DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Ban assault weapons, buy them back, go after resisters: Ex-prosecutor in Congress

On a different note, I was speaking with a school security consultant last week who is trying to come up with ways to make the interior of the schools safer. He admits that nothing he is working on will work outside of the building itself, like in the parking lot, at a sporting event, kids loading or unloading off the bus, etc..

But he has developed a prototype (and actually built it at a couple of different schools).. it involves modifying the school lobby with masonry walls, concrete filled, security glass all around, a single door entry point, a pass through of backpacks so you are not in possession of your backpack for a few minutes... overall it looks like an interesting and effective plan to keep guns OUT of the school.. the challenges with it are that it creates a single door entry point, which is going to be a nightmare first thing in the morning when all the kids arrive unless you have multiple of these. You are creating this confined box inside the school which if a kid walked into with a gun, would be shooting fish in a barrel until somebody took him down.. it doesn't include any metal detectors and the cost of construction, based on the school it is being retrofit into is about $175k.. I know some folks have run some numbers on what it would take to protect a school.. well there is an actual number and a description of what it will accomplish. The cost obviously does not include anybody attending to this area, that would be in addition to.

This system sounds similar to what we have. All pistol purchases require a permit prior to. Basicy, you go to the Sheriff's office, fill out a short form, present valid ID, and they'll do a background check. Of everything is good to go, you get a permit (it's like $5). Essentially its a prepaid background check so when you go to the gun show you can make a same day purchase. Its one permit per pistol. The seller then maintains the permit and sales paperwork for i think 3 years before being able to discard it. Its approved by the Sheriff, but there's no actual interview.

Now if you have a valid CCW permit, which is valid for 5 yrs, you don't have to have a permit for each purchase. Same thing with my badge.

You brought up a key word "objective". The problem is, we can't reach objective solutions if we aren't looking at the factors objectively, and i don't think that is being done for the most part. I think some of that is due to a) agendas and b) a lack of agreeing on information that would build a launching pad for amy further discussion. And of course we all have our viewpoints.

For example: I don't believe suicide by firearms should be included in the violent gun deaths statistics. In my experience people typically don't commit suicide because a method gave them the idea. They've made a decision largely a part from the method (although some people go to great lengths to be creative).

I'm not trying to say anyone is wrong for including those stats, rather I'm simy stating the position I'd be coming from.

I also think it's important to factor in how many times a gun is used in self defense or to save someone's life, be it pulling the trigger or simply brandishing it. IMO the rates by which people use it to defend themselves should be just as relevant as the rates by which people do harm.

I would love to see those statistics with those taken out, however for political reason I do not think we ever will.

Do you know where the line is for disqualification? Is a DUI 8 years ago enough? Is having the police at your house for suspicion of domestic violence enough even if no charges were ever filed? Since I live in the same place you do, I'd love to read up on what is a disqualifier... not that I would have any... I'm a choir boy...

Thanks for the input, i was hoping you'd chime in again.

Compromise is supposed to be a mutually agreed upon deal where both sides give up some things, but also both walk away with all or at least part of what they wanted right?

I'm sorry but i just don't see what your side is giving up in exchange for anything. You personally may not have a problem with further restrictions because maybe you don't own a gun (i don't know if you do or don't). Gou wouldn't actually be giving anything up by giving up whole or in part a Right you don't ever intend to exercise anyway.

I haven't seen anyone in favor of stricter background checks, registrations, licensing,etc say "well, if they can pass the strict background check and receive sufficient training, then i would compromise and allow teachers to carry concealed in the classroom".

Sorry man, but i hear talk of compromise, but I'm just not seeing what the other side wants to concede.

And I'll be honest with you 442, i think there are more 2A people willing to have discussions and entertain compromises, but if someone is going to make a proposal, but can't answer basic questions like "How will this actually help?" Or "what kind of limits and checks will there be so that new laws/regulations won't be abused?", There really isn't anything to discuss.

At least i dont think so.

I think people tend to forget or simply not realize, but the gun issue is a very personal one for a lot of people and you have to address it as such.

For example, if someone says Devil should turn his AR in, than i think it only fair that someone tell me how my rifle specifically will help reduce gun violence.

Tell Devil to register his guns in a Fed database? Ok, but someone should be able to tell me how giving up thag level of privacy will help anything.

Unfortunately it has to be that specific because 99.999% of the people who are subject to those laws would never have hurt someone in the first place, so the whole vague and nebulous "to reduce gun violence" isn't going to cut it for most of us.

The AR 15 has been around since the 1960's why is in just now an issue?



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ArmaLite_AR-15

The problem is where does it stop?

Ok....next have a buy back program on shotguns. Then others. I am from the school that guns aren't the problem, idiots are the problem.

I don't own a AK, but fully support a persons right to own one.


I don't like legislating law abiding citizens in to criminals. That is a slippery slope.

Some years back a few idiots thought that outlawing liquor was a good idea. That signature made millions of people law breakers overnight and created a crime wave unseen prior.


Now if we want to have a serious discussion about background checks, I can deal with that.


If you simply want to take weapons from people, you thrust us in to civil chaos.


Doing this will unseat society as we know it.

This is a good thing if not used in the wrong way.

Honestly I don't knkw the specifics as to what all the background check includes aside from the criminal history. There may be a check in local agency databases to see if there is a mental health concern. Felo y is an automatic disqualifier, DUI's don't matter, and domestic violence isn't likely to be an issue if there aren't any criminal charges/convictions.

One idea I've ki ked around is having all gun sales over seen by a dealer. Right now there is no prohibition on a private sale, other than things like not knowingly selling to a felon, or having knowledge it is going to be used in the commission of a crime. A private seller can require a permit for their own records, but its not required.

I think i might be willing to entertain a requirement that all private sales be required to be overseen by someone with a FFL. A permit would be required and the documents maintained by them under the same regulations as if they sold the gun. Right now i believe if you purchase a gun online or it needs shipped, it has to be sent to a FFL dealer.

Kind of like a notary for gun sales.

Good idea. Could charge a small fee and file proper documents. Excellent idea actually.