DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Hue Part 4 .. How much rope does he have ..

Thats the million dollar question ...

Get back to beating this horse folks ... its a fighter and just won’t die ...

It's a zombie horse!!!

Hue has to have a strong first 4 weeks. 2-2 or better keeps him safe. 1-3? Gives him 1 maybe 2 more weeks to string together a couple more wins. I dont think Dorsey lets us go winless the first half of the season. I think for it to be a successful season at a minimum we have to be flirting with a .500 record for most of it.

Hue lost the HC v FO battle in Oakland...Dorsey lost the HC v FO battle in KC...Hue won the HC v FO battle in Cleveland.

Hue hasn't succeeded here in any measurable way...and we now have more talent-evaluating talent in the FO STR...and maybe as good as any in the NFL.

I'd say the rope is short and the scapegoat options are even less than that.

What 'scapegoat options'? There are none...

You might turn out to be right, Pastor. Hopefully we will have a good vet QB next season and not lose so much.

I know most wanted Hue gone. I didn't care one way or another. My take is nobody wants to turn this team around more than Hue. Nobody. So why not get an OC and let Hue try again next season... at least for a few games?

At least that's what we are stuck with, for now. Hopefully Hue can help turn things around. If not? Later-gator!

All wrong, all wrong. If they are not going to get rid of Hue before the season starts, and before training camp starts,

Then we have to assume Hue gets the entire 2018 season.
0-16 again or not.

And if we don't like it we can lump it! Haslems the owner and it's his call.

I fully expect them to start out 0-5, 0-6, 0-7, and so on, and to come out with the same things they said this year, and last. Going to turn it around at the bye week, ... but then it won't turn around.

It's what I expect, I have no reason not to. (He's got more rope than a rope manaufacturer)... (He's Teflon baby!)

I disagree. I think if we keep losing game after game after game? Haslam will give Hue the boot.

P.S. Isn't it terrible we even have to think things like this?

+

I disagree as well. Haslam won't like an empty stadium. However, T/Long does have history on his side...

I think willie is just trying to be nice.

I think Hue has enough rope to coach himself to solid footing, or coach himself off the team.

Hue has enough rope to hang himself. I'm still not sure he makes it to game 1 this season, but if he does and doesn't win one of his first 3 games, he's gone.

I think if you aren't firing Hue after 0-16 then he's here for the entire 2018 season. Barring something drastic, Hue will be given a chance to coach all 16 games. There's really no point to fire him mid season. At 0-4, playoffs aren't out of the question. Technically, kinda.

What do you mean by drastic? Each loss is a new all time record for losing. He doesn't and won't have the all time worst roster ever assembled, so this is on him.

No, it's on Sashi, Haslam, and Hue.

To think Hue is solely responsible is ignorant.

You know darn well that I was ok with Sashi being fired also.

I was just clarifying.......I was not trying to argue. Just clarifying that there is plenty of blame [I prefer the word "responsibility"] to go around.

Jimmy isn't going to fire himself and has already fired Sashi.

Drastic is along the lines of losing the team.

And I agree. This isn't the least talented team ever assembled and won't be next year. There are a lot of people who convinced themselves even before a game was played that Sashi was a terrible hire. Him being fired somehow justifies that for those people. 0-16 is a coaching issue not a talent issue.

What possible scenario do you think would cause Hue to not be here game 1?? That seems a bit far fetched at this point.

I mean sure, he could die, which I hope doesn't happen. Discord at draft time? Force one of the coordinators on Hue?

If it happens at all, I would think it would be at least 5 games in to next season at the earliest.

From recent history it seems like the preferred time to fire a coach in season is over the bye week. Let's see what our schedule looks like when it comes out. I think Hue is almost guaranteed to last to the bye week.

There seems to be a battle on what OC Hue gets and whether or not that OC calls plays. The forced marriage is already showing signs of strain and Hue is out of other people to fire.

I'm not saying that there is a strong chance that he is gone week one, but there is a reason that we turned down a chance on working with the QB's in the Senior Bowl.

"Turned down"

Normally I would agree.

I think this year is going to have a major emphasis on winning ball games. I think we need 2 wins in the first 5 games.

If we are sitting at 1-4 or 0-5, I don't think it goes beyond that. JMO

If I had to put a number to it, I would tend to agree, 'peen. We need to get a couple of wins early to put this behind us...

We were saying this exact thing a year ago after the Browns set their franchise worst season.



And the year before too. (after 3-13)

Well, hey, I gotta agree - "things can only get better".

Bringing in a GOOD veteran QB that can be our starter will help Hue a ton. Getting him playmakers in free agency and the draft will also be huge. We need to add quality players not more average ones. Hiring an experienced offensive coordinator will take more pressure off Hue as well. This can work. Wecan turn things around quickly with the right moves.

Who says we don't have continuity?

Nothing short of Belichick becoming available. But at that point we'd probably have to fire Dorsey as well. Which I'm totally cool with.

Any time after the Super Bowl and before the start of the league year, or before the Draft, or even before Training Camp.
If someone becomes available, or Haslem has an explanation, about transitioning and getting guys settled in.

If training camp opens, then I'd think it's far fetched.

We'll win 2-3 despite Hue, and everyone will go"Progress!", and we'll continue with him in 2019. And we'll win 2-3. Then, he may get fired. Maybe.

If we win 2-3 Hue will be long gone before the end of the season ...

Man, this board is absurd.

Cleveland Browns: Hue Jackson lays out why he’s a terrible coach

https://nflspinzone.com/2017/12/09/cleveland-browns-hue-jackson-explains-why-hes-terrible-coach/

Hue Jackson, the master of telling on himself, admitted today that he’s a horrible coach for the Cleveland Browns that only knows how to do things one way.

A day after getting Sashi Brown fired and his new general manager, John Dorsey, was hired, Hue Jackson admitted why the Cleveland Browns are in the state they are. Jackson, in what is becoming a weekly tradition of embarrassing press conference moments, when asked what he wanted from his new general manager, answered that the new GM “told him his goal is tor bring him the players that fit the coaches,” per Mary Kay Cabot of Cleveland.com.

The head coach of an NFL football team needs to get players to fit him. In a league filled with coaches adjusting to their players almost on the fly, Jackson is admitting flat out he can’t. And this has been pretty clear year with his mishandling of DeShone Kizer. Instead of catering the offense to his rookie quarterback, Hue demanded the rookie adjust to him. And when it failed, Hue panicked, buried Kizer and tried to go trade for A.J. McCarron.

So while people watch Kizer struggle out there every week, many have criticized the now former head of the Browns personnel department, Sashi Brown, for not picking Carson Wentz and Deshaun Watson. Jackson is admitting that he wouldn’t have adjusted and simply didn’t want Watson, which was already known, but people like to conveniently forget.

Unfortunately, Watson suffered a season-ending knee injury, but Bill O’Brien in Houston completely transformed his offense to fit Watson. This included any number of concepts Watson used at Clemson and more collegiate offensive plays, which resulted in huge results. Hue would’ve made Watson play the same, traditional style pocket passer he’s had for Kizer and it would’ve been a disaster, which is why Jackson didn’t want Watson.

The Eagles offensive staff, including their head coach, offensive coordinator and quarterback coach, all former quarterbacks, met Wentz halfway. They certainly had some of their more traditional NFL concepts, but they incorporated things that Wentz did at North Dakota State to ease the transition. This is a big reason Jackson preferred Jared Goff out of Cal.

Speaking of Goff, a big reason the second year quarterback has had such a terrific second year is new head coach Sean McVay has done a lot to help Goff. Notably, Most notably. McVay is calling his audibles for him, but again, where Jeff Fisher just dumped him into the NFL and he struggled, McVay went back and helped him get more comfortable.

Andy Reid, who has had a ton of success in the NFL with two different franchises and went to a Super Bowl, changed his offense this season to fit around Alex Smith better. They incorporated a ton of run, pass options and different ways to create offense and points. It produced a ton early in the year and has fallen off the second part of the year. Even Reid, who also handed off play calling duties to his offensive coordinator Matt Nagy, is still working, still adjusting to a veteran quarterback that’s been in the NFL for over a decade to try to improve their offense.

Bill Belichick, the coach with a fistfull of rings, changed his offense to fit around a rookie Jacoby Brissett when Jimmy Garoppolo was injured and Tom Brady suspended. The smartest coach in the NFL knew better than to try to ask Brissett to be Brady. He saw what he could do and couldn’t do planned around it, enabling the New England Patriots to win as many football games as Jackson has in almost two years.

The famed West Coast, or Ohio offense, was born out of necessity. Bill Walsh didn’t plan on it. He was forced to come up with when his starting quarterback, Greg Cook, went down to injury and he had to adapt around backup Virgil Carter who was smart, accurate and could move. They found a way to win with what they had and it changed the game. That’s what great coaches do.

Hue Jackson is admitting he can’t do this, won’t do it and has shown he wouldn’t know how if he tried. Jackson is saying he has to have a specific quarterback, great pocket passer. And if that doesn’t happen, he can’t function to the tune of 1-27. And when things go bad, he panics and will scratch and claw his way into blaming anyone else for his own inadequacies.

No level of football is beyond a coach adjusting to the talent on the roster, but particularly the NFL where careers are so fleeting. If Jackson gets Josh Rosen out of UCLA (clearly who he’ll favor) and Rosen were to get injured or is ineffective as a rookie, Jackson will panic and try to do something stupid again. He did it for Carson Palmer in Oakland and crippled their franchise for a few years. He tried to do it for A.J. McCarron in Cleveland in a move that would’ve been a disaster.

Jackson, the man who thinks of himself as some sort of quarterback coaching deity, knows no other way, won’t adjust to a quarterback and has clearly shown why he’s ill-equipped to be the head coach of the Browns or any other team. In a game that is constantly evolving, even in the midst of a single season, Hue Jackson insists on being a dinosaur. They went extinct as did this style of coaching and it’s absurd that this could continue into 2018.

Interesting take.

OK, I can appreciate that, but what if Hue gets canned and the drafted QB doesn't fit the next HC's system? Should this be a concern?

No. We should draft the best QB regardless of HC.

Wait, I know you hate Hue, but are you really taking that article seriously? LOL

Click on the link and look at the picture of the author. If the slanted language and takes were not enough to convince you that the guy is a joke, perhaps the pic will.

What did he actually SAY that you disagree with? I don't care what he looks like.