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and if we can't get cousins?

Both o-lines sucked. Swish is comparing Darnold's game to Jackson's game. In my opinion, if Darnold went against MSU's D, his numbers and game would have been much better than that against the Buckeyes and if Lamar went against the Buckeye's D, his numbers would have been worse than that against MSU.

Mayfield's immaturity scares me too, could be another Johnny Manziel. Take either Rosen or Allen with first overall pick, leaning towards Allen.

With $117M in cap space, we could outbid any other suitors. The only reason we couldn't is if he refuses to sign with Cleveland.

That's what I thought you were saying. I was confused with the "USC's line was worse" comment, but I see what you mean now.

The only real problem I have with Lamar is he is like RGIII, running is a big part of what makes him tick.

They say you can coach that out of a guy, but I am not so sure. He has had that X factor since he was a kid.

I didn't mind Tebow as a runner because he was bigger and stronger than many, maybe most linebackers.

It's hard to predict injury, but my worry is the kid is going to have a short career. If he didn't run so much, I'd be there with you. He's a really good QB.

Trust me, if we take him, I am on board.

Mayfield's immaturity scares me also, could be another Manziel. Draft Rosen or Allen, (leaning towards Allen), With the first pick.

U wont be for long .. at least not after my initial assessment ... i’ve watched 3 of his games today ... no, not the one he played in today ...

Hes very innacurate ... in the NC game the announcer even said on the 1st series of the 2nd half ... “he missed ANOTHER WIDE OPEN RECIEVER” ... in the 3 games I’ve watched ... he’s had 6 or 7 throws that were WAY OFF BASE ...

This kid is even more innacurate than RG3 was ... hes worse than Vince Young when it comes to accuracy ... he may even be worse than Kizer ...

If we draft him ... you’ll regret it sooner as opposed to later ...

Mayfield is an immature the way a kid is immature where it's more of a product of naivety than maliciousness (ala Manziel). I think Mayfield might have the best personality of the QBs that will go into the draft this year. I just wonder if he has the talent to make it in the NFL. I see him as either JFF or Drew Brees.

long reply:

bro Tebow was built like Mike Alstott. you can't arm tackle Tebow, or defenses was gonna get killed. hell, teams in the nfl learned that the hard way.

i mean, tebow was 6'3, 233. man oh man.

i think people tend to not realize that Lamar runs so much partly because he doesn't have a choice. he is the ENTIRE louisville offense. he only has one reliable target, a trash O line, and ok running backs in his college career.

i think you can run an offense similar to the systems in Seattle or Carolina with lamar.

my concern is this: Hue. bro i've been finding myself nodding my head in agreement with you with regards to how Hue runs this team.

on one hand, i want hue to have his own hand picked QB to work with. whoever that is, so be it, as long as its the guy Hue wants.

on the other, i'm really scared that Hue isn't the guy who can develop a rookie QB.

for example: look at Kizer's build. you know what would've been the perfect style of offense to run for Kizer? The panthers offense.

Cam Newton isn't the most accurate guy and everyone knows it. however, they always have been one of the top rushing teams, and that has led to Cam having some monster plays in the pass game. Newton also runs, and him and Kizer have similar size.

but Hue is making Kizer pass pass pass pass pass, even though we have capable RB's to be a top 10 rushing team in the nfl.

So whether it's lamar or Darnold or mayfield, im worried that Hue is gonna find a way to screw them up, then toss them under the bus.

why not? man this is what i'm talking about.

Darnold gets all the excuses in the world, but lamar doesn't.

he had ZERO TD's, and turned the ball over 3 times. they were down 17 points, so obviously he's gonna throw the ball way more, especially in the 2nd half.

you damn right there were key drops and fumbles, seeing as how 2 of those fumbles lost were from him, remember?

you blatantly ignore my comparison of the entire year, not just this game.

also, you blatantly ignore the FACT that i said at the end of the day, him, mayfield, or lamar being drafted by us i'm perfectly ok with and completely on board.

so no, YOU come on man, with your selective ass reading.

Well, ok, maybe I was being nice since Swish loves the guy. I have noticed he isn't accurate, and I am not sure I have ever seen him play under center.

I am a spread guy, so playing under center isn't all that important to me except that the NFL continues to cling to drop back passing even though a third of the teams, inching towards half, don't have a QB worth a flip.

he isn't the most accurate, but neither is darnold and some others.

he's still has better accuracy than Kizer, though. obviously most QB's do so that isn't saying much.

but i've watched plenty of games last season and this season, and the guy has got better and better throwing the ball.

Lamar has the occasional pass from under center. Usually they're on play actions. Today he threw a playaction pass from the I today to a wide open TE for 13 yards. I'll see if I can find a clip of it.

This was a single season record.

well, Bone, since you want to use just raw stats now, lets use raw stats.

(not including bowl stats for BOTH QB's)

Darnold: 480 attempts, 63%, 4143 yards, 8.6 per pass, 26 TD's, 13 Int, 148.1 QB rating
Jackson: 399 attempts, 60%, 3489 yards, 8.7 per pass, 25 TD's, 6 int, 151.5 QB rating.

i mean damn bro. i can add JUST the interceptions from lamar this bowl game, and none of the turnovers from Darnold, and he STILL has the better TD:INT ratio.

so since you want to use raw stats, the raw stats says Lamar had the better passing year than Darnold.

i don't even have to add in Lamar's rushing stats, cause then it ain't close. it ain't close whatsoever.

Darnold has better offensive talent to work with. he has the better coaching staff around him. he plays in the easier conference. he has the better overall team.

and yet Lamar still outperformed him.

again, i'm cool if we take Darnold. my beef is the excuses you'll run on Darnold, but won't do the same with Lamar.

you see Mayfield as either JFF or Drew Brees.

I see Mayfield as either Montanna, (of course nobodys Montanna, a lesser version type set) or Cam Newton.

I see him as Cam Newton's Mindset in Montana's body type skill set.

Of course after today, I've got to rethink.
Denzel Ward didn't play in his bowl game

Saquan Barkley is looking like the real deal.

And I think I like Nic Bosa, I mean if I had to make a safe pick find a player that won't bust. (that said he's probably a sophomore, I dunno).

You don't have to, I trust you. I was just giving a general impression.

I didn't watch all of the game. Tomorrow is our anniversary. Rather than fight the crowds tomorrow, we went out for a late lunch/early dinner this afternoon...that is what years do to you.

For tomorrow, we bought shrimp, meats and cheese for a charcuterie board to go with a Dom from the cellar....all at home. No, I am long asleep before the ball drop.

Just letting the board know that you can see both Darnold and Lamar Jackson as franchise QBs worth the #1 pick.

Swishy. You CANNOT run around in the NFL like he does now. He will get KILLED.

He's an AWESOME athletic specimen without doubt. That 13 yard TD run today was a thing of beauty.

He's not gonna get away with that crap in the NFL. Nor is Watson.

You're trying to reinvent the wheel. Ain't gonna happen.

Enjoy your anniversary

Lamar Jackson didn't look as bad as his numbers today. Showed some good things.

Congrats and Happy Anniversary to you and your better half, Ballpeen. Hope the Browns send a win to you and your bride as a gift tomorrow.

how? Cam newton is successful being a dual threat. Wilson is successful being a dual threat, Rodgers is a dual threat (yes).

Vick was successful being a dual threat. Kaep took his team to the SB being a dual threat.

Watson had 19 TD passes before getting hurt in PRACTICE. not during a game, in practice.

a running QB doesn't toss 19 TD passes in the NFL.

so with all due respect, the evidence of how these QB's have played entering the league isn't lining up from what i'm reading on the boards.

Mr. pocket passer Trubisky STILL isn't even over 10 TD passes on the season, and yet Watson has already had multiple games tossing 3 or more TD's in a game.

So kwhip, again, i'm perfectly fine with taking darnold if thats what the team wants. i'm all aboard.

but i don't get the blatant disrespect around here when it comes to lamar jackson. the same stuff people are saying about lamar is the same stuff they said about Watson vs Trubisky.

and so far, Watson is way better at the professional level than Trubisky.

It'd be tough to defend Barkley, Jackson, JG and a new stud WR...

The main problem with Jackson is I can't understand what the heck he is saying, ever hear him talk, its a mix of Cajun with a bit of Randy Macho Man Savage

Draft Barkley first overall and take a QB, either Rosen or Allen, with the second first round pick.

We think alike on some things peen. We are doing the same.
Our favorite is prosciutto, salami, Parmigiano Reggiano, bread and a good Cabernet Sauvignon for tomorrow. We added smoked bacon from this place meats

+1, everything you stated is correct. Lamar could be better than Watson- I'd like to know his dedication to the position and his mental makeup. What I liked about Wentz was his knowledge of game, mental ability, plus physical traits. Lamar has better physical.....and I saw Lamar SLIDE when he wanted to, he's darn good.....GO Browns!!!!

And what happened to Watson his first season ??

He got hurt in practice after scoring 21 touchdowns for his team in 7 games. The Browns have scored 24 touchdowns this season.

So he missed half a season with an injury .. Tha'ts what I was asking .

So did Wentz. I'll take that half season of production to the bank every day.

whats your point though?

Wentz is also injured. Winston got hurt, Rodgers (again), Bradford, Luck STILL can't get on the field.

My point was trying remember what happened to Watson with the injury .. To lazy to look it up .. Not all of us have agendas / hyper sensitive / defensive / deflecting and so on .. lol .. It was a simple ??????

he got hurt in practice.