DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus President Trump Calls Out Sports Figures

One question for the NFL would be:

After a black supremacist specifically targeted and murdered 5 white police officers on July 7th 2016 in Dallas, why did you reject the Cowboys' request to wear decals honoring the slain members of the Dallas Police Department?

We have NFL players who stand for "Save the Queen" but kneel for "The Star-Spangled Banner". But if they kneel in the end zone after a touchdown, and it's not to praise the Lord, they get a 15 yard penalty and a fine... I can't help but think that whether and when to allow freedom of expression is enforced inconsistently.

I hope you're not referring to me, I never questioned your service.

Because one is a constitutional right. The other violates the uniform policy in the NFL. It's why players get fined for stuff like the cleats they wear.

deleted - off topic, no sense in derailing this further

The NBA has a rule that says players must stand for the National Anthem. And while I'm skeptical of such a rule, that is not a violation of the first amendment. Devil covered this very well the other day.

Also not protected by the first amendment are consequences, such as when people like me don't like watching overpaid, spoiled athletes disgrace the country before playing a game, and thus turn off the TV and find something else to do.

edit: They stood for the foreign anthem and knelt for the American one. I am surprised you are so encouraging of this.

Moot


No reports from either the league or players documenting that any such fines were actually levied.

When a similar situation arose in 2011, the NFL announced in advance of the day that no fines would be assessed:

but didn't you say in an earlier post that the players did not agree with the deal the NFL did. Well the players did not agree with the uniform policy either the nfl made it up -

Why don't any of the players take a knee during the game? Wouldn't that have more of an impact for the message they are trying to get across?

And you realize that it is a right for them to protest, that constitutional right only keeps them from going to jail over it. If they get cut or are benched, its the teams right to do so.

Why are you comparing apples to oranges?

The players signed a contract for uniform standards. They did not sign a contract saying they have to stand for the national anthem because of the deal between the NFL and he military.

Who here claimed otherwise?

only because of the backlash. You cannot tell me you don't see a double standard with the NFL here. and again, as I have stated, I believe it is the players right to kneel if that is how they want to protest, I just don't like it, which is my RIGHT as well. I think they would be better served to do it during a game, but they wont because then they know they wouldn't get a check.

Then why are you skeptical of the rule since you clearly believe it's not violation of their constitutional rights. Can't have it both ways bro.

I don't understand the point of you pointing out info we are all aware of.

The NBA has a rule. The NFL does not. Thus the NFL players doing what they are. Sure, the owners can cut the players if they so choose, but the NFL as a singular organization has no such rule for consequences.

So again, what was the point of your post?

How do you know what was signed and what wasn't? AS employees of the teams and the league, their bargaining agreement allows the NFL to sign deals on the players behalf. The NFL made a deal with NIKE, moving from Reebox, your saying that every single player in the NFL had to sign off on that, lol?

Every single person protesting the NFL about Kap not playing and complaining about it.

You said the players were fined. No fines assesed. Setting the record straight. Continue...

I don't believe the NFL should add a rule requiring players to stand.

However, doing so would not be a violation of the players' constitutional rights-- the NBA already has such a rule. Companies can fire employees based on their political views expressed in private, on their own time.

It's possible that the NFL adding such a rule would be in violation of the collective bargaining agreement.. I'm not sure on that one.

Actually there is a rule about it:

Link - a - do

Good find. I wonder if these anthem protests could be described as an 'illustration'? Perhaps reasonable minds could differ on that one.

And yet look at the statement from the NFL commissioner. How come you won't post his comments?

Oh well. All this boils down to is people are upset that the league is allowing players to speak out against social injustices.

Sad that this is considered divisive but nazis marching the streets isn't.

Doesn't flood like it's a rule from your own source with what the players are doing. Oh well.

I again ask the question that I posed above (directed at the NFL):

After a black supremacist specifically targeted and murdered 5 white police officers on July 7th 2016 in Dallas, why did you reject the Cowboys' request to wear decals honoring the slain members of the Dallas Police Department?

Because again, one is in violation of the NFL uniform policy. Unless mandated by the league. It's the same reason why the running back in Pittsburgh got fined for wearing pink in support of breast cancer awareness, or players get fined for heir cleats, or why players aren't allowed to have a BLM decal on their helmet.

The answer was already provided to you.

That depends......

Political activity retaliation is not covered by the same laws that prohibit retaliation based on other things. Retaliation by private employers based on race, color, sex, religion, national origin, age, and disability is prohibited. There are also laws protecting against retaliation based on union or concerted activity. These laws don’t protect you from an employer who might fire you because of your political beliefs.

Most employees of private companies do not have legal protection against discrimination based on political affiliation or activity. A public employer may be prevented from firing someone based on political speech because that would constitute the government itself suppressing free speech.

The following states ban discrimination based on some form of political activity:

Colorado, North Dakota, and Utah prohibit discrimination based on “lawful conduct outside of work.”

Montana is the only state that bars employers from firing people without good cause. Additionally, the good cause must be job-related. Failing to perform job duties satisfactorily is an example.

Connecticut prohibits discrimination based on the rights guaranteed by the First Amendment. The state applies the same rules to private employers that are applied to public employers under the First Amendment. For private employers, the activity must not substantially interfere with the employee’s job performance.

New York prohibits discrimination for off-duty “recreational activities” such as arguing about politics at a social event.

California, Colorado, Guam, Louisiana, Minnesota, Missouri, Nebraska, Nevada, South Carolina, Utah, West Virginia, Seattle (Washington), and Madison (Wisconsin) prohibit employers from retaliating against employees for engaging in “political activities.”

It is important to check with your specific state because what activities are defined as political varies between states. For example, in California, courts have held that advocacy of forcible or violent conduct does not qualify as “political” within the terms of the statute.

New Mexico prohibits employers from discriminating based on “political opinions.”

Washington D.C., Utah, Iowa, Louisiana, Puerto Rico, Virgin Islands, Broward County (Florida) and Urbana (Illinois) prohibit employers from discriminating against employees based on party membership.

Illinois, New York, and Washington prohibit employers from discriminating against employees for election-related speech and political activities.

Arizona, Washington D.C., Georgia, Iowa, Minnesota, Missouri, Ohio, Oregon, and Washington prohibit employers from discriminating against employees who have signed initiatives, referendums, recalls or candidate petitions. For example, in these states, an employer would not be able to retaliate against someone for signing petitions supporting certain initiatives such as anti-same-sex marriage or same-sex marriage.

Louisiana, Massachusetts, and Oregon prohibit discrimination based on contributions to a specific campaign.

Since unions and their members are also very politically active, many standard union contracts include prohibitions on political activity discrimination, and some employers have also chosen to include this type of discrimination among the categories prohibited in their company's anti-discrimination policy disseminated to employees.
On April 26, 2016, in Heffernan v. City of Paterson, the Third Circuit held that if an employer demotes an employee out of the desire to prevent that employee from engaging in protected political activity, the employee is entitled to challenge that unlawful action under the First Amendment and Section 1983 even if the employer’s actions are based on factual mistake about the employee’s behavior.
If you live in one of these states or have a union contract, and you have suffered political activity retaliation, you should consult with an attorney or your union to learn more about any protections that may apply to you.

https://www.workplacefairness.org/retaliation-political-activity#1

Typical, cant come up with a decent reply so go straight to the "you're a racist" playbook.

Did you not see where I stated I believe I stand by their right to protest, just wish it was a different time of the game? Why don't they kneel during a game btw? Would make more an impact. Cause their money would be effected that's why.

That's not what it boils down too. Knee during a game then. Make a real impact. And if this protest was so important to the players, why did the Steelers let them get silenced by the man. They are protesting oppression, yet the Owner of the team the oppressor silence them. lol

Thanks for the post. That was actually very informative. I think the gist of what I said is accurate-- the employers can (at least sometimes) fire you because of your political beliefs. It's a lot more complicated than that depending on the state, private vs public and unionized vs non-unionized employment, and all that.

Yeah a time when nobody is watching. Get over it. Don't like it don't watch.

What are you talking about? Where did I imply you were a racist anywhere in that post?

Stop being sensitive.

I gave you a reply, you just didn't like the response. Not my problem.

Sorry but you're wrong. What they are doing IS making a real impact now, because it got guysnlike you all upset over the flag and now we're talking about it.

the steelers decided as a team to stay in for the national anthem, and their owner made a statement in support of the players.

So what are you talking about? And if you don't have a problem with what the players are doing, why are you continuing to whine about it?

Your words aren't lining up with your actions.

And as far as the NFL Commish, do you honestly think he or owners care anything about the protest? Heck no, all they care about is their bottom line. They all had the same response, same comments. They came up with what was the least disparaging to both sides so as to not to try to upset one over the other. But I highly doubt the commish or the owners care about either side of the issue.

Why must people bring up things that don't matter anymore?

Is it a deflection technique or something.

Bill Clinton hasn't been in office for 17 years, Hillary hasn't held an elected position in since she was a senator. Bush has basically stayed out of the limelight since he was in office..

Who care about them now. That's yesterdays news. Today, we have a 5 time draft dodger in office.

That's not really something you can argue about.. But instead of acknowledging it, people deflect.. Same thing the president does..

healthcare/health insurance, North Korea, Iran, the UN, Tax Reform, The wall.... All things that Trump said he'd tax care of shortly after he was sworn in. He's only made things worse (yeah, I know, he's gotten a SCOTUS put in, he's signed a bunch of executive orders blah blah blah..But no legislation, nothing,, Not one)

And Trump thinks it's ok to stir up this stuff up over something that is a right we all have.. I'm convinced he does this to distract us from the REAL ISSUES we face in this country.

Like I've said before, I'll always stand for the anthem, that's the way I'm wired I guess. But I will not damage the reputation of those that wish to protest something/anything in any peaceful manner.. It's their right.

This president thinks that it's OK to try and destroy people for their beliefs if they differ from his. He's forgotten we have right's. Perhaps he'd like to take them away... Like a real Dictator would do..

Rant Off

Me?

Lily, nary a spot.

Yeah I get that. The league could have, and should have made an exception for that cause. They will let teams wear decals honoring the deceased spouse of an owner. They should have allowed the Cowboys to wear such a decal as well.

Thinly veiled at best, your hinting that anyone who disagrees with the protest is a neo Nazi white supremacist. Nice try tho.


How am I upset about it? I stated multiple times I stand for their right to kneel. I just think it would have more class on their part and more impact to do so at another time.

Tell that to #78, I guess he didn't get the message or decision. And it was stated that until after they got flack - I live in Pittsburgh, trust me, they are getting killed for standing in the tunnel. And honestly they should - if you want to protest protest, don't be a pansy and sit out the fight.

Because its a message board , they are made for ummmm messages and discussion. Are you tyring to silence my voice and oppress me?


edit to add - and I never said I didn't have a problem with it, I stated I stand by their right to do so. you see as a free thinker and not just someone who follows ideology, I can disagree with something but still support the right for it.

No one can answer either why they have not protested an actual game? If the protest meant so much to the players protesting, make a real impact.

Your hood hair is showing.

Racist much?

I am proud to be White and proud of my heritage. So to you Racists that makes me KKK or Nazi?

Interesting. If I made a comment like that about another Race, all hell would break loose.

Yeah yeah yeah, the Steelers took their ball and went home. Didn't even show up to play.

The only thing I got out of that was a deep admiration for Alejandro Villanueva. It's unfortunate that he has to play for such a slimy organization, but it's professional football and sometimes these players just have to take the opportunities (read: roster spots) that are presented to them.

I hope the Browns employ him at some point, either as an offensive tackle, or if that doesn't work out for football reasons, perhaps a nice cushy job in the P.R. department.

Because it shows hypocrisy, its ok to look past something when your person is in office, but as soon as the next person does the same thing its the end of the world. Kinda like the refugee ban, when Obama implanted it, not a peep, trump does it and the whole left freaks out and has a heart attack.

And no matter what you say, the fact is he had a deferment from the draft. Question it all you want, doesn't change the fact it was a deferment. Unless you have the medical records from when you treated him personally?

Bro you are sounding super salty right now.

That OL has the right do stand away from his teammates or not. That's the teams issue to deal with.

It wasn't thing fielded anything. It was just a comment pointing out how one group is being attacked for not being racist, while the actual racist aren't catching anywhere near the heat the players are.

If you don't find that odd, then that's fine. But understand that me and you are nothing alike, and it's clear we don't view the world the same way.

Nobody is trying to silence you. You just don't like your opinions challenged. That's on par with conservatives who cry about PC this and that every time they make a silly comment and called out on it. Play victim once you can't defend the position anymore.

Somnow their play on the field is indicative of the protest?

That's stupid.

Kinda like how "black power" "support black only business" etc is black supremacy and you would stand against that right?

How is Kap supporting the cause now a days?