It seems the Browns have been on the high side of every offer made to any Free Agent.
I couldn't help myself....that's one of my favorite movies ever. But to add to that, it was reported that even the Browns offered more money than the Ravens for Tony Jefferson. He just decided to go with a team with a better record from last year. ( I can't say better team, I just can't)
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
He was back in time to sign the offer BEFORE the FA signing period began. He exercised a legal system approved by the NFL. The Browns punished him for it and the team suffered for it too. They had no "other path to follow" when it came to the RT position.
Quit acting like they're saints. They aren't. They've made good moves and bad moves. You're just another mac only from the opposite direction.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
He was back in time to sign the offer BEFORE the FA signing period began. He exercised a legal system approved by the NFL. The Browns punished him for it and the team suffered for it too. They had no "other path to follow" when it came to the RT position.
Maybe the offer was one time offer you refuse it we have the right to modify it as market value plays out we could raise it or lower it depending on demand. Same as the player and agent has the right to shop around for best deal for them the Browns or any team has the right to modify a deal that works for them. MS punished the Browns for offering the best contract he would be offered, Browns felt no loyalty from MS and took the slap in the face by MS and headed in a different direction. MS and his agent bet on himself and lost. The bad moves made were made by MS and his agent, he was offered the best contract to stay. For a player "who WANTED TO PLAY HERE " he didn't show it!
They had no "other path to follow" when it came to the RT position.
The Browns so far have offered free agent they wanted the best contracts offered. They made a plan they wanted improve the team as they go with players who "WANT TO PLAY HERE" so far the players lost accepted less money to play elsewhere.
Negotiation go both ways it seems the Browns are saying we will offer fair contacts but won't be extorted by greedy agents.
Just how many games would the Browns have won with MS? You keep saying they would be a better team with him well how much better? playoffs 1 game , 10 games? SB?
That point cannot be disputed. They were offered (seemingly) a good deal and it was declined by them. What transpired after that is speculation but the end result is he signed for less elsewhere. Both sides lost by not signing the original deal (and yes, he was within his right to look elsewhere). Makes you wonder how forthright his agent was in the first place...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
Seems like the posters who aren't trying to make excuses understand. Since you believe the FO is perfect, you never will. Time for me to stop wasting time on your BS.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Seems like the posters who aren't trying to make excuses understand. Since you believe the FO is perfect, you never will. Time for me to stop wasting time on your BS.
You made that up , I never stated they were perfect.
If you hate everything about the Browns how to you call yourself a fan. Time for me to stop wasting time on your BS.
In the Peter King/Paul Depodesta interview, King took the opportunity to bring up the subject of the front office's practice of not re-signing their own free agents. King told Depodesta that even he is bugged by this trend the Browns front office continues to use. Peter King, welcome to the group of fans who are having a difficult time understanding what the Browns' are trying to do, allowing some of their best to leave rather than re-signing them.
As Peter King correctly pointed out, the practice of not re-signing your own free agents creates "unnecessary" holes that must then be filled. King named the two ex-Browns who played for Atlanta in this years Super Bowl, Alex Mack and Taylor Gabriel...RT, Mitch Schwartz, who started 17 games for the Chiefs and most recently, Terrelle Pryor, the Browns top WR in 2016.
Here is how Depodesta answered Peter King's concerns...
“I’d say going back a year when we did have a handful of free agents and WE ALLOWED THEM ALL TO SIGN ELSEWHERE, that was a moment in time. That is not something that we want to do continuously."
Anyone care to interpret Depodesta's answer?
I will take a stab at it...Depo said, "WE ALLOWED THEM ALL TO SIGN ELSEWHERE"...
Put another way, imo, the front office made a pre-determined decision not to re-sign those players Peter King named. Depodesta is admitting that the Browns didn't intend to re-sign those players...they intentionally allowed them to leave.
I wish Peter King would have pressed Depodesta on the WHY Depo, Sashi and Haslam agreed on that strategy?
Sashi's offer would have made Schwartz the highest paid RT and more than Joe Thomas. If anything, Sashi would have been more in a bind if Schwartz signed. More than likely he would renegotiate Thomas's contract. I hardly think Schwartz was punished. Why than did Schwartz go look for better? His agent used Sashi's offer to drive up the price elsewhere. It is not that hard to see.
More than Joe Thomas? I don't think so.
If that's true, then they just signed Kevin Zeitler to more than Joe Thomas makes since they paid Kevin Zeitler more than the Scwartz contract was worth. That's my point, you don't have a problem paying Kevin Zeitler top G money in the league but makes excuses for not signing Schwartz?
You're not making any sense here.
I hate when I do not have my facts in order. Your reply made me think. I rechecked. Schwartz wanted 9 million. Cleveland offered 7. I thought Sashi offered 9. That basically shot down my whole argument.
I do think you are a little harsh judging Sashi, but that is an opinion. I cannot fault an opinion with an opinion.
On December 1945 on a frozen field at Cleveland Municipal Stadium the Rams defeated the Washington Redskins 15-14 to win their first NFL Championship. However, the joy for Cleveland fans would be short lived as the Rams got approval to move to Los Angles less the a month later.
As the Rams headed for the coast, a new league called the All-American Football Conference would begin play. The league was dominated by the Cleveland Browns who would eventually join the NFL in 1950.
Is he available? I hope he retires a Brown. Probably sick of all the sunshine and good weather. Come back home and kick for us for a year or two, Phil!
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
Just a bit of perspective in defense of Sashi on all of this "keep our own" business:
Sashi's responsibility and loyalty is to the Browns, not the Browns' players. So, when a guy like Schwartz or Pryor want to go off an play games - which is their right - he has to also make sure he has his #2 option lined up and getting locked in.
What he cannot do, and what he should forever get roasted for should it happen, is to spend so much time trying to keep one guy like Schwarz or Pryor that he ends up missing out on them AND whomever his #2 option was. He has to lock up a roster spot with a capable player. Preferably, that is the guy that was already on our team, but if you can get comparable production from another guy that IS ready and willing to sign as you would expect from your guy that is dawdling - you move. You take care of you first. If that aligns with the ideal of keeping your own guys, then that is fantastic, but if not... it is what it is.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
In the Peter King/Paul Depodesta interview, King took the opportunity to bring up the subject of the front office's practice of not re-signing their own free agents. King told Depodesta that even he is bugged by this trend the Browns front office continues to use. Peter King, welcome to the group of fans who are having a difficult time understanding what the Browns' are trying to do, allowing some of their best to leave rather than re-signing them.
As Peter King correctly pointed out, the practice of not re-signing your own free agents creates "unnecessary" holes that must then be filled. King named the two ex-Browns who played for Atlanta in this years Super Bowl, Alex Mack and Taylor Gabriel...RT, Mitch Schwartz, who started 17 games for the Chiefs and most recently, Terrelle Pryor, the Browns top WR in 2016.
Here is how Depodesta answered Peter King's concerns...
“I’d say going back a year when we did have a handful of free agents and WE ALLOWED THEM ALL TO SIGN ELSEWHERE, that was a moment in time. That is not something that we want to do continuously."
[color:#FF0000]Anyone care to interpret Depodesta's answer?
I will take a stab at it...Depo said, "WE ALLOWED THEM ALL TO SIGN ELSEWHERE"...
Put another way, imo, the front office made a pre-determined decision not to re-sign those players Peter King named. Depodesta is admitting that the Browns didn't intend to re-sign those players...they intentionally allowed them to leave.
I wish Peter King would have pressed Depodesta on the WHY Depo, Sashi and Haslam agreed on that strategy?
[/color]
Yeah.
Most of the FA's they let go elsewhere likely didn't fit in with the plans going forward and so instead of wasting those player's time, they helped them on their way?
Benjamin, Gabriel? Does anyone really expect us to keep a stable of under 6'00" WR's after a) the Browns were criticized for having such a thing in the first place and b) our new coach publicly preferred taller, bigger WRs?
Gipson? Good, but I don't think his injury history showed him to be a player they could confidently feel would be on the field long enough to build around.
Schwartz? In the end I think the FO probably could have shown a little more patience with that situation. But I also don't blame them from moving on so quickly. The assumption around here is that Schwartz and his agent politely thanked the Browns for their offer and stepped away for a moment to see what was out there. What you guys keep ignoring is all the hype just prior to where top RT's were rumored to be able to garner $10-12 mil/year. You in particular mac talk about Sashi and his ego, but would you deny the possibility and likelihood that Schwartz's group would be just as petulant and petty after being insulted by the Brown's offer that came in several millions less per year than what they thought they were going to get?
IMO it's just as likely that upon seeing the Brown's low-ball offer (compared to the hype) that Schwartz's camp, while not officially, reacted and said something that essentially ended the negotiations, that there was nothing else to talk about. If that was the best the Browns were going to do, and you really, truly believed you could get much more, why wouldn't you tell them you're done here and your taking your business elsewhere?
"Hey, I'm a reasonable guy. But I've just experienced some very unreasonable things." -Jack Burton
-It looks like the Harvard Boys know what they are doing after all.
I am over that, but don't get me started on cutting Phil Dawson
Not re-signing Phil Dawson was one of the first acts that Jimmy Haslam/Joe Banner carried out as the new owner/CEO of the Browns.
The policy of "no loyalty" to your own was something the Browns fans did not expect from the new owner...but that policy continues today and Banner has been gone for years.
The practice of overpaying someone elses free agent while playing low-ball hardball with your own players facing free agency is another practice Haslam brought to the Browns.
Then people wonder why the Browns have been so bad under Haslam's rule.
1957: The Browns select Syracuse Fullback Jim Brown in the first round of the NFL Draft. Brown would go on to capture both the NFL Rookie of the Year, and MVP as the Browns shot back up to the top of the Eastern Conference. After a one-year absence the Browns return to the NFL championship game after completing a 9-2-1 season. However, the Browns would never even be in the Championship game losing 59-14 to the Lions in Detroit.
Then people wonder why the Browns have been so bad under Haslam's rule.
The policy of "no loyalty" to your own was something the Browns fans did not expect from the new owner...but that policy continues today and Banner has been gone for years.
Let me ask you this at what point is it OK to let players go where does the "loyalty" end, at some point you have to use the guys you draft you can't keep them all!
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