This, I don't get. Why does anyone have or want an "agenda" on an anonymous internet forum?
Just be like TONY and have your opinion, and yell it proudly.
ham..MY AGENDA...as a life-long fan of the Browns (50y+)...I hope to see my team win some games, hoping to see the Browns in the playoffs, competing for a Super Bowl and ultimately winning a Super Bowl.
THINGS I THINK I KNOW...
Football is not BASEBALL..I'm pretty sure of that!
Harvard is not the center of the football universe!
I'm not easily swayed or impressed with pedigrees that have little to do with football.
Analytics cannot tell evaluators what is in a player's heart. Analytics cannot measure a football player's desire. Prejudgement and psycological testing have little to do with accurately judging football (QB) talent.
I've seen enough from our front office to know that they are part of the problem when it comes to identifying and drafting a franchise QB.
I've seen how this Browns owner reacts when the losses mount and I'm here to say, blowing this thing up is not necessary. I'm especially concerned that our owners and management will find a scapegoat to lay this mess on and proclaim that they are not part of the problem.
Everyone is to blame.. all of them need to hold their hand and plead guilty for their part in this 1-23 mess.
Then, they need to do what is necessary to fix the mess!
My agenda?...It might be time for me to adjust my expectations..I'mhopeful the Browns can achieve an 8-8 season in the next 10 yrs.
Just a thought: The 49ers are as bad as the Browns at 0-8. Their FO decided to try to improve their football team and made a call to the Patriots. Or maybe they got lucky and the Patriots called them. Doesn't matter. The point is that they made a move to improve their team (in their opinion). The Browns, on the other hand, appear to have done nothing to improve their football team. That, or they feel that their football team is just fine for now and the answers lie in the 2018 draft.
Which FO looks like they know what they are doing? Which one doesn't?
Just another reason why no Browns fan can really be serious about this FO running another draft. JMO
After 55 years, I'm walking away from this dumpster fire. Good luck to everyone who continues to hang on. You'll need it.
We don't have the definitive account on that one. Conflicting "facts" abound...
Ok that's fine about TP but as I asked,IF THEY REALLY LEFT AT 5,is it asking to much for the person being paid millions to run the franchise and has control over the roster to actually be in the building with the trade deadline coming up ?
"Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts." - Winston Churchill
TP and his agent DR thought they could get ahold of someone in the browns FO to let them know he would accept their offer before he signed with the skins correct...how did that work out ?
TP might be available again, but the front office would need to be pro-active and willing to bring him back.
At what? The league minimum?
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
If I am the owner, and my FO is calling it Miller time at 5 PM right before the trade deadline, then I am firing the front office.
On the other hand, if I am the owner and my coaching staff is emailing a bunch of my dirty laundry to reporters, I am firing the coaching staff.
I hate to say it because it will probably set us back a couple of years, but depending on the truth of this it might be time to blow it all up again. We have signs that both sides are dysfunctional if this is true.
... actually be in the building with the trade deadline coming up ?
I'm certainly not trying to be argumentative, but what could they accomplish sitting in the building? I fully expect that they have the means electronically to be kept up to date and conduct business as necessary. We can only speculate about the "one hour"...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
Vers, I believe whether it ends up to be a choice between Sashi and Hue, it's either Hue or both.
I don't believe that any GM or head of player personnel, which ever title they tag on it, will come here saddled with someone elses HC. So IMO, if Sahsi goes, so goes Hue.
I believe Hue could be fired and Sashi could be kept, but if Sashi goes, so goes Hue. That's just usually how it works. The baby always gets tossed out with thw bath water in these situations.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Vers, I believe whether it ends up to be a choice between Sashi and Hue, it's either Hue or both.
I don't believe that any GM or head of player personnel, which ever title they tag on it, will come here saddled with someone elses HC. So IMO, if Sahsi goes, so goes Hue.
I believe Hue could be fired and Sashi could be kept, but if Sashi goes, so goes Hue. That's just usually how it works. The baby always gets tossed out with thw bath water in these situations.
Yup. That's usually how it works.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
If I am the owner, and my FO is calling it Miller time at 5 PM right before the trade deadline, then I am firing the front office.
On the other hand, if I am the owner and my coaching staff is emailing a bunch of my dirty laundry to reporters, I am firing the coaching staff.
I hate to say it because it will probably set us back a couple of years, but depending on the truth of this it might be time to blow it all up again. We have signs that both sides are dysfunctional if this is true.
The optics of this situations seems like coaching staff vs front office. Great!
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
If I am the owner, and my FO is calling it Miller time at 5 PM right before the trade deadline, then I am firing the front office.
On the other hand, if I am the owner and my coaching staff is emailing a bunch of my dirty laundry to reporters, I am firing the coaching staff.
I hate to say it because it will probably set us back a couple of years, but depending on the truth of this it might be time to blow it all up again. We have signs that both sides are dysfunctional if this is true.
All of those reports are from PAST browns executives with axes to grind against the team. Take them with a grain of salt.
Its also 2017, you can have an office and work anywhere in the world just as efficiently as in Berea. JMO.
If I am the owner, and my FO is calling it Miller time at 5 PM right before the trade deadline, then I am firing the front office.
On the other hand, if I am the owner and my coaching staff is emailing a bunch of my dirty laundry to reporters, I am firing the coaching staff.
I hate to say it because it will probably set us back a couple of years, but depending on the truth of this it might be time to blow it all up again. We have signs that both sides are dysfunctional if this is true.
The optics of this situations seems like coaching staff vs front office. Great!
I can only imagine the intense pressure that all these guys are under...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
Vers, I believe whether it ends up to be a choice between Sashi and Hue, it's either Hue or both.
I don't believe that any GM or head of player personnel, which ever title they tag on it, will come here saddled with someone elses HC. So IMO, if Sahsi goes, so goes Hue.
I believe Hue could be fired and Sashi could be kept, but if Sashi goes, so goes Hue. That's just usually how it works. The baby always gets tossed out with thw bath water in these situations.
Those are very good points and you are probably right.
I do think that we have to consider that this is a unique situation.
Hue is respected league-wide. He was the top candidate just a couple of years ago. There might be potential GMs willing to work w/Hue.
Do you think Sashi/Depo are respected in NFL circles? LOL.......we've all heard the comments about how whacked their plan was. What potential HC would want to come to work for this FO and owner?
Pit, it is almost hard to believe how one franchise can always be such a mess.
... actually be in the building with the trade deadline coming up ?
I'm certainly not trying to be argumentative, but what could they accomplish sitting in the building? I fully expect that they have the means electronically to be kept up to date and conduct business as necessary. We can only speculate about the "one hour"...
How about this: "hey, I've got a call on the other line, could you pick that up?" Or jotting notes to someone while you're on the phone, or just giving the appearance that you're all together?. You can't do everything remotely.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul. - John Muir
... actually be in the building with the trade deadline coming up ?
I'm certainly not trying to be argumentative, but what could they accomplish sitting in the building? I fully expect that they have the means electronically to be kept up to date and conduct business as necessary. We can only speculate about the "one hour"...
How about this: "hey, I've got a call on the other line, could you pick that up?" Or jotting notes to someone while you're on the phone, or just giving the appearance that you're all together?. You can't do everything remotely.
Can anybody identify whether or not any of the FO staff (Berry, Kovash, Grigson, Meers, Opara, Saganey, etc) were in the building after 5pm? We're speculating on scant information...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
... actually be in the building with the trade deadline coming up ?
I'm certainly not trying to be argumentative, but what could they accomplish sitting in the building? I fully expect that they have the means electronically to be kept up to date and conduct business as necessary. We can only speculate about the "one hour"...
How about this: "hey, I've got a call on the other line, could you pick that up?" Or jotting notes to someone while you're on the phone, or just giving the appearance that you're all together?. You can't do everything remotely.
Can anybody identify whether or not any of the FO staff (Berry, Kovash, Grigson, Meers, Opara, Saganey, etc) were in the building after 5pm? We're speculating on scant information...
This isn't the first time that the FO has been accused of not being on the job. Remember the reports of Pryor trying to contact the Browns about the 1-year contract and that he couldn't reach them. Of course, the Washington FO was available.
Then again, it is a bit much to ask for a Harvard lawyer to miss Happy Hour at the club.
The optics of this situations seems like coaching staff vs front office. Great!
I believe Hue knows exactly what is going on in Berea, behind the scenes.
The front office is covering their ass ready to dump the entire mess onto Hue and the coaching staff.
If Haslam can't show the leadership to step up with a plan to fix this fubar mess that HE CREATED, then he might as well sell the team.
It's a damn easy fix if some are willing to give a little. Now is when we find out what kind of men are running this franchise...backstabbers, concerned with maintaining their own powers...or men who care about building a winning franchise.
Now is when we find out what kind of men are running this franchise...backstabbers, concerned with maintaining their own powers...or men who care about building a winning franchise.
Vers, I believe whether it ends up to be a choice between Sashi and Hue, it's either Hue or both.
I don't believe that any GM or head of player personnel, which ever title they tag on it, will come here saddled with someone elses HC. So IMO, if Sahsi goes, so goes Hue.
I believe Hue could be fired and Sashi could be kept, but if Sashi goes, so goes Hue. That's just usually how it works. The baby always gets tossed out with thw bath water in these situations.
Those are very good points and you are probably right.
I do think that we have to consider that this is a unique situation.
Hue is respected league-wide. He was the top candidate just a couple of years ago. There might be potential GMs willing to work w/Hue.
Do you think Sashi/Depo are respected in NFL circles? LOL.......we've all heard the comments about how whacked their plan was. What potential HC would want to come to work for this FO and owner?
Pit, it is almost hard to believe how one franchise can always be such a mess.
Are they dysfunctional because they are innately dysfunctional? Or are they dysfunctional because we are losing? "Winning fixes everything."
If we blow things up, will it help us win? Or will we keep losing and have more dysfunction?
Despite appearances to the contrary, it's generally not a quick fix league. The team that wins free agency rarely wins the Super Bowl. A bad team that overpays in free agency generally gets worse and ends up where we are now with rosters filled with guys like Bowe and Britt.
We're going to have to fix things through the draft. To fix things through the draft, you have to stick to one plan. (It helps if it is a workable plan)
JG wasn't going to come in and magically fix things overnight. We would probably have been better, but how much? No JT, No WRs, underwhelming DBs. What happens if he gets hurt trying to work with that? No long-term contract, do you franchise a rehabbing QB with 6 quarters of tape?
We still need WRs who can catch and DBs who can cover and more importantly work together.
We knew Kizer was a project coming in, well, let's work with him. Hue get whispering.
Maybe blowing things up is the right way to go, but it will probably get worse before it gets better. And there is little guarantee that Haslam's next choice will work out any better, or that a better option will even make itself available. Giving this group a full three years could help improve future options.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
Hue is respected league-wide. He was the top candidate just a couple of years ago. There might be potential GMs willing to work w/Hue.
Do you think Sashi/Depo are respected in NFL circles? LOL.......we've all heard the comments about how whacked their plan was. What potential HC would want to come to work for this FO and owner?
Pit, it is almost hard to believe how one franchise can always be such a mess.
Hue won't have any trouble finding another job..the others may find work in baseball or doing some contract stuff for another franchise. But Sashi hasn't even shown the ability to complete tough negotiations..that in reality were not even that tough had he been a bit flexible.
For Haslam, who the hell is going to work for him if he flushes this mess down the crapper? Haslam might as sell the Browns if he can't make some adjustments.
If Jimmy fires Hue, I can't imagine anyone other than Jim ONiel or some other laughing joke with nothing to show for it coming and willingly accepting this job. This environment scares off anyone with some incline and some credibility.
It's getting to the point we won't even be able to get waterboys without overpaying them or something.
This is an environment filled with pathetic items. Pathetic front office. Pathetic staff. Pathetic players. If we sold pathetic, we'd all retire.
I posted this in another thread, but felt it warrants the attention.
The snowball has turned into an avalanche......
Benjamin Allbright was just on 92.3FM and stated all the coaches know they are going to be fired at the end of the season.
Allbright also said that later today he will be releasing the emails that were sent to him last night from members of the Browns coaching staff irate about the Garoppolo trade.
Jimmy is going force himself into a box .. Either move the Team to a new Market or sell !
What would moving solve? It would still be up to him and the wife to find the right people to fix the mess. Getting it fixed for us would be immensely more gratifying than for some other city.
Jimmy is going force himself into a box .. Either move the Team to a new Market or sell !
Why? He is still making money had over fist.
Anyway, its clear that Hue thinks he is out, so he is trying to scrub the 1-23 stench off himself. Which is understandable but he is responsible for part of it too.
Hue is clearly a respected OC, but he is a failed HC. Dick LeBeau 2.0.
And Sashi and others should be out right after them. Too laid back, on a 5 year timeline when it didnt take that long to build a team.
I know people desperately want continuity. And I know people think we will not get anyone. I would disagree with the second point.
The team has 2 first rounders, likely #1 overall and a pretty good front 7 and assets to build a team really fast. Someone will jump at the chance.
It would still be up to him and the wife to find the right people to fix the mess. Getting it fixed for us would be immensely more gratifying than for some other city.
And therein lies the problem. The Haslam's are incapable and FAR from qualified to hire people to run their organization. It's their money but they should be honest with themselves and know that they are in over their heads regarding the hiring process. The one ability a successful leader MUST have is to understand what he/she doesn't know and find people that do know. The Haslam's have FAILED MISERABLY in this regard and that is THE reason why the Cleveland Browns continue to suck.
After 55 years, I'm walking away from this dumpster fire. Good luck to everyone who continues to hang on. You'll need it.
Jimmy is going force himself into a box .. Either move the Team to a new Market or sell !
Why? He is still making money had over fist.
Anyway, its clear that Hue thinks he is out, so he is trying to scrub the 1-23 stench off himself. Which is understandable but he is responsible for part of it too.
Hue is clearly a respected OC, but he is a failed HC. Dick LeBeau 2.0.
And Sashi and others should be out right after them. Too laid back, on a 5 year timeline when it didnt take that long to build a team.
I know people desperately want continuity. And I know people think we will not get anyone. I would disagree with the second point.
The team has 2 first rounders, likely #1 overall and a pretty good front 7 and assets to build a team really fast. Someone will jump at the chance.
I think the team is not as bad as Hue makes them look. Once he is gone we can begin building a winner. We need a scrappy no bullsh## coach. Sash and Depo need to disappear! We have a great opportunity in the draft to take a big step forward. I have confidence that this organization will get it right. Can't wait to dump this regime! Go Browns!!!
Exciting football will be back in Cleveland this fall!
The team has 2 first rounders, likely #1 overall and a pretty good front 7 and assets to build a team really fast. Someone will jump at the chance.
I'm sure someone would take the job,but the real question is,will whoever that someone is be the right person to turn it around ?
Going by JH track record so far it doesn't seem promising .
How hard can it be to find a smart young no bullsh#t coach like the Rams and Bills then ROCK AND ROLL!!!!!! Pay me 20k and with dedicated allout research, I'll find you one in one month. No brag, just fact!!! Top shelf!
Exciting football will be back in Cleveland this fall!
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