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Another DEAD AMERICAN at the hands of ILLEGALS ... no biggie though ... Where’s the outrage over this from the lefties ... I wonder if a WALL may have saved his life .... naaaaaa .. prolly not ...  Appearantly he was beaten to death with rock(s) ..... maybe u can have some illegals over for dinner Clem ... i’m sure there all nice folks just like the refugees you’ve had over ... CAUSE your EXPERIENCES are the only ones that matter ...  I’ll go out on a limb here and say that the family of Mr. Martinez has a slightly different take than u do about ILLEGALS .... but their just jaded or PREJUDICE like me .... isn’t that right Clem? ... http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/11/19/sou...l-in-texas.htmlBorder agent killed, another injured during ‘attack’ near Texas southern border ... A U.S. Border Patrol agent was killed in the line of duty Sunday while patrolling the Big Bend Sector of Texas along the southern border with Mexico. Agent Rogelio Martinez, 36, died of injuries sustained while responding to “activity” near Interstate 10 in the Van Horn Station area, according to a news release from U.S. Customs and Border Protection. Martinez and his partner, who was injured, were transported to a hospital. The partner, who was not identified, remains hospitalized in serious condition. Border Protection spokesman Carlos Diaz told The Associated Press the FBI has taken over the investigation. Martinez, who was from El Paso, worked as a border agent since August 2013. President Trump pushed the need for his proposed U.S.-Mexico border wall Sunday night following the incident, tweeting: "Border Patrol Officer killed at Southern Border, another badly hurt. We will seek out and bring to justice those responsible. We will, and must, build the Wall!" Elaine Duke, the acting secretary of the Department of Homeland Security, released a statement Sunday calling Martinez’s death a “tragic event.” “Earlier this morning, I was notified that Border Patrol Agent Rogelio Martinez died as a result of serious injuries suffered while on patrol in the Big Bend Sector of our southern border in Texas. Agent Martinez was responding to activity while on patrol with another agent, who was also seriously injured,” the statement read. “We are fully supporting the ongoing investigation to determine the cause of this tragic event. On behalf of the quarter of a million frontline officers and agents of DHS, my thoughts and prayers go out to the family and friends of Agent Martinez and to the agent who is in serious condition.” Sen. Ted Cruz, R-Texas, also released a statement calling the attack a “stark reminder of the ongoing threat that an unsecure border poses to the safety of our communities and those charged with defending them.” “Our condolences and prayers go out to the family and friends of Border Patrol Agent Rogelio Martinez, who was killed this morning in the line of duty. We are also praying for the full recovery of his partner, who was also attacked,” Cruz said. “This is a stark reminder of the ongoing threat that an unsecure border poses to the safety of our communities and those charged with defending them. We are grateful for the courage and sacrifice of our border agents who have dedicated their lives to keeping us safe," the statement read. "I remain fully committed to working with the Border Patrol to provide them with all the resources they need to safeguard our nation.” Border Patrol records show that Big Bend accounted for about 1 percent of the more than 61,000 apprehensions agents made along the Southwest border between October 2016 and May 2017. The region's mountains and the Rio Grande make it a difficult area for people to cross illegally into the U.S. from Mexico. The Border Patrol website lists 38 agents who have died since late 2003, some attacked while working along the border, and other fatalities in traffic accidents. It lists one other agent death in the line of duty this year.
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It's not a new concept. "Nations" have long realized the need to prevent unwelcomed/injurious people from coming into their "nation". (nation in paranthesis because I'm not sure that's the right word for China back then) How important? Imagine the immense expense of constructing the Great Wall of China.  Antagonists of the U.S./Mexican Wall are idiots.
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Antagonists of the U.S./Mexican Wall are idiots.
I don't think they are idiots, I think they are focused. Focused on their ideology of America being for the World instead of for Americans. They will sell this Nation out in a heartbeat in order to feel better about providing welfare to the rest of the world. Protecting our sovereignty as a Nation is mean.
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And it worked, too.
Proof: you don't see any Mexicans in Chynah.
"too many notes, not enough music-"
#GMStong
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~ Legend
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"Nations" have long realized the need to prevent unwelcomed/injurious people from coming into their "nation". (nation in paranthesis because I'm not sure that's the right word for China back then)
Then America was created and adopted unconditional jus soli.
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J/C
I keep hearing the left trying to play this off as the cartel attacking the man.
Sorry, im not buying that. The cartel is not going to use rocks to attack you. Especially when they have all those fast and furious guns.
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Thats better then what i’m hearing ... everyone of them I’ve seen interviewed won’t answer the question ... they fall back to the same ole BS about how crossings are down and there’s other ways to secure the border ... Not that the cartel answer is a good one ... there not shy about using there guns thats for sure ... Here’s a suggestion ... find a few illegals .. have them over for dinner and everything will be fine then ...  .... These people drape themselves in the american flag protecting people that are here illegally and then when they KILL AMERICANS they go hide behind the same flag ... PATHETIC ... I said it in a different thread ... if they ever have to walk in Kate Stienle’s or Jamal Shaw’s dads shoes ... there tudes will change so fast it’ll make your head spin ... Until then ... all we’ll get is them defending the illegals and the BS they spew defending them ...
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Sheriff: Border Patrol agent’s death may have been an accident CULBERSON COUNTY, Texas – Details remain scant in what the FBI describes as a “tragic incident” that left one Border Patrol agent dead and another in serious condition. The FBI said both men were found injured late Saturday in a culvert area in southwest Texas. Rogelio Martinez, 36, died from his injuries at a hospital Sunday morning. His partner, who hasn’t been identified, remains hospitalized in serious condition. The two Border Patrol agents suffered traumatic head injuries and other wounds such as broken bones, according to the FBI, which is leading the investigation. The results of Martinez’s autopsy are pending. Although there hasn’t been an explanation of what happened, Texas politicians — including Gov. Greg Abbott and Sen. Ted Cruz — have described the incident as an “attack.” President Donald Trump said the injured agent had been “brutally beaten” as he called for the wall between US and Mexico. But in Culberson County, where the two officers were injured, the local sheriff painted a different picture, suggesting to the Dallas Morning News that investigators are considering the possibility that the agents fell in a nighttime accident. “The evidence is not obvious as to what happened out there,” Sheriff Oscar Carrillo told the paper. Martinez and his partner had been on patrol near Interstate 10 in the Big Bend Sector, which runs along the US-Mexico border, when they responded to activity, US Customs and Border Protection said. CBP officials would not say what type of activity. After they responded, Martinez’s partner reported that they were both injured and needed help, according to CBP. They were found about 12 miles east of the town of Van Horn at 11:20 p.m. Saturday, according to the FBI. A Customs and Border Protection spokesman said Martinez had not been shot. He had been a border patrol agent since 2013, officials said. President Donald Trump cited the incident as a reason why the US needs to build a wall along the border with Mexico. “As you heard we lost a Border Patrol officer just yesterday and another one was brutally beaten and badly, badly hurt,” Trump said Monday. “It looks like he’ll make it, but very badly hurt.” On Sunday, Trumped had tweeted, “We will seek out and bring to justice those responsible. We will, and must, build the Wall.” On Monday, Gov. Greg Abbott’s office announced a reward of up to $20,000 through Texas Crime Stoppers for information leading to the arrest and conviction of whoever killed Martinez and wounded his partner. He tweeted: “I’m offering a reward to help solve this murder of a Border Patrol Agent in Texas. Help us catch this killer.” Texas Sen. Ted Cruz said the attack was “a stark reminder of the ongoing threat that an unsecure border poses to the safety of our communities and those charged with defending them.” Mexico expressed its regret regarding the incident, its willingness to collaborate with the US Department of Homeland Security and condolences to the families of the two agents. http://kfor.com/2017/11/21/sheriff-border-patrol-agents-death-may-have-been-an-accident/
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Sheriff: Border Patrol agent’s death may have been an accident CULBERSON COUNTY, Texas – Details remain scant in what the FBI describes as a “tragic incident” that left one Border Patrol agent dead and another in serious condition. The FBI said both men were found injured late Saturday in a culvert area in southwest Texas. Rogelio Martinez, 36, died from his injuries at a hospital Sunday morning. His partner, who hasn’t been identified, remains hospitalized in serious condition. The two Border Patrol agents suffered traumatic head injuries and other wounds such as broken bones, according to the FBI, which is leading the investigation. The results of Martinez’s autopsy are pending. Although there hasn’t been an explanation of what happened, Texas politicians — including Gov. Greg Abbott and Sen. Ted Cruz — have described the incident as an “attack.” President Donald Trump said the injured agent had been “brutally beaten” as he called for the wall between US and Mexico. But in Culberson County, where the two officers were injured, the local sheriff painted a different picture, suggesting to the Dallas Morning News that investigators are considering the possibility that the agents fell in a nighttime accident. “The evidence is not obvious as to what happened out there,” Sheriff Oscar Carrillo told the paper. Martinez and his partner had been on patrol near Interstate 10 in the Big Bend Sector, which runs along the US-Mexico border, when they responded to activity, US Customs and Border Protection said. CBP officials would not say what type of activity. After they responded, Martinez’s partner reported that they were both injured and needed help, according to CBP. They were found about 12 miles east of the town of Van Horn at 11:20 p.m. Saturday, according to the FBI. A Customs and Border Protection spokesman said Martinez had not been shot. He had been a border patrol agent since 2013, officials said. President Donald Trump cited the incident as a reason why the US needs to build a wall along the border with Mexico. “As you heard we lost a Border Patrol officer just yesterday and another one was brutally beaten and badly, badly hurt,” Trump said Monday. “It looks like he’ll make it, but very badly hurt.” On Sunday, Trumped had tweeted, “We will seek out and bring to justice those responsible. We will, and must, build the Wall.” On Monday, Gov. Greg Abbott’s office announced a reward of up to $20,000 through Texas Crime Stoppers for information leading to the arrest and conviction of whoever killed Martinez and wounded his partner. He tweeted: “I’m offering a reward to help solve this murder of a Border Patrol Agent in Texas. Help us catch this killer.” Texas Sen. Ted Cruz said the attack was “a stark reminder of the ongoing threat that an unsecure border poses to the safety of our communities and those charged with defending them.” Mexico expressed its regret regarding the incident, its willingness to collaborate with the US Department of Homeland Security and condolences to the families of the two agents. http://kfor.com/2017/11/21/sheriff-border-patrol-agents-death-may-have-been-an-accident/ Sure, they were just looking for a better life and then the nasty border agent came along and beat himself to death with a rock. Lets give them a safe place in California.
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The jury is far from out on this one. You don't know what happened and neither do I. It was at night and after looking at several sources it appears they may have fell into a ravine. Now I don't know if that's true, but if you google it, there are several sources that say this is a strong possibility. I'm not going to make some alarmist claim until they complete their investigation.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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U gotta realize sumptin about Pit ... 40 years ago if 4 mafia bosses got gunned down in front of a steak house in NYC he would have shuttered at the thought that it was Italians from a rival mafia org and that would be WRONG to suggest even though based on history anyone with common sense knew “who” the killers were .... Just a few weeks ago ... i posted a story in my ILLEGAL murders thread at the time that they found some human remains in a park in Long Island where over the last 3 years or so they’ve found multiple other body parts of folks KILLED BY ILLEGALS ... He pointed out i was jumping the gun ... i *LOL* at him ... u get my jist? ... PIT FYI ... it was confirmed last week that the folks whose body parts they found in the article i posted were indeed killed by MS-13 gang members that were HERE ILLEGALY ... Thought ou’d wanna know that ....
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IF this was the result of homicide that's terrible.
IF this was a result of an accident it is no less terrible .
The families concerned only know that they no longer have a husband, father , son , brother .
You politicizing it makes you less. I get that you want to play gotcha because you believe that your opinion on illegal immigration is the best . That every incidence of wrongdoing and violence perpetrated by these individuals are evidence that you are right and everyone else is wrong . Damn tragic is all it is .
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Alternative threads based on this thread title: African American man lynched by GUESS WHO ... Jewish individual sent to concentration camp by GUESS WHO ... Endorsing sexual assault by grabbing of woman's anatomy by GUESS WHO ... Farce of trickle down economics supported by GUESS WHO ... Suppression of minority voters by GUESS WHO ... Endorsing a pedophile for public office by GUESS WHO ... Hand-waving of obstruction of justice by GUESS WHO ... Spying on rival's campaign by GUESS WHO ... Feelings are valued over facts by GUESS WHO ... Wanting to curtail the rights of consenting loving adults by GUESS WHO ... Using religious dogma to make laws by GUESS WHO ... Politicians still in the closet hating themselves with legislation by GUESS WHO ... Promoting the farce of boot straps for minorities by GUESS WHO ... Equating same-sex marriage to marrying toasters by GUESS WHO ... Putting the rights of Judeo-Christian religions above all Abrahamic religions by GUESS WHO ... Condoning violence towards opposition at rallies by GUESS WHO ... Making fun of an individual with a disability at a campaign rally by GUESS WHO ... Government by nepotism by GUESS WHO ... Failure to disavow Nazis, white supremacists and other hate groups by GUESS WHO ... -------------------------- Diam, please look at the person you voted for by claiming a superior ground. Yes, murder is bad. Some idiots come across this border looking for trouble. However, to lump everyone into " ZOMGS DANGEROUS ILLEGALS" is ridiculous; you do this all the time. People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. In your case, don't throw boulders. Your mansion collapsed the instant you made this thread. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200 dollars. ----------------------------- 
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U must be a GREAT TEACHER ... thank u SO MUCH for enlightening me to the fact that not all ILLEGALS are bad ... AWESOME MAN ... THANKS ... Your kids are so lucky to have U for your awesome insight ... If you’d like to be an even better teacher ... go ahead and pull out your dictionary and look up the meaning of US CITIZEN and ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT ... Once again .... AMERICAN CITIZENS LIVES MEAN LESS TO U than ILLEGALS right to be here .... god forbid U ever lose a loved one or a friend to an illegal ... if u do we’ll see what your thoughts are then ... PS. I know FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY is not even a word in your vocabulary and u may not know that the country is 20 TRILLION in debt and that in 2015 ILLEGALS cost us 125 BILLION ... Now that I’ve explained that to U ... are u at least intelligent enough to see that there is SOMETHING DRASTICALLY WRONG with that picture .... for the kids in Alaska’s sake I sure hope you can at least understand that SIMPLE ECONOMIC CONCEPT!!!!!!
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IF this was the result of homicide that's terrible.
IF this was a result of an accident it is no less terrible .
The families concerned only know that they no longer have a husband, father , son , brother .
You politicizing it makes you less. I get that you want to play gotcha because you believe that your opinion on illegal immigration is the best . That every incidence of wrongdoing and violence perpetrated by these individuals are evidence that you are right and everyone else is wrong . Damn tragic is all it is . Like how the left politicizes shootings?
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These ad hominem attacks show me you’ve got nothing, Siam. I teach my kids to avoid logical fallacies in their arguments.
I suggest you drop personally attacking my profession. I’m quite sure that’s against the rules, and it just immediately exposes flaws in your argument.
0=logical fallacies
0=ad hominems
So therefore...
0+0=0
0 is also the amount of dignity 45 has for women.
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Haha, Siam.
Cause he won’t stop whining like a teenage girl.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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I'm confused.. help me out. If this guy was murdered, that would make 2 border agents this year who have been killed in the line of duty.. so you want to build a $20 billion wall and spend billions more deporting people which may, or may not, solve the problem.
Meanwhile, over 40 police officers have been shot and killed in the line of duty this year... but looking into stiffer gun regulations is COMPLETELY out of the question...
yebat' Putin
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Be quiet, you gun grabbing commie. How dare you want to restrict the 2nd amendment rights!
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Be quiet, you gun grabbing commie. How dare you want to restrict the 2nd amendment rights! Rocks don't kill people, lack of walls kills people.
yebat' Putin
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I'm confused.. help me out. If this guy was murdered, that would make 2 border agents this year who have been killed in the line of duty.. so you want to build a $20 billion wall and spend billions more deporting people which may, or may not, solve the problem.
What about this problem? The total cost of illegal immigration to federal, state and local taxpayers for the nation’s 12.5 million illegal aliens has increased to $116 billion annually, according to a new study released Wednesday by the Federation for American Immigration Reform (FAIR). The study, one of the most comprehensive to date on the issue, investigates the major contributing factors driving the high cost of illegal immigration, and compares that to the revenue state and local governments collect from illegal aliens. http://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog/h...yers-is-growing
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Do you always go after people who actually agree with you on the immigration issue because they aren't lock step in agreement with every word you say?
Jumping the gun is wonderful when you're right. Not so wonderful when it turns out you're wrong. In this case I said I have no idea which report is right. And actually, you don't either.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Are u for real? .. a 20 BILLION DOLLAR WALL for 2 dead border agents ... before i get into how BS of a question that is ..... whats a LIFE WORTH TO U DC ... what amount of money can u put on your CHILDRENS LIVES DC? ... PLEASE go ahead and let me know ... Cause now i’m confused ... how much is each of your children’s lives worth .. appearantly 10 billion each is to much ... PLEASE TELL ME what are your children’s lives worth to U ... appearantly my nephews lives mean more to me that your children’s lives to do u ... and dont whine .. your the one that opened this can of worms with your BS ass scenario ... way to boil it down to just two border agents at a 20 billion dollar price tag ....  Thats border agents ... what about all the DEAD BODIES they’ve found in LI alone this year ... what about all the drunk driving deaths at the hands of illegals .... How about Kate Stienle ... he was deported 5 times ... HE WAS DEPORTED 5 TIMES ... were not 100% certain the wall will help ... COMMON SENSE says it will but maybe it won’t ... ... but we know not having one means were sending them back for a vacation ... I expect that CRAP from Swish and Rocket and his ilk ... its who they are ... they could give a crap about americans .. they’ve made it clear allowing people who HAVE NO RIGHT being here is more important than AMERICAN LIVES .... i dont expect it from U ... i thought u were better than that ... Again DC .. help me out .. HOW MUCH IS THE LIFE OF ONE OF YOUR CHILDREN WORTH??? Won’t even bring in what it costs the US taxpayers to pay for all the ILLEGALS ... appearantly the words fiscal responsibility isn’t a part of your vocabulary either ... Lets go over to your gun control questions .... How many of them cops were killed by people with guns LEGALLY BOUGHT? ... get back to me ... my guess is VERY FEW IF ANY ... theres not a lot of lawyers, accountants or teachers doing it ... i’m guessing a HUGE % of them more than likely have criminal records and couldn’t buy a gun galley under todays GUN LAWS .. How’s Chicago doing DC .. some of the STRICTEST GUN laws in the country .. its a SHOOTING GALLERY every weekend ... it’s SICKENING ... how many of them got their guns LEGALLY DC? ... Thats a great plan .. lets take the guns away from those that aquire them legally cause im sure all the guns bought on the street corners would be turned right in ... ... Not sure what plan of yours is worse ... cause just keeping the status quo with the border is working out real well on many levels ... Your barking up the wrong tree with the wrong person .. I have the FACTS on my side in both instances ... I’ll be waiting to see how MUCH MONEY EACH of your children’s lives are worth to U .. U do understand the 2 border agents had moms and dads and brothers and sisters and possibly wives and kids ... no? ...
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Here u go DC ... just for U ... keep making your snarky comments .....yup .. we dont NEED NO WALL ... This is SICK ... what kind of people do this stuff ... http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/11/22/ms-...police-say.htmlMS-13 victim was stabbed 100 times, decapitated, had heart ripped out, police say A man murdered earlier this year by the MS-13 street gang was stabbed more than 100 times, decapitated and had his heart torn out of his chest and buried with him, Maryland authorities said Wednesday. Montgomery County Police said one of the alleged killers, 19-year-old Miguel Angel Lopez-Abrego, was arrested Nov. 11 in North Carolina. Lopez-Abrego, known as "Timido," has been charged with first-degree murder and was ordered held without bond after his first court appearance. According to court documents, which cited interviews with a gang informant, up to ten MS-13 members planned to lure the victim to the Silver Spring park where he was killed sometime this past spring. The documents allege that Lopez-Abrego helped dig the grave where the victim was found, and also used a walkie-talkie to alert the other gang members to the victim's arrival. The informant also claimed Lopez-Abrego was the first to attack the victim, stabbing him with a 15-inch knife. The informant led police to the grave on Sept. 5 and "detailed the choking, stabbing, decapitating and dismembering [of] the Victim's body," according to a police affidavit. The documents do not give a motive for the killing. The victim has yet to be conclusively identified. Police describe him as a Hispanic male standing approximately 5 feet, 2 inches high and weighing approximately 126 pounds. He had short, dark brown hair and a missing lower tooth that may have been noticeable when he was speaking or smiling. After the victim's body was found in September, police released photos of the clothes and rosary he was wearing when he was killed. They included a sweatshirt with the words "First United Methodist Church Laurel, Maryland" written on the left chest. Anyone with information is asked to contact the Montgomery County Police Department's Major Crimes Division at (240) 773-5070.
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Does it hurt your narrative if the victim turns out to be illegal ? I mean then your only outrage would be that it happened on American soil .
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Border agent murdered by GUESS WHO ... This is precisely why we need a US/Canadian border wall.
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I see what you did there.
#gmstrong
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Ya ... theres a lot of illegals from canada killing americans .. HUGE PROBLEM THERE ... Soon they’ll say I’m OK with it cause the ILLEGALS MURDERING us FROM CANADA are white .. thats how they roll ... real stand up guys they are ... Maybe one day they’ll have the misfortune of losing one of theirs to an illegal ... then watch their tudes change ... Its real sad that unless they lose someone close to them its FINE and DANDY ... to them its like the old saying in hoops .. NO HARM NO FOUL ... problem is this isn’t basketball ... 125 BILLION is what we spent on illegals in 2015 No biggie .. were doing so well economically ... its not like were in debt or anything ...
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Are all undocumented workers murderers?
Are all people from the south racist?
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It always makes me >.x when people say the south is racist.
Black culture is a huge part of the south. It's a major part of our heritage. (aside from the statues you guys hate) And we all embrace that.
You all yanks are about a billion times more racist than the south.
No Craps Given
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I agree. Racism in Ohio was much more prevalent than it is here is SC.
It also galls me when people try and defend groups of people while making biased, bigoted claims about other groups of people.
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Ya ... theres a lot of illegals from canada killing americans .. HUGE PROBLEM THERE ... Soon they’ll say I’m OK with it cause the ILLEGALS MURDERING us FROM CANADA are white .. thats how they roll ... real stand up guys they are ... Maybe one day they’ll have the misfortune of losing one of theirs to an illegal ... then watch their tudes change ... Its real sad that unless they lose someone close to them its FINE and DANDY ... to them its like the old saying in hoops .. NO HARM NO FOUL ... problem is this isn’t basketball ... 125 BILLION is what we spent on illegals in 2015 No biggie .. were doing so well economically ... its not like were in debt or anything ... 1) It was a joke about the band The Guess Who 2) All of the numbers you cite regarding illegals are laughable figures you're parroting from Sean Hannity. Their methodology doesn't account for tax revenue, and wildly inflate cost based on assumed and incorrect numbers...but oBUMa, I guess
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Joined: Jul 2014
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I'm confused.. help me out. If this guy was murdered, that would make 2 border agents this year who have been killed in the line of duty.. so you want to build a $20 billion wall and spend billions more deporting people which may, or may not, solve the problem.
Meanwhile, over 40 police officers have been shot and killed in the line of duty this year... but looking into stiffer gun regulations is COMPLETELY out of the question...
Because 2 dead Border Agents isn't the only problem?
I'd be curious to know, philosophically speaking, at what point is erecting barriers to keep other people out ok and what's the threshold where it becomes not ok?
We lock our doors because we don't want strangers (even well intentioned ones) from walking in uninvited and raiding our fridge.
We put up 6 ft privacy fences to keep our good neighbors from seeing what happens on our property.
We put barbed wire on top of chain link fences to keep people from coming over.
Embassies have walls and Marines to limit who comes in and out of the compound.
Israel erected walls and fences that helped to sharply reduce the number of suicide bombings (generally thought to be a good thing).
As was mentioned previously, the Great Wall was erected to keep out alien monsters (with the help of Matt Damon of course...*watch last years "The Great Wall")
If we can get away with building a Wall for a cool $20 billion to control the flow of people... I'm no sure why we wouldn't?
For those against building a wall, I guess you have to ask yourselves what's more important: the hurt feelings of citizens of another country, or human lives?
And I'm not even talking about the killings and violence Diam posts about... I'm talking about all the other stuff that has happened with your open borders viewpoint. The human trafficking (forced labor and sexual exploitation of children)... people seem to be very upset about the opioid epidemic. Don't you care that the majority of the heroin supply comes from across the southern border? There are signs at national parks that warn visitors of the dangers of drug cartels that operate regularly in the area. I don't understand how that can be ok?
It's not racist to want to put up a physical wall. And the reality is that physical walls DO work.
This topic to me seems to be one that IMO should be pretty dang easy to find common ground on. It should be a no brainer to admit that walls help keep the people you want out, out. It also should be easy to discuss an immigration policy that allows people of good character and intent to come here and have an opportunity at a better life.
"Hey, I'm a reasonable guy. But I've just experienced some very unreasonable things."
-Jack Burton
-It looks like the Harvard Boys know what they are doing after all.
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Philosophically, our system of economics requires cheap labor, and will find it no matter what. The day we erect a border wall is the day tunnels are dug under it and flights are planned over it. A physical wall isn't going to even dent the need for migrant labor in our country. Its only purpose would itself be philosophical - peace of mind for racists.
The philosophical goal stated - "keep illegals out" - is just that: philosophical. It wouldn't actually keep illegals out, unless we shifted our economic model.
(and to be honest, the "tunnels/flights" line is philosophical in nature as well. Let's be honest, if we built a border wall, the illegals would be led right through the "big, beautiful" door of it)
In terms of philosophy - what would be the actual point of a border wall? Is the goal to keep out migrants?
Because if so, abolishing the minimum wage would be the way to do that. Not a pointless, expensive ornament erected in the name of racism.
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Joined: Jul 2014
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Philosophically, our system of economics requires cheap labor, and will find it no matter what. The day we erect a border wall is the day tunnels are dug under it and flights are planned over it. A physical wall isn't going to even dent the need for migrant labor in our country. Its only purpose would itself be philosophical - peace of mind for racists.
The philosophical goal stated - "keep illegals out" - is just that: philosophical. It wouldn't actually keep illegals out, unless we shifted our economic model.
(and to be honest, the "tunnels/flights" line is philosophical in nature as well. Let's be honest, if we built a border wall, the illegals would be led right through the "big, beautiful" door of it)
You actually make a point that I think gets left out too often... there IS a door to come through. I have yet to hear a Wall supporter state that there shouldn't be one.
But even if you are correct that building a wall would lead to tunnels and increased air traffic, the logistics of such endeavors would make it near impossible to achieve the same level of migration that is currently going on.
In addition, it wouldn't take a whole lot to monitor the air (radar, which we already do) and the occasional seismic sensor could help detect any tunneling activity.
So respectfully, I'll disagree that the benefits of a wall is mostly a philosophical construct.
In regards to your points on the economy and cheap labor... in this we do agree. There will always be a demand for it. Always has been and always will be.
GW Bush took a lot of flack for suggesting that illegals come here and do the jobs most Americans won't. He's 100% correct. How many people that aren't brown in complexion do you see hanging out in the day labor lines at Home Depot? You don't see many white dudes or black dudes trying to make a few bucks out there.
And this in a Nation where we complain about lack of jobs, and push this idea that you have to have a college education to make a living.. there's no other possible way to do it.
But let's take this a step forward in to the future.
Let's say we continue forward with a policy similar to what we have now, illegals come in, do those jobs, and never fully integrate into society: socially, economically, legally... doesn't that in essence create a de facto 2nd class citizenry? I don't think anyone actually wants that!
So then maybe you say we should have a system that makes them citizens... maybe it's blanket Amnesty, shortcuts in the legal immigration process, whatever it is. Ok, then they become American citizens.
But what did we agree was a problem to begin with? American citizens demand cheap labor and refuse to perform it. So why would these new citizens continue to perform it? Especially if we have a welfare state that they are now eligible for that can give you just enough so that you don't actually have to perform it?
So as I see it, we're really not solving the problem and run a high risk of creating new one.
I'm definitely curious to hear your thoughts.
"Hey, I'm a reasonable guy. But I've just experienced some very unreasonable things."
-Jack Burton
-It looks like the Harvard Boys know what they are doing after all.
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 52,481
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 52,481 |
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 80,476
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 80,476 |
How can that be true? It doesn't fit the scare tactic narrative.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 16,199
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 16,199 |
No sugar tonight in your coffee.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson.
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 16,199
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 16,199 |
The Mexicans are attacking!!!! Build the wall!! "Oooops" "The sound of silence"
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 34,804
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 34,804 |
GUESS WHO's not posting a bigoted response?
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Border agent murdered by GUESS WHO
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