DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Would any other NFL team not fire a 1-19 coach ?

Good question Vers. They probably draft better players then us even though they pick later because they keep coaches and FO staff around longer then 2 years so they all know what they need and want and they draft them. In these next 2 weeks we should not subtract but ADD. MR. Haslam should bring all his coaches and FO people together have a meeting and tell them he is bringing in a football guy to overseer personnel decisions. He should set the chain of command and parameters and go with it. I also believe he should strongly recommend to Hue that he hire an OC. Hue can save face by saying it got to be too much to be a HC and an OC. There's no shame in it. It's not the time to fire but to hire. Firing anyone at this point would be counterproductive. The only ? I have is whom can we get? JMO

Also, Pittsburgh has had the same defense in place for 20 years. Once you have that type of continuity, drafting is much easier. The fact that Tomlin came in and didn't change it, helped them immensely.

Good post. I am not saying you are wrong, but I really don't believe bringing in an OC to call plays would help anything at all. In fact, I think play calling is one of Hue's strengths.

I know people don't want to hear this, but our talent at the skill positions sucks.

Butler has the same D as LeBeau? I get the 3-4 thing, but I thought there were some significant differences and that is why LeBeau was forced out????

I remember you saying that at the beginning of the season about our skill players. You said our wr's and db's are bad. It came to fruition, they are. If you read what I posted I said MR. Haslam should strongly recommend an OC not order. That would leave a little room. I don't think Hue is the problem. Lack of skill payers and experience is.

It might help, Homes. I'm not saying I am right. Just discussing.

I actually like talking football w/you because you tend to be very objective and fair-minded. I was just conversing. You could be right, no doubt about that.

Ah Noooo... Hue is the problem and nobody in existence could convince me otherwise!!!!

Our WR production will get better when we get a better QB, better WR's, they all get a few years experience in the same system, and our Route tree grows into more than four branches.

I don't know. Probably better. Hard to put a number on it. I do understand. It would't be .500. The wins would probably still be single digit.

Maybe we keep Hue, maybe we don't. I don't care either way. What I do care about is that something has to change.

I don't know that they always do, but I understand your point.

Probably because they have other players around who help them be better players. It's easy to take any one player out of the game from a defensive standpoint. OK...maybe not easy, but I think you understand my point on that one.

There are no good answers here. We could go one of 4 ways here. We can stand pat. We can dump the coach, we can dump the FO, or we can dump both the coach and FO.

I guess at this point it probably best to stand pat, or stand pat with some minor changes. I can understand if we blow it up again. The thing is that we don't know who made the calls to pass over a few QB's. I am sure Jimmy does, and that can't be sitting well with him right now. Maybe it was the FO. Maybe it was Hue. Maybe it was both.

I suspect if changes are made, we will know who made those calls.

Will the Qb run the routs for them. Will the QB win the release and make them somehow win against the CB's?

Maybe the QB will catch the ball also..

Our Wr's are bad, has nothing to do with QB play.

We certainly need to better production from our QB and our WRs. They are young, but I am not getting the feeling that we have any answers on those two units.

I think you bring up a good point when you mentioned the limited route tree. Recently, a lot of people were getting on Hue and wanting him to simplify the offense. Well, they got their wish.

Doing so might work for a quarter and maybe even a half, but teams can adjust to a limited offense during the course of the game and stifle the offense.

I agree 100 percent, and it's not limited because Hue is a bad coach. It's limited because of all the young players we have who do not know the system well enough yet.

Your right our WR's are bad. Now our QB's are also bad all on their own (Of course all three of them are young and inexperienced and still have a lot to learn)

You and Tony should get a room.

Okay.

Everything out of your mouth is about blaming the FO. Tony, on the other hand, blames Hue on almost every post he makes.

I'm sure it would be a wonderful conversation between you two if you were to speak privately.

Since when did one or two people become MANY? Watson is looking ten times better than Kizer, BUT get back with me in three years and lets see how they are doing. Watson may still be looking ten times better but we don't know yet.



Hue says that is not what he texted, but lets PRETEND that he did. Maybe the Browns were set to pick Watson at 12 and then Houston called and offered The 25th pick, AND the number one pick next year, and the Browns saw more value in that since they still have so many holes to fill on the roster. Hue could have been one of the ones who prefered to trade down. That is all nothing but speculation just like all of your posts have been on the front office.

I agree 100%, but I would consider this two independent problems. And honestly I think our Wr's are much worst than our Qb's

Of course Watson was going to look better in his first season than Kizer. Watson was the more polished quarterback while Kizer was getting benched on a very bad Notre Dame team. Kizer was drafted as a prospect. Hue was going to have to develop Kizer while Watson could just slide in and play... But was he the long term answer? eh, who knows. Houston needed a quarterback who could just slide in and play now. And if Houston had any semblance of a QB, they'd look good. Our team is still being built. Our team is about development for the long term. That is why we are making the decisions we are making.

On top of all the Watson complaining, remember Osweiler was there last year and didn't play well. And people wonder why we cut him....

Honestly, there are no excuses on passing on Deshaun, not the way he played on college and not the way he is playing.

He's just an amazing football player. The way he targeted Sherman, and Sherman's reaction on the end tells it all...

Amazing player

Look at this way.

Browns are 4-41. since Dec 2014

2-19 Dec 2014 - 2015 - Hue Regime starts.

2-22 Since

losing JT to injury. Rock Bottom.

All coaches need at least 3-4 years to build a consistent team. We all know that. Not sure if the Haslams know that though.

I'm pulling for Hue to get this turned around by the end of the season.

Bam, blunt nature and truthfully said.

Would be a great way to go after the bye, showing some corrections, less to no penalties, adjustments and some production... and especially on the offensive side of things. This would mean SO much going into the draft and the offseason of next year. It would literally be huge.

1-23

j/c:

I have no idea if Watson is the real deal or not. He's looked good thus far, but it's early.

I do think it's a false narrative to say that most people thought Watson was a step in and play qb. I think most experts believed that he would have to be brought along slowly. Most thought the same thing of Kizer.

Watson threw for over 400 yards yesterday. He is just a rookie. The front office passed on the guy for Peppers. Is that smart when our 1st need is QB.

The Watson camp thought he was the best player in college football... and he's proving us right.

Nobody has 2 great games against a Saban's D just by luck. Nobody faces the legion of Doom like DW did, just by luck or a good game.

The kid is special, the O chemistry with him is just amazing.

He's the prototypical franchise QB in the sense that he is the face of a franchise, like he has in Clemson.

We decided to pass on him twice... and that in my opinion exposes the fault of the model we are following. We cannot pass on "bona fide" talent like we do so often just to pile up bodies.

I was ok with drafting MG, I think he is one of those players we cannot pass,but I was not ok with the trade at 12

It appears we have become competent in consistency.

I still believe that Hue has a strong say in who we bring in at QB. And with Watson sitting right there, I don't know for sure that Hue wanted him.

Bro .... or are still on a-hole terms ... *L* ...

These guys can all talk til their blue in the face ... seriously ... they can talk til their blue in the face about HOW GREAT EVERYONE THOUGHT WATSON WAS GOING TO BE ...

One simple question ...

WHY DID HE LAST TIL THE 12th pick of the draft ... if he was such a NO-BRAINER SLAM DUNK why was he sitting there at 12 ... don’t the slam dunk no brainers usually go a wee bit higher than that? ...

And none of the pundits thought he lasted too long either ...

This is simply a case of ...

FRUSTRATION and HINDSIGHT BEING 20/20 ...

I think one of the concerns with him is they didn't feel he was a pocket passer. There were experts who thought he could go #1 and experts who thought he could come in play right away. I think the general consensus was that he could play but he would need some work learning to pass from the pocket.

He is playing well. Will it last? The concerns about him Houston took a chance on. I haven't seen him play that much but from what I have seen he's been mobile, often fleeing the pocket but keeping his eyes down field.

He's a winner and that's what most loved. Why we passed on him would be a good question for Hue and company...

I see what your saying, but there's even more that goes into it than that.

Wentz, from what I recall, was an even bigger ? than Watson was... and he went #2 in that draft. The kid that came out of NDSU and didn't even start there until his junior year. Similar type of situation with Trubisky.

It's a crap shoot, yes... but it's even more of a crapshoot then people even admit.

Sorry, forgot the J/C.

There is also a lot of concern about Watson's arm. Already, his passer rating plummets 15 points when playing outdoors compared to indoors. 6 TDs to 5 ints outdoors vs 13 TDs to 3 ints indoors.

Colin Cowherd once talked about the Alex Smith phenomenon. He fools everyone at the beginning of the year in great weather but he deteriorates come playoff time when the weather turns. Guys like Tom Brady, Ben Roethlisberger and Aaron Rodgers don't change - regardless of the fine weather at the beginning of the year or the frozen and windy wasteland come season's end. Alex Smith does. Smith doesn't have a bad deep arm, as we've seen the last few weeks, but it falls off.

This is especially true in Cleveland. It gets cold, wet and windy by the end of the season. A guy like Kizer has the arm to slice the wind, but there was, and remains, concern that Watson does not.

Watson looks good so far, he's made some gorgeous deep throws, but his throws do lack elite velocity and his deep passes require that little extra arc to get the distance. By the end of the season, the deterioration of conditions could be enough to knock the ball off the mark just that much to complicate things significantly.

That isn't the worst situation for a dome team, but for us, that can really sway a draft selection.

why did aaron rodgers fall in the draft?

Ian Rapoport is reporting Hue Jackson's job is safe, both now and, at this point, heading in to next season.

"I'm told at this point Hue Jackson is safe, even [if there was] an ugly loss [today]," Rapoport said. "... But firing Hue Jackson now, on the plane home, as we've seen in the past, would be against everything the Browns are trying to do. Changes are expected to come at the end of the season in some form or fashion. But at this point, they are not expected to involve Hue Jackson."

Wow, that's huge. I think Rapoport is a really reliable source, so it sounds like Hue isn't going anywhere.

Sorry, forgot the link;

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...e-browns-record