good luck.

But, you do have to keep in mind all the stuff the Browns were going through AT THE TIME, with manziel. We/they already had one drunk on the team. And I'm sure the front office was thinking "do we want another?"

Also, I think presott was drafted in the third round? That would mean 32 teams passed on him, twice.

Actually the point isn't that "Dak should of went #1" or whatever.

I liked Dak, wanted to draft him.

He got a DUI, I knew we weren't going to.

That doesn't change the fact that he (and probably a few other QBs) were better prospects than Cody.

It has nothing to do with us, or Dallas.

I know there was some on here (1 or 2 for sure) that were big Dak fans .... and said so at the time. Kudos to them.

But for the most part I think most people's opinions on "we should have drafted Dak" are based entirely on the fact that he has done so well. That rationale doesn't make any sense to me. . . no-one knew how good he was going to be. No-one. Otherwise he wouldn't have been picked at 135.

I get why those w/half a brain would think that.

Y'all can talk all you want, but almost everyone [including those on this board] had Dak rated higher than Kessler.

We coulda just taken Connor Cook. At least that would of made sense.

Also, the "trust me on this" has never made sense to me.

Kessler is not, and never will be, Hue's style of QB.

Palmer, Dalton, hell even Pryor.

They all have strong arms. Good height.

It doesn't make sense.

I want to make something clear, because jfan compared me to mac.

I have liked some of the moves the new regime has made and I have disliked other moves. I am not like mac and bash every move. I am not like many of the homers and excuse away every bad move. I try to look at each move objectively.

I never understood the Kessler move from day one. I sure as hell didn't get the RGIII/Cody combo. They are like worlds apart in what they do. Never made sense to me.

Now, the FO has made some good moves. I like the OL signings this year. I love how we extended Bitonio. I understand getting the deal done w/Collins.

I'm not one-sided and despise getting classified as such when I express my opinion about certain moves that I do not approve of.

The RG3 move made sense. He fits Hues model a lot better than Cody does (he has a great deep ball)

If he had anything. Was even a fraction as good as he was in '12, we struck it rich.

If he didn't. Well, we cut him. No harm no foul.

I don't think RG3 was the reason we passed on Wentz.

I think he, like Dak, was a QB nobody thought would be as good to start as they were. Even the teams that drafted them.

That doesn't excuse passing on them.

I'm not a homer trying to excuse "mistakes", I just chose to try to find a logical reason for it, then move on. Because what other choice do I have?

Make a bunch of threads complaining about the same stuff over and over?

I wasn't referring to you. Your comment about Cody not fitting Hue's style just provoked an idea.

And I wasn't bad-mouthing the RGIII experiment. What I was saying that RGIII and Cody are nothing alike and bringing both in during the same year never made sense to me.

Dallas did get lucky ..... but their luck was in that they had built an excellent team for a young QB to slide right into, and they also added a truly premiere RB, and these factors, along with a capable defense, meant that a young QB didnt't have to try to put up 30+ points every week, all on his own.

Also, their defense wasn't supposed to be anywhere nearly as good as it played.

I'm not sure I understand how you reconcile this point?

If as you surmise the teams who drafted them didn't think they were good enough to start and couldn't have reasonably foreseen how well they would have played, why would or should the Browns FO have any different of an opinion? What or who do we have that had us in a position to know what no one else knew at that time?

Because they were better PROSPECTS.

Dallas drafted Dak, after trying to trade up for both Lynch and Cook (reportedly) he was then going to learn behind Romo.

Philly traded up for Wentz, and the immediately made him their 3rd QB.

If not for two injuries. We may still not know how good they are.

But that doesn't mean that they weren't better prospects than Kessler. Who very few people had rated in the middle of the draft. And after one year, wouldn't raise him that much unless you really value "moxy"

Don't forget that Kellen Moore probably would have started the season as the starter for the Cowboys if he hadn't broken his leg.