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I thought this was a "public message board"...oh, that's only when you post something someone else doesn't like, like in the shack. You're not a ref on this board. Learn to deal with that. If you don't like a post, DON'T READ IT.
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If a guy doesn't practice well, what measuring stick is used to determine he gets in games??
That has me perplexed as well.
If Frye doesn't practice well, and Anderson does......why is RAC flipping a coin?
Start Anderson this week and start Frye the next.
Or Frye this and DA next......now is the time to find out.
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Posted by Referee00-- Just a kind reminder to folks, we all like to joke and have fun, but let's keep Pure Football as being "Pure Football"... especially now that Football has started again.
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Last I checked, you weren't the ref. You posting whining about how others post also adds nothing to the discussion. Let the refs do their job. You aren't one of them.
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I realize you have a hard time remembering that this isn't your personal fiefdom. But that's OK. I didn't expect you to change when everyone moved over here. I just thought is was rather funny that you constantly run around and chide people for their posting habits. I shall try and refrain from finding the humor in your posts in the future. It shouldn't be hard....... 
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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If a guy doesn't practice well, what measuring stick is used to determine he gets in games??
Good question. I don't have an answer for it. I do know that Savage and Crennel both new this before he was drafted and talked about what happened at the Senior Bowl week.
General reply...
Pure football does mean pure football. It has always been that way and always should. I'm not sure how extended conversations about this in a topic helps though. Maybe if the Refs would step in it would help keep us on track.
#gmstrong
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If a guy doesn't practice well, what measuring stick is used to determine he gets in games??
Well,I'm not saying "practice doesn't account for part of the equasion",because it does.
Now before I "go down this path" don't feel that I'm trying to equate Davidsons system to Chuds,but there are comparisons..............
When Davidson took over during the season,both Frye and Anderson were "thrown into a new system". Both had to "learn on the fly". And both had to "perform in real time" under that scenario. Now I understand that Dividson didn't implement an "entire new system all at once". But Peen,you know the game probably better than me or at LEAST as good! And you know as well as I do that he was adding new plays and formations weekly.
Now I'm no coach,but I think that Frye reacted much better in that situation up untill he was injured. I won't get into a debate about that one way or the other. I did see DA have one good half as the "back-up". But when it all fell on his shoulders as "the starter,unless my eyes decieved me,he looked like a Nutter Butter Sandwich Cookie being crumbled inside of Joe Thomas fist!
I think looking at both QB's learning a new system in "real game time" is a very accurate way to determine how they will react under pressure.
Of course each HOPEFULLY has progressed. But what I saw of DA as a starter while learning a new system,scares the hell out of me a lot more than what I saw from Frye in that same scenario.
JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I'm torn over whom to keep, Dorsey or Anderson. Anderson could buy time for Quinn if Frye flops. But I feel that QBs have a short period of some success before defenses expose them. That's when they step up. Once game planned against, Anderson will look worse IMO. He's a very inconsistent passer. My buddy knew him, said he was an idiot.
Frye's my guy. Quinn will take over when the time is right. But there is no rush. I'd love to let Frye play the entire season. If the rest of the offense (Running game) steps up, it's definitely a possibility.
Anderson might be backup QB quality and better than Ken Dorsey will ever be. So the question is what's more important, Dorsey whom supposidley is a "Good Mentor" or Anderson whom is "fighting Frye for a starting job"
I wish we could just hire Dorsey as a QB coach or something. In that we can't, I say see about the possibility of trading DA. If not, he can't be activated and will prob have to be cut.
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
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I think the team is torn as well....and have said so for some time....thus why I have said I think there is a good chance we keep all 4 qbs on the roster.....I don't think we want to cut any if we can't get one traded right away. I think the team will hold hope for that eventually happening and deem it more worthwhile to keep the extra qb than a extra db or some other nobody.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Shep,, Clearly I've insulted you in some fashion.. for that I'm truly sorry.. if you notice, I expressed an apology to everyone else and asked to be forgiven,, for what I was about to do, but in my heart, it had to be said. Had I not written it, someone else would have..
But again, I'm sorry if I offended you in any way, it was not my intent.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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And as an added....I don't think Dorsey is nearly as bad a player as most think.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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And as an added....I don't think Dorsey is nearly as bad a player as most think.
I disagree. Not to go down the NCAA road again, but the kid never played a game of REAL football until he played the Bucks and was exposed.
I won't disagree that he isn't smart, because he is.......but he's not a fundamentally sound ballplayer.
Daman- Replied in PM, no offense taken.
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..but he's not a fundamentally sound ballplayer.
His current status tells that story well... with his brain and understanding of the game, if he had the fundamentals and skills to go with it he'd be Peyton II.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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1st String
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Frye's my guy. Quinn will take over when the time is right. But there is no rush. I'd love to let Frye play the entire season. If the rest of the offense (Running game) steps up, it's definitely a possibility.
I really don't see Frye or Anderson starting for very long. This competition between these guys adds up to a backup QB competition. Keeping in mind that this season could very well tell us if Romeo is the Head Coach for next season.
I honestly believe bringing in Quinn sooner rather than later buys Romeo another season at the helm. On top of that it gets Quinn the playing time and experiance to be a much more stable starter next season. 
Just wait till next season, I have heard that for over 40 years!
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I think the team is torn as well....and have said so for some time....thus why I have said I think there is a good chance we keep all 4 qbs on the roster.....I don't think we want to cut any if we can't get one traded right away. I think the team will hold hope for that eventually happening and deem it more worthwhile to keep the extra qb than a extra db or some other nobody.
No way......lots of teams only carry two QBs anymore, no way we carry four.
Anderson or Dorsey will be the odd man out.......
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maybe so.....just don't be shocked if another possibility happens.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Keep Anderson, Start Dorsey. Boot Frye.
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Great sound reasoning there. Thanks for the in depth post. I don't understand why Dorsey would be considered a mentor as a 5 year veteran that hasn't been higher than #2 on any depth chart. We don't have a mentor for the QB on the roster.
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I guess thr way I see it, the objective is to win the game you play. I think we all agree that Dorsey is the weakest QB in terms of skills and arm. He has a noodle. This wanting him on the roster because he is "cerebral" makes no sense at all.. if we want him as a coach / mentor (and I had my fill of that mentor crap with Willie McG. Thats BS) then by god, offer him a spot as an assistant QB coach and let him freakin coach / mentor and open up a roster spot to someone that CAN play the game. Carry 3 QB's: CF, DA and BQ
SaintDawg™
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I don't know about that Corpus,, Starting a QB to save your job is a move that happened with Palmer as the coach and Couch as the QB.... I think you can trace the downfall of both people to that one decision,., At least I think that's when things started to go wrong IMO. (certainly not the only reason, but like I said, I believe it was the start of the downfall)
It was a mistake to rush a QB then, and I don't see it being any different this time.
There is one Caviat to that thinking.. At least to me anyway. That is if we have a successful team..ie: proven run stuffing D, proven secondary and a Proven Running game with a Oline to match,, THen I could see it working..
While I think we could very well be on our way to all those things, it's not PROVEN yet.
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Damanshot
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I don't understand why Dorsey would be considered a mentor as a 5 year veteran that hasn't been higher than #2 on any depth chart. We don't have a mentor for the QB on the roster.
Coach, I think the reason people feel that way about Dorsey is the things that Quinn is saying, coupled with his Intellect and knowledge of the game and his comfort level with Chud.. No guarantees that's correct, but I know that's why I get the feeling he'll remain..
Oh,, Dorsey was the #1 QB in SF for 10 games for what it's worth 
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
Great sound reasoning there. Thanks for the in depth post.
I don't understand why Dorsey would be considered a mentor as a 5 year veteran that hasn't been higher than #2 on any depth chart. We don't have a mentor for the QB on the roster.
So what you're saying is...that I can't post my opinion without attaching some useless drivel that 10 people will twist around and flame, another 10 people will agree with and the other 1000 just read over and ignore in the first place? Sweet.
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Sorry, I meant on the Browns roster  . I know he is comfortable with Chud's system, but I am more concerned with a veteran that can understand what happens in the actual game. Game experience is something that Quinn needs. We needed it with Frye, too, and didn't get it. I just think a veteran with game playing experience would benefit all our QBs more.
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Coach, I don't see a whole lot of those guys sitting out there right now... At least none that I would want anyway.... any suggestions?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Drew Bledsoe for the veteran minimum and understanding he would never see the field
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Well, the heat wave has broken. It must have because hell has frozen over. We agree on Dorsey. I have a hard time seeing him as a mentor when he's seen a total of roughly 10 games as a starter and none as a Brown. Plus the fact that he's, what, all of 4 or 5 years older than Brady?
I don't doubt he's a smart guy. But if you're gonna keep only 3 guys I'd think you'd want all of them to be able to win you a game or two if they had to.
I could be wrong but I just don't see dumping Frye or Anderson in favor of Dorsey just because he's Brady's buddy. At the very least I'd want something in a trade for Charlie or Derek rather than just cut them.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't he officially retire?
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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And as an added....I don't think Dorsey is nearly as bad a player as most think.
You've got to attend a practice. From what I've seen in the past two years, only Nate Hybl has looked worse in the past 5-6 years. That includes your Lang Campbells, Booty's, the black Qb from So. Alabama from last year, etc. There is a reason that Romeo would rather play Frye at 50-60% in last years finale vs. Houston, rather than give Dorsey the reins.
Not to knock the guy as a person, or someone whom I feel the Browns (if he is cut) should consider offering a coaching (offensive quality control?) position to.
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Yes, along with many other athletes that have been brought back. Testeverde has retired a few times and still gets a gig.
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I have a hard time seeing him as a mentor when he's seen a total of roughly 10 games as a starter and none as a Brown
Well heck, if your gonna use logic
one comment and I'm getting off this.. If Quinn looks upon him (Dorsey) as a mentor, a sounding board, a go to guy to ask questions of, isn't that all that really matter? Just a thought
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Damanshot
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If Quinn looks upon him (Dorsey) as a mentor, a sounding board, a go to guy to ask questions of, isn't that all that really matter?
If this was band camp, yeah. But the NFL is a brutal business. Push comes to shove friendship won't mean a thing, IMO.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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If he would be able to provide answers to Quinn's questions, yes. Unfortunately, I don't see him being able to like a vet that's been in the fire and succeeded has. Shoot, we could offer Bledsoe or Testeverde an asst QB coach's job and not even take the salary cap hit.
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Daman, the circumstances are totally different, but I understand where you are coming from. It was Palmer's first season with an expansion team. No matter what happened that first season, he was going to be the head coach the following season. Remember this is Romeo's 3rd season and Bill Cower is waiting in the wings. I believe starting Quinn sooner rather than later help to throw this years record out the window as far as Romeo is concerned.
Just wait till next season, I have heard that for over 40 years!
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We could debate the tenure or expected tenure of RAC till the cows come home... But I doubt Cowher is even thinking about waiting in anyones wings.. JMO however.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Dorsey certainly isn't a "mentor" from an experienced player aspect. That much is certain. But the "big picture" may be a little different. From an X's and O's standpoint,he's certainly the best we "have" to fill that role. People aren't going to like this,but the fact is,our FO and coaching staff are going to base this decision "100% on Quinn" and nothing else. IF they feel Quinn will be or does have a "good chance to start" before the end of this season,I think they keep Dorsey. Quinn is behind in "learning the new system". While Dorsey may not be the best at "executing this system" from everything that we've been told,Dorsey comprehends this system far better than ANY QB we have. Since it appears Quinn trusts and believes in what Dorsey says,it sounds like the best guy to "fill in the blanks" for Quinn,is Dorsey IMO Now the real debate is a fairly simple one. Some of us believe that they value Quinn learning this system and becoming "game ready enough" to use a roster spot "as a teacher" for Quinn. Some of us don't. I think that about sums it up. 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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The fact is ..and some of you don't want t to admit it..none of the QB's have looked sharp in practice..and that first preseaon game is going to show it.
Frye isn' t a practice QB BUT sometimes those very things translate into a game.
DA has looked like DA..practice dummy..Dorsey is what he is..brain..no skills..
Frye is what he is..temporary starter..as I maintain , you should be able to look at a QB 's skillset and see if it translates to starter or backup or bust..and Mensa if you even bother to respond leave your stats at NFL.com.
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 08/10/07 02:18 PM.
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I think you summed it up pretty well myself. See,according to what is "being said" the starting role is "up in the air". You see Frye as "the temporary starter". Same here. You see DA is "The practice dummy". Same here. And you see Dorsey as "brains and no skill". Same here. But people are asking "If they are so close in practice,what's the decioding difference"? IMO It's how they played when Davidson took over. Frye wasn't great,but he looked better than DA as the starter. The lesser of the two evils to a "noticeable degree". They were both learning a new system at the same time. Both started under Davidson in that new system. Frye looked better under those conditions. The question was if we don't carry four QB's,who goes? I think they'll keep the "brains" to help Quinn play catch up in the new system instead of keeping the "practice dummy". Sure,being a Browns fan,I hope Charlie is MUCH better! Our future second stringer? The better he is,the better for us. But unless something MAJOR happens to Quinn,he's going to be the starter. I'm not fooling myself about that. He's by far and away the most gifted guy we have at the position with a great skill set. JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Lets look at DA and Dorsey..
DA as I said a month ago can read a blitz..but he is a Dilfer clone..he cannot read coverages plus he has no touch or accuracy on deep passes..
He looks terrible because now there's a complex system in place and it's over his head..
Thats what I loved about Kosar , he didn't have a cannon but he was accurate on deep passes..
Now he had that slight side-armed release which got a lot of his short/mid range passes batted down.
Dorsy has the brains..there's nothing else to speak of..he is a tutor type of guy..nothing more.
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So you've confirmed the fact that we agree. That's nice.  IMO- Since both Dorsey nor DA can "really contribute on the field" you keep the tutor to invest in teaching the "future" given the choice between the two. Here's where we'll probably disagree. But if they think Quinn would be better than DA by week four,don't you "keep the tutor" to help him along rather that "the practice dummy"?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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I don't see any value DA would have..so I don't see any disagreement..
Where that comes is I think we could do some sort of trade..for a bank of player cards..lol..
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