DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2018 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 23 Buccaneers 26 NFL recognizes hit on Browns' Baker Mayfield should have been flagged

OCT 24 11:45 PM ET
Pat McManamonESPN Staff Writer

The NFL recognizes that Tampa Bay Buccaneers safety Jordan Whitehead should have been penalized for a hit on Cleveland Browns quarterback Baker Mayfield on Sunday, a source familiar with the league's thinking said Tuesday.

Whitehead could have been flagged for one of two infractions: unnecessary roughness for a hit to the head of a sliding player or unsportsmanlike conduct for using his helmet to hit a player, the source said.

The NFL is not commenting on the hit. Fines are typically announced on Fridays. If the league fines Whitehead, it will be public affirmation that the play should have been penalized.

The hit occurred in the Bucs' 26-23 overtime win on Sunday. Mayfield slid at the end of a 35-yard run on second-and-26 in the fourth quarter. Shortly after Mayfield's knee hit the ground, Whitehead's helmet hit the side of Mayfield's head.

Whitehead lowered his head to make the hit and used the crown of his helmet. Both are textbook examples of what the league does not want and are included in the descriptions of hits that could lead to a player being ejected.

Officials initially flagged the play, but after a conference, referee Shawn Hochuli announced that the flag would be picked up.

"The quarterback was still a runner and therefore is allowed to be hit in the head," Hochuli said to the crowd. "He had not yet begun to slide."

Mayfield was ruled down at the Tampa Bay 41-yard line with 7:47 left and the Browns trailing 23-16. A 15-yard penalty would have moved the Browns to the 26. The Browns moved to the Bucs' 1 on the drive but failed to score on a fourth-down quarterback sneak.

When Mayfield started to slide is a judgment call; hits to the head are not. Sliding players are protected by league rule from hits to the head. The league knows the penalty should have been called, according to a source.

"There's a lot of stuff being put out on protecting the quarterback," Mayfield said after the game. "Doesn't seem like the Browns are getting a lot of calls, but they can review it, and they can say I was a runner, but I started my slide. That's helmet-to-helmet contact."

Browns coach Hue Jackson said after the game that he did not understand why the flag was picked up. Other players complained. On Monday, Jackson said the team would ask the league for clarification.

"That was disappointing," Jackson said. "That is all that I can say."

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25066168/nfl-knows-hit-browns-baker-mayfield-flagged

Great. The best streak we can put together is consecutive weeks that we get an apology letter from the NFL saying they botched yet another call.

of course

Three letters of apology should = a win.

I am not one to complain about officiating, but it's to the point that this is happening every single week.

I would love the hear the explanation of why 5 officials didnt know that and didnt call that.

There was a flag thrown. Apparently 1 of 5 knew. He just got overruled by the other 4

Doesn't negate the fact that Baker needs to get down. We would be singing a very different tune if we got the flag and he was concussed for 4 weeks.

True, but that is a completely separate issue unto itself.

I bet that flag was for taunting

HaHa, good point. Except that would mean that they overruled a call to be in our favor. I'd have better odds of winning the powerball.

For what? Baker gave the ball to the ref.

The player lead with his helmet, which contracted with Bakers helmet.

They made the wrong call to pick the flag.

I don't normally complain about the officiating, but it has been down right criminal this season.

They literally took the Raiders game away from us.

Yes, on a judgement call.

But what is more blatant then not calling an obvious false start? That is not under the criteria of a judgement call.

If you are not going to call something, then at the very least you should be consistent and unbiased.

They have not been either imo ... But at the same time this team has not shown the disciplin that is required to play at a high level week in and week out.

Some of this can be contributed to playing so many rookies, but the Coach really needs to get this team to be more discipline. At least some signs to that effect.

The NFL, Roger Goodell and the officials (with their STUPID Twitter account) can kiss my rear end. They are BLATANTLY cheating the Browns. Everyone knows it. Just stop already. Tired of this crap.

Agreed. As usual too little too late from the league. The refs should learn to get it right the first time.

I'm interested to see if there will be a fine. I'm sure, if there is, it will be a fine without much explanation... or an apology.

DISCLAIMER: we have been hosed by the refs on calls they should not have missed .. its HORRIBLE and OUT OF CONTROL ... i am not defending EVERYTHING thats happenend to us ... this is NOT THAT ... this is simply an explanation on what happenend on this particular blown call ... as i said from the start ... they missed it ... some of u IGNORE that when replying to me when i do this ...

So lets do the math here ... in the other thread i said two things relevant to this statement ...

- if the refs on the field had the chance to see it on replay they would have called the penalty .... this sure looks like a confirmation of that ... i told u guys HOW HARD THAT IS TO CALL in realtime ...

And here’s how the convo went menZas ... i’ll gaurantee it ... they focused the convo on weather he was protected as a qb and they determined he wasn’t protected cause he slide to late .... then they decided it wasn’t a helmet to helmet hit ... AGAIN ... that’s VERY ERY HARD to determine in real time ... it’s WAY WAY WAY EASIER from the tv highlights ...

If u wanna argue he started to slide ... thats a JUDGEMENT call ... they ruled he slide to late ...

They didn’t blow it then IMO ... they did miss the helmet to helmet the video makes that clear ... but like i said this isn’t no where’s near as easy of a call as a false start ...

- i also said the league would say it was “in the officials judgement” in there statement ... well i was wrong ... they came out through BACK CHANNELS and admitted they were wrong ...

This RULE is hard to judge .. they’ve made it TO HARD on the officiate ...

Why do u think they made SEVERAL VIDEOS explaining the rule MULTIPLE times in MULTIPLE DIFFERENT WAYS .. and there not done “tweeking” it ... there not gonna come up with public videos but the officials are getting something periodically more than likely still ... there STRUGGLING with this rule still ... there having a hard time DEFINING it in terms that make it easier for the ref to officiate ...

It basically came down to a series of if, then’s ... most rules NEVER get an explanation video ... the ones that do usually get one video that runs for 3 - 5 minutes ... and once in awhile a rules explanation will need a 30 second correction video ...

With this rule ... they came out with 4 or 5 and each was 5+ minutes ...

There STILL SORTING THIS ONE OUT ...

Its a MESS ... i told u guys this and the QB landing rules would cause a ton of PROBLEMS ... not even 1/2 through the year and its all ready come true in spades ...

U notice theres been no qb landing issues in the last 3 or 4 weeks ... U GUYS THINK THAT JUST HAPPENEND CAUSE THE OFFICIALS GOT BETTER .... .. no ... LIKE I SAID 3 or 4 weeks ago .. the league will get word out to the refs on how to change what there suppose to call and guess what .... IT APPEARS THEY DID ...

This one isn’t such an easy fix ... there hosed on this one ... gonna be an issue til they revert back to the old rule and i don’t see that happening for liability reasons ... we‘ll see on that one ...

Not bad for a ... what was it one of u guys reffered to me as .. A POP WARNED LEGEND OFFICIAL or some slam close to that ... not bad for a pop warner official ...

Dude, I apologize for my response in the other thread. I understand what you are saying 100%. Most of these calls for late hits, helmet to helmet, DPI, etc... are not always easy.

My contention then and now relates to how the NFL has tweaked the enforcement of some of these rules. I APPLAUDED the NFL when they relayed that helmet contact would be a "point of emphasis", not because of the rules them self, but because of the protocol for enforcement. They said, in no uncertain terms, that plays should be reviewed to establish punishment and enforcement.

That was the big failure Sunday. It was made even more obvious when the official openly statement that there was contact to the head. Regardless of whether or not I've ever been an official, I clearly understand the rule. Seems that Sunday, five guys in stripes, obviously did not. When a group of officials talk it over and the result is 100% ignorance or just plain arrogance towards rules and protocol, that is the definition of INEPT.

+1 they saw it, they said they saw it, they said it was ok.

You are right Diam.

My issue with it is that typically, when the flag is throw, much like a review, they should need irrefutable proof to withdraw it.

Unless one the refs can say "I saw it and it was a shoulder, not a helmet hit", then the flag should stand. And I have to presume that the head-to-head hit was the reason for the flag, based on the refs comments about a -paraphrase- "blow to the head is therefore allowed."

Another thing that sticks out to me is the pass interference against Calloway. The official closest to him saw it and dismissed it with what looked like a laugh until another official threw a flag. That looked like that official had an agenda against the browns with those action. I wonder if this same official threw questionable flags during the game.

I agree, I've never seen it as much as this year. Penalties aren't a negotiation process. Makes them look dumb, especially when they "decide" on the wrong call.

Actually, Baker jumped up and got in the face of the player that hit him... he might have given the ball to the ref but he went immediately to get into the defenders face.

And good for him. We know the guy has the fire to go facemask to facemask, and he has a hard head.



What bothers me is I didn't see a group of our players in the punks face, and a coach who didn't stick a finger in a refs face.

Sometimes as a coach you need to do what is right, even if it means taking a penalty.



My wife is right, Hue is a weak man.

I'm sure the refs got a free pass on this. If they can't make textbook calls, maybe they shouldn't be refs.

The officiating is either criminally fraudulent or incompetently stupid. One of the two. Either way, it should be investigated.

Officials suck.....

There is a reason, especially at the high school level, that officials, umpires, and ref's are getting out of it, and new ones aren't coming in. Just watch, at the h.s. level, the nest 5 or so years.

Now, I agree, at the nfl level it would be nice to have competent officials that know the rules and don't make mistakes.

It would also be nice if a qb didn't throw any bad passes.

You know what, NFL?

I don't care about your apology. It's the same kind of hollow apology that comes out of every abusive husband's mouth when he knows he's gone too far- again.

You know what I'd rather hear from you, NFL? This:

"We acknowledge the substandard level of officiating at recent Cleveland Browns games, and are committed to improving the quality of our officials' performance. We are implementing several measure to bring about said improvements, including..."

..and finish this with a list of positive changes (fines for blatantly bad calls, increased training, full-time status for all refs...)


That's what I want to hear from you, NFL.
And then, I want to see it happen.

If all you plan to do is to continue issuing weekly apologies for your systemic abuse of an entire fan base, then kindly stfu.

Because we've heard it all before.

I'd like that, but then I remember the NFL was never tough on domestic abuse either.

http://www.footballzebras.com/2018/10/nfl-fires-down-judge-hugo-cruz/

Thanks for the memories HUGO, and for giving a free TD to our opponent.

You suck.

How many are they going to have to fire for the helmet hit to Baker?

Next question: which games did he work this season?

Is that the guy who blew the call in the San Diego game? The guy who blew the same call in the Tampa game might be sweating it out this week.

Yes, that is the guy that blew it in the Chargers game.