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Yes,I'm guilty of not trusting politicians. It's served me pretty well.
In what ways has this method served you well?
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Served me well?
1. Humans are humans. By not having "more faith or belief" in one person than another (without knowing them quite well) I have not set myself up to false hopes in anyone.
2. Respect and trust are "earned" not given. To respect or trust someone based on their "title or position" has proven to be very foolhearted in many cases.
3. To just "blindly believe" that politicians are sincere in "standing behind their principals" has proven to be false often times on the part of both parties. So I have prevented myself from falling prey to that.
4. Some back a party or politician SO strongly,that they find themselves backed into a corner of trying to make excuses and rationalisations for every move they make. They let their "heart dictate their minds" based on emotions. I have no such alligence by understanding that.
It makes it much easier to weigh an individuals performance and deeds when your emotion and political affiliation is "not to" give any of them "the benifit of the doubt" untill they earn it.
Just like the kid in this story. The fact is,I agree with that counselmans sentiments 100%! I pretty much agree with every word he said! But the fact remains that it's nothing but "raw emotion" not based on a conviction. Feeling that way is fine. Stating it as "his personal belief" is fine.
But once you use it in your "official capacity on government letterhead" it's not fine IMO To publicise and revel in the fact that you attack people "before thy have recieved due process" is not supporting the very procedures that our government stands for in the judicial process.
That's the only place we really disagree here IMO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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You typed a lot of words but said nothing to answer the question.
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Hey Pit, Do you mind if we drop off some good people in your neighborhood who are awaiting trial on murder, rape, and arson? All three have lengthy priors, but, you wouldn't mind giving them shelter for a couple of weeks would you? 
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Yes,that's how it"s "seved me well".
You may not understand my answers,but they're there.
Maybe it's the term "serving me well" where the confusion is.
I feel anything one does to "skew their opinion" based on political affiliation or "belief" in individual politicians without knowing them on a personal basis often times does "not serve them well".
You can take that for what it's worth to you,but the ways I think I've benifited by avoiding that were spelled out pretty well.
JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
You may not understand my answers,but they're there.
Maybe it's the term "serving me well" where the confusion is.
I think so too.....you made a blanket statement that "not trusting politicians has served you well."
Okie doke.
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Hey Pit,
Do you mind if we drop off some good people in your neighborhood who are awaiting trial on murder, rape, and arson? All three have lengthy priors, but, you wouldn't mind giving them shelter for a couple of weeks would you?
Appearantly you don't actually read and follow a thread very well. Not surprised....................
Here some quotes that you conveniantly "overlooked" because you'd rather start trouble than actually "contribute to the debate" that can answer your questions. Maybe you should READ the thread first?
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The fact is,I agree with that counselmans sentiments 100%! I pretty much agree with every word he said! But the fact remains that it's nothing but "raw emotion" not based on a conviction. Feeling that way is fine. Stating it as "his personal belief" is fine.
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Caring about your community is a fine thing. Having pride in your community is a fine thing. Wanting thugs out of your community is wonderfull.
Now,you do the math.
Try reading first and talking second. Often times you'll find the answer to your own questions before you bother asking them.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Good to see Pit is wanting to debate and not doing the personal insults and attacks.
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Good to see Pit is wanting to debate and not doing the personal insults and attacks.
I'm sorry, did he insult and attack someone, or is he simply defending himself from being tag-teamed....again.
Do you have something substantial to contribute to this discussion Coach, or just taking a shot at Pit...again....
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Finally!
Been a while since we have disagreed on something.
I like what Councilman Polensek did. IMO not only was it worded well but was probably educational for the thug. He is probably the 1st person to spell it out in plain English for him, you want to be a punk drug dealing thug, your life will more than likely take one of two turns, jail or death.
As usual, someone doing wrong, pulling the race card and getting with the BIGGEST racist in the world, Rev Al Sharpton. Speaking of Mr. Sharpton, and your earlier reference of the Duke lacrosse team... I don't believe I have yet heard an apology spoken from his lips over his comments about that.
[b]USNavyDawg (Ret.) ![[Linked Image from i87.photobucket.com]](http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k155/brownsfan4173/NFL-Football.jpg)
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Post deleted by 123yathatsme
oioioioi
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Whether it gets deleted or not, it's offensive, but not that you really care.
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Not that I have to answer to you, but Pit has accused MANY posters on here of attacking people. Merth CLEARLY was joking, hence the smiley. Pit insults him and throws personal attacks at him in response. Pit has claimed in many posts that all he ever wants to do is debate the issues in a civil matter, yet he is always the first to throw out the insults. If you don't like me calling him on it, here's a hint, don't read it. Last time I checked, you aren't a ref and you aren't my father. Until you produce some sort of documentation of either, I'll post as a I please. Ironic, isn't it, that you don't add anything with your post, but don't mind trying to put your 2 cents in. Hypocrisy is still a tool you love to employ, eh?
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Whether it gets deleted or not, it's offensive, but not that you really care.
Offensive? No, sometimes the truth just hurts.
[b]USNavyDawg (Ret.)
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Not that I have to answer to you, but Pit has accused MANY posters on here of attacking people. Merth CLEARLY was joking, hence the smiley. Pit insults him and throws personal attacks at him in response. Pit has claimed in many posts that all he ever wants to do is debate the issues in a civil matter, yet he is always the first to throw out the insults. If you don't like me calling him on it, here's a hint, don't read it. Last time I checked, you aren't a ref and you aren't my father. Until you produce some sort of documentation of either, I'll post as a I please. Ironic, isn't it, that you don't add anything with your post, but don't mind trying to put your 2 cents in. Hypocrisy is still a tool you love to empoy, eh?
HA! Touchy touchy today huh?!?!
I posted my opinion earlier in the thread. So yes I actually contributed to this discussion. I wasn't Johnny Comelately, taking potshots at people...a tactic you love to "empoy"
Secondly, maybe Merth was joking, obviously Pit didn't see the humor in dropping murderers off at his doorstep.
Last time I checked, Pit didn't have to answer to you...so...what goes around, comes around...I still fail to see any insults or attacks...but we obviously look at things through different eyes. Nothing new there.
I'll leave you alone though, you seem to be in a bad mood or something.
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Whether it gets deleted or not, it's offensive, but not that you really care.
Offensive? No, sometimes the truth just hurts.
There's nothing truthful about it
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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No, I just find your hypocrisy quite sad. Youmake a post for the sole purpose of calling me out...and it is criticizing me for calling someone else out. I guess it's ok for YOU to do, but not for me to do. No, Pit doesn't answer to me with his posts....but I will point out when he has claimed that he is innocent of these actions and blamed them on others that he disagreed with and lied about.
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No, I just find your hypocrisy quite sad. Youmake a post for the sole purpose of calling me out...and it is criticizing me for calling someone else out. I guess it's ok for YOU to do, but not for me to do.
Acutally, no it's not, because all it does is lead to stupid, petty arguments. So you should try another way to "call" someone out. Or better yet, what do you think about the subject at hand, how about you discuss that.
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No, Pit doesn't answer to me with his posts....but I will point out when he has claimed that he is innocent of these actions and blamed them on others that he disagreed with and lied about.
I've seen Pit admit to the very things you claim he says he's innocent of. So, again, this is pointless, just like your post to him, just like my post to you....where does it really help anything...it doesn't!
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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I like what Councilman Polensek did. IMO not only was it worded well but was probably educational for the thug. He is probably the 1st person to spell it out in plain English for him, you want to be a punk drug dealing thug, your life will more than likely take one of two turns, jail or death.
Actually,I agree with the sentiment of his message. Had he sent it "to the kid only" wouldn't it have gotten the same message to the kid without making it a "public insult"? I find it hard to believe a kid will gain anything but more hatred,resentment and rebelion when you hold him up to public ridicule in such a way. By sending this out to the Plain Dealer,do you really think this message was guided toward "the kid"?
Secondly,aren't politicians supposed to respect the law and the judicial system? I would really "hope" that they would to REALLY "set an example" for the youth in the community. To send a letter like this "pre-judging someone" before the case has concluded a verdict of innocense or guilt,may easily lead one to believe that this man is playing judge,jury and executioner. At least that's how it reads. And it was done in "an official capacity". From his office,with government letterhead from a counselman.
You see Navy,it wasn't a letter sent only to this kid. If that was his intent,why forward it to all the others including the press?
It wasn't sent from the counselman as "a private citizen" but in his "official capacity".
He has this kid found guilty already and said as much in his letter that was distributed to the press.
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As usual, someone doing wrong, pulling the race card and getting with the BIGGEST racist in the world, Rev Al Sharpton. Speaking of Mr. Sharpton, and your earlier reference of the Duke lacrosse team... I don't believe I have yet heard an apology spoken from his lips over his comments about that.
I agree with your above quote to a great degree. Remember how outraged you were when Sharpton had those boys pretty much convicted by his public comments? How can you condemn one,yet condone the other? IMO,what this counselman has done is very "Sharptonlike" in regards to Sharptons comments in the Duke rape case. The difference is,I think they were both wrong in their comments.
While you seem to feel one is somehow better than the other. I don't really understand that line of thinking.
JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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As I said before, I don't care if you like it or not. Pit accused several posters of making things personal and for insulting him and he always debates in a civil manner. I can pull the actual quotes up if you want. Pit always has had a habit of doing it, but then playing the martyr. Regardless, as I said, I don't care if you like it or not. You're not a ref and I broke no rules. It's still hypocritical for you to criticize someone for doing something and then do the same exact thing. Whatever. Have the last word as you always must, but don't expect me to heed your advice on posting....that'd be like taking advice on how to block from Kevin Schaffer. 
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As I said before, I don't care if you like it or not. Pit accused several posters of making things personal and for insulting him and he always debates in a civil manner. I can pull the actual quotes up if you want. Pit always has had a habit of doing it, but then playing the martyr. Regardless, as I said, I don't care if you like it or not. You're not a ref and I broke no rules. It's still hypocritical for you to criticize someone for doing something and then do the same exact thing. Whatever. Have the last word as you always must, but don't expect me to heed your advice on posting....that'd be like taking advice on how to block from Kevin Schaffer.
You're right Coach, you're the best. I'm a hypocrite. Your posts are so full of information and enlightenment. I learn so much from them. I submit to your superiority.
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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I agree with your above quote to a great degree. Remember how outraged you were when Sharpton had those boys pretty much convicted by his public comments? How can you condemn one,yet condone the other? IMO,what this counselman has done is very "Sharptonlike" in regards to Sharptons comments in the Duke rape case. The difference is,I think they were both wrong in their comments.
While you seem to feel one is somehow better than the other. I don't really understand that line of thinking.
Great point!
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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As I said before, I don't care if you like it or not. Pit accused several posters of making things personal and for insulting him and he always debates in a civil manner. I can pull the actual quotes up if you want. Pit always has had a habit of doing it, but then playing the martyr. Regardless, as I said, I don't care if you like it or not. You're not a ref and I broke no rules. It's still hypocritical for you to criticize someone for doing something and then do the same exact thing. Whatever. Have the last word as you always must, but don't expect me to heed your advice on posting....that'd be like taking advice on how to block from Kevin Schaffer.
You're right Coach, you're the best. I'm a hypocrite. Your posts are so full of information and enlightenment. I learn so much from them. I submit to your superiority.
See, that wasn't so hard now was it? 
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It took every bone in my body to keep from puking all over my keyboard....my hands have broken out in hives from typing it.
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Why is it necessary to post this?
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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You're right Coach, you're the best. I'm a hypocrite. Your posts are so full of information and enlightenment. I learn so much from them. I submit to your superiority.
That's probably the only way to shut him up!
He's just trashing yet another pretty civil debate. Nothing new here. Yes,I told someone they should actually "read a thread before they post". I actually told them that if they did that they may "have the answers to the questions they're asking before they even ask them".
Yep,that's a HUGE personal attack.
That's as much as I'll comment on this because it adds nothing to the issues of the thread. Adds nothing to the debate. Only further helps "aid Coach" in his ongoing habit of trashing threads while having nothing rational to add to the actual topic of the debate...................................
Carry on Coach.......................
I have all of the faith in the world that you will. Some things you can pretty much make book on with a relative level of certainty. And that's one of them.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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You're right Coach, you're the best. I'm a hypocrite. Your posts are so full of information and enlightenment. I learn so much from them. I submit to your superiority.
That's probably the only way to shut him up!
I realize that now
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He's just trashing yet another pretty civil debate. Nothing new here. Yes,I told someone they should actually "read a thread before they post". I actually told them that if they did that they may "have the answers to the questions they're asking before they even ask them".
Yep,that's a HUGE personal attack.
That's as much as I'll comment on this because it adds nothing to the issues of the thread. Adds nothing to the debate. Only further helps "aid Coach" in his ongoing habit of trashing threads while having nothing rational to add to the actual topic of the debate...................................
Carry on Coach.......................
I have all of the fith in the world that you will. Some things you can pretty much make book on with a relative level of certainty. And that's one of them.
Couldn't have said it better myself...well I could've but it would've included a great deal of profanity!
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Actually,I agree with the sentiment of his message. Had he sent it "to the kid only" wouldn't it have gotten the same message to the kid without making it a "public insult"? I find it hard to believe a kid will gain anything but more hatred,resentment and rebelion when you hold him up to public ridicule in such a way. By sending this out to the Plain Dealer,do you really think this message was guided toward "the kid"?
Polensek has been sending these letters out for years. He sends them to the thugs. The thugs/ childs momma is the one who took it to the Plain Dealer not the councilman.Maybe his momma should gently explain to the obviously sensitive young man if he quit commiting crimes perhaps the mean letters would stop.
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If you follow the link to the original letter, you'll see that the councilman copied the PD on the letter himself.
![[Linked Image from i75.photobucket.com]](http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i302/lrhinkle/d5eaf0b9-e429-4211-b53f-b843bfcf6aa9_zps2ac17420.jpg) #gmstrong
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That's what I get for believing a politician.  I saw him on channel 8 say he did not send the letter to the PD so either the letter is incorrect or Mr Polensek is fibbing. Or maybe I was hearing stuff again. Anyway, I think they said they were going to replay the interview at eleven so I'll see if I can stay awake long enough to find out.
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In Case your confused or take a "news network" at face value,here's the e-mail and the people it was forwarded to. It wasn't a simple matter of "sending a kid a message". Even though I know "FOX is God". Or at least his spokesman to us lowly earthly beings..................... http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2007/0719071cleveland1.html?link=rssfeed
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Well, it looks like we gonna find out.
SaintDawg™
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It isn't a news network. It was the local affilite's local news cast.
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q/r
You know I think we are missing something here...People are complaining about the inappropriate use of language in this letter...But isn't the language part of the point...I mean if Polensek had written a totally PC letter...it would have had zero effect. None whatsoever. Heck it would have probably elicited the same response Polensek got when Arsenio refused to shake his hand....The language in this letter conveyed more in message than any PC written letter ever could. It treated this kid in the same manner that the kid has treated others(according to Polensek's story and his prior record).
I saw absolutely NOTHING racist nor threatening in this letter. Appropriateness is of course a subjective term. I would not expect to hear or read this type of language from someone in his position. But I can't bring myself to completely condemn him for it either...
the only real issue I see here is what did Polensek hope to accomplish with this letter??? What purpose does it serve??? The fact he sent it to many people including the media makes me thing that he wanted this publicly known. If he had just sent this to the kid, I can see the letter as only serving his purposes of releasing the anger he has for illegal and thuggery type behavior. But he didn't just send it to the kid. He sent it basically to EVERYONE....And frankly I don't see this as politically motivated...As in, he did this in order to get re-elected....In fact it may cost him the next one. So it really confuses me.....What did he expect to accomplish????
It also bugs me to see the comments, especially the salutation used out of context. The papers and others try to make it sound like a threat...when in the context of the letter it is clearly a reference to the earlier part. Where he states the kid's current lifestyle will only end up in 2 ways. So in essence he is making a plea to the kid to make a decision....whatever he decides....he will no longer be a burden on the community...If he chooses to clean up his act...he will no longer be a burden...if he goes to prison...he will no longer be a burden...if he dies....he will no longer be a burden.....
I don't know if I support what Polensek did or not...I understand the feelings and sentiments....but don't understand the execution and goals for the purposeful public knowledge of this letter...
I thought I was wrong once....but I was mistaken...
What's the use of wearing your lucky rocketship underpants if nobody wants to see them????
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Why is it necessary to post this?
Biting satire....this is a personal attack upon the Rev. Jesse. Rev. Jackson has been active in self promoting and community promotion for 30 years now and he has found the magic wand of enrichment for himself and a few lucky coattailers.
The article stated, "Winston's mother, Tonya Lewis, said she plans to speak to her attorney, former City Council President George Forbes, about filing a lawsuit against Polensek. She said she also has written a letter to black activist the Rev. Al Sharpton.
Lewis said she views Polensek's letter as a death threat against her son because the councilman said "he didn't care which one came first, that he went to jail or the cemetery."
She also complained that the letter referred to Winston as "dumber than mud," which she considers a racist remark because mud is black and dirty"
The racial aspect is introduced by MRS. Winston and not the councilman. That is why good satire must contain an element of truth to point out the obvious.
The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, .
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It isn't a news network. It was the local affilite's local news cast.
Okay P,if it makes you "feel better"..............................
You can't take everything you see on the news as factual no matter the channel or the network.
Is that "fair and balanced" enough for you?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465 |
Way to CC the PD...attention seeking jackass.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,831
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,831 |
From a previously posted article: Quote:
Arsenio is a troubled youth. He was arrested last year after assaulting a police officer. The charge was dropped.
Two weeks ago, he was charged with dealing drugs in front of a convenience store. Like so many young, black men, he seems intent on fashioning a steel cage future.
Are you kidding me? It's not his fault he deals drugs and gets arrested. It's because he's from a tough neighborhood. That's why he tells a politician who wants to clean up the town to kiss his ass. Poor guy, someone needs to get him some help but don't hold him accountable..it might hinder his spirit. 
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum This makes me sick.
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