DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Depth Grades (long)

As I have been saying for a while, you don’t have a good team until you have a deep team. Injuries happen. Can you survive them? It’s already ringing true with the O line this year. Five starters aren’t enough, you need 8. This is why we’re better this year. So without further ado, the preseason positional DEPTH analysis from joey b:

Grading based on starter quality, ability of first back up to start a few games, and ability of back ups to start the whole season if top two guys go down.

QB: As much as we may hope, this unit grades an F right now. Even assuming Charlie plays well enough to win (which is a big assumption), we don’t have a proven starter behind him. Frye is mediocre, Anderson is too, Dorsey is smart but not athletic, and Quinn just isn’t ready. There is no doubt much HOPE, but there is no depth, even if Quinn becomes the second coming.

RB: Grade D. The reason this isn’t an A is because we only have one Jamal Lewis. Almost every starting RB in the NFL gets injured for at least a game or two. He’s not the same guy he was five years ago, but he’s an improvement over Droughns and he’ll do what we need running, catching, and blocking. Behind him? The hard working special teamer Wright (who might handle a game or two if Lewis goes down, but that’s it) and Harrison/Barclay – all potential no experience. Again, lots of HOPE for they two young guys, but right now? Not ready, no depth.

FB: Incomplete. I’m copping out here because I don’t know how many we’re keeping and how they plan to use the FB. Smith was a great blocker and we dumped him, so that’s not the primary concern. Vickers is really still an unknown, and he’s injured now anyway. We’ll see what we have in Ali tomorrow.

TE: Grade A. This is what depth looks like: A standout starter (Winslow), a steady and PROVEN veteran back up (Heiden) and a special teamer with promise (Dinkins, Krause, Ortega) who could start in a pinch. Depending on what Chud is looking for, blocking or catching, will determine the third stringer. If Winslow goes down, we lose some talent, but we don’t fall apart. Heiden can start a whole season and hold down the position. That’s decent depth.

WR: Grade D. Edwards and Jurevicius are fine, though not spectacular, starters. They’ll get the job done. Wilson may very well be a disaster, but Cribbs and Carter provide experience and talent, though not overwhelmingly so. I’m giving Cribbs and Carter the benefit of the doubt – Carter because of the preseason reports, and Cribbs because he has thus far stepped up when we needed him to. If Wilson pans out, we’re up to a C.

OL: Grade A. Hooray!! For the first time in years, we have depth, on display right now. With Tucker, Steinbach, and Bentley out, we’re still functioning at a high level. Joe T is the real thing, Shaffer is a proven vet who can fill in fine enough in a moments notice. Steinbach, Fraley, Tucker, Bentley, Friedman, McKinney – six quality guys (Maybe not Friedman) for 3 interior positions. Shaffer, Tucker, Butler – all can play RT with not too much drop off. Sowells and Matua are your young developmental guys with a few games between em. This is what depth looks like in the NFL.

DL: Grade D. The only reason this isn’t an F is because I think Roye will make it back. Roye and R. Smith are probably good enough, if barely, to last a season. Washington and Smith will give us quality minutes. Fraser is, well, not terrible. So we could survive Roye and Washington, say, out for a couple of games. But that’s it. Any significant loss here and an already weak position becomes an outright disaster. Oshinowo, Harris, Purcell, Pittman, Kelley, Parker? Anyone comfortable with these guys starting? Maybe an F is the better grade, now that I think about it.

LB: Grade B. We’re really close to an A here, if I believed McGinnest had anything left. I’m waiting to hear his retirement announcement any day now. Wimbley and Peek, golden. Davis and Jackson, above average. Williams – golden back up, maybe a starter. Thompson, McMillan, Short – perfect examples of what 3rd string should be – great special teamers, up and coming young guys, or versatile with experience. If McGinnest makes it back with another year left, we’d be as good as you can ask for.

CB: Grade A. Some here might disagree with an A, but I’m giving it because this group has proven they can step up when disaster strikes. Bodden, Wright, Holly – I’m fine with any of them starting. Really like them all and they’re all still growing. McDonald seems to be a great value rookie. Perry, as bad as he looked the other day, has actually been decent when he’s played last year. Minter and K. Wright, if they make it, are your experience and potential. Even Poole can play if he has to. And Baxter, well, I think he’s great just for showing up, and I’m not going to count him out.

S: Grade B. Jones is great. Poole, though unproven, I like and have seen enough to think he’ll be just fine. Hamilton was a steal in the seventh last year. He could very well start tomorrow if we needed him. Behind them, though, nothing. This would be an A if we had kept Russell, and might be a C if Adams is crap. Not sure about him though, so we’ll leave them here for now.

Please remember two things:

1. this is an analysis about DEPTH, not simply starters.
2. This is not a Brady Quinn thread. Repeat: This is not a Brady Quinn thread. And, one more time, this is NOT A BRADY QUINN THREAD.

Discuss.

Great, another Brady Quinn thread.

Even if you are way off in your evaluations of our depth, (and I don't think you are), it's obvious you've put a lot of thought and consideraton into this post and I applaud it.

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QB: As much as we may hope, this unit grades an F right now. Even assuming Charlie plays well enough to win (which is a big assumption), we don’t have a proven starter behind him.

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I don't know that I'd give the Frye/Anderson duo an F. That's pretty harsh. Who is Peyton Manning's backup? Many teams lack a "proven starter" as a backup quarterback.

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RB: Grade D... Again, lots of HOPE for they two young guys, but right now? Not ready, no depth.

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The HOPE comes into play in showing how young our roster is. But just like the QB's, although there are slightly more than a few teams with a great one/two punch at RB, most teams would have little more than hope if their starter went down for an extended period.

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FB: Incomplete. I’m copping out here because I don’t know how many we’re keeping and how they plan to use the FB.

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I think RAC gave a hint as to how the FB will be used in this offense. When he announced Vickers having pulled a hamstring he made mention that it could cause
a change in offensive gameplaning. He said with the FB out they could adjust by using more tightend's sets or multiple wide outs. He also said that the biggest problem would be if it (a FB injury) happened at the last minute, but with a little time to work on it the team could make the adjustment.

What that tells me is that the FB is to be used somewhat extensively and with him out there is not enough depth behind him to avoid a gameplan adjustment.

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TE: Grade A.

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Ain't it great to have at least one position in good shape?

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WR: Grade D.

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I agree, a real trouble spot.

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OL: Grade A. Hooray!!

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Hooodathunkit? I'm not sure if we really get an "A" here, but maybe. Isn't it amazing that two short years ago we had no line to speak of? What the hell was the team doing?

Savage has really done a good job of repair here. The FA's cost a fortune and it's not the best way to put together a line, but did he have 5 years to build it through the draft?

It's come together nicely. If Sowells can become a quality starter, with that pick and Joe Thomas, then 2/5's of the line are from the draft. One more good pick and most of our line will have been built from the draft. That could happen as early as next season with a payoff in the next. There's the 5 years.

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DL: Grade D.

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The starters themselves are nothing to write home about and there's a big drop-off after them. This is now the biggest talent problem on the team in my opinion. I, like some others, look for Savage to address that heavily in the draft and at least one 1st tier FA signing next off-season.

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LB: Grade B.

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Now Phil can pick some linebackers. Again, it's amazing how fast this group has improved in a two short off-seasons.

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CB: Grade A. Some here might disagree with an A, but I’m giving it because this group has proven they can step up when disaster strikes.

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That's on Mel Tucker. I can't award a "A" here. Bodden is the only proven corner and it's a step down from there unless you are grading "potential". If Wright is the real deal right out of the gate then the potential of the backups looks real good.

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CB: Grade A. Some here might disagree with an A, but I’m giving it because this group has proven they can step up when disaster strikes.

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Tough for me to call. I believe you may have it right.

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2. This is not a Brady Quinn thread. Repeat: This is not a Brady Quinn thread. And, one more time, this is NOT A BRADY QUINN THREAD.

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Can I talk about Brady now?! Can I? Can I?!!

Good topic.

I was going to do one on talent....but this works as a good place.

QB...at this position all you need is somebody to hand off because I am of the opinion just about any team is screwed once the back-up has to come in....so from a depth standpoint, we are pretty good here...grade A...we have a rookie and 3 other guys who are nothing but back-ups.

RB...I disagree with your grade of D.....after Lewis...Wright is a guy who doesn't fumble and is able to hit holes and churn out some yards...he is proven....Barclay looks to be the 3rd guy...and he offers some juke...I like the combination.

FB....who really cares?? It is a worthless position unless we plan to use fullbacks, so I will go with your grade.

TE...same as you....we are going to be in the position of having to cut some pretty good players at this position....solid top to bottom.

WR....again we agree. People keep saying good receivers can be plucked from all areas of the draft.

Maybe we are proving that is hogwash. We aren't very good here and we have all sorts of picks, including FA, invested in this area.

OL....agree again...I think the line is fixed as good as we can really expect. We have some solid starters and 2-3 guys in reserve who will be able to hold their own.

Dl....I think it is higher....maybe a C+...the problem is the starters suck. Some of the starters should be back-ups.

Backer...I agree...we have some solid talent...and I am counting on zero from McGinnest.

Corner...I agree.

Safety....I don't. I don't think we have anything proven in this area....so it is hard to give a grade.

You gave an A to the Corners which is full of ROOK's and injured players..

yet you gave a B to our LB's who are pretty much set and ready to go at any day...

not that it matters.. just curious why our LB's didnt get higher.. thats the best part of our defense..

Dub: good points all around. I think I may have been too harsh on the QBs and RBs.

QB backups are all right, trouble is there is no starter yet.

If Lewis really is as advertised, we're certainly better off than last year. I just haven't seen anything from the backups yet to give me any confidence if lewis goes down. Wright is serviceable for a game or two, but after that...?

As for the corners, I know my A is controversial, but I'm really genuinely not worried about this group. That could just be my "gut feeling." AHHHHHHH!!!!!

And if you must, you may discuss Quinn in terms of his clipboard holding.

Peen, good point about the DL. It's hard to tell, really, what kind of quality we have because a 3-4 line is hard to judge anyway, really just about clogging the line. If we had Roye and Washington as situational backups that'd be nice depth. Problem is, no one is better to start.

Great post. I love it when people put a lot of thought into posts.

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QB: As much as we may hope, this unit grades an F right now. Even assuming Charlie plays well enough to win (which is a big assumption), we don’t have a proven starter behind him. Frye is mediocre, Anderson is too, Dorsey is smart but not athletic, and Quinn just isn’t ready. There is no doubt much HOPE, but there is no depth, even if Quinn becomes the second coming.

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I think as of today this is probably pretty accurate. If Frye can step up in the beginning of the season and Quinn becomes ready it could change a lot. Frye will make a good backup in this league and Quinn will hopefully become a quality starter.

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RB: Grade D. The reason this isn’t an A is because we only have one Jamal Lewis. Almost every starting RB in the NFL gets injured for at least a game or two. He’s not the same guy he was five years ago, but he’s an improvement over Droughns and he’ll do what we need running, catching, and blocking. Behind him? The hard working special teamer Wright (who might handle a game or two if Lewis goes down, but that’s it) and Harrison/Barclay – all potential no experience. Again, lots of HOPE for they two young guys, but right now? Not ready, no depth.

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I can see where you are coming from but this is also a position that can change drasticly. Our backups are inexperienced and unproven but there is a good chance IMO that one will step up. A good oline should help.

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FB: Incomplete. I’m copping out here because I don’t know how many we’re keeping and how they plan to use the FB. Smith was a great blocker and we dumped him, so that’s not the primary concern. Vickers is really still an unknown, and he’s injured now anyway. We’ll see what we have in Ali tomorrow.

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I don't even know if we will carry more than one fullback. We might use a te in a backup role here.

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TE: Grade A. This is what depth looks like: A standout starter (Winslow), a steady and PROVEN veteran back up (Heiden) and a special teamer with promise (Dinkins, Krause, Ortega) who could start in a pinch. Depending on what Chud is looking for, blocking or catching, will determine the third stringer. If Winslow goes down, we lose some talent, but we don’t fall apart. Heiden can start a whole season and hold down the position. That’s decent depth.

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Depth is nice.

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WR: Grade D. Edwards and Jurevicius are fine, though not spectacular, starters. They’ll get the job done. Wilson may very well be a disaster, but Cribbs and Carter provide experience and talent, though not overwhelmingly so. I’m giving Cribbs and Carter the benefit of the doubt – Carter because of the preseason reports, and Cribbs because he has thus far stepped up when we needed him to. If Wilson pans out, we’re up to a C.

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I agree.

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OL: Grade A.

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Life is good.

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DL: Grade D. The only reason this isn’t an F is because I think Roye will make it back. Roye and R. Smith are probably good enough, if barely, to last a season. Washington and Smith will give us quality minutes. Fraser is, well, not terrible. So we could survive Roye and Washington, say, out for a couple of games. But that’s it. Any significant loss here and an already weak position becomes an outright disaster. Oshinowo, Harris, Purcell, Pittman, Kelley, Parker? Anyone comfortable with these guys starting? Maybe an F is the better grade, now that I think about it.

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Sad but true.

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LB: Grade B. We’re really close to an A here, if I believed McGinnest had anything left. I’m waiting to hear his retirement announcement any day now. Wimbley and Peek, golden. Davis and Jackson, above average. Williams – golden back up, maybe a starter. Thompson, McMillan, Short – perfect examples of what 3rd string should be – great special teamers, up and coming young guys, or versatile with experience. If McGinnest makes it back with another year left, we’d be as good as you can ask for.

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I agree but noticed no McMillian. He is a guy who I thought didn't have a shot to make the team this year but does seem to be playing well. What are your thoughts on him?

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S: Grade B. Jones is great. Poole, though unproven, I like and have seen enough to think he’ll be just fine. Hamilton was a steal in the seventh last year. He could very well start tomorrow if we needed him. Behind them, though, nothing. This would be an A if we had kept Russell, and might be a C if Adams is crap. Not sure about him though, so

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I hope Pool does step up and I believe Adams will be very serviceable.

Turk - I gave the corners an A because even though they are injured and young, there isn't a drop off in performance (although Perry was awful the other night). At least, not much of one. That to me is what depth is all about - being able to play well if the starters go down. If that position was completley healthy, we'd have Bodden, Baxter, Wright, Holly - all of them starter quality. The fact that we're ok if Bodden and Baxter can't play, tells me we've got depth.

The Backers are pretty good, but not perfect yet, because if we lose Peek or Wimbley, we don't have anyone to replace their pass rush. Again, assuming Mcginnest is done. Thompson, McMillan, and Short aren't starter quality at OLB in the 3-4.

I like McMillan, but I think he may have reached his ceiling. When he is in against the 2nd stringers in preseason, he dominates, last year and this year. But with the ones, he's invisible. Well, not invisible, but nothing to write home about. I think he's an ok back up. If Wimbley goes down in a game, McMillan could hold down the fort. But we'd notice a real big dropoff if he had to start for any extended period of time.

He's kind of like a Jason Wright. Good special teamer, knows his position, and does everything so so.

by the way, i'm ashamed to admit this since i've been around for so long, but how do you quote someone's post as you're responding?

When you hit reply on a post you can hit the quote function and then copy and paste only the part you want to quote.

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When you hit reply on a post you can hit the quote function and then copy and paste only the part you want to quote.

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Thanks.