DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Las Vegas shooting

he would have to do that once the crowd disperse.

he definitely can hit a ton of unsuspecting people who are pretty much stationary.

but once people panic, start running or hit the ground in cover? spray and pray doesn't work that well, especially from that distance.

and i'm not giving him too much credit seeing as my entire point is that either he wasn't the actual shooter, or he needed help and/or training from an outside source in order to pull this off.

i would love to be wrong, GOD i would love to be wrong, and the video shows that this guy was just that good and an unfortunately nut job terrorist attack. but as of right now, that doesn't seem plausible.

In vegas, in a high roller suite, yes...yes I do.

Oh Man Peen, on Facebook, there are a ton of folks that are promoting this 2nd and 3rd Shooter theory. I mean they've gone to far as put up pictures on the hotel showing the shooters room that we know of, then assume the reflection of that room is another broken window. They also say that on the 12th floor there is another broken window, but the problem is, you can't tell because they've put a red dot on it..

But yet, they insist that those are broken windows and other shooters were spotted firing from those windows.

It's insane

He bought a lot of guns apparently. How many did he use?


I don't think it's difficult at all. What surveillance? What scouting? More than likely it was a simple "Hey, gonna be a lot of people there, and if I get a room here, I can shoot."


Perhaps you are mistaking his shooting as having any sort of "aim". He was shooting into a crowd of some 22,000. He wasn't aiming, he was firing with a general "kinda hit that crowd" mentality. There was no precision involved. He wasn't sniping. He was using either a full auto weapon, or a semi auto with bump stock. You may have a valid point there, but I don't think his age matters much. I also know I have no "training" in guns that anyone can verify, other than my ccw class. But, I do pretty well - aiming and hitting what I aim at.





But I think the point you might be missing is, he didn't have to be "good" at firing/shooting. He didn't need to be a marksmen, or pass any accuracy tests.



You're right, facts are still coming out, probably will be for weeks.

I know many 1%'rs, and it's not normal. I know many bottom 20%ers and it's not normal. It's not normal.





Keep in mind - and I've read all of your posts on this thread, I'm not attacking you: This guy wasn't a military sniper trying to hit 1 specific target/person.

This guy wasn't operating under the military rules of "limit/eliminate collateral deaths/damage/"

The only rule of engagement he operated under was "put as many bullets into that huge crowd of 22,000 as I can, as fast as I can."

This wasn't a military tactical attack. This wasn't Arch out hunting woodchuck, or deer. This was a carpet bombing approach. You don't need a lot of planning for that......you just need a lot of ammo/guns, and very little planning.

JMO.

Don't get ticked at me.

I don't know NV, or Vegas' laws, but around here, putting a camera in a hotel room is illegal.

And further, good friend of my wife is a "high roller", goes out to vegas about 6 times a year, room comped, etc.........I bet she'd be surprised to learn the hotel had cameras in her room.

that doesn't line up with what LEO's are saying. they are saying this required a fair amount of planning to pull this off.

It would require planning in terms of getting all of those guns and ammo into the hotel. But spraying bullets into a crows of 22k people doesn't require a lot of skill.

Vegas is like fort knox. They are watching every single thing you do. they have algorithms set up to watch players and can even try to dictate how you gamble, how long etc. Legal? IDK. Am I right, IDK. I am just saying that I find it far fetched the hotel doesn't have more information on the guy. Especially if he visited and gambled as much as he did, they would know more about him than anyone.

Okay, not trying to argue here, at all.

I just know that having a target of 22,000 makes killing some, if that's your goal, easy.

I just know that being able to shoot "down" on a crowd is beneficial, if your goal is to do what this punk thug did.

I know it would be rather simple to carry guns into a hotel room in a suitcase or a ....suit bag? whatever it's called.


I, or you, could get a room in a hotel with a simple phone call.

Now, to request a certain room, or, at a minimum, a certain side of the hotel, up high, may have taken some "planning" in order to get said room at a time when there would be a large outdoor concert. Not much planning, but some.



Again, I'm not "attacking" you. Ignore the name of the person that's replying to you, and go from there.

Regardless, the guy did do some planning, but it wouldn't be all that hard for anyone to do.

And, 59 people died, and I'm hearing close to 600 were injured, I can't forget that part of it.

J/C

Every time there is a tragedy, do the conspiracy people not find that it a conspiracy of the conspiracies? meaning, I find it more out whack that all these things were planned for some reason, rather just happening.

Sandy Hook - people said conspiracy
Ft Hood - conspiracy
San Bern. - conspiracy

I bet we see photos of that brunette in the crowd here soon too every keeps peddling is at all the shootings. I think the conspiracies are the ones the people are creating.

I believe it's human nature to look for answers when the things that happen simply make no sense.

I don't doubt any of that.....but you said they probably had cameras in the guys room.

Fairly certain that's illegal.

They can, and obviously do, have cameras all over the casinos. And the entry to hotels, etc.

I guarantee they don't have cameras in the bathrooms, and I highly, highly, highly doubt they have cameras in the rooms, as you stated.

Some areas are public, and cameras are allowed. Some areas are private, like hotel rooms and bathrooms, and cameras aren't allowed.

Pitt, this may be the only thing we ever agree on sir.

I am not saying its legal, I just think its far fetched they would not. That's just my opinion, I maybe wrong.

However it begs to question - are they private rooms if they are only used as comps? Technically you are being given that room, so its not yours you are renting and would have no privacy to it. I may be reaching, just thinking out loud.

Nah. I'm a firm supporter of 2nd amendment rights and a border wall. I'm sure there will be others. lol

I think you are reaching.

Comped or not, who cares?

I mentioned the lady I did because you said "high roller". She's a high roller.

Comped rooms or not, they don't have cameras in the rooms. Period.

I think determining the ability and training of the guy comes down to figuring out how many total rounds expended, if it’s over 5000 as reported than yeah hitting 6-700 out of 22000 is probably luck, but as I’ve said, one inch of variance and those rounds miss , barrel overhears, those miss, if he only fired say 1000, given that info, then it took planning and training with a specific intent

A hard shell golf travel bag would hold an awful lot of rifles and not draw a bit of suspicion. It's on wheels and easy to get around. You can take it out the next day, empty, and bring it back after your round of golf fully loaded. Getting them into the hotel room shouldn't be that difficult.

Cameras in rooms? Never. If you have a reasonable expectation of privacy you can bet there are no cameras. Step out in the hallway and they are watching you.

I think when the investigations are over, Vegas should hold a Memorial Outdoor Concert at the same site to honor the dead and wounded and their families/friends. Also dedicated to the First Responders and Doctors/Nurses.

America continues, Strong and Free!

I was in Vegas two weeks ago for the Life is Beautiful music festival. Went to the strip one night and got a room at the Flamingo. Cameras everywhere. Up and down the halls. Every elevator waiting area. All over the casino’s floor. In the restaraunts. Everywhere. It’s a big brother state. Hopefully they weren’t in our room or whoever was watching my girlfriend’s and my room got a show. It’ll be interesting to see how many times this guy came and went with bags/cases. The hotel will know(s) that for sure.

quote above by Portland:



Yeah, many cameras even in my apartment building too.

Entrances, elevators, lobby, mail boxes.

It's for our "protection".

The comings and goings of anybody who lives in my apartment building could easily be reconstructed and documented.

Vegas shooter may have been targeting another music festival

By Larry Celona

October 3, 2017 | 4:08pm | Updated

Vegas shooter may have been targeting another music festival

Las Vegas mass shooter Stephen Paddock may have had another target in mind.

Last weekend, he tried to rent a room overlooking a music festival a few miles away from the scene of his carnage Sunday, a law-enforcement source told The Post.

But Paddock couldn’t get a room that looked out onto the Life is Beautiful Festival, headlined by Chance the Rapper and Lorde and held in Sin City Sept. 22-24, the source said.

That festival was held several miles north of the Route 91 music festival that the cowardly Paddock sprayed with bullets from a 32nd-floor suite in the Mandalay Bay casino on Sunday.

http://nypost.com/2017/10/03/vegas-shooter-may-have-been-targeting-another-music-festival/

Well from what we do know. the guy was in vegas at hotels gambling all the time. so this could just be coincidence....I think that's what it is. It was obviously well planned, I don't think he would have overlooked booking a room in time and miss out his chance.

but if that was the case, it blows a hole in the "crazy leftist" theory, but there will be no way of knowing or ever proving this was or was not his intention on that day

i think people need to understand that leftist rightist ideology is gonna be a problem when it involves domestic terrorism.

not saying you do it, but we throw a lot of blanket statements at foreign terrorist issues based on broad ideologies, as we aren't ingrained in the regional culture.

Here, we're all personally and emotionally invested, and people will defend every little detail when it comes to who's ideology can be targeted.

No doubt it was a packed "tighter than fish swimming in a barrel" crowd. More like sardines in a can at first.

Since concert crowds are generally no more than a foot apart and this crowd standing, the first few(7-8) 50-100rd mags most prob impacted from the torso up unless they hit the front row.

I'd bet most casualities happened within the first 6-7 mags. After those mags it prob then became as hard as fish swimming in a barrel. After the crowd became aware and started running he prob just directed fire towards the 6 exits.

Imo.......
getting the guns in.......easy.
getting the ammo in.......easy.

He was well known there so.......getting the room was easy.

Sadly it was prob easily planned and executed. I think most people try to overthink it.

JMHO

God Bless them all.

That's the thing about theories. They're usually based on something that tends to give them at least some thread of credibility. That's why there really is no "crazy leftist theory". It's just a made up fantasy.

Well at this point we don't know. Past events show there crazy leftist and crazy rightist. I was merely pointing out that if that was the case (he wanted to shoot up a rap concert), it throw that theory out.

But again, we will never really know if that was the case or if it was just coincidence. Every single thing in this guys life is going to be looked at and assumptions are going to be made, that's for sure.

My crew and I read about that. We were all thankful that we were not the target festival. That said I had VIP treatment with a hotel room inside the actual festival grounds. A lot of the music I just watched from my 2nd story hotel room overlooking a stage. The windows at my hotel opened. There was no screens either. I didn’t go out much to see music. Most of the music at the festival wasn’t really in my wheelhouse. I was there as a gig with my art.
The Ogden, where the dude apparently scouted the festival from, was just outside the festival grounds. It overlooked another main stage. One I only caught Schoolboy Q and a Cirque performance on. Anyway, when my girlfriend and I ran off to the Strip for a night we walked off festival grounds and caught a Lyft from the Ogden lobby. Just 10 days prior to the shooting.
It’s all a little too close.
But...
Won’t stop me from going to festivals.

It scared me when I read that and you posted you were there.

Some of my friends were pretty freaked out. As were my parents.
My mom called me to tell me I’m “never allowed to go to festivals again”. Lol, even though I’m 45 years old her momma instincts still kicked in. She just doesn’t have any say anymore.

Have a h.s. classmate of mine that was in Vegas. She's fine.

Have a friend of my cousin that was there - and left with Big and Rich just........I think 48 minutes before.

I baby sat for this kid. Wow, I hate that term...........I kid watched this guy years ago. He's got a vid on facebook.

He was there.


And, it means nothing.

Just don’t tell her that.

I was very surprised, I went through a few recent pages of this thread and there are a few people who post here who actually think there might be some kind of - might I mention the word - conspiracy here. Usually at Dawgtalkers? Nope. It certainly seems to me that most of you who post here will believe just about anything the main stream media dishes out to you. It's true.

I don't know if there is a conspiracy or not here and I am a conspiracy theorist myself of sorts. It is just so freakin' odd - why would someone who by the looks of it who was doing very well in life, who was never in trouble with the law go on a freakin' killing spree at age 64? It just doesn't make sense. And there lies the mystery.

Perhaps he was just a psychopath like his father? I don't know.

It will be interesting to see what is what when more of the facts come out.... if they ever do.

Daman, I haven't been on much, working on a hospital project but got on fb for a bit last night and there was a flood of the second shooter.
Videos showing a strobing light from the 4th floor-others say that light has been going for 3 days before. The window broken on the 12 floor.
that somebody in a security uniform was being chased through a bar by a bunch of officers just after the shooting.
that there was a women in the crowd saying that you all are going to die tonight.

The only thing I can think of is why does a guy who goes to vegas and gambles a million a year and made 2 million on 1 real estate deal would plan all this.

He probably had help somewhere but time will tell on the multiple shooters

To me? This sounds like there might be two separate guns going off at the same time. They don't sound like they are in the same location either. But could it just be the sound echoing off the buildings?

Police said it was two shooters on the video.

This is crazy. I don't know what to think anymore...

I said the same thing to my wife a couple days ago. IT may be all the echos and ricochet and it may also be return fire-if anyone even had a clue as what to shoot at.

I did hear in one of the videos that police officer said that there was 2 shooters-
and I say a couple nights ago people at the event thought that the shooter was on the ground also

The shooter was older.
He was not much into Social Media.
He apparently didn't have a Facebook Footprint.
Don't be surprised if a Media Outlet receives a Manifesto in the mail within the next few days.

Now if true, this cuts WAAAAY too close to home....

[shudder]

be glad he wasn't tossing out homemade grenades or pipe bombs ... you can't stop someone from mass murder if his mind is set to do it. Just imagine if someone had launched bags of flour and set off the dust after soaking the ground with kerosine or setting down a leaking propane tank on the edge of the crowd. Guns are little toys compared to what a sicko with ambition could do at one of these events.

Look at what just one bag of flour can do ...



We live in a dangerous world...