DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Your predictions on imminent US action against North Korea? What do you think?

OK. My odds:

Just the same old shtick. “Economic sanctions” and “You’re a bad boy Kim Jung-un”

10% chance

Increased, militarily enforced economic embargos.

40%

Ultimatum “Do this now Jung-un - or else.”

40%

Direct military action. (too late now Jung-un - today was your last day alive).

10%

nothing at all...

sad but could be

it's like a very complex puzzle

I think Trump supporters are expecting more than the same old routine.

I'm expecting more.

No... But I really had my mind set on it.

Hey seriously, I'm pretty sure there's been a "Travel to North Korea at your own risk." advisory for a few years now.

Kind of like "Climb Mt. Everest at your own risk." You might die.

Who knows.. I do know that we have a president that says he knows more than the Generals,, so we'll see I guess.

Timing needed to be right as this is a very very delicate situation .. I think it is ...

He needs to be dead ... he went into hiding after Rodman left cause he was afraid of a Bin Laden style execution ... he has good instincts ...

Its time for him to be gone ..

logic says nothing will happen.

however, we're not dealing with an administration who thinks things through, as they make decisions based on the image it will bring.

so with any other president down the list, nothing.

with Trump? God only knows. i'll say direct military action right now is at 50%, closer to 60% maybe.

Jun 20, 12:47 PM EDT



MCCAIN: AMERICANS 'STUPID' TO STILL WANT TO TRAVEL TO NKOREA


BY RICHARD LARDNER
ASSOCIATED PRESS
link

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Sen. John McCain said Tuesday that Americans who are "stupid" enough to still want to travel to North Korea should be required to sign a waiver absolving the U.S. government of any blame should they be harmed while there.

McCain, the chairman of the Armed Services Committee, said North Korea "murdered" Otto Warmbier, the 22-year-old American college student who died just days after North Korea released him from detention in a coma. He had arrived in Ohio on June 13 after being held for more than 17 months.

"They just murdered him," McCain said.

The University of Virginia student was accused of trying to steal a propaganda banner while visiting with a tour group and was convicted of subversion. He was sentenced in March 2016 to 15 years in prison with hard labor.

"There should at least be a form for them to fill out that says, 'If I go to North Korea, I understand I am taking great risk and I do not hold the American government responsible. Now I hope the American government will help, etc., etc. But I realize what has happened to previous American citizens, including their deaths,'" McCain, R-Ariz., said in a brief interview.

"I would have that first because if people are that stupid that they still want to go to that country then at least they assume the responsibility for their welfare," McCain said.

Sen. Bob Corker of Tennessee, the Republican chairman of the Foreign Relations Committee, said the U.S. should think about banning U.S. citizens from visiting North Korea.

"I think we should strongly consider it," Corker said. "It puts us in a really precarious situation when Americans are detained there."

The United States, South Korea and others have accused North Korea of using foreign detainees has hostages to secure diplomatic concessions. Three Americans remain in custody in the North.

"It's unsafe," Corker said, adding that the "trumped up charges" like those Warmbier was accused of "can continue to happen."


I believe McCain put it in words that everyone can understand...DON'T BE STUPID!

To reinforce the point, all travel to North Korea should be BANNED...therefore, if someone "stupid" decides to defy the BAN and become a prisoner of North Korea, don't come crying for the US government to bail you out.

That solves the problem putting all the responsibility on the individual for their own actions.

If I were Commander in Chief I would inform everyone we were going to take out NK's nuke capabilities. Even if we are forced to go Nuclear ourselves.

I would move the subs into position.
I would launch all our bombers towards NK.
I would position our Navy.

Then I would launch an all out sneak Nuclear Attack on China!
Take em out, burn em down!

After China's destruction I would announce to the world it was repayment for Pearl Harbor!

(don't even begin to take this seriously)

yea, except Trump is probably taking a silly strategy like that seriously. it's all fun and games until he exactly does it.

No need to do anything but get rid of the head of the snake at this point ..

Then see what happens ...

The head needs to go .. NOW ...

So whats your solution .. how about u tell us what u would do instead of .. nope .. not gonna go there ...

Whats your solution?

As of now your solution is to do nothing ... if thats your actual solution ... whats your logic behind that ... what do u think would happen next if we do NOTHING but act like the penguins of Madagascar and " wave and smile boys .. wave and smile" ..

I believe at some point, there's a 100% chance that military action will take place against N. Korea. The boundary will be pushed to the point that at some juncture we will have no choice. It's not a question of if, but when.

I'd put it at about 30%. This is a real tough situation. Most people (not you) don't realize that NK has just tons of arsenal pointed right at Seoul, ready to go off. It's always a powder keg.

I see it playing down to some sort of game of chicken we have with China. I could see it that we'd appear to have all of our assets in place for some sort of a strike. China's intel would see it, and they would somehow put deeper pressure on the regime to curb the nuke garbage and/or release other prisoners.

It's all a huge, scary game of chicken at this point. China is still in the driver's seat though, IMHO.

The solution right now is to do nothing.

If you want to go to war with Korea, you better have a damn good reason.

Fat boy running his chops is not a good reason.

Unsuccessful missile test is not a good reason. Especially since there are other countries like Iran who test missiles, I don't see anyone on this board advocating that we go to war with Iran.

As crappy as it is, some dumbass American who decided to go into NK and tragically died recently isn't a good reason.

Mattis and a host of other very smart people do not want to go with NK, and aren't advocating going right now, either.

So now that I gave you my reasons, explain to the board why you're smarter than Mattis and think it's a good idea to put troops in harms way in NK.


"Cause trump said-" is not an acceptable response.

The problem is that China is trying to grab territory. The last thing they want is US troops right on their border, cause that could trigger a massive conflict.

North Korea is the buffer. There no reason for China to do anything at the moment.

And if the US decides to strike first, china won't be the ones with eggs on their faces. We will.

People need to understand this isn't just about military action, but more than ever we need diplomacy.

Why is it that Mattis and others understands that, but Trump doesn't?

Do you really believe that the death of this guy is the only reason? Seriously?

Do you believe we should ignore a leader who has stated he is building a nuclear program with the intent to attack the United states and is working on building a long range missile to achieve that goal?

At what point do you believe we should stop ignoring that?

I don't see where he thinks that is the ONLY reason. The biggest problem is that there is a sliding scale of solutions at this point.

Obviously, the lunatic leader has been running his mouth off about the nuclear program. At what point do we consider it to be more bluster or a dangerous bargaining chip in order to get concessions vs. a real threat to our security? I don't have the answer to that. Obviously again, we can't actually have them reach that capability, so I don't know where we put the red line, because the costs of engaging in a military action that could involve China makes it a grave, high-stakes situation.

Where did I state that's the only reason?

As far as military action, yes, we should do nothing. Because nothing is required right now.

I specifically said we needed diplomacy, but I guess I shouldn't be surprised you completely ignored that part of my post.

Unlike you I'm not into bombing people just to bomb them. I know you and your war mongering ideology love doing nonsense like that, but I'm not part of it.

I'm cool with us doing something similar to what we did with the Iranian deal. Do what we can to end his nuclear ambition as peacefully as possible.

You need to chill with this gorilla chest beating. Military action should be a last resort. You conservatives however like using the military like bouncers kicking some drunk chick out of a night club, always gotta be a first option. Stop it.

Do you honestly think we have been ignoring all of this?

My opinion is that China knows that NK is not too far away from a total internal collapse, much like the Soviet Union did in the 1980s.. they don't have the economy to sustain their level of military spending and their people are suffering greatly.

At some point they will collapse from the inside and China will be there to move in and peacefully take over.

Hell the last thing they probably want is for us to go to war with NK... we will bomb them back to the stone age, then spend trillions of dollars rebuilding them better than they ever were before and they will become an industrial power.. much like Japan did.

Oh ye of little comprehension! lol I'm not saying we need to do anything.... now. I'm saying that if things continue in their current state, there will be a point that we're left with no other alternative. I don't believe any rational person would conclude otherwise.



That would be the ideal solution if we can get this tyrant to even engage in any talks.



In case you missed it, I would only call for military action as a last resort. I'm the last person who wishes to send our military into battle if there's any other viable solution. At this time there is no cause for war. Yet with each passing day that N. Korea continues to thumb their nose at us and our allies to achieve their goal at long range nuclear capability.

Unless that course changes, at some point the military option will be stringly considered.

See Pit, even Swish thinks you are a conservative.

That's when I feel my claim as a moderate is vindicated. When both sides label you, you must have some type of middle ground. lol

That's why I like guys like Jim Webb. Democrats don't want to claim him and the GOP doesn't like him either.

Everyone on every side can smell BS when it is placed before them.

Hmmm .. guess my questions were to hard for Swish ... just like when i first came to the board ...

Guess i can quit reading him all ready ...

Please don't tell me if he goes "hard in the paint on me" ... :rofl ....

BYE BYE SWISH ....

Trump's all good with China now. I think Xi complemented his huge inaugural crowd at dinner or something because Trump loves him some Xi now.

As far as NK. You can't hit them without out risking SK/Japan getting nuked. And I don't think a surgical strike killing Kim is even an option because of that risk.

Please don't think you can talk about anyone's reading comprehension when you just sat there and assumed I was talking about the death of fat boy. If you don't want anybody putting words in your mouth or intentionally misrepresenting what you said, then the change starts with you.

Anyway, maybe we can get fatty to engage in talks. But I honestly don't see much of an effort from the trump administration doing that.

It seems like they got into office and immediately decided to start flexing muscles.

I'm trying to see strategy from Un's perspective. And from his perspective, there zero reason to take trump seriously at the moment. Not only did he "send" armada at his doorstep, but come to find out, he lied about that too. The fleet was heading in the opposite direction.

Why would I (Un) engage with the US while they blatantly lie about sending a fleet, combine with the fact that the US wants to show a hostile force?

If I'm Un, I'll let trump's stupid ass attack first. We know the US military is worlds better than whatever crap equipment NK has, but who will look like the bad guy here if the US strikes first?

Congrats, another Vietnam. Then combine that with the fact that we have no idea what china will do in response, and it's possible WW3 begins in east Asia.

Have to get Un to the table peacefully at all cost.

?? I directly answered your question.

You didn't answer mine. If you just gonna play antagonist all day then why bother saying anything to me at all? Save yourself the time, seriously.

But in all fairness swixh, lil kim hasn't followed ANYTHING
the u.s. has said under any president. Or the U.N.

He just goes about his jolly ways, saying, in a term you'll understand: "kick rocks".


(edited because in my first line, I apparently hit something that posted what I said, before I was finished)

I agree bro. He has to meet half way.

But until he starts using his military to order actual attacks on us or our allies, then what should we do about it?

Not sure. (you did notice I edited my post, right?)

What I do know is sanctions haven't worked. Threats haven't worked. He keeps lobbing missiles which nk isn't allowed to have under u.n. sanctions. He has nukes, which n.k. isn't allowed to have under u.n. sanctions.

He's been doing it for years.

So, when IS the time? I don't know.

I do know, the longer he's left to do whatever he wants, the worse it could be.

I'm not in favor of a war. Or a bombing attack.

What to do? I don't know.

Assassins.

Right, well guess what?

There's two solutions: diplomacy, or war.

Sanctions didn't work with Iran, either. So we did what we had to do to get them to the table, and so far so good.

All I'm saying is let's try to exhaust the diplomatic way first. Un hasn't attacked any of our allies or us. Get him, china, and other countries to the table like we did Iran, and let's see what can be worked out.

While I'd be for that, and am for that - lil kim has shown over and over, and so did his dad - that they won't honor anything they agree to.

They do their own thing.

Again, I don't have the answer right now. But if a nuke goes off on our property, I'll have 2 thoughts: 1. Could've easily been stopped, and 2: n.k. will cease to exist, but more than likely, ww3 exists.

Neither is a good thing.

I am sure by now we have mapped every square inch of NK and know where every bit of their Nuke capabilities are.

We could attack and bomb them away with supersonic bombers and missiles before they knew what hit them.

I agree. This isn't the spark to ignite things.

If push comes to shove, I still don't think China will do anything to defend him other than talk. They know the guy is a unstable lunitic.

To put it another way, is it better for China to have good relations with us, or with Pugsley. Before we bombed Syria, we told the Russians to pull out, and they did. Do the same for China, and they will. China isn't going to throw all they now have in to turmoil over N. Korea. What can N. Korea offer them?

Once you are at the big table, you aren't going to let a player like N. Korea ruin that.

That's why war is the last possible option.

Yet so far, he's broken every sanction, refuses to negotiate anything and has thumbed his nose at the globe.

We are far from needing to go to war, but each passing day brings us closer.

But does it have to be a "traditional" war?

Perhaps a Police Action.