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http://www.espn.com/blog/cleveland-brown...lans-fell-apartJarvis Landry and ... ? How the Browns' wide receiver plans fell apart play 9:21 AM ET Pat McManamon ESPN Staff Writer Facebook Twitter Facebook Messenger Pinterest Email print BEREA, Ohio -- How did the Cleveland Browns receiver position become so needy? Several factors came into play, including bad luck and (depending on your point of view) either (A) bad planning or (B) some players not coming through. Highest Percentage of Drops The Browns lead the NFL in percentage of passes that are dropped. TEAM DROP PCT. Browns 8.4% Titans 6.3% Packers 6.0%* Ravens 5.7% Bills 5.6% Cardinals 5.5% * Going into Monday's game The team now lines up with a rookie quarterback trying to establish himself by throwing to one experienced receiver, Jarvis Landry. It's quite a change from the original plans, which saw Landry as the No. 2 receiver opposite Josh Gordon amid a group that would allow rookie Antonio Callaway to develop and a former first-round pick (Corey Coleman) to finally reach his potential. The group that will join Baker Mayfield on the field this Sunday at the Tampa Bay Buccaneers includes Landry, Callaway, Damion Ratley (a sixth-round pick who saw his first significant action in Sunday's loss to the Los Angeles Chargers) and Breshad Perriman, just signed on Saturday. The Browns do not have a receiver in the top 25 in receiving yards or the top 20 in average yards per catch. No receiver has more than one touchdown for the season. It led coach Hue Jackson to say Monday: "We'd like to have more." How did this all happen? In increments: Coleman turned into a bust. Coleman was the first first-round pick of the Sashi Brown era, the guy the team acquired when it traded down from the spot that could have been Carson Wentz. Coleman was oft-injured, struggled with precision on routes and had issues catching the ball. But first-round picks get a lot of leeway, so the Browns patiently waited for him. Offensive coordinator Todd Haley made Coleman the frequent object of his ire and attention in camp. Eventually, Coleman complained to Jackson about running second team; he was traded to the Buffalo Bills a few days later. He's now out of the NFL. The Browns have struggled to get the ball to veteran Jarvis Landry, and rookie Antonio Callaway has looked like a rookie often this season. David Dermer/USA Today Sports Gordon was traded. The Browns did everything over the years -- and this season -- to make it work with Gordon. Tantalized by his talent, they welcomed him back after he missed 10 games in 2017. They worked with him in the offseason. They stood by him when he left for most of training camp. They gushed when he returned, and they even protected him by not playing him in the final two games of preseason. But when Gordon showed up late for a walk-through the day before the second game of the season at the New Orleans Saints, the Browns had had enough -- especially because Gordon hurt his hamstring the night before doing a workout/photo shoot in the team's indoor facility. The Browns announced they would be releasing the guy who had been slated to start opposite Landry, then traded him to the New England Patriots. Callaway has been inconsistent. The Browns got talent when they drafted Callaway in the fourth round, but they also got a guy who didn't play a down at Florida in 2017 for various disciplinary reasons. No matter, the Browns threw Callaway in the mix as Gordon's replacement. He played 81 percent of the snaps at New Orleans, 90 percent against the New York Jets and "only" 70 percent against the Oakland Raiders because he twisted his knee before overtime. The Browns determined they were asking too much of him, and they cut him back against the Baltimore Ravens. That seemed to work, but the guy who replaced him as the starter was injured, and Callaway was back to 97 percent of the snaps against the Chargers. The Browns know they're asking too much from a guy who isn't precise with his routes and who has had some big drops. But they don't know what better options they have. Rashard Higgins got hurt. Higgins was one player who showed growth from the get-go. He had a strong camp and a strong preseason, and he was having a strong game against Baltimore in an increased role. But he sprained his MCL blocking for David Njoku and missed the last game. He will miss the next game, as well. The ripple effect of his injury was to return Callaway to the demanding spot he was in prior to Higgins being given a chance. Derrick Willies got hurt. Willies stepped in for Higgins after his injury against Baltimore and played well. The Browns did not add anyone after Higgins' injury in part because they liked what Willies did. But in Friday's practice, Willies laid out for a ball, landed awkwardly and broke his collarbone. Rod Streater got hurt. Streater was signed when Gordon was traded. Expectations were minimal, but he was getting more opportunity. Streater broke a bone in his neck covering a punt against the Chargers, and he is lost for the season. While expectations for Higgins, Willies and Streater were modest, losing all three in a few days was an unfortunate stretch. play 0:39 Jarvis Landry and Joel Bitonio promise the loss to the Chargers wasJarvis Landry and Joel Bitonio promise the loss to the Chargers was just a bad day, not an example of the team getting ahead of itself after getting to .500. "We don't want to lay another egg like that," Bitonio said. Video by Pat McManamon Ratley was given a chance. The sixth-round pick had hardly played, but the Browns had no choice but to put him on the field after injuries to Streater and Willies. Ratley missed a first-half touchdown pass against the Chargers, but he played well after -- with six receptions for 82 yards. The situation meant he went from hardly playing to 65 snaps (88 percent) on offense to go with 13 on special teams. Dez Bryant asked for too much money. The Browns brought Bryant in for a visit during training camp, but he didn't sign. Reports had him seeking $10 million for one season, which was too rich for the Browns. And maybe too rich for too many other teams; Bryant remains unsigned. Perriman was signed. Perriman was the first draft pick in Ravens history released before his rookie contract expired. The Browns added him after Willies was injured. With Streater also out, Perriman is the fourth receiver on a team that uses four receivers a lot. Landry became the only experienced player on the field. The Browns showed their belief in him when they gave him a $75.5 million contract before the season. Landry said Monday he's being double-covered on almost every key situation -- red zone, third downs. He has only caught 11 of the 29 passes Mayfield has thrown him in his three starts, and in total, has caught 51 percent of the passes thrown his way -- a career low. Drops have plagued the entire group. According to ESPN Stats and Information data, Landry ranks tied for third in the league in dropped passes with five, a shock given the way he caught the ball in preseason. It's not just a Landry issue, though. The entire receiving group -- including backs -- caught less than half the passes thrown on Sunday (22-of-46). ESPN Stats and Information research indicates that four of the top 16 players in the league in drop percentage (drops per target) are Browns, and three of the top seven in terms of numbers of drops are Browns (Njoku with six, Landry with rive, Callaway with four). Callaway and Ratley both missed potential touchdown catches on Sunday. Immediate solutions are not readily found. Duke Johnson Jr. is an option, but Johnson is at his best as a receiver out of the backfield, not as a receiver lined up outside. A trade is an option, but there are a few teams that need receivers, so a trade isn't a given. The free-agent option isn't appealing; Perriman lasted four days with the Washington Redskins after the Ravens released him, and he's now a Brown. While answers aren't easy, the path to this point is clear. Unmet hopes for Coleman and Gordon made the position thin. Injuries depleted the position further. Performance and production from those remaining have not met expectations. The challenge for a young quarterback? Significant.
Meh.
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Gordon is a POS. I regret defending him. The team stuck by him, did everything they could, and he repaid that by pulling exactly the kind of crap he knew would get him bounced. I never wish injury on a player, but if he had double ACL & MCL tears, or got banned permanently for substance abuse, it wouldn't bother me a bit. I'd call it karmic justice.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Agreed Cal. I don't wish for anyone to get sick or hurt but if it happened to JG it wouldn't bother me. Our Browns stood by him and that's how he showed his appreciation? Unacceptable!!!
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You know my love will Not Fade Away.........
#gmSTRONG
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Love Baldy's breakdowns. And yeah, the receivers ain't receiving. Don't know if those catches would've changed the outcome, but they should have all been caught.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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thing that bothers me is that Baker throws a very catchable pass. Its time for this group to hang out with njoku and work the jugs machine to their hands bleed. Enough with these balls being misplayed when it was on the freaking money.
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we simply don't have the playmakers on the outside to make this work right now ... It obviously has to be addressed in the draft (unless we get Cooper maybe)
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Jeudy is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Tillman is flanked out wide to the right. Judkins and Ford are split in the backfield as Flacco takes the snap ... Here we go."
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The number of dropped passes is disgusting. Two of which would have resulted in touchdowns.
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True. We should be using more screens, quick slants, run the ball more and maybe use our RB's, especially Duke as a flanker.
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thing that bothers me is that Baker throws a very catchable pass. Its time for this group to hang out with njoku and work the jugs machine to their hands bleed. Enough with these balls being misplayed when it was on the freaking money. Agreed
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I think the Browns are dropping way too many passes. No argument there.
However, the ball placement from Baker has been off. He throws a lot of high passes into traffic. That's pretty rough for the receivers because they are going up and exposing their ribs.
The receivers need to catch better and Baker needs to make better throws.
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j/c
I'd shy away from sending Callaway too far away from the LOS to catch passes ... he gets lost and can't locate the ball (yes, I know he had the big catch at New Orleans ... but that was more luck IMO)
There have been a number of times that he can't find the ball, get to the spot, etc.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Jeudy is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Tillman is flanked out wide to the right. Judkins and Ford are split in the backfield as Flacco takes the snap ... Here we go."
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I agree, hasn't been helped by all the drops, but he has thrown passes too high - so often that, it's been noticeable.
I wonder if his 6'1 height causes some of that, when he has to throw over the line without a clean lane to throw through.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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I think this is a learning year for Callaway, just as it is for Baker.
This will probably upset some people, but I am getting the impression that a lot of excuses are being made for Baker when we lose and he is getting too much credit when we win. Hell, we held the Rats to 3 FGs and it was Baker, Baker, Baker! He throws two picks, takes needless sacks, misses wide open receivers, and completes less than 50 percent of his passes and it's the fault of everyone else.
I don't like that.
With that said. I did not want us to draft Baker before the draft. However, he has impressed me and I am glad we took him. I think he has a real shot to be the guy. He has a ton of great traits. He has changed my opinion of him.
I just don't like how some fans are placing praise and blame in regards to him and the rest of the team. I don't think that kind of talk is good for a team. That stuff can poison a locker room. I wish y'all would stop. None of it is Baker's fault. Not blaming him at all. He's been a stand-up guy. But other players hear the noise and it's not something they like hearing, especially when there is plenty of praise and blame to go around.
Let this "team" develop.
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I agree, hasn't been helped by all the drops, but he has thrown passes too high - so often that, it's been noticeable.
I wonder if his 6'1 height causes some of that, when he has to throw over the line without a clean lane to throw through. I think so. It was really evident in the Chargers game.
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Ok, Duke said he’d like to play the slot, and he has very good hands, so we are leaving him on the bench as a RB and bringing in street WRs?
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I think this is a learning year for Callaway, just as it is for Baker.
This will probably upset some people, but I am getting the impression that a lot of excuses are being made for Baker when we lose and he is getting too much credit when we win. Hell, we held the Rats to 3 FGs and it was Baker, Baker, Baker! He throws two picks, takes needless sacks, misses wide open receivers, and completes less than 50 percent of his passes and it's the fault of everyone else.
I don't like that.
With that said. I did not want us to draft Baker before the draft. However, he has impressed me and I am glad we took him. I think he has a real shot to be the guy. He has a ton of great traits. He has changed my opinion of him.
I just don't like how some fans are placing praise and blame in regards to him and the rest of the team. I don't think that kind of talk is good for a team. That stuff can poison a locker room. I wish y'all would stop. None of it is Baker's fault. Not blaming him at all. He's been a stand-up guy. But other players hear the noise and it's not something they like hearing, especially when there is plenty of praise and blame to go around.
Let this "team" develop. I doubt any of them read this board, so the chance of it being a locker room issue is zero.
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Probably because Dorsey, Hue, Haley, Saunders, and our other offensive coaches are really, really inexperienced and don't have as much knowledge as the fans on this message board in regards to who should play where and when.
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Drew Brees is only 6' and has thrown for more yardage than any QB in NFL history. I agree height is an issue with Baker but it has been done at this level. I would think that if Baker has any questions on this issue and called DB he would be happy to help. JMO
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Ok, Duke said he’d like to play the slot, and he has very good hands, so we are leaving him on the bench as a RB and bringing in street WRs? I agree. In camp he asked Hue to move to the receiver position but was deemed too valuable in the running backs room....LOL...what a joke. He is so valuable in that room he doesn't get but a few plays a game. Stick Duke outside and start looking for a back to bring in to sit 98% of the plays and let Duke play 85% of the plays is what I'd do. But Nooooo, we need him on the bench. Why did we even extend him?
Last edited by Ballpeen; 10/17/18 07:23 AM.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Duke is the type of RB that Chubb could learn to be an all pro from.
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Ok, Duke said he’d like to play the slot, and he has very good hands, so we are leaving him on the bench as a RB and bringing in street WRs? I agree. In camp he asked Hue to move to the receiver position but was deemed too valuable in the running backs room....LOL...what a joke. He is so valuable in that room he doesn't get but a few plays a game. Stick Duke outside and start looking for a back to bring in to sit 98% of the plays and let Duke play 85% of the plays is what I'd do. But Nooooo, we need him on the bench. Why did we even extend him? I know facts aren't important in regards to a good Hue bashing, but Duke has played more snaps than either Hyde or Chubb in the past two games. I would also like to point out that Haley is calling the plays. Hue called them the last two years and used Duke much more than Haley is. Okay. The factual post is over. Back to your regularly scheduled Hate on Hue programming.
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It's dire now, but honestly, I guess I see light at the end of the tunnel.
Higgins will be back soon (hopefully), Willies will return next season, Calloway is young and didn't play much recently so he needs to be given some time.
Maybe Perriman can be a stop gap. Dunno
Njuko needs to step it up and same with Landry.
Mayfield has to put the ball in a better place.
There isn't one thing there that can't be fixed with time and some coaching.
Do we need receivers, yeah and the next draft is where to get them.
As an aside, someday, I'd like someone to explain what Gordan did that made him the straw that broke the camels back.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
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Njuko needs to step it up IMO, these past two games Njoku has done well as a receiver.
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I noticed this last week especially. Our guys do not go out for a catch. Unless it hits them in the basket, they do not try for it. And a lot of the time, when it does hit them in the basket, they drop it anyway. SMH. Its going to be a long year with this WR corps.
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Njuko needs to step it up IMO, these past two games Njoku has done well as a receiver. Agreed.... Evan Silva Verified account @evansilva #Browns TE David Njoku in Baker Mayfield's 3 starts: Week 4: Led team in catches Week 5: Led team in targets Week 6: Led team in catches & targets Tweet
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Ok, Duke said he’d like to play the slot, and he has very good hands, so we are leaving him on the bench as a RB and bringing in street WRs? I agree. In camp he asked Hue to move to the receiver position but was deemed too valuable in the running backs room....LOL...what a joke. He is so valuable in that room he doesn't get but a few plays a game. Stick Duke outside and start looking for a back to bring in to sit 98% of the plays and let Duke play 85% of the plays is what I'd do. But Nooooo, we need him on the bench. Why did we even extend him? I know facts aren't important in regards to a good Hue bashing, but Duke has played more snaps than either Hyde or Chubb in the past two games. I would also like to point out that Haley is calling the plays. Hue called them the last two years and used Duke much more than Haley is. Okay. The factual post is over. Back to your regularly scheduled Hate on Hue programming. Again, my point since you missed it is Duke wanted to go outside, so put him there. Hyde hs been playing well. Chubb needs more chances. Let them do the running work and get Duke out there with them. I understand that Haley is calling the plays. He seems to have a history of have a workhorse back. That's fine by me. I'd also like to point out that Hue is the head coach. I am sure he is involved with the game planning and such. Also, my comments weren't directed only at Hue. I never mentioned him except in reference to Duke asking to be moved outside. I see a clear need to have him involved in the passing game. I see a clear need to have more receivers who can catch the ball. I see that Duke can clearly catch the ball. So with that said, I rather see Duke in a receiver role than bringing in some street scrub like Streeter or Perriman. I would rather see balls thrown in Dukes direction over any of those guys. But, the other side is maybe we will see it this week. We need to see it. Let Hyde and Chubb carry the ball. Get Duke in to the slot or outside. If it takes readjusting player packages, they better be readjusting.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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J/C
Only a Browns Football Season can we go from having touted one of the best WR corps in the league to literally talking about moving a RB to WR in few short weeks. SMH.
I really really really like Dorsey, but the way we have handled the WR position group has been....suspect.
Landry has been fools gold up to date. He is not giving the effort he is being paid for - or is the talent just less than we thought?
Gordon - well, I am ok with the trade because at some point you have to put your foot in the ground and make a stand, but they really seem to have put a lot of their eggs in his basket going into the season but not having a backup plan for a #1 target.
Going into a season with your #1 WR a drug test away from being out of the league - who has admitted to robbery and gang banging, constant drug use, and in and out of rehab, was well...short sighted to be nice.
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Again, my point since you missed it is Duke wanted to go outside, so put him there. Hyde hs been playing well. Chubb needs more chances. Let them do the running work and get Duke out there with them. I agree with this. Maybe they tried him out there in a practice and he couldn't run a route tree though. We don't know they didn't TRY to accommodate him tho, to be fair. I mean, when Coleman asked for a trade, the obliged. So I would assume when Duke asked to be moved, they probably put him out there to see if he could cut it, and maybe he just couldn't. WR is a different animal than RB.
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J/C
Only a Browns Football Season can we go from having touted one of the best WR corps in the league to literally talking about moving a RB to WR in few short weeks. SMH. Who was it that touted or WR corps as one the best in the league? I mean outside of some posters on this board.
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J/C
Only a Browns Football Season can we go from having touted one of the best WR corps in the league to literally talking about moving a RB to WR in few short weeks. SMH. Look back over the years. Almost without fail, any group that we've felt was a lock to be our strength takes MAJOR hits by the 6th week of the season. This effect is part of why I tried to avvoid joining The Isle when there was all the talk of how much talent we had. I was like "we've heard that before, then we had Gary Baxter, and LeCharles Bentley, and a motorcycle, and staph infections, etc, etc, etc....". Our strengths pretty much ALWAYS get decimated and then the season go in the crapper.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I don’t understand why we’re allergic to Duke Johnson (outside of inept planning).
While I get that it’s hard to say “Duke should be getting X touches a game”, because flow and situation dictate that, when you’re down 2+ scores and have WR’s who can’t catch or separate, it clearly should’ve been the Duke show.
He had what, like 100 yards on 5-6 touches?
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J/C
Only a Browns Football Season can we go from having touted one of the best WR corps in the league to literally talking about moving a RB to WR in few short weeks. SMH. Look back over the years. Almost without fail, any group that we've felt was a lock to be our strength takes MAJOR hits by the 6th week of the season. This effect is part of why I tried to avvoid joining The Isle when there was all the talk of how much talent we had. I was like "we've heard that before, then we had Gary Baxter, and LeCharles Bentley, and a motorcycle, and staph infections, etc, etc, etc....". Our strengths pretty much ALWAYS get decimated and then the season go in the crapper. But it was looking very promising. However, the promise was unfortunately the high point and fell apart rapidly from that height. Given time, we'll get past it but you just have to shake your head at where we presently stand in relation to our WR corps...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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I don’t understand why we’re allergic to Duke Johnson (outside of inept planning).
While I get that it’s hard to say “Duke should be getting X touches a game”, because flow and situation dictate that, when you’re down 2+ scores and have WR’s who can’t catch or separate, it clearly should’ve been the Duke show.
He had what, like 100 yards on 5-6 touches? Agreed. He should have been "featured", while maintaining some degree of balance...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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So knowing what we know about our WR core... who in college should we be watching? Anyone have a favorite college WR they like at the top of the draft?
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 19,587 |
Njuko needs to step it up IMO, these past two games Njoku has done well as a receiver. Agreed.... Evan Silva Verified account @evansilva #Browns TE David Njoku in Baker Mayfield's 3 starts: Week 4: Led team in catches Week 5: Led team in targets Week 6: Led team in catches & targets Tweet #notalent.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,900
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,900 |
http://walterfootball.com/draft2019WR.phpFor reference. I’m not a big fan of first round WRs that are under 6’2”. Too small of a catch radius. Often too small to get off a jam at the LOS. I know there are guys that break that mold but there’s far more Cory Colman’s than Antonio Brown’s. I like guys that can out physical their DB and ‘go get it’ when it’s jump ball time. Guys like AJ and Julio. That said the top talent in this draft looks to be in the <6’2” mold.
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
j/c:
This won't be a popular take, but I think it's worth considering.
Jarvis Landry had more catches in first four years than any other WR had their first four years. He didn't exactly have the best QBs throwing it to him while accomplishing that impressive feat.
He started the year off fine. He's young. His skill level didn't magically disappear. However, his numbers are way down during the last 3 games.
I saw the dude running wide open on multiple occasions on Sunday. Baker didn't see him. Other times, Baker's throws have been off target. I readily admit that I am confounded by some Landry's drops, but I don't think it's all on him or the scheme.
Baker and Landry need to develop a better chemistry. The Browns are going to have to figure out a way to get Baker to see the field better. Baker is going to have look at some of the shorter routes instead of looking for the home run all the time.
I don't think it's coincidence that Landry's numbers have fallen off the cliff during Baker's 3 starts.
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 822
All Pro
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All Pro
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 822 |
Could not agree more, Vers!
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 16,244
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 16,244 |
I don’t understand why we’re allergic to Duke Johnson (outside of inept planning).
While I get that it’s hard to say “Duke should be getting X touches a game”, because flow and situation dictate that, when you’re down 2+ scores and have WR’s who can’t catch or separate, it clearly should’ve been the Duke show.
He had what, like 100 yards on 5-6 touches? On that note, from today's players meeting w/ the media.....
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Jarvis Landry and ... ? How the
Browns' wide receiver plans fell
apart
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