DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Putin wins ...USA capitulate to Russian intervention in elections.

McConnell not mincing words.

"I would rather take a political risk in pursuit of peace, than to risk peace in pursuit of politics."

-President of the United States of America
Donald Trump

That kind of thing never happens. BTW, glad you met nice boobs.

This would be a Freudian slip. An unintentional error brought on by the feelings of your subconscious.

Personally, rhetoric and narrative aside, I think that Trump royally screwed up yesterday. I wouldn't have a problem with Trump doing what he did yesterday if he did it better. As WSU is pointing out, the Russians have only been charged with this. Now Trump and Putin want to possibly have their intelligence agencies work on this case together. However, Trump mentions no arrangement for those Russians to be expedited here for trial, despite him having the opportunity to do so. Had he done that, I would've obviously been morally against this paling around with the Russians, but I would applaud such a master stroke move. Instead, he just says he trusts Putin and today he's saying he misspoke. He just makes the situation worse by trying to fix it.

As far as the Russian investigation goes, it has always been a Benghazi trap for Democrats. 24 hour news cycle has overcovered it, it's become politicized and now the house is trying to investigate this while the FBI is as well. The whole thing is a gigantic mess. Just let the FBI do their job, which will take a long time considering the conspirator is across the world. Take the time to enjoy Donald's Presidency. His lack of respect in the Senate and his ill gotten plans have essentially tied his hands for major pieces of legislation. Liberals should just be thankful we don't have a President like Pence.

I think he said that right before he commited treason on stage in front of the world. Glad you pointed it out, was well written by some staffer.

I am not buying that line of bull for one second. The camera and body language on both ends tells the story....

Trump does not have a poker face. You can see his emotions..

I'm still confused as to why the more liberal minded folks aren't patting Trump on the back for what they see as treason. According to them essentially every aspect of "America" is a bad thing:

-The Founding was by a bunch of racist old white men who wanted to create a place to oppress everyone else
-It's the birthplace of slavery. And while slavery technically ended, we still feel the shock waves today and the sentiment is still there in a largely uncaring white nation.
-It's economic system is one based on a bunch of rich white men exploiting the labor of the masses and outright stealing the fruits of their labors
-It's judicial system is designed primarily on the oppression of minorities
-The Constitution itself is outdated and irrelevant, and so should be interpreted not by what it says, but what we think it ought to say
-Life isn't fair and therefor the nation needs to become more socialized minimizing the importance of the individual
-We have war zones in the streets of what we thought was a civilized society due to the mass proliferation of guns, and a large populace unwilling to do anything about it.
-Internationally we are Imperialists, bent on taking what we want from whomoever we want and have no compunction about slaughtering innocent people

The genesis of every social complaint and piece of legislation coming from the left has it's basis in the belief that America is a bad place.

Liberals love to tell you what's bad about it, all the while exploiting what it has to offer. What you don't ever see them do is celebrate America.

And they can't Clem. Because during this last Presidential race they defined the celebration of America as white nationalism. The second coming of the Third Reich.

America is such a bad place, and always has been... logically they should be celebrating any treason against such an abomination if for no other reason than "the Enemy of my Enemy....."

Trump is a creepy and weak imbecile who has no true ideology.

I'm confused as to why anyone doesn't realize that's a basic fact that transcends liberal or conservative.

Stephen Miller wrote that.

40 apparently wants to shout from the rooftops "I AM ONE OF THOSE IMPOTENT WEIRDOS!"

"Misspoken".

"When the barely cognizant spineless weakling folded at the first sign of pressure like he always has for 40 years, that wasn't him once again folding under pressure like a senile spineless weakling like he always has...he merely misspoke"

I’d say I misspoke also ...you know .....mmmmm treason or lying?.. lying works for me. After all It’s the Trump era ...enjoy!

j/c

I am curious, what is it that some of you wanted to happen? really? Do you want Trump to stand up there, degrade Putin in front of the world, possibly starting a war with nuclear ramifications? I am starting to think so. . . . .

Trump isn't capable of degrading Putin.

Remember the last time he tried that hissy fit? What did he come up with? "Lil Rocket Man"?

The issue is that he's a spineless and barely cognizant idiot, not "I wish the barely cognizant dullard would've exceeded his capabilities and done X"

He's a child who melts in the face of the slightest compliment. That's why he ended up being a game show host/pennyante conman after he flunked out of real estate.

Not true. Trump degraded himself and the USA. And now he’s lying about it. Glad you, him and all his supporters are happy he sold the rest of us out. Wake up Murcia!

I like the jump in thinking that occurred over a year or two for Cons.

Originally it was, Obama is a weak leader we need to desperately replace, because he is making us lose against Russia. Now it is, Trump is a strong leader, but if he were to disagree with Russia, and publicly accept what his information agencies has said happen, he might start world war 3.

Putin is an ex-KGB operative. He's not exactly the spray tanned getting type to blow up on someone because they contradicted him. When he wants to get personal points to make up for imaginary strikes against him, he likes to get super personal about it. For example, he used to allow his dogs to jump on Angela Merkel (who is deathly afraid of dogs) and liked to joke that Bush Jr.'s dog would be eaten for lunch by Putin's dog. He's not some moron like Il or Erdogan who needs to remind people of his power by using his power.

Normally, in some parallel universe, this is exactly the position I would be likely to take, but....

We aren't in that universe, we are in this universe.. where Trump berates and denigrates EVERYBODY. He has blasted the leaders of some of our deepest allies, threatened them and called them names.. he has blasted the poor.. immigrants, especially those from sh*thole countries.. veterans who have been wounded, captured, and killed.. members of the media.. members of other political parties.. members of congress just trying to do their job.. special investigators.. his own appointees who dare to have a different opinion.. judges.. the NFL... mostly these are just Americans, elected foreign leaders, or people who want to be Americans.. and nobody is spared from his wrath..

Then, in the course of a few months, he meets with two of the more evil people on the planet.. Kim Jong Un and Vladimir Putin... and suddenly he's Mr. Freakin' Rogers....

Because it's treason.
By a sitting President.

Everything else you wrote about is a cute, clever interpretation of opinions about what this country should stand for.

The man stood in front of the entire world and threw his entire intelligence apparatus under the bus. More than once. He said he believes ex-KGB over 17 of our agencies with stacks and stacks of evidence to the contrary.

Perhaps you are confused.
I am not.

7 rifles
6 blinks
1 blindfold.

problem solved.

https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1CBTAA...382.KOI_1RC_OOA

That's jellyfish in Russian comrade. It also translate to Trump now.

Trump handled himself poorly at this news conference. Very poorly. However the insane rhetoric coming from the left is fascinating. Comical even. Posters even calling for the murder of the POTUS. . . . .

Sad. Disgusting.

A simple check on PolitiFact shows otherwise.

real news..

Amid swelling evidence of Russia's interference in the 2016 presidential election, President Donald Trump pushed back against critics who say he's given the Kremlin a free pass.

In one tweet on Feb. 20, Trump said, "I have been much tougher on Russia than Obama, just look at the facts. Total Fake News!"


Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump
I have been much tougher on Russia than Obama, just look at the facts. Total Fake News!

9:38 AM - Feb 20, 2018
76.3K
72.3K people are talking about this
Twitter Ads info and privacy
The tweet immediately drew guffaws among media commentators and on social media, who quickly plucked examples of Trump downplaying evidence of a far-reaching effort by Russia to meddle in the election. (Just a day earlier, we gave Trump a Pants on Fire for tweeting that he "never said Russia did not meddle in the election.")

When we looked at the past decade of U.S.-Russia policy, however, we found a more nuanced picture. Tougher government policies implemented under President Barack Obama have largely continued under Trump, even though they were often overshadowed — and perhaps undercut — by Trump’s friendly remarks and tweets toward Russia and President Vladimir Putin.

The election-meddling conflict
The consensus among experts is that Obama was more forceful than Trump has been to date on countering election meddling.

"The key difference from Obama was (Trump’s) unwillingness to take the meddling issue head on," said Stephen Sestanovich, a senior fellow for Russian and Eurasian studies at the Council on Foreign Relations.

As we’ve noted in previous fact-checks, the Obama administration took actions before and after Election Day. Prior to the election, the Obama administration publicly named the Russian government as the culprit, confronted Russian President Vladimir Putin in person, and worked to secure U.S. election infrastructure — all while intelligence agencies investigated the issue.

But the Obama administration’s most significant retaliatory measure against Russia came after Trump’s electoral win.

On Dec. 29, 2016, Obama ordered 35 Russian diplomats and suspected intelligence agents to leave the United States, and he also imposed narrow sanctions on some Russian individuals and organizations.

Trump, on the other hand, has cast doubt on Russia’s election meddling and repeated Putin’s denials of his government’s involvement.

"The Trump administration has repeatedly tried to undermine the credibility of the FBI and intelligence agencies in their investigation and assessment of the threat to the integrity of U.S. elections by Russian operatives," said Yoshiko Herrera, a political science professor at the University of Wisconsin-Madison.

Herrera added that Special Counsel Robert Mueller is looking into whether the Trump administration crossed the line into obstruction of justice by trying to impede the investigation of the Russian threat to the American electoral system.

While some experts noted that Trump signed a law calling for new sanctions against Russia in response to its interference with the election, they added that the legislation was hardly the product of Trump’s hardline advocacy. Congress largely passed the bill — with veto-proof majorities — in response to Trump’s downplaying of the meddling question and his seeming interest in lifting sanctions against Russia, Sestanovich said.

When it came time to sign the bill into law in August, Trump did so grudgingly. He expressed significant reservations, saying it was "seriously flawed" because it usurped the executive branch’s negotiating authority.

Matthew Kroenig, an associate professor in the Department of Government and School of Foreign Service at Georgetown University, said Trump had a point with his reservations about the legislative package, noting that the Obama administration made similar arguments that congressional sanctions against Iran infringed on the executive's authority to set foreign policy.

Several experts said the White House has been hesitant to implement the sanctions. Sestanovich characterized its implementation as "slow and half-hearted." In late January, Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin told lawmakers the administration would apply sanctions to a new list of Russian oligarchs and senior government officials.

"The Trump administration didn’t provide the list of who they apply to until very late," Herrera said. "That’s a clear sign of foot-dragging by the White House."

Susanne Wengle, a political science professor at the University of Notre Dame, agreed that Trump "has not been proactive or voiced strong opposition to Russian involvement in U.S. politics," while Obama did.

However, she noted that the Trump administration has not gone so far as to reverse Obama-era laws and regulations, including the Magnitsky Act, which targeted high-ranking Russians with sanctions.


Russian President Vladimir Putin listens to President Barack Obama in Hangzhou, China on Sept. 5, 2016. (Alexei Druzhinin/Sputnik, Kremlin Pool via AP)

Geopolitical relations
The White House provided some examples of policies broader than the reaction to election meddling. Judging the tweet based on the administration's geopolitical policies makes the analysis a bit more complicated.

There’s a crucial dividing line for U.S. policy toward Russia — early 2014, when Russia annexed the Ukrainian region of Crimea. Before that, the United States sought common ground with Russia. After that, Russia was seen in a more adversarial way.

During the early years of Obama’s presidency, and especially during the Russian presidential interregnum of Dmitry Medvedev, the United States sought a "reset" with Russia and managed to hammer out several accomplishments, including a nuclear-arms deal.

"Obama's first national security strategy only mentioned Russia as a potential partner, never as a possible threat," Kroenig said. "He promised in the famous ‘hot mic’ episode that he would have ‘flexibility’ to make concessions on missile defense after the (2012) election. He refused to intervene in Syria in part because his team feared direct conflict with Russia. He refused to provide lethal aid to Ukraine fearing escalation with Russia. And he did not develop a serious strategy to deter the threat of Russian nuclear ‘de-escalation’ strikes."

However, an increase in conflict between the two countries, heightened by the return of Putin to the presidency in 2012, prompted skepticism about whether a genuine reset was feasible. Ultimately, the reset died out entirely after the Crimean annexation in 2014.

In a very narrow sense, Trump has a case. "If you compare current 2018 U.S. policy to U.S. policy during Obama’s first term, then the U.S. is clearly ‘tougher’ on Russia now," said Dan Nexon, an associate professor of government and foreign service at Georgetown University.

After 2014, however, Obama’s Russia policy stiffened considerably.

These included a rapid set of sanctions on people and enterprises in March 2014 following the Crimean annexation, and sector-based sanctions on Russia in July 2014 following continued Russian military activities in eastern Ukraine, said Anders Åslund, a senior fellow at the Atlantic Council.

Later, Obama’s actions included the expulsion of Russian diplomats in December 2016, the closing of Russian compounds, and a variety of statements critical of Russia and Putin.

Disentangling Trump’s comments from his administration’s policies
Trump’s rhetoric has consistently indicated warmth and trust toward Russia and Putin, and Trump has also sent mixed signals about the U.S. commitment to NATO.

On the other hand, post-2014 U.S. policy aimed at Russia has chugged forward in important ways since Trump became president — despite his rhetoric.

"The rest of the executive branch and Congress have actually taken a few tough stands against Russia during the last year," said Susan H. Allen, director of the Center for Peacemaking Practice at George Mason University’s School for Conflict Analysis and Resolution.

Among them, Kroening said, are a boost in funding for the European Reassurance Initiative, a security program that began under Obama; the development of new, low-yield nuclear capabilities to deter Russian nuclear attack; upgrades for missile defenses; and an approval of Montenegro’s bid to join NATO, which had been in the works for years. The Trump administration also slapped new sanctions on five Russians and Chechens over human rights abuses.

Trump’s two highest-profile acts challenging Russia were his cruise missile attack against Syria’s Bashar al-Assad, a Russian ally, and his approval of lethal arms sales to Ukraine. In both of those cases, Trump went further than Obama did, though it remains to be seen how thoroughly the administration will follow through on both developments.

To the extent that Trump’s policies against Russia have met or exceeded Obama’s post-2014 policies, the credit goes more to his agencies and Congress, experts said. These policies are ones that "hawkish military types in his orbit like, and were not likely from his own initiative," said Wengle, the University of Notre Dame professor.

Our ruling
Trump said, "I have been much tougher on Russia than Obama, just look at the facts. Total Fake News!"

There’s broad agreement that on election meddling, Obama’s actions — while arguably insufficient to the threat at hand — were stronger than Trump’s. On a broader geopolitical level, there has been a significant degree of consistency between the Obama and Trump administrations in actual U.S. policy, and even a few examples where Trump has gone further than Obama did. That said, Trump’s own record of Russia- and Putin-friendly comments have sent contrary messages about U.S. policy toward Russia.

We rate Trump’s statement Mostly False.

Well in the real world our "Friends" in Europe are robbing us blind by not paying their share of their own defense and with tariffs on all our goods. Previous politicians played nice and pretended NATO was strong while any rational person can see they are a Paper Tiger.

With "Friends" like that, who needs enemas. They needed berating.

With missiles flying over our allies and Nukes pointed at us, NK needed berating to come to the table and make the world a safer place.

Russia and the United States control 90 percent of the Worlds Nukes. We should be talking and not at each others throats all the time.

The illegal immigrants come here and bring with them MS13 and other criminal elements. It needs to stop.

And most of those people do come from crap countries and we already have plenty of people who can dig ditches and mow lawns.

The day of "Play Nice, Tell us what we want to hear Politicians" has brought us to this point.

Trump is Change. Much needed Change.

No joke here gentlemen, you can’t say this. Heard about a guy on the news shortly (days/weeks) after Hinckley got arrested that got pulled over for speeding.
Cops asked why he was in such a hurry.
I’m going to finish the job Hinckley started.

Arrested.

If you think Trump being a little more honest and direct with Putin would have started a nuclear war.. then we have no business trying to be their ally. That level of instability puts them below NK and Iran as far as I'm concerned...

Trumps entire speech wasn't horrible.. but he had 2 or 3 opportunities to show his stones and he failed..

For example, Putin said early in his remarks...

Yes, they do. It is pretty much universally accepted within our intelligence community that Russia was attempting to influence our elections.. that is a very solid reason for tension.

First Trump said this..

So he's afraid to call out Putin but he throws many many Americans under the bus right here.. as if those folks he mentioned DO NOT have America's best interest at heart.. that their complaints are all totally unfounded.. and they are just whining to hear themselves whine..

Then Trump addressed election meddling...

So what is his interesting idea? Great, Putin felt strongly about it.... so do millions of Americans and we view Putin as either wholly responsible or at least complicit in it happening.. this is why folks say he sided with Putin over the American people..

Most of the rest of it I have little problem with... which is why I've never go so far as to call it treason.. weak? Yea, I think in several instances he looked very weak..

Fox narrative parroting... Trump is once again the victim... PUH_lease.

Trump commits treason in front of the world and we are supposed to give him a pass? GOP values.

New day new story;
now president dumb dumb is defying the US Intel again saying that Russia is now not targeting the elections.

He must have gotten a call from his Puty saying he has to tow the party line

The rebuttal is hardly coming from the left; Many conservative pundits, lawmakers and intel find this to be the crapshow that it is. Even some on fox not named hannity

It is pretty routine that Trump committing egregious behavior on live TV gets a snoozefest from his base. Yet when people call Trump out on this, some of his die hard supporters start clutching pearls like a grave offense has been committed.



This week has shades of last August when Trump fumbled at the goal line and couldn't even distance himself from literal nazi's in Charlottesville.

For as many times as you have conclude "treason" trump should have faced trial what 50x by now.......

you remind me of those old grandma's that are always repeating the same thing over and over and over, no matter the facts.

"keep that up and you'll go blind"

Unfortunately for you, your hate filled rhetoric has blinded you long ago...

"Some people HATE the fact that I got along well with President Putin of Russia. They would rather go to war than see this. It’s called Trump Derangement Syndrome!"

-President of the United States of America
Donald Trump

Rand Paul: "Trump Derangement Syndrome" Has Gone Over The Top And People Have Lost The Big Picture

Sen. Rand Paul debates CNN's Wolf Blitzer about "Trump derangement syndrome" and the media's reaction to the Trump-Putin summit. He responds to Newt Gingrich, who tweeted that

"I think people have gotten over top on this and lost the big picture," Paul said. "The big picture is that we should be engaged with Russia. We should have conversations with Russia. We have serious conflicts in various parts of the globe. It would be a mistake not to have open lines of communication with them."

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/...ith_russia.html

This bit is priceless coming from a Trump supporter...

repeat the lie until it's true... The Trump Way.

Treasonous Illegitimate President

We can have dialog with Russia. POTUS shouldn't stand there and tell the world he believes Putin over all the usa intelligence that shows that Russia interfered in the election. . . And You only have to read a little to know the change of story by Trump wasn't because he misspoke it was because he was stunned at the reaction across 'll parties .... Sen Rand Paul and a few other stooges not withstanding.

"Trump derangement syndrome" only exists in the fairytale Fox News World, back here in reality we just call it PATRIOTISM.

the WORLD WIDE REACTION, he's the poster child for most laughed at non-comedic leaders. He would be beyond embarrassing if it weren't for him being such an obvious TRAITOR.

When President Trump says it is not just the Russians, it is neither Treasonous nor Erroneous, it is FACT...

"Every day, foreign actors, the worst offenders being Russia, China, Iran and North Korea, every day they are infiltrating our digital infrastructure and conducting a range of cyber intrusion against targets in the United States."

Director of National Security
Dan Coates

So, do you want Trump to listen to his Intelligence people or do you not? So far, they are saying the same thing. Because they are Fact.

Poodle