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Well, considering the the length of the NFL season and the time invested in traveling, practice, games, camps, and the off the field meetings, commercials, photo shoots, appearances and so on.
From an availability perspective, when did Vick find the time to be so hands-on in the dog fighting circuit.
Charles Manson wasn't "hands on" in the murder of Sharron Tate,he was just the boss of the operation. He gave the orders. And he was found to be guilty. Ask him how the "hands off" approach worked for him?
If Vick was giving the orders,or was a part in this through money,he's just as guilty as everyone else involved according to the rule of law. As it should be IMO.
We'll see how it plays out in court.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Vick has not yet been convicted of a crime but has by his own actions allowed an illegal gambling enterprise to conduct business on one of his properties. This gambling business traveled across state lines and has violated the spirit of the laws of the USA.
The federal indictment won't go away. Vick is still innocent of the charges until he goes to court and is convicted but he has tarnished the "shield" of the NFL, assorted companies that Vick has represented and the fans of Atl.
All the lawyers in the world won't stop the indictment from continuing unless he pleads....if he pleads he is considered guilty by NFL standards. If he chooses to delay and fight the indictment and charges, which he has every right and responsibility to do, he will drag the NFL,apparel companies and ATL fans thru the mud for years possibly.
Arthur Blank will not continue to pay him nor will the NFL allow him to play while this is playing out. Let's watch and see how many low lives come to Vick's defense.
The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, .
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my guess is unless they have a ton of evidence without one of his "family" memebers rolling on him ... one did ...
Could they be that stupid? Vick is the goose that laid the golden egg for his family members... would one of them really roll on him? If anything they should have been drawing straws to see which one was going to jump in front of the bus for him....
yebat' Putin
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Well Ralphie,all I know is,that according to the article that was posted,they're giving strong consideration to "offering" Vick a paid leave untill the legal proceedings come to a conclusion.
The article also seemed to indicate that IF Vick REFUSED such an offer,they may consider other options.
It's just my opinion that IF he gets suspended without being found guilty,it may cause "the race card" ie...Sharpton,Jackson,the ACLU,etc.... to cause every bit as much of a scene and a distraction as they would have if they permited Vick to play. I can't garuntee that,but it would seem like a natural pregression based upon what I've seen in society as of late.
If keeping the press and bad publicity down for the overall good of the NFL is what both the Falcons and the NFL has as their ultimate goal,I think the "paid leave" option is the most viable one in this situation.
JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Yeah, Blank does seem to be a decent sort of guy... too bad for him really.
As for the League,,, if they took any action against Vick before the outcome of the trial, wouldn't they be leaving themselves wide open for a lawsuit from Vick?
I mean, heck, we live in a society where some people think it's ok to take legal action against someone or some company for making the coffee to hot (sorry, but that still cracks me up).
So wouldn't Vick have a case against the NFL? Not that I want him to win,, He's just too slimey for me.
#GMSTRONG
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If keeping the press and bad publicity down for the overall good of the NFL is what both the Falcons and the NFL has as their ultimate goal,I think the "paid leave" option is the most viable one in this situation.
I believe it's going to come down to pretty much what Vick wants to do... The NFL and the team can only offer these things, if Vick refuses to accept them then he will force their hand... which in its own right, would be interesting to watch....
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"...It's just my opinion that IF he gets suspended without being found guilty,it may cause "the race card" ie...Sharpton,Jackson,the ACLU,etc.... to cause every bit as much of a scene and a distraction as they woulÍ have if they permited Vick to play. I can't garuntee that,but it would seem like a natural pregression based upon what I've seen in society as of late."
Pit, I do understand your point of view and the Vick loyalists and the ACLU may untimately carry the day. What happens when the videos of the dog fights are spread across our TVs at night and dying,ripped apart carcasses of dogs including a few family pets are displayed on U Tube?
Let the race card players and race pimps justify the drugs,guns and rap plus occassional death after that hits the news.
If Rev. Al and Jesse Jackson are counting on the black NFL players joining in the demonstration against the Commissioner....good luck. I'll put my money on the ticket buyers and consumers of goods advertised on football games...they may not march in the street but money talks and B.S. walks!
The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, .
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If Rev. Al and Jesse Jackson are counting on the black NFL players joining in the demonstration against the Commissioner....good luck. I'll put my money on the ticket buyers and consumers of goods advertised on football games...they may not march in the street but money talks and B.S. walks!
It's a big assumption that these fellas would be upset. Sharpton helped draft a letter against what Vick is accused of. I think I'll take a wait and see attitude to see how it plays out.
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What happens when the videos of the dog fights are spread across our TVs at night and dying,ripped apart carcasses of dogs including a few family pets are displayed on U Tube?
The best I could hope for,is that people begin to understand that it's not the "breed" that's bad,but the people that do this to the breed. Maybe people will start to have a little compassion for Pit Bulls and consider their plight. Maybe,just maybe,something positive can come from it for the Pit Bull breed.
Ralphie,many people on this board,maybe you included,know that I own a Pit Bull. It's my third. Each was raided from a puppy and have been very loveable family pets. Fighting,inbreeding and teaching this breed to be vicious,has almost destroyed the breed.
Causing them to be outlawed in many communities and legislated in many states. Nothing hits home to me much more than this does. If anyone could harbor more hate and resentment over something like this than I do,I just don't know how.
It's very difficult for me to remain objective and NOT call for Vick's head on a platter to be honest with you. But I do believe everyone has a right to due process before being persicuted for a crime to the point of extreme.
And suspending him "without pay" could open up a whole can of worms that could be very ugly. I really don't want to see that happen to my favorite sport,the NFL.
I'll just leave it at that accept to say that this subject is very near and dear to my heart. And if he is convicted,I'll be the first to yell to high heaven for the strongest penalties allowed by law and the NFL.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Per ESPN NEWS...
GOOD...Suspend em' for the INDEFINITE FUTURE!!!!
Kudos to the Comissioners Front Office...
Vick ordered to avoid camp during investigation
Associated Press
Updated: July 23, 2007, 8:07 PM ET
NEW YORK -- Michael Vick was ordered by commissioner Roger Goodell on Monday to stay away from the Atlanta Falcons' training camp until the league reviews the dogfighting charges against him.
"While it is for the criminal justice system to determine your guilt or innocence, it is my responsibility as commissioner of the National Football League to determine whether your conduct, even if not criminal, nonetheless violated league policies, including the Personal Conduct Policy," Goodell said in a letter to the quarterback.
The NFL said Vick would still get his preseason pay and Goodell told the Falcons to withhold any disciplinary action of their own until the league's review was completed.
Go Browns!!!
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We gotta get this guy!!!!  
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Did Goodel Come Down With That Or Was It The Falcons GM?? I Thought I Heard On ESPN Earlier That Goodel was Making a Decision Today 
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You've gotten all of that out of a single statement ordering him not to report for camp? Are you related to Kreskin or Chris Angel?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Did Goodel Come Down With That Or Was It The Falcons GM??
I Thought I Heard On ESPN Earlier That Goodel was Making a Decision Today
It was Goodell
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Good. I hope they suspend his sorry ass.
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You've gotten all of that out of a single statement ordering him not to report for camp?
Are you related to Kreskin or Chris Angel?
Chrissy...lmao...
Don't give me this BS about "Innocent till Proven"...
Sorry man...NOT HERE...
This dude's a SLUG...And has been ever since he was at VT...And they can take his Little Bro with em'...
Go Browns!!!
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I'm really starting to like Goodell. 
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I'm really starting to like Goodell.
x2
I like cracking down on off the field idiots.
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i saw this coming when peta started to protest the NFL, when pack man got in trouble not to long ago i remember hearing punishment for anything that does not give the NFL a good reputation.
oioioioi
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LOL, such good news. Im in Va and close to Vt, so there are to many fans around him and alot of them are bummed. I ask them how the hell can they be upset over this POS.
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I'm really starting to like Goodell.
Gonna clean up the league...
And now maybe Atlanta can get a REAL NFL QB...
Where's Schaub nowadays???...lmmfao...
Shoulda SLAMMED this POS when the Airport Bottle Incident happenned...$$$ does more than just TALK...
THIS is the example that needs to be SET...He and Pacman...BOTH of em' can pick splinters while WATCHIN' on Sundays...
Go Browns!!!
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Is there any possibiltiy that the Falcons let Vick walk and draft Brian Brohm out of Louisville next year?
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You've gotten all of that out of a single statement ordering him not to report for camp?
Are you related to Kreskin or Chris Angel?
Chrissy...lmao...
Don't give me this BS about "Innocent till Proven"...
Sorry man...NOT HERE...
This dude's a SLUG...And has been ever since he was at VT...And they can take his Little Bro with em'...
If he's "offered a paid leave" untill the court case concludes and he accepts,what say you then?
Because the strongest indications are that's what they're looking at as of now. Will to then "throw a tissy"?
Because in case you missed it,in your blurb,they're "paying him for being at camp" even though he won't be there.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Not unless they tank their season or do an awful lot of trading.
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I would marry Roger if given the chance.
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Not unless they tank their season or do an awful lot of trading.
The year when Vick was injured the Falcons went 5-11. Their offense was built around him and I dont know how much of that Petrino actually changed. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
Last edited by lefty33; 07/23/07 08:39 PM.
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Petrino is a QB genius. He'll build around Harrington.
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He'll build around Harrington.
That's why the original prediction of them maybe having a shot at the Louisville QB has merit...lol. Harrington has failed 2x now, and I doubt Atlanta is any different.......dude can't read a D.
Although I wouldn't want my QB to be Vick (even before the Fido incident) he get's too much of the blame for them not being a high caliber team. The truth is they aren't that good.............and throw Harrington into that mix and they are down right awefull. A top 5 pick isn't out of the realm of possibilities for them at all imo.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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He'll build around Harrington.
That's why the original prediction of them maybe having a shot at the Louisville QB has merit...lol. Harrington has failed 2x now, and I doubt Atlanta is any different.......dude can't read a D.
Although I wouldn't want my QB to be Vick (even before the Fido incident) he get's too much of the blame for them not being a high caliber team. The truth is they aren't that good.............and throw Harrington into that mix and they are down right awefull. A top 5 pick isn't out of the realm of possibilities for them at all imo.
Harrington was not a fit for Mooch's WCO. Last year he did slightly in better in a more aggressive downfield attack that minimized his reads. The guy isn't a total hack, but Petrino has done work with guys of similar skill (Hunter Cantwell). Granted its NFL vs NCAA, but I love Petrino.
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Pit I understand your affection for this breed of dogs. I have known of pit bulls and rotties who were as gentle as one of my goofy labs, but I also know first hand of the sudden attack abilities of these dogs.
We can argue forever about the propensity of attacks from "always gentle" dogs who mysteriously attack other dogs,cats and some humans.
I lived in WV a few years back and suffered thru a horrible experience wherein a normal decent couple we knew owned 2 female pit bulls. They were gentle non aggressive dogs....until the day that the 2 of them attacked a 4 year old girl and she died from the wounds. Her crime....following her mother as she knocked on the door of our friends home. She was crying and as the door opened the dogs rushed her.
Yes, tragic...typical of the breed????...maybe more than we want to admit. Our friends were ruined financially and the little girl's family was equally destroyed. This occured in Huntington,WV. 3-5 years ago.
What does it mean??? These dogs were raised from 6 week pups and never were trained in aggression or defense....you tell me?
Shortly after the breed was outlawed in the town of Huntington,WV.
The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, .
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If he's "offered a paid leave" untill the court case concludes and he accepts,what say you then?
I'll tell you what I'd say.......he's admitting guilt if he does that! If he weren't guilty, he would call a press conference and announce that these charges are ludicrous and he wants to play football under his contract.
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Will to then "throw a tissy"?
What????
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Because in case you missed it,in your blurb,they're "paying him for being at camp" even though he won't be there.
Common practice when dealing with union employees while building a case to prevent them from filing a grievance and forcing your hand before you are fully prepared. It's a PR nightmare for the league regardless of which way they go, so they have NO CHOICE than to do it this way.
Big deal.....pay him his thousand bucks a week for camp.
His ass is in a sling and he knows it, or he would be shouting from the rooftops of the buildings in hotlanta.....he will take it and hope the cards play out in his favor, because he's a POS and he has no choice...
Sayonara dick vick.....
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You've gotten all of that out of a single statement ordering him not to report for camp?
Are you related to Kreskin or Chris Angel?
Chrissy...lmao...
Don't give me this BS about "Innocent till Proven"...
Sorry man...NOT HERE...
This dude's a SLUG...And has been ever since he was at VT...And they can take his Little Bro with em'...
If he's "offered a paid leave" untill the court case concludes and he accepts,what say you then?
Because the strongest indications are that's what they're looking at as of now. Will to then "throw a tissy"?
Because in case you missed it,in your blurb,they're "paying him for being at camp" even though he won't be there.
Atlanta brass was considering a 4 game suspension as it is...And deservedly so...
SOMETHING suspension wise was gonna happen...Yeah he's getting paid...SO WHAT...
This SLUG will be lucky if he ever takes another snap in this league...Get used to it...I don't even need to see a trial...HE'S GUILTY CHIEF...And U KNOW IT...
There's an age old saying...U can do whatever u want...As long as u don't get CAUGHT...Hell...At our age we combined have prolly gotten by the law way over 100 times...WAY over 100 times...We just haven't been CAUGHT...Vick HAS...And I'd bet the house they'd snag his Lil' Bro if they LOOKED...
Go Browns!!!
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Falcons Should Have Went After Jeff Garcia.
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Falcons Should Have Went After Jeff Garcia.
Petrino's offense has no similarities to any system Garcia would be good in.
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Found this on a falcons board 
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Well I agree about Petrino, but I don't think Harrington can look good in ANY system. We also disagree about last year. I watched him with the Fish 3 or 4 times, and it was pretty bad (except for the Lions game where he was average). His arm is plenty good enough, but he can not read a D, he seems slow to process info, and he doesn't have very good pocket awareness either. Petrino's system can't fix that bro NOBODY'S system can. He's the classic 1st round bust QB pick imo, becuase on paper he looks great.......but he simply can't grasp the mental side of the game. Dude the Fish where QB hungry, and dumped him for the Lemon guy.........that's all I need to know.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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Cleo Lemon is a pimp!
I think Harrington's issues are confidence related. The guy is quirky, and a lot like Couch, he was broken down confidence wise by the time he left Detroit. I think Harrington does things that people don't give him credit for...he has good footwork, a good release, strong arm. A lot like what Petrino did with Stefan Lefors, I expect him to scale back Harrington's reads. Basically give him two progressions, then likely a dumpoff to his safety valve, or throw it away.
Tedford's system only made the QB read half of the field, so I'd expect to try to emulate that. Then again, I have serious man love for Petrino, and Harrington likely is going to revert back to his near 20 picks a season days.
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The NFL said Vick would still get his preseason pay and Goodell told the Falcons to withhold any disciplinary action of their own until the league's review was completed.
The bottom line in all of this is that he will get paid all the way up to the beginning of the regular season. Not just "camp money" but all of his pay right up to the regular season.
Do I think he's guilty as hell? Of course I do. I've actually read the entire indictment.A link to it is posted in Tailgate. And from reading it,like everyone else (pretty much) I "think" he's guilty.
But the very same source you're quoting (ESPN) has stated that they're pretty much trying to "force Vicks hand" into taking a paid leave untill the case concludes. That the NFL,Blank,Gene Upshaw are all working together for a offer of a "paid leave" deal to Vick. The NFL doesn't want a major lawsuit and the pressure that will come from suspending him without a verdict of guilt. They don't look forward to a lawsuit,that may in the end,tie the commissioners hands later in diciplinary actions.
Plus,if Vick CAN somehow beat these charges "even on a technicality" and the league suspended him before hand? Can you imagine the legal mess that would represent for the NFL?
The one thing I'm not doing is "sticking up for Vick". I'm just fully aware of the legal ramifications that could occur if the NFL "jumps too soon". And I believe Goodel has enough sense to do that too. Let me tell you,I have a Pit Bull as a pet. I HATE people who fight them and mistreat them. Nobody hates that more than I do.
I'm just looking at the "big picture" here and it's a touchy situation for the league.
And Shep,say what you will. If Vick's "only choice" is paid leave,or suspension without pay and a court battle to collect your pay,the path of least resistance means very little.
But I think he's guilty as hell. To suggest otherwise is quite innacurate. But there's a whole lot more going on here than just a simple suspension. It's a lot more complicated than some are making it sound IMO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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The conviction rate on a federal indictment is roughly 96%. Vick is so boned it's not even funny.
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Petrino is a QB genius. He'll build around Harrington.
I genuinly respect your opinion, but this statement is flabergasting.
We are talking about Joey harrington....right?
Back to the topic,
Sweeeeeet, my girlfreind (huge animal lover and activist) might actually go to a Browns game now. She was boycotting anything NFL until thye suspended him.
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Falcons' Vick indicted by grand
jury in dogfighting probe
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