DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Jury awards $4 to family of black man killed by sheriff’s deputies in Fla.

Yeah, but it doesn't fit the political narrative of the GOP sermons we get here.

Not to mention the disgusting insult of the Jury award.

ALL, repeat, ALL statements involving "the running dude" were part of a HYPOTHETICAL (that would be something that did NOT actually happen) scenario, and were in no way stated, suggested, or implied to be a part of what actually happened.

This was clearly explained and defined, and is the reason I previously referred to several of your questions involving "the running dude" as absurd and nonsensical, as you appeared to be conflating the hypothetical situation with what actually happened, and your questions appeared to assume that events which did not happen, actually did. As does the rest of your current post. AT no point, in no way, did I state or imply that the dead guy, at any time, was running towards the children. Learn to read and comprehend more completely, you are making stuff up.

Hell, white women dont trust white men either. In todays day and age most women dont trust most men. I can understand why too , most of us are dogs

Old, at what point did you "understand my argument", was it the first time I stated it clearly, or the sixth or seventh, and what, specifically, was different from the beginning statement to the last one?

The points which you now apparently understand, are the exact same ones which you, and especially Swish, have continually whined that I have never made.

Now you tell us. Good save.

Do yourself a favor and just stop posting in this thread. You’ve embarrassed yourself quite enough.

Ah, I see.. so in a thread about an actual event, where we have a fair amount of detail about the actual event... you pick many things that are directly in line with that event, change some of them to make them sound worse and more dire than the actual event... then claim the whole thing was a hypothetical..

Well, if you were backpedalling any faster.. and if there was something behind you.. I'd be scared you might trip and hurt yourself.. No need to respond to that, it's a hypothetical...

This shooting happened in 2014 which could explain the lack of video...

A Florida family is calling for justice after a federal jury cleared a sheriff’s deputy of using excessive force in the 2014 shooting of Gregory Hill Jr. and awarded the family $4 in damages for funeral expenses and pain and suffering.

Hill, an African-American father of three, was fatally shot in 2014 after a white sheriff’s deputy responded to a noise complaint, CNN reported. A mother picking up her child at a school across the street from Hill’s home heard Hill playing music in his garage and called in the complaint.

When St. Lucie County Deputies Christopher Newman and Edward Lopez showed up at Hill’s house, they knocked on his garage door and front door, according to the lawsuit filed by Hill’s mother in 2016.

“After Newman knocked on the doors, the garage door opened revealing Hill within the comfort of his own garage and home,” the lawsuit said. “Upon information and belief, Deputy Lopez indicated loudly that Hill had a gun and then the garage door closed. Despite the door being closed, Newman fired his handgun approximately four times and killed Hill.”

Two bullets hit Hill in the abdomen and one hit him in the head. A SWAT team arrived and released chemical agents into the house, and then authorities realized Hill was dead. He was found with an unloaded handgun in his back pocket.

Newman said he fired at Hill because the man had been holding the gun during their interaction, but Hill’s family disputed that claim.


http://time.com/5297891/gregory-hill-jury-awards-4-dollars-police-shooting/

Just so y'all know the garage is attached to the house

Sorry pal, you lost me when you said I whined about something. Show me where I whined about a single thing. All I remember doing was calling you out when you claimed to be a genius. Is that whining to you?

I really would like to know if anything happened in between those two events.. he opened the garage door, cop yelled gun, garage door closed..

In between opening the garage door and cop seeing the gun, was there any interaction? Any words spoken? Yelling? Threats?

As I said, what was the ACTION that caused the cops to fire?

The only way any of this remotely flies is if the cop thought his life wasn’t in danger from a slow moving garage door.

He had an unloaded gun in his back pocket.

This is why body cams need to be mandatory.

This happened in 2014 did they have body cams then?




https://ballotpedia.org/Police_body_camera_use_in_the_United_States

Yes

https://ballotpedia.org/Police_body_camera_use_in_the_United_States [/quote]

Any gun is considered loaded at all times. The officers would not have had any way of knowing whether it was loaded or not. You said that saying the level of intoxication was a way to discredit the man, yet saying the gun was unloaded when it doesn't matter is way of trying to discredit the officer that shot.

Agreed. I want to see more information to see how/what made them think this way.

agree 10000000%

I understood the premise.
To answer your question: no. In 2014, there probably weren't body cams.

WHICH IS WHY SWISH IS PROPOSING THEY BE MANDATORY GOING FORWARD.

This situation is an example of exactly his point.
You just helped him put an exclamation point on it.

[in my best Marv Albert voice]: "Vambo: with the assist... Swish with the tomahawk- YES!!!"

What a useful tool.

Body cams for police where available in 2005.

In the U.S. cameras started to appear in police departments in 2014, experts predicted behavior on both sides of the badge would improve under the watchful eye of the lens.

You’re correct that the officers had no way of knowing if the gun was loaded or not.

But again, there’s been no reports saying the gun was actually pointed at the cops or anybody else for that matter.

And that’s why I’m harping on that action that took place. Cause if people are making the argument that simply having a gun on your person is a threatening action, then we should have a way higher body count every year than what we’ve seen.

None of the other situations matter if there was no threatening action that Hill made which warranted a deadly response from the cops.

Over loud music.

Correct, I have not seen any reports other than an officer yelling "gun".

Again, the only thing I have seen on here, is that he was intoxicated with a weapon. Is that enough to warrant a threatening action? I know where I live, its against the law to be intoxicated and carrying a weapon. That doesn't preclude you to getting shot for doing so though.

There are lot of scenarios which could have happened. Officer 1 screams GUN, officer two assumes the other officer saw the mad reach and he opened fire. Justified? depends on who you ask.

Another scenario, the man saw a black guy with a gun, got scared and shot. Justified. Nope.

Another scenario, the man threatened the police etc., went to shut the door, and was fired upon. Justified, possibly.

another scenario, the man reached to close the door, as he did so reached for the gun, but was fired upon before he could grab it. Justified, yes.

IMO all of these could have happened. Which is why I want more information, and to date, we have not received more. but that does not mean that questions should not be asked, because like I said, this has some stench to it at the very least.

And it says something that the cops haven’t released more information.

Because as we’ve already seen, if they truly think it’s a good shooting, they release video or investigation reports and all that.

Yet in this case, they’ve haven’t been as forthcoming with the details.

Well obviously the punishment for not doing that should be a death sentence.

"Newman said"? That's what we have, we only have the cops side because dead men tell no tales? And the police department isn't exactly forthcoming with all the details as Swish pointed out already.

so wait wait wait wait wait.

Hill was holding the gun the ENTIRE time?

if thats the case, why did the cops wait until the garage door started closing to fire? why didn't they shoot him on the spot?

this is the crap im talking about. if the cops stated that he had the gun on him the entire time, then it makes zero sense that they waited until after the door closed to fire.

so now, if they shot him, how did an unloaded gun end up in his backpocket, if indeed he held the gun in his hand the entire time?

and once again, what threatening action did he take that warranted the cops to fire?

bro this is increasingly looking like the cops fabricated a story.

and as well all know, this wouldnt be anywhere close to the first time.

CNN news report

So true and it won't be the last until body cams are mandatory everywhere.

The thing about body cams is that they are far more likely to confirm the officer's account, and help to convict a defendant.

There are times where they do indeed show the officer behaving badly, and this goes the other way around.

Which one do you think you are more likely to hear about on social media, or CNN?

I'm just saying.. for those who wish for universal body cams, be careful what you wish for. It's likely that facial recognition technology will be incorporated into body cams in the future as well. What you're really wishing for is to give police more and more effective tools to do their jobs-- something many people are surely ok with, but I suspect this is not where Swish and Spiral are going with this.

what in the world are you talking about?

thats the ENTIRE POINT of making body cams mandatory, so it can either corroborate the officers account, or the defendants.

thats the entire POINT. to make officers more effective at the jobs. that benefits EVERYBODY.

lol haus you was better off not saying anything. what a joke.

He was speculating about now and into the future, not necessarily about this one incident.. Yes the technology existed then but they weren't as common..

You left out this part...




https://ballotpedia.org/Police_body_camera_use_in_the_United_States [/quote] [/quote]

Vambo, nobody is taking about using body cams then. I simply implied that we need mandatory body cams NOW.

I really don’t understand what point you’re trying to make here, because it has nothing to do with what was stated.

Never change Swish. You make this forum fun sometimes, a hard thing to do.

You make it sound like the left is demanding accuracy and accountability. That may be their stated goal. I have my doubts about their authenticity, but there will be an easy way to find out.

If/when (when) police body cams are overwhelmingly more likely to be used to convict defendants (keeping in mind who is more likely to be a defendant in the first place) than they are to acquit them, we'll see what the reaction is.

If it's a dejected concession that the right was right all along, so be it. Accuracy and accountability it was. If the left collectively screams and throws a hissy fit, we'll know the left was full of crap the entire time.

I still don't think you've thought through all the ramifications. Fast forward 5-10 years, and let's say all police officers are required to wear body cams. But with this, these devices also incorporate facial recognition technology and it is synced to a database that is continually updated with information about people who have warrants out for their arrest, "undocumented immigrants", and other persons of interest. And officers will instantly know the status of just about every person they encounter.

Is this a good thing, or no? It's an honest question. I don't have a good answer for it. It seems like it would be a nightmare scenario for the left but they just keep pushing these body cams. I'm not sure what to make of it-- a failure of long-term thinking, perhaps.

Swish, I gave my two cents earlier, but this thing keeps going, so why not just in, because it is obvious we got nothing better to do....first, we posters have all the facts. And each of us is correct in our own minds......Some facts- I think.

This happened 4 years ago, do you REALLY think cops are going to release more info.....look at map, ST. LUCIE county isn't near any population centers, they got NO money of cops, or body cameras, so please....I promise, the cops of THAT county moved on LONG AGO....so should we.

Bottomline, a drunk black man died in his garage, his music was to loud, he illegally had a gun, he was killed with garage door going down or already down, but shot thru door by cops who thought they were threatened......I don't get it, neither do lots of other posters, but a jury looked into it and didn't press ANY charges....how's our society doing.

Four years later we will never have any for info AND body cameras will NEVER be mandatory BECAUSE law abiding citizens don't want to pay for them......criminals get shot. Some th ink no great loss. They don't believe in E Hemingway "For Whom the Bell Tolls, It Tolls for Thee". Some richer, progressive police departments are getting body cameras...never happen at today's prices for most police departments.

Spent lots of time on 4 year old police, jury, FINISHED case.

How much time do poster think about these CURRENT issues- from Jackass- Chicago crime update site- these are close- every 3:15 minutes some one is shot, every 17:40 min someone murdered....84% no prosecution...most shootings black on black crime... these are CURRENT problems....what's the fix. Cameras on every street corner. Black Lives Do Matter, and some improvement compared to last year.....but, numbers are always staggering.

Thought-provoking post.

Shootings and killings in Chicago have been consistently declining since President Trump took office. More detail: https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/01/us/chicago-crime-drop-april/index.html

Again, what is your point?

That somehow demanding more methods of accountability is a bad thing?

IMO, there’s little difference between a cop having a body cam on him and the cameras you see on all the street corners in metro areas.

The only difference is one is mobile, and one is not.

Do you realize YOU created this narrative of the left and accountability? Where in gods name are you getting this from? All of my post have been speaking from my perspective and no one else. I never made the claim that “the left” is doing anything.

I have said this is what minorities have a problem with. Which means the ONLY way your made up narrative makes sense is if you believe all minorities are on the left?

Is that your stance? Because if not, then once again, you have made a completely useless post.

I mean damn. Your entire post is framed off the hilariously false narrative that only the left wants body cams. Which tells the board you have completely ignored the many calls for body cams on the right.

Classic Haus. Somehow assuming that a certain line of thinking is only exclusive to the left.

You, vambo, and Nelson are really on a roll with your blatant false narratives, misdirections and assumptions.

I'm neither for nor against requiring police officers to wear body cams. I don't care much either way. Just putting some observations and ideas out there that I don't think have gotten enough consideration. Beyond that, I'll keep an open mind. I'm sure I'll come to a stronger opinion in time.

don’t want to pay for a lot of things, yet that hasn’t stopped the government from spending money on programs they think will help.

If you want to talk about black on black crime, make a separate thread about it. Black on black crime is not an excuse for racism. I don’t here white on white crime being a problem, despite the fact that close to 90% of all murders by whites are done by other white people.

The only way bringing black on black crime when it comes to police shootings work is if you believe black people are inherently violent.

Do you?