DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Head Coach Search Part IV

Petey, I think you mean you want a candidate who didn't get caught. As I said, headhunting and intentional injuries for money was a practice league wide. You would likely be perfectly fine with a coaching candidate who participated as long as you didn't know about it. And that may very well eventually become the case.

Look, I'm not trying to convince you your feelings are wrong, you are absolutely entitled to your opinion on the matter. I just disagree, and feel GW deserves a shot if he continues to perform at a high level, and if that's who Dorsey choses. Like I stated before, he wouldn't be my choice but I'm not the guy making the decision. Williams made a mistake, he did his time, he loves his job, and he has the guys playing at a high level. There's no reason to punish him for something he's already been punished for. JMHO

I can respect that Pete ... i don’t agree with it ... but im not gonna let u have my opinion so i’d Be shocked if your gonna allow me to have yours ... *L* ...

If i thought he were the right candidate ... we’d talk about it ... man to man ... look me in the eye and answer some questions .. not softballs .. questions like ..

- how did it affect U and your family ...
- what did u learn from it ...
- why should i not expect a repeat performance ...

There’d be like 20 or 30 questions like that ... were getting into it ... the longer u do this the more “honest” his answered will get as we move on ...

And i’d Get right in his face and use a deragotory ass tone ... i’d Be relentless and try to pee him off ... see how he reacted ...

And thats after a 1st and 2nd interview where its been all smiles and sunshine ...

IF i thought he was my guy after that ... we need a 3rd interview ...

- and i’m Walking in the room not being a rude jerk but my mannerisms and tones would not resemble the warm smile and handshake he got in visits 1 and 2 ...

And i’d Start off with a “stern” voice and it would escalate as we moved along with the appropriate body language ...

It would be a hurdle for him to clear ... but IF he was my guy ... HE’D GET A CHANCE TO CLEAR IT ...

We just disagree here Pete ...

Your not around much ... if i dont see u ... hope u enjoy your christmas even if it finds u away from your family cause your out doing your thing ...

I posted a part of an article from Terry Pluto, who is pretty well plugged into the league, who said that many other teams did what Williams did ..... and maybe worse ..... only Williams was the one who got caught.

I also find it funny that McCarthy is the leading candidate for a job that isn’t even open yet ... *L* ..

Thats crazy ...

For those that didnt see it ... someone posted a tweet i think of McCarthy being the leading candidate for the falcons job ... he hasn’t even been fired yet ... *L* ...

That was my thought as well. "When did the falcons fire their coach?"

I predict that we win this week and GW as head coach talk will escalate.

Exactly. We (or at least I) watched football for decades with crazy behavior going on in the piles and on the field. I applaud the push to make it safer. Williams is the poster child for why the practice needed to be exposed, but if he had been the only one, he would've quietly gone away. If they had gone after everyone who was guilty, the league would've been decimated.

You'd think they'd let Quinn know first. Funny how he was one of the hottest prospects four years ago, but now after one bad season there's talk of replacing him with a guy who is "boring and not innovative". People have their heads up their butts. Quinn went to the playoffs in two of his four years, and went to the Super Bowl his second year after going 8-8. We all know McCarthy's record, but according to some, he's not good enough for us.

If I remember correctly, coaches like Buddy Ryan, Jerry Glanville and just about any Raiders coach since the 60's, just to name a few, promoted behavior like that on the field. It's been going on since football has been played. Some never were caught.

Actually, all but one were never caught.

I believe we could win out and Williams still wouldn't be the head coach next season.

Not bringing Williams back would be the dumbest move the team could make. Hire a new coach, change the offense and defense, cut talent that does not fit the new scheme, and suck again. Been there done that way too much.

Dorsey isn't going anywhere.

Maybe, maybe not, but he would definitely be top five in consideration.

J/C

I remember years ago,Bill Walsh set the league on it's nose with the WCO.
Evevry owner looking for a new HC was blown away with young OC's who could talk the WCO language.
Some turned out to be damned fine coaches,most fell by the wayside.
Fast forward to today and it's all about spread and RPO's.The young coordinators versed in the scheme will have a leg up on the more traditional based coaches.
Some will turn out to be fine coaches,most will fall by the wayside.
Coaching isn't about schemes,it's about getting players to believe in and achieve greatness.
I don't know much about any of the names being bantied about on here,so I can't really say who I'd favor.but,I would be cautious about a young hot shot coordinator spouting off about RPO's

In my opinion, I don't want another Mangini situation. Been there, done that. I want someone who who is in lockstep with Dorsey and maybe Williams becomes that. I think we will entertain the idea out of respect for his work and time here.

Maybe he becomes the permanent head coach but I believe he's way down on the list.

Getting a new coach wouldn't mean we are rebuilding.

This will not happen. We win out, Williams is the head coach.

I like Williams and I think the team respects him.

Honestly, if he was available Kyle Shanahan would be my pick.

I think getting a new head coach measns changing everything again. Most on here complain about the lack of continuity, and now are calling for another change, I don't get it. I'm not crazy about Williams defense, but the team has been stocking players to run it, if we change DC, we are back to square one, having to switch out players to fit the scheme. IMO, that means setting the team back again.


Also, the connection between Freddie and Baker is huge. They believe in each other. Changing OCs at this point would, again, set the team back at least another year to learn a new scheme and terminology.


If they brought in Arians, and he kept Williams and Freddie, I believe that would be the best situation for this young team. The defense would be in their third year of the same scheme, and the offense would be in their second.


With the progress going on right now with this team, I can't think of any reason to change things again. IMO, we would be right back to being a team learning a new system and switching out players, and losing games in the process.

I tend to agree. Perhaps Ariens would keep some of the continuity, but I also believe a new coach other than him would be a total restructure system-wise. Add to that that we're probably this next off season away from completely building out GW's defense and nearing elite status. Tearing that apart will piss me off, barring some miraculous series of events.

No need to tear the D down .. not a fan of Gregg’s D philosophy in that he doesn’t adjust it enough to fit the talent ...

I just as soon get a new DC in ASAP and get the learning started ...

There’s no need to “tear” the D down ...

Gregg Williams or Bruce Arians (if he keeps Williams and Kitchens). Anyone else is yet another rebuild.

I want whatever coach gives this team the best chance to win the division this year and next year.

Ariens would change just as much as any other HC, history has proven they all do the same thing,

they give lipservice to continuity but we see on average about 11 veteran players from your roster, sent to other places, and coordinators change and schemes change.

Ariens, anybody.

YOU GOT WILLIAMS THERE NOW, Ride em out, give him a chance to pass or fail next season.

He's shown more promise than Hue did in a 3 game stretch, than, well pick any 3 game stretch from Hue's time with the Browns.

This is not true. At all.

Changing systems and rebuilding are not the same thing. The Rams hired Sean McVay and Wade Phillips. They dramatically improved with basically the same players.

The team has not been stocking players to run Gregg Williams system. The team has been stocking players. There are plenty of defensive coordinators out there who would change the "scheme" to the players that they are told they are going to have.

The team does not have to be set back because of a scheme change. There are teams that have new coordinators every year and the team improves. We are just damaged because we haven't had the players. Now we do.



I agree that their connection is huge. I also think that more important than their connection is making sure we have an offense that will play to our franchise QB's strengths for the long term. That could be Freddie Kitchens, it could be someone else.



What happens when Arians has to retire in a year or two because of health reasons?



1. It's hard to think about the long term when the short term is going so well.
2. Changing coaches doesn't mean the team takes a step back. As I said above, look at the Rams last year (or the Bears this year or the Titans.

Doesn't mean it won't happen. At this point it's mere speculation whether we'll be working under new systems or not. But I can't think of a single time we've changed coaches and kept the same systems in place, can you?

No ... we’ve never had this much talent dawg ...

What i williams “system” ... its called blitz someone 90% of the time and bring a bunch on 50% of those .. *L* ...

MG, Ogbah, Avery, Joe, Ward, Randall, Mitchell witch one of them are we gonna cut? ... thats 7 of about a 14 man rotation ...

Pepp could be cut cause so far hes underperformed ... hes played much better starting around week 3 or 4 this year ... but he still has flaws and holes in his game ..

Kindred .. nuttin special ... Kirksey, Collins could be upgraded real easy ...

Naaa ... sorry dawg ... could it happen .. sure ... i just dont see it ..

we FINALLY have TALENT ... it’s FINALLY GOOD to be a DAWG!!!

I misunderstood. No, I don't think we'll blow it up talent-wise, just add to it. (I think Collins will be replaced.) I mean we'll be starting over system-wise. I do think the players are executing GW's system better. I just wish we could keep moving forward with it. It's aggressive, has attitude, and relies on players doing their jobs. When we have healthy corners, our D looks really good, though we need better contain on the edges. I figure Dorsey will add another corner, another LB, and a beast in the middle. I would love to see that defense working with Schobert calling the shots in a system we've had three years. Tell me you don't think the point total would come down.

You know, I actually like Williams system. The only thing that actually concerns me about it is the vast amount of talent it takes to run it effectively. I'm not sure if the salary cap will permit you to assemble and keep that kind of talent together over the long haul. You need elite pass rushers and a shut down secondary. Trying to hold that kind of talent together while keeping talent on O together that can be an effective scoring unit together is a tall order.

I cant argue with u on the immediate results ... they’ve been in his system for two years now ... i dont like how he runs his system .. he doesnt adapt it good enough to his personal ... its to aggressive for me ...

I’m not a fan of his system so i’d Rather get to one i like more quicker .... cause its all about me ... *LOL* ...

Not sure we really disagree here ...

I’m choosing a new system over continuity with the current system ...

Your choosing continuity over a new system ... u seem to like Gregg’s system more than i do ..

Make sense?

It's a good point. Right now we have the cap space. I wonder down the road, though the cap does go up. Where it really becomes tenuous is four years from now when Baker needs the big dough and the rookie contracts are coming due.

Perfect sense. I'd say you're more likely to get your new system than I am to keep continuity. Now we wait.

No Thanks. His defense stinks.

I don't know, can he work with Baker?

Dorsey won't let it happen.

U don't teardown talent. And we've got guys that can run ANY 4-3 defense.

U UPGRADE wherever possible.

Guys like Collins and Kirksey. Carrie and Boddy-Calhoun. Kindred. One could argue Ogbah.

It's imperative that we continue to draft well because we CANNOT re-sign every good pick. Cap won't allow it. Especially when Mayfield comes up. And that will piss off a lot of people like Mac.

Watch what happens to the Rams when Goff comes up.

The teams with these hot new QBs on Rookie deals MUST draft well going forward if they want to be perennial contenders.

This defense NEEDS some serious upgrading at ALL 3 Levels. But it WON'T get a teardown. 2 immensely different things.

I don't like Williams Defense either. We blitz and get gashed on the ground and leave the middle of the field wide ass open way 2 much for my liking between the 20's.

I HATE THAT.

It's why we give up Damn near 30 a game.

Relying on Red Zone and Turnovers is STUPID.

His Browns deal will be very lucrative for him.

This is what it boils down to. Does Riley want to leave Oklahoma. No matter how good and comfortable he's got it there, some guys are just drawn to other challenges. Some guys aren't drawn to the status quo. If Dorsey liked what he saw when he scouted him and he's not a status quo guy he will be the next Browns coach.

Guys who will not be the next Browns coach for sure: McCarthy, Jim Harbaugh. I'll probably add to this list as time goes on. I'm pretty sure on those two though.

If not the Cleveland Browns somebody will.

Whether it's his desire to coach in the NFL is another question.