DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2018 NFL Season 2018 NFL Draft Josh Allen #2

What's that based on?? For Allen to be the best anything it is going to require significant improvement... His potential might be off the charts but I'm tired of the projects we've had,especially with the #1 pick. I want the best QB with the least risk of busting. That means it won't be Allen in my opinion. . . If it is him I'll wait and see and support the guy, but man what a risk.

Folks, we have no say in this matter; we have to trust that Dorsey knows what he's doing. If he fubar's this draft, he's not only out of a job, his career is over. Try to have a little faith.

We've seen so many guys fubar drafts, it's just difficult.

I'll just feel so much better if we don't draft that guy. Rosen, Mayfield, or Darnold. Any of those three. Just not Josh Allen.

We have a serious opportunity here. If Dorsey screws it up, he loses his job. But how does that help me? My team still has had two winning seasons in 20 years and made the playoffs once in 20 years

He's already had a better off-season before the draft, than most of our GMs have had with the draft. As long as he picks anyone close to where they are evaluated, it will be a successful off season.

j/c...

That MMQB article citing a "friend of Dorsey" spilled the beans that Dorsey is leaning Allen is a hoot.

There is very little chance Dorsey stakes his career on Allen. Hell, he just traded his doppelganger in Kizer.

Some numbers....

Mike Clay Verified account
@MikeClayNFL
Worst final FBS season off-target rates among top QB prospects last 3 years:
Josh Allen 16.3%
DeShone Kizer 14.5%
Jeff Driskel 14.4%
Connor Cook 13.5%
C Hackenberg 13.4%

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And...

Brent Sobleski
@brentsobleski
Catchable ball accuracy, per @PFF:

Mayfield: 64.9%
Darnold: 62.1%
Rosen: 54.1%
Allen: 51.0%
Rudolph: 50.6%
Jackson: 49.0%

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I admit to being somewhat intrigued by Allen .... and if I was picking in the 20's, I might take him ..... but I will be extremely unhappy if the Browns take him at #1 overall.

Twenties, sure. Overall number one is so ridiculous, I commend the FO for being so tight-lipped people believe it's a possibility.

Exactly. I just get so nervous seeing all these reports linking us to him lately. At some point, where there's smoke there's fire

He can go ahead and risk his job on Josh Allen with another team as far as I'm concerned.

I'm sick of losing. I'm sick of failures at QB. We have the number one pick, it's not something to screw around with.


All the trades and free agency mean nothing if he screws up this QB pick. And that's the truth. Screw up this QB pick and he's just like all the rest of the GMs we had before. Guys that helped us have two winning seasons in 20 years

Remember .. Last year they were predicting the Browns would take Trubisky right up til the card was read...

I just hope I have some hair left by the time the draft gets here....

Didn't Dorsey pick Mahomes last year....

I have a feeling he's going to try to outsmart himself and will look like an ass...

Mid season Hue and Dorsey will be out of here, if he tries to be a smart ass...

I think all carry a risk factor. Make no mistake, I am not Pimping Allen.

I am going to trust what Dorsey wants. Have no real choice.

I love your logic. LOL

You are sick of losing. Any other QB in this year's draft will bring winning to the Browns in 2018? The talk is the Browns should draft Darnold 1st overall and sit him for the entire year. In essence, to throw away this year's first overall pick for a future prospect in 2019. I believe any player taken first overall should be played immediately and I believe Josh Allen is the guy for the Browns.

I can support this point of view.

If you are willing to take a QB in the first round as your franchise QB, you should be willing to take the QB first overall.

I would rather see the Browns take Allen than Darnold.

Baker Mayfield should be the pick, but they will go with a taller guy.

They've made clear that Tyrod Taylor will be the Browns 2018 starting QB. So that's that. And I'm fine with that. I accepted it. But Tyrod has only one year left on his contract.

What i'm not okay with is having the number 1 pick, and three QBs who have shown themselves to be viable options for that pick, and saying, "Frig it, I'm gonna choose what's behind curtain number four".


This isn't about this year. It's about 2019, 2020, and 2021, and so on.

I'll tell ya what; if we select Josh Allen, Ken Zampese better get ready to coach his butt off, and then pray that any of it correlates into actual games

Why is that?

I get a kick out of some of these "advanced statistics".

Rosen is regarded as the most polished passer in the draft... throws with anticipation, throws receivers open, pin point accuracy, etc... Allen, well he can't hit the barn side of a broad lol.

What is "catchable ball accuracy" anyway? Is that like "happily married marriage rates"?

Gee, I'm sold.

What the heck is "AFC North QB" anyway?

An AFC QB is a QB that can play in inclement weather, large enough to absorb repeated hits by good AFC defenses, can play under center, is a good play action QB, has a strong arm to throw the ball through the winds that often are present on game day in AFC North games.

I would say that a QB with a history of concussions, played in a gimmicky offense in college (spread, read option, any Big 12 school), no football IQ (able to make adjustments) are all criteria of a non-AFC North QB. Take it for what it is or not. It is what I see as a AFC North QB. Winning the AFC North is the only excepted minimum goal every season. Until you win the AFC North, you are just the Cleveland Browns, laughing stock of the NFL.

Not only would Dorsey be risking his career on a QB analytics says has a 62% chance to bust (Mayfield under 30%), but he's risking his career that Hue and Haley can develop him.

I get the impression that now that we have Tyrod, it's ok to take a risk at #1 because we have a very serviceable QB.

I also believe this pick is going to be all Dorsey. I don't think he's going to be diligent with this pick, I think he's going to pick the guy he has a "feeling" about. I've read that's partly why he was let go in Kansas City. Without any consent from the organization, he went rogue and drafted Kevin Hogan.

If he picks Allen, I hope he's right, but the odds say he's not.

Allen is intelligent, has generational physical tools, displays a great attitude and wants to be in Cleveland. He's the guy!
I really like Mayfield, and I think Rosen will be good right away. But long term, Allen looks special to me.

I have heard Hue Jackson say things before. Remember Hue what said about drafting Cody Kessler? Hue Jackson has less and less to say about the team personnel in my opinion until he wins. I believe that Tyrod Taylor was brought in because they wanted to win now and were unsure of the play now, win now prospects in the draft. Hue has no cover left. He wasted it with RG3, Josh McCown, Deshone Kizer, and Cody Kessler. His reputation as a QB whisperer is tarnished. I believe that Todd Haley has more to say about who the Browns play at QB in 2018 than Hue Jackson does.

As this is only my feelings about the matter, I believe that Todd Haley would not have come to Cleveland under other circumstances. I have no inside knowledge of the Browns plans. I am only trying to make a reasoned and logic guess. If Allen is taken #1 overall, if Darnold is taken #1 overall, I believe they will be given every opportunity to win the job and if they do, Hue Jackson will come out and say so in a press conference even though he previously said that Tyrod Taylor was the starting QB in 2018.

And what evidence you have to back any of these claims up?

This is all speculation with no evidence behind it? Correct?

Hogan was a 5th round pick. I find it doubtful that a QB picked in the 5th round is going to jeopardize someone's career.

And, if you read what's being written Dorsey uses the word "consensus" alot. Some opinions might carry more weight than others but he certainly has not given everyone the finger and sat in his office deciding who he and he alone will pick...

I agree. The guy has walked on at two different programs and started. He is the most accurate and has a good arm.

If he was a inch or two taller there wouldn't even be any talk about who we would take.

You can already see people talking themselves into this rubbish.

Baker Mayfield is definitely a player i wouldn't doubt to be successful in this league.

Not one bit.

I'd love Baker Mayfield to come here. Not my top guy (Rosen), but still a solid choice.

He's had a lot of experience, and he's proven himself wherever he goes. He's certainly not someone i'd ever tell that they "can't" do something.


My biggest nervousness with Mayfield is that he might have a bit too much of a "Me" attitude. Which is something that might work in college, but grown men will see right through

Sure we do.

But looking forwards, as Tyrod is only signed for 2018, wouldn't you want the best prospect?

And with understanding that Tyrod is merely our QB for 2018, what makes anyone think that in 2019, Josh Allen will magically "Get it" and become a good QB?

I have a lot more faith in guys who already have had some success in college, than a guy like Allen who really hasn't shown much other than inconsistency at Wyoming.

The NFL is a big step up, and in some ways, you are what you are. You can improve on it, but you still are what you are. And Allen, in College, was inconsistent with his accuracy and his decision making.

The other three, are far ahead of him in those terms. Wouldn't it make sense to draft one of them? Even if they wait out the season, I'd have more faith in the guys who already kind of get it, verses the ones who don't get it at all.


Accuracy, anticipation, ability to read defenses. Those are the most important traits in a QB. Pick one that has those traits. Don't pick some guy who doesn't, hoping you can coach those traits into them for 2019.

It's absolutely ludicrous.

Drafting #1, you want a true franchise QB and a 6 ft QB with immaturity issues isn't a franchise QB.

We.will draft Darnold and leave the running around, running from the cops Smurf QB to be someone else's problem.

As for Allen, the fractured clavical and shoulder issue worry me more than accuracy.

Yeah the fractured clavicle really stopped him from throwing 70 yard bombs at his pro-day and the combine.

I be more concerned with soft tissue injuries (ie. labrum, rotator cuff). A. Rodgers has had 2 collarbone breaks and he seems to be pretty good still.

It's not the ability to throw the ball, it's the ability to take a hit. He didn't play much and even then it wasn't against the size speed combo if the nfl.

I think if we had gone out and snagged one of the top top QB FA's (Smith or Cousins, only) then I could get on board with grabbing Allen later in the first (with a trade down/up, whatever). As much as I love having Tyrod here, we still have to take the most sure thing at QB in the draft. There is a chance that Allen will turn into everything people think he can be, but we're not in a position to take on that type of risk at #1. We don't have a Favre for Allen to be our Rodgers.

When I put everything I have into driving the golf ball, I can hit it pretty far. It usually ends up on another hole.

No benefit to hitting it far if it doesn't go where you need it to go.

With QB, if I had to choose between accuracy and a cannon ... I will take accuracy.

That's not what I am saying. If we only had a pick in the 20s, and he fell in the draft, and was there when we picked, I would consider taking a shot with him. However, I think that there is much better quality at 1 and 4 than Allen. If we were in the mid 20's, and if we didn't have a franchise QB, then I would be willing to take a chance on Allen. I am not willing to do so at 1 or 4 though.

NFL.com had Casserly's draft, and he has us going Darnold at 1, Chubb at 4, and then has us trading back to the 1st with the Eagles, and us getting Michel in the 1st as well. (which I assume would be us trading either 33 or 35 and some combination of a 4th, 5th and/or 6th)

I would love that 1st round.