DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum NBA Finals: Avoiding the Sweep

I agree with all five points.

Punch and Spergon are good BB posters but our agreement ends there.

I don't want Lebron to leave. The Cavs record for the 4 seasons he was gone was 97-215, and it could have easily been worse had it not been for lucking into the #1 pick that would become Irving. Gilbert has his positives (willingness to spend, can get deals done) but he doesn't know basketball at all. Tyronn Lue and Mike Brown (twice!).. enough said.

So yeah, I know if Lebron leaves the Cavs are screwed. All those assets we had several years ago took a long time to acquire. We had extremely good luck in the lottery. Lebron came back in his prime. We won't be able to just throw an unprecedented amount of assets around to build a team. The road back to relevance will mean having to make consistently sound basketball decisions over a long period of time, plus a little luck.

Saying Cleveland fans don't deserve a winner is a bunch of crap, especially when you say it on a Cleveland Browns message board. If there's any bunch that deserves a winner, it's Browns fans. It's not like the Indians and Cavs haven't had their own tough breaks as well, this bright stretch in Cavs history notwithstanding.

Believe me, I think he's leaving, but man I wish he would stay. I totally understand though.

I think it would be really hard to make this team any better.

It's kinda funny, last year after the finals, I kinda felt like with what Golden State had, and what we had, that we just weren't gonna beat them status quo.

But you watch how they played this year, they were vulnerable, for how good they were. Having Kyrie, in hindsight, I think you could have made it a series.

We'll never know why Kyrie really wanted out. Maybe after everyone is done playing, we will. I tend to believe the theory that the Cavs kinda felt like I did, with just not being good enough as is, and they floated Kyrie's name out to a few teams. He got wind of it, and demanded a trade. I don't think it was anything about being second fiddle. Truth is, with the way Jayson Tatum played this year, Kyrie could easily find himself again as second fiddle to Tatum, who plays well at both ends, is physically gifted, and also doesn't have an injury history.

I think Kyrie's ego got banged up a little bit, and wanted out. I don't think it had anything to do with Lebron. You can say a lot of things about Lebron, but it'd be hard to find a former teammate who didn't like playing with him, and being in the league 15 years, he's had a ton of them.

If he leaves, I hope they strip it down all the way. Get what you can for Love, Korver, Hill, Tristan, etc.. Those guys have value. You're probably stuck wtih JR for another season. You can start your rebuild with the 8th pick this year, and then you'll probably be top 3 the next year, and just hopefully it's a top heavy draft.

It sucks. Going back to being a 20ish win team isn't fun. I think the organization as a whole learned a lot these last four years. Hopefully they can take that knowledge and apply it.

Or maybe Lebron just signs his supermax deal in Cleveland and the Cavs just figure it out.

Some team in this league is going to make 1-2 really good moves, and that's probably where Lebron ends up. The Cavs could easily keep Lebron if those moves are made, no question.

It's just tough because we don't really have the assets. The 8th pick would obviously be a part of any of these moves, but what else do you package up that someone would want? Cavs are in a real tough spot, but there's no doubt in my mind that if they could bring in another really good player, that Lebron would stay.

realistically, what moves can be made? we have the 8th pick ... that MIGHT acquire a borderline star on a team who's looking to dump him (Demarcus Cousins?), but we'd have to throw in some expiring contracts probably.

Love might get us something, but at the same time it also means we'll lose him.

Honestly, LBJ can't stay if he's trying to win the title.

It has been said that the TT contract is a back breaker .. Not being able to deal him and JR is really tough ..

just imagine if they were both team options ... we'd be sitting pretty right now

The Shumpert deal killed us too. We decided to invest the majority of our cap into the core of Lebron, Love, Kyrie, TT, JR and Shump. And after that, all of them sort of underwhelmed. That's where the core of our problems start. Those 6, well, minus Lebron.

Shump pretty much disappeared after he got his deal. We turned his contract into George Hill and Rodney Hood, which was actually a pretty good deal.

I've been thinking about what a free pass Kyrie has gotten from the media and the fans [at least the ones I have read.]

A lot of blame has been directed toward Gilbert, LeBron, and others. Yet, I don't hear guys like Stephen A. Smith putting any of the blame at Kyrie's doorstep.

I don't know what happened, but it appears to me that Kyrie's motivation was selfish. I have read that the Celtics are worried about losing him soon and that he has a desire to play in New York.

Just something new to talk about.

I read a blog or something awhile ago that speculated that players compare themselves to each other through the one-on-one game. It's what they've done since they were kids, and in the NBA, every player wants to be the one to break the ankles of another guy. Kyrie is probably the best one-on-one player in the world, and it's likely he beat Lebron (and others) frequently in practices. He could also put up 50+ a game doing his thing, and he probably got to the point where he thought, "I'm the better player! I can beat him one-on-one and score more points than him. Why does Lebron get all the attention?"

But 5-on-5 is so much more different than 1-on-1. For all of Kyrie's great qualities in the solo game, it doesn't translate when things move to a team game. He's not the best defender, he doesn't set up teammates well, he thinks shot before pass, etc. Kyrie probably values himself at the solo game, while teams value him at the team game, and that probably eats him up inside.

To be honest I’d rather have shumpert at 10/year than George hill at 20. Hill is the worst contract in the nba by a wide margin. Outside maybe Deng or Batum

Dear Cleveland,

Had a blast. Miss you already.

Sincerely,
EveDawg

We had good seats.

Because horses.

Oh, and coming home, I was wearing the Cavs shirt they give you at the game, and all kinds of random people had sooooooo much sympathy.

I think the whole world watched that game.

And there were Cavs fans every where. At the airport in Cle, O'Hare, Atl.
Like everywhere.

I know they are bandwagoners. Mostly. When Lebron leaves, nobody will cheer for us.

But hey, it was fun while it lasted!

The most important thing that happened on that trip was I got over my fear of flying. So, I guess I'm going to Long Island next.

The king has not yet decreed that his reign in Cleveland is over yet...

The Celtics might do that for him if he stays.

Great stuff, Eve. Was it all worth the trip? It sure sounds like it was.

Cleveland rocks! (And "Full Moon Over Parma" for true Drew Carey Show fans!)

It was, yes. I would do it again. I knew we were going to lose after Game 1, so the loss didn't bother me much. I was just pleased to be able to see my team play in a championship game in Cle with the GOAT on our team. That's kind of priceless, win or lose.

I didn't stay with family for this trip. My hotel was downtown near the Q. (Drury Plaza). So I did a lot of walking around downtown. That was a lot of fun. Cle downtown is much nicer and safer than Atl downtown.

Here is the hotel. It was very nice.

Oh, and we ate here:

https://www.sokolowskis.com/

I know it's kind of a famous place. They talk about it on food network / travel channel shows. So had to go there. (and I'm half Polish). Food was great. I love Cleveland.

Edit: Plus the picture of Anthony Bourdain with the restaurant owners staring at me while I ate. Cheers, Mr Bourdain.

A 10 mg Valium taken before boarding should help.

Be sure and rent a car, there’s nothing like driving on the Long Island Expressway. Nascar has nothing on those folks.

Dr prescribed some Xanax. But I got over it. Didn't take any of it on the way back. Some liquor on layover, but that was it. I am cool now, which is weird because I had this phobia for years and years.

I know, right. I have lots of family in NY, NJ....anytime I am there I fear for my life driving on those freeways. Omg.

Josh Cribbs
‏Verified account @JoshCribbs16

Rumor has it @KingJames bringing @russwest44 to the @cavs #enoughsaid #cavs #2019nbachamps 🙄🙄🙄 👆🏾👆🏾👆🏾😱😱 #powerhouse




HMMM

Westbrook is signed with the Thunder through the 22-23 season..

Yes, he is ... but I'll be honest, I had heard rumblings of them wanting to move on from the Westbrook era, especially if PG leaves

Trade everybody for him, but Love and Nance Jr. And JR.

Not gonna happen-- Westbrook is a former MVP in his prime, signed for 5 more years. His trade value is very very high if he's even available (doubtful.)

I mean, in order to not get laughed off the phone, we'd have to build the package around Love, the #8 pick, and any other desirable assets/players if we have any (do we?) That would upgrade us to a courteous, "no thanks, we're not interested in dealing Russ."

There's also the issue that in order to make contracts work, we'd have to send a lot of money out. The problem is that outside of Lebron and Love, all of our highly paid players are burdens (i.e. have negative trade value.) Nobody wants to get stuck paying Hill $19m a year, TT $17m a year, JR $14m a year, or Clarkson $12m a year.

I'm skeptical of this but if it's true, there are teams that could offer a lot more than the Cavs could.

Wait and see what the Cavs can and or can't do. The WWE errrr, NBA can allow or not allow whatever it wishes.

Thanks for sharing your experience, Eve. Very cool!

I want to get back to the Kyrie thing.

How good were the Cavs w/Kyrie and w/out LeBron?

How many games has Kyrie missed due to injuries in his career?

How many guys would want out of a situation in which they were in 3 straight Finals [and you missed most of one of them due to injury,] and won one of them?

How freaking selfish do you have to be in order to demand a trade under the above circumstances?

Kyrie has gotten a pass from the media that he does not deserve.

Excel brought up some very good points. Kyrie was an awful defender when he was here. He wanted to dominate the ball. He wasn't all that interested in setting up his teammates. He missed a ton of games due to injuries. The team sucked when he was the main guy.

And he wanted out? How freaking petty and selfish is that?

You dont know what the situation was internally. All any of us know is the reports we hear that are based solely on rumors.

If you were working somewhere and were not happy, would it be selfish and petty of you to want to leave for somewhere that you would be happier?

Lebron to the Spurs makes a lot of sense:

- Add him to Kawhi and Aldridge
- Popp would fulfill his dream of playing for a GREAT coach ... and LBJ would be coached
- Maybe they could even pull CP3 to them as well ... if they all rework contracts (he has a great relationship with Popp and Bron)

Chris Paul
Lebron James
Kawhi Leonard
Lamarcus Aldridge


That's a start

I see him going to LA or San Antonio if he leaves.... aybe Houston but I'd think la or San antiono

LBJ has gone for max contracts each year, in order to maximize this coming contract. (a 5 year, likely his last) I don't see him signing for less than the max.

Which teams can afford that kind of deal while also maintaining their roster?

The only way Paul would get there is if he signed a veteran minimum. Even getting Lebron there is difficult, as they are $4 mill over the salary cap already for next season. They would have to move quite a number of contracts just to get Lebron under the cap.

I still think they are the dark-horse candidate to get him though, because of the reasons you said. They just won't be able to stack the roster.

I said Cleveland, not the Eastern Conference.