DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns tried to trade for Terrelle Pryor

The plan was to be bad. Do you think they are starting all these young players to try and be good?

There's a difference in a bad team and an 0-9 team. No, I don't think they "planned" to be winless. But I've heard that excuse before.

Circular logic, lousy plan because of the end game IMO. If you have a lot of picks, you get to pick a bunch. Admit to some of these being misses (even if many misses is closer to accurate and honest). If you are lousy after the fact, bingo ! You get a lot of picks. This cycle should be sustainable.

Our whole process seems to be all and only about "More picks." As if that is an end unto itself and its own goal and reward. How about better talent, fewer picks, more wins? We went too deep and purged veterans that could have us winning some IMO. Hard to take; harder to believe. The bet must be that all picks potentially will outplay the veteran they replace. I point out the real ceiling as far as how much better new blood can get. An upside limit in some at least who will not be there quickly if at all.

I believe we we have over-valued the premium we have placed in "Many, Many Picks." And we have misjudged our ability to judge real football talent and secure best value for those picks, or traded it to those who did. Piling up picks is good. But it is not an end itself.

Change the thinking before the next draft and get a few vets.

I don't think they planned to be winless, but they definitely planned to be bad. The 0-9 thing is bad, but it's also pretty random. There are a few games we should have won (the Jet games immediately comes to mind). If we are 2-7 instead of 0-9 the conversation might be different, but it really isn't in the larger context.

You just have to hope there is a next step in the plan after building the talent base back up through the draft. We don't know because we are still in the "be bad" part of the plan.

I don't know who is going to be around next off-season, but if the current front office is still in place, my guess is that we sign a few more free agents (like we did with Zeitler, Tretter, Britt, etc) and trade some picks for veteran players.

I don't know about anything being random or in context. The way I see it some teams just find ways to lose. We are one of those teams. That's why I don't see it as random as you do and that's the context I believe it falls under.

Got it. We just differ on how we view some of the things that occur in football. While I think some teams find a way to lose (like trying to a QB with no timeouts from the three yards line with 15 second left in the half), I also think some of the things that caused the team to lose can be random (a dropped interception, a fumble not recovered, a missed tackle, etc.). I also believe young players are more likely to make mistakes that lead to losing and we are playing a ton of young guys.

In the end, I am sticking to my point that the team planned to be bad and there is not much difference between 0-9 and 2-7. I would hope I would view the team the same in either situation.

Everything you two have said in this quote is considered by dozens of expert professionals whose job is to set NFL point spreads.

But somehow the Browns seem to be "beating the odds".

Although not their opponent.

It's hard for me to rap my head around " Getting Better " ! I gave the FO a pass on their first Draft but not real sold on their the last ??? Garrett was a no brainier , but what was their intent when Drafting Peppers , and just what has he brought to the table ?? Nojoku in the first was a reach for a developmental GUYand shows on the field. mAYBE THEY ARE USING HIM WRONG ?? I wouldn't have drafted Kiser , so I guess I shouldn't comment on him ..

Hue can only work with what he has .. For the record , not now , nor have I been a big fan .. Guess I wouldn't mind him sticking around another season as long as we have a true OC ..

Have to admit that I am curious as all get out to see what Haslam ( Diam's Thief ) does at the end of this disastrous Season ..

Whole lot of bellyaching over nothing. It's only year two of a complete rebuild. That is not enough time to evaluate fairly what they are doing. We already knew before this season even started that we would have a lousy record. Haslem even came out before the season started trying to lower people's expectations towards winning.

Hue doesn't have too much on his plate. That reasoning is just silly. Hue only has to worry about the offense. He has one of the best DC in the game assisting him and I promise you that Hue trust his DC enough to just let him do his thing. If Hue doesn't feel he needs a OC then so be it. I imagine after he gets his system in place better that he will train one up to run the offense the way he likes it.

Kiser will get better or he won't. He is just a guy we took a low risk chance on because he fell into our laps. I mean he was a solid draft pick for where we took him. I like where we took him at. TO ME, it looks like Hue has him improving so I am cool with it.

Keeping in mind that our Front office were rookies last season I think it's reasonable that they made some mistakes due to inexperience. Did they learn from those mistakes though? I think they did. I see them making progress and improvements in the way they do things. This is only their second year so we are still seeing a lot of mistakes but they will learn from them and get better over time.

This team sure has been frustrating at times. Still, we are not even 2 years into this yet. It's way too soon to give them the ax. The end of year three will be the first year of evaluation that you can fairly make IMHO. Just be patient this year even if we are the team with the worst record.

For Christ sake we've only lost 23 games out of the last 24, give em a break.

How dare you insert common sense into this subject. Don'y you know we are all doomed to hell forever ( even if we don't believe) Imean no matter what happens we are all going to die extremely horrid, wretched, and excruciating deaths just because one person says so.

Well its been 20 years bro .... there’s reason to believe ...

I’ve thought we hit rock bottom like 10 times .. then w2e do something dumber than the last time ... it seems to be a pattern ...

I think were close and have a real good shot of a bright future for the first time EVER ... but i can’t blame others for being skeptic ...

I have no problem with someone being skeptical. I have a problem with somebody being a whinny little female dog. Big difference

I expect that type of post from some of out posters, but not you, bro. You're better than that.

Diam above:





But this time......!!!

The Browns have been so bad for so long we have become used to losing.

Teams with bright futures don't start a season 0-9.

Unless of course - and here's the sad part - 3-6 is bright.

Sorry not in a good mood tonight, and am frustrated with Gibson's comments as he was treated very well while he was here, now he wants to grab a knife and stab the people responsible for helping him make millions. Ungrateful little SOB.

Sorry gm ... he had 3 COMPLETELY new regimes in 4 years and was headed for a 4th completely new regime in 5 years if he stood ...

The overall record while he was here 19 - 45 ... i’ll Say that again .... 19 - 45 ..

He never finished with even a 500 record in any year ... 7 wins was the HIGH POINT in year 3 ... and we followed that up with a 3 win debacle his last year ...

Thats a CLUSTER F ... not being treated well at all ...

If your in a bad mood and u choose to respond to me ... do us both a favor nd wait til tomorrow ... i don’t wanna call u a whiny little beatch but will if u force me too ... *LOL* ...

Have a good night bud ....

Gee I wish somebody would treat me so bad that I could make enough money to retire in my mid 30's and never have to worry about money again for the rest of my life. Oh the horror.

Just call me Lassie

I agree with Vers. It's not really paranoia if they are all out to get ya.

Are the Haslam's not getting a return on their investment? Come on, bro...........this isn't charity work. It's a business. The Browns have done a lot of players dirty. I would include Gipson in that group. He owes them absolutely nothing.

Based off that comment ... U LOVE LOSING ....

Grow up!!!!!!

Don't forget it's also based on your research of talking to players' lawyers, agents, or at a minimum the secretaries for those lawyers and agents. This is an important part of your journey as a lead investigator into what ails the Browns.

not to mention:


Apparently, we need more unqualified people making football decisions, not less, because Britt is outplaying Pryor with a much worse rotation of bad QB's doing the throwing for us.

It's always The Silver Lining with Purp. That insight really says a bunch about how bad Pryor has been.

I don't even think Pryor has been bad. I think he joined a team that was comfortable with the pieces and chemistry they had in place. Washington wasn't really interested in Pryor until they knew he only wanted a prove it deal. Mac says insurance, and I'm inclined to agree.

In hindsight, I think both camps regret their decision. Done all over again, I think Pryor would have signed his extension and the Browns would have done a little more to ensure it would happen.

I put the blame on Pryor, however. At least the Browns took a chance on a bunch of developing rookies and a productive veteran; It hasn't worked out great, but on paper it wasn't an awful decision. Pryor, however, I'm not sure how he didn't see this coming.

Those people aren't even here anymore.

Another way to look at it ...

Britt is making 17 mill GAURANTEED ... i believe all of it is this year ..

Pryors total cost for they year is going to be 6 mill as he isn’t going to hit any incentives ...

Is Britt outplaying him by 11 mill this year???? ...



PS. Its a BS argument anyhow .... u have no clue what TP would be doing here ... NONE .,,,

Its an IRRELIVENT COMPARISION ... and is blown to hell when u look at what there making this year ...

Comftorable with the pieces and chemistry they had with the people they had in place ....

Dude ..

Their two WR’s last year Garçon and Jackson left via FA ...

Crowder their slot guy from last year was moved outside before he got hurt .. hes missed more game then he’s played I believe ...

Jordan Reed their stud TE has missed more games than he’s played i believe and when he has played he’s been hurt ...

Dotson played very little if at all last year due to injuries ... hes not really done diddly ...

TP has simply STUNK ... DROPS .. DROPS and then MORE DROPS ... plus hes been playing through an injury ...

TP had PLENTY OF OPPORTUNITY to shine .. hes just literally DROPPED IT!!!

Saying the skins were/are comfie with the pieces and chemistry with the pieces they had in place couldn’t be FURTHER FROM THE TRUTH .... especially when u factor in the injuries too their two holdovers from last year ...

They LOST BOTH of their STARTING WIDE OUTS from last year ...

I would be interested to see the number of targets Pryor has received, especially in the last 3 or 4 games. I watch parts of their games and I have only saw Cousins target Pryor once in the last 3 weeks and that pass sailed 5 yards over his head on the sideline.

That would be a telling number.

If he is that far off, can we be sure he was targeted? LOLetc.

Ummm, was Pryor in the game at the time? Just wonder how far he has fallen to be benched. Or has he been?

He doesn't get targeted because he is an iffy route runner.

Terrelle Pryor not targeted in loss to Vikings

http://www.cleveland.com/osu/2017/11/terrelle_pryor_not_targeted_in.html

Redskins' Terrelle Pryor was never targeted in loss to Vikings

It seems like a long time ago that Terrelle Pryor was considered a prize signing for the Washington Redskins.

But for the second time in three games, the former Buckeye and Brown was held without a catch.

In fact, in Sunday’s 38-30 loss to the Vikings, Pryor did not even have a target.

2 reasons the Redskins probably didn't want to trade Terrelle Pryor

http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/reds...-terrelle-pryor

A report from Cleveland.com showed that the Browns wanted to move for Terrelle Pryor Sr. before the NFL trade deadline, but the Redskins would not part with their wideout.

Many fans want to know, why not?

Through eight games, Pryor has not produced much in Washington. He has 20 catches for 240 yards and one touchdown. Last month, Pryor even apologized via his Instagram feed for his poor performance with the Redskins.

After losing receivers Pierre Garçon and DeSean Jackson last offseason, many expected Pryor to step in and have a huge year in Washington. Teamed up with Kirk Cousins and put into an effective Jay Gruden offense, the theory made sense.

It hasn't happened.

Pryor has been plagued by suspect hands and subpar route running. At the same time, he has all the physical tools to make an impact, like he did last year in Cleveland.

With significant usage in the Browns offense in 2016, Pryor went for over 1,000 yards receiving. In Washington's offense, where Cousins move quickly through reads, Pryor is not getting close to the target count he got last season in Cleveland.

So again, why wouldn't the Redskins brass want to trade Pryor?

Two reasons jump out:

Pot committed. The Redskins signed Pryor to a one-year, $6 million contract. $3 million of that came in the form of a signing bonus, and with eight games done, he's already earned another $1.5 million in salary. Considering the Redskins have already paid 75 percent of the contract, the team must want to see what they can get out of Pryor in the remaining 50 percent of the season.
Up the ante. In the NFL, almost any player can be moved if the offer comes in high enough. The Browns would have already been getting a value for Pryor, just based on the contract structure. It's unlikely they offered much to acquire their former star wideout, especially considering Cleveland is in the middle of another terrible season and could chase Pryor in free agency this winter.

One last thought: It might be premature to close the door on Pryor delivering some value for the Redskins this season. At this point, he will certainly not play up to offseason expectations, and another 1,000 yard season won't happen, but if the Redskins want to make a December playoff run, a big, athletic wideout might help.

Maybe.

Pryor bet on himself, and he lost.

If you listen to mac, the Browns front office was stupid for offering him more money than any other team did.

If you listen to mac, Pryor was signed by the redskins as an "insurance policy".

Bottom line, Pryor and/or his agent screwed the pooch here. He'll have to deal with it. A "show me" 1 year deal vs. a better 4 year deal..............do the math.

And yes, I'm in a rather bad mood tonight. Who cares about my mood.

Happens to all of us from time to time. Turn it around, arch...you have control.

I actually posted that a few days ago in another thread:

Terrelle Pryor thus far in 2017:

20/37 for 240 yd, 1 TD