DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2018 NFL Season 2018 NFL Draft Sam Darnold

https://twitter.com/AllbrightNFL/status/948722627442454533

I think I just used the quick reply
Tendency to do that on my phone

Oh God, I hope this doesn't get in the way of Jordan's responsibilities to host that Food Network show.

Maybe Sam will learn both QB and cooking.

That's Jesse Palmer I believe

Today I learned that Jesse Palmer and Jordan Palmer are two different people...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlZ_buuG1E8

Cowherd on the Browns taking Darnold. I dig it. I get good vibes from him.

I think Cowherd is butt-hurt because Rosen didn't give him the exclusive and rejected his request to go back to school if the Browns had the first overall pick.

Yet another reason to take Rosen.

Thanks bone ...

Thanks Bone. I know DD is a big proponent of breakdowns, could you do one for Darnold to show us what you see?

I'm curious too. I WANT Darnold to be the guy. I like everything I read about him, I like the attitude, I like the numbers he put up. But then I sit down and watch him actually play, and I don't see what other are seeing. I don't get it ... granted I'm probably the worst person to analyze a QB.

I can't even put my finger on what it is that looks off with him. Is it his footwork? His longer passing motion? Ball speed?

I went into the Cotton Ball without really seeing this guy play. He was the guy I wanted. Then watching the Bowl game, I saw nothing impressive out of him. He threw incompletions everywhere. He had turnover and he looked rattled. Once he missed a wide open guy on a crossing route my a mile and I thought to myself, "Yikes, if this was Kizer, people would have the pitchforks out". What I did see was his receivers make a lot of great plays that helped him out.

I saw a guy that wasn't exactly commanding the LOS either. After every play he was staring over at the side-line at the coach with a "what now coach?" look on his face. Sometimes they would line up quickly, and he was still looking over. I didn't see a guy picking out blitzers, audibling, or directing coverages. He seemed like he was waiting for direction from the coach.

So I figured maybe he just had a bad game. Everyone said he tore Penn State apart last year, so I watched a video on that game with all 50-some of his throws. I saw a lot of the same things. A ton of incompletions, not a lot of throws that were zipped into tight windows, and a lot of receivers (JuJu) making great plays to help him out.

I'm obviously missing something.

I don't think you are missing anything. I think the dude had one incredible game that blew people away.

I think he has terrible lower body mechanics when facing pressure.

I think he has a long, long delivery.

I think he turns the ball over too much.

I think he struggles w/accuracy due to his mechanics and inability to stand in the face of the rush.

I do think he is the second best qb prospect in the draft, but he has a long, long way to go.

I don't think he is even close to being as good as Rosen is.

Which game was that? The Penn State game?

Here's the video for that game:


Notice all the incompletions at the start of the video. At 1:52 He misses a wide open guy on a flat route that someone like Kizer would be absolutely crucified for.

There are some decent throws in there, but nothing that made be say, WOW! A lot of the time the receivers made a great play on the ball or they were just wide-open in the first place. Lots of plays make me think ... Yikes, he's not going to last long with Browns fans if he makes throws like that.

I think you're right about the long delivery though. Maybe that's what's bugging me. At times, he looks like a soccer goalie flinging out an outlet passes.

Yeah, I was talking about the Penn St game.

I read how great he was and how he was better than Rosen and then I watched the two play against each other this year. There was no question who was the superior qb in that game. It wasn't even close. So, I started watching more videos of both.

I don't know.........I could be wrong, but I don't think it is all that close. Josh Rosen is the best qb in the draft. By far.

My problem with Rozen is that he seems to lack all the intangibles that Darnold is said to have. He reminds me of the QB in draft day, where it seems like he's the real deal, but the secret is he's not much of a team leader.

Maybe that's totally false, but him basically saying he didn't want to play for Cleveland sort of put me off on him.

I understand. We all have our opinions on different qbs. I was actually going to stay out of the qb debates this year, but when I really started watching Rosen, I had to change my mind.

I'm not asking anyone to agree w/me. Just expressing my opinions. It's always fun to debate such things since we don't get to talk about things like the playoffs. LOL

If we were running a pure WCO I think Rosen would be the QB I want most. He has the absolute best ball placement and the best delivery of any QB in this draft for passes under 20 yards. It's not even close.

Then you have teams like us who want to focus on the Air Coreall System where you need to go deep. The best ones that I have watched for that are Mason, Bakerfield, and Darnold.

If bakerfield didn't have the stupid gene off the field and wasn't so short He would be the #1 pick. He does have those problems though and wishing them away won't make it happen. I think adjusting to the NFL will be tough at first for him but that he will explode later on if someone like the saints draft him to replace brees. They know best how to deal with his issues IMHO.

Darnold only has two seasons to go by and he got worse in his second season. He probably got worse due to his team and coaching staff falling apart. Still he does have that it factor but IMHO he will need to some serious grooming to fix mechanics and bad habits. If he sits a year or two then watch out. If we sign Alex Smith then I would love to draft this guy.

Mason to me is the best deep ball passer in this draft by far. He is far more accurate with his deep ball than anyone I have seen in a long time. He is big, physical and perfect for the afcn. He will make some bonehead throws like Darnold in short passes but his mechanics are way better and he releases the ball faster too. His large volume of work gives you a better gauge to how he will play and he definite sees the field well. Only Rosen can challenge him for being the best to see the field.

I honestly think ALL of these guys could end up being starters in the NFL and having a great career. It's the first time in a long time I feel like we can't screw it up by drafting either one of them. Mason is my favorite though because I think he is the most complete QB and will thrive the best in Hue's system. I just hope one of these fine young men will end up as a Browns player.

I've done my research also and have also made up my mind.

Sam Darnold is MY QB for this team.

3 things are turning me off on Rosen and I just cannot get past them.

The Injuries
The Concussions
The Tude

I question his desire to be the best. I really question his desire to play in Cleveland, even though he's NEVER mentioned the word CLEVELAND. Just a gut feeling on my part.

I don't care how NFL Ready he is. This isn't about a Day One Starter.

Darnold. High Character kid. Hard worker to be the BEST. Accurate. My gut says THIS is the guy who will take over this team for the next 12+ years.

This is the guy I want to have the ball in his hands down 2 to 6 with under 2 minutes to go.

Darnold is a "Creator" with his excellent movement in and out of the pocket. I just LOVE everything about this guy.

Barring signing Cousins, I'm taking this Kat #1, signing a Vet Presence at QB and getting him READY as soon as Game 5.

In MY OPINION there is NO other choice here.

THIS pick will be what turns this team around for the Long Haul.

Matt Miller sees it the SAME WAY!

Drafting Darnold #1 is a much higher risk than drafting Mayfield #1.

No stupid gene off the field for baker, either.

except when resisting arrest and trying to run for it ... sorry but something just seems broken with him.

Apparently a lot of people have never been a 22 year old and drunk at college.

Nothing broken with him. Prescott, Winston, and Newton have all been arrested while in college. 2 of them were #1 picks. This isn't Johnny manziel stuff.

I'm well aware of the difference. My gut tells me he has mental issues and I am very seldom wrong when I get that feeling about someone. It's just my opinion and of course your welcome to yours too. I still don't want him.

My sentiments, exactly.

That's the most outrageous thing I've ever heard. Mental issues?! When have you ever met or talked to him?

lol, this reminds me of Peen that didn't like Joe Banner because he looked like a Rat. I remember that one, basically, if he looks like a rat, he's probably a rat (from experience), lol


EDIT: But Baker Mayfield looks like a total jerk to me. Sometimes a jerk is who you want on your team though. Kevin Garnett could be a jerk. Philip Rivers could be a jerk. But so can Jay Cutler and Johnny Football and Ryan Leaf

just sayin

Dorsey has a solid reputation as a talent evaluator. He has brought in 2 other guys who have solid reputations and with whom he has worked before. I know they have yet to prove themselves here, but I am confident that we finally have the right people at the right time. They will have way more info than any of us. Whether they go with Rosen, Darnold, Cousins, or anyone else; I think they will make a good choice. I'm willing to sit back and let them do the job they were hired to do.

Daniel Jeremiah in March of 2017:



https://twitter.com/MoveTheSticks/status/836951471321145345

W84

My first breakdown has not changed at all.

Even after months have gone by I see the same things:

Athlete. Started playing basketball at 5. Could have played Pac 12 basketball. Played linebacker and wide receiver as well as quarterback. Highly recruited.

6'4" 225 lbs. When you watch him it is obvious what kind of athlete this kid is.

Kirk Herbstreit made the comment during the UCLA vs USC game that Darnold needs to return to school. That he needs to get better. That he is unrefined in the pocket. Stares down receivers and does not go through progressions.

Herbstreit covers a lot of college football. I respect his opinion. I understand what he saying. Most undergrads would benefit from graduating and gaining the experience. It can only help.
At the same time Darnold is pretty good. No doubt he will be told by agents etc. that he would be drafted in the top five.

Darnold makes the big plays when they have to be made.

His mechanics are not picture perfect like Rosen's. He has a round motion. In the pros they will tighten his delivery up.

But what Darnold has can not be taught. He has great instincts for the game. I know his int's are high this year but that in the big picture means little. You have to be aggressive in college when the program is on you. You have to try and make things happen. He will learn about turnovers. Just like Kizer.

Darnold can move. He knows when to run and he is effective as a runner. I love guys who on third and long can break your back by running and getting first downs. He also can create outside the pocket both with his legs and arm.

He has arm strength but he throws for completions. He will put touch on the ball when needed and velocity when needed. But he does not rifle ball all the time.

He throws with anticipation and accuracy. He sees the pattern and gets good ball placement most of the time. He also throws guys open. This guy is accurate. He does not miss often. Even on throws that are not completions usually the ball is right there.

Scouts talk about the "it factor". And Darnold has "it". It is clear that the team counts on him and believes he can deliver. He has leadership qualities. You can see it from the way coaches and players relate to him.

USC plays out of the shot gun. They do run the ball. They run some plays that you would see in the pros but not on the level of UCLA.

I am not sure that playing another year at USC would help him as much as going to the NFL. "If" he went to a team that didn't have to start him he would learn a lot. If he got thrown right in there he would have to learn like most. That means making mistakes and paying the price.

It will be very interesting to listen to everyone during the draft process. Rosen or Darnold? Both look very good. Some will like Rosen. Some will prefer Darnold.


In the end analysis this guy makes plays when you need them. He will be a team leader. He will be tough and I believe durable. He fits the mold of what you need to play in the North.

j/c

They have three months to study all the QBs in detail. Whoever they pick, they better get it right.

I know he didn't shine in the OSU game but somewhere I made a comment on his stare. He ALWAYS had this intense look about him. If we go Darnold I would like to see him start on the bench. Admittedly, I've never been a huge advocate of that tact but WTH, maybe we need to switch it up. McCown for as long as we could ride him would work for me.
If we get a year out of him then that's great!

Thank you Bone. I am on the fence between Rosen and Darnold. I like Rosen's precision, but I love Darnold's leadership. It's a tough choice. I'm glad we have Dorsey/Wolf to make it. Again, thanks.

Well one things clear. Whoever the Browns take, Somebodys' going to be unhappy.

Only the small minded who think they’re opinion offers the only successful outcome.

You never know Kizer might transform and make whoever we draft a moot point ^^

/ducks as the snowballs are thrown =P