DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Cavs Season Continued

If the Cavs have the worst record in the NBA what is the worst position they can get in the lottery?

They started really bad last night, but for the last 3 quarters they played some good ball.

In years past, the team with the worst record had a much better chance (25%) at the first overall pick. This year the odds have been revised, I presume in an effort to discourage "tanking".

Beginning with the 2019 draft, the NBA will change the lottery odds as follows:

140 combinations, 14.0% chance of receiving the No. 1 pick
140 combinations, 14.0% chance
140 combinations, 14.0% chance
125 combinations, 12.5% chance
105 combinations, 10.5% chance
90 combinations, 9.0% chance
75 combinations, 7.5% chance
60 combinations, 6.0% chance
45 combinations, 4.5% chance
30 combinations, 3.0% chance
20 combinations, 2.0% chance
15 combinations, 1.5% chance
10 combinations, 1.0% chance
5 combinations, 0.5% chance

I'm still bummed we didn't trade up for Donnic. We don't have much of a core to build around right now. Sexton is okay, but I don't think he's the a piece like Donnic would of been. Osman has been a bit of a disappointment this year. Our two best players have been Nance and Tristan, and they are both 26 and 27. By the time we've finished any sort of rebuild, they'll be pushing 30 with big-men miles on them.

Agreed 100%. Especially since Nance is diet Thompson with range and athleticism. I'm hoping we can unload TT soon. With Doncic we're probably talking a top 10 pick, now we have great odds to get the number one pick. Like I've said previously though, I'm not sure Sexton's game matches well with Zion.

I hate our roster right now. Sexton and Osman are statistically like the bottom 10 players in the league right now. I hope Sexton gets better next year. But man he is not a PG. Delly back to doing Minn Delly things. Hopefully Love comes back and we can look like a legit NBA team and not the team the Generals play when they need a morale boost. What sucks is with the new rules, we can be literally the worst team in the history of the nba, and still have the same odds of landing the first pick as the next 2 teams. We really need to get that first pick and get a franchise guy like Zion to build around.

from the PD article last week

"According to ESPN's Real Plus-Minus, which measures a player's estimated on-court impact on team performance in net point differential per 100 offensive and defensive possessions, Osman ranks 468th out of 472 NBA players. That's the second-worst RPM on the team, ahead of only Sexton. That specific metric points to Osman being the league's third-least productive starter. "

Somebody commented that it was the best defense Harden's played all year. What did Harden do to pizz Giannis off that bad?

This OKC game is good. Going to 2nd OT.

I’m thinking Walton doesn’t make it to end of year

https://www.latimes.com/sports/lakers/la-sp-lakers-hernandez-20190113-story.html

Lakers can't win without LeBron James, and are making it impossible to win with him

The way the Lakers are playing these days, every time they step on the floor solidifies LeBron James’ claim as the most valuable player in the league.

Remove James from the lineup and they border on unwatchable most nights. Sunday, with James sidelined for a 10th consecutive game, the Lakers morphed into something particularly grotesque, a group inferior to even the NBA-worst Cleveland Cavaliers, who entered Staples Center on a 12-game losing streak.

On a night when the sound most often heard was the home crowd’s collective holding of breath followed by groans of disappointment, the Lakers dropped a 101-95 decision to the last franchise to discover how much James could make a team forget how bad it actually was.

The Lakers couldn’t score. Like, at all. From the field, from the free-throw line, it didn’t make a difference.

If James’ absence was an opportunity for the likes of Kyle Kuzma, Lonzo Ball and Brandon Ingram to demonstrate how much they had developed over the last year, the situation has instead exposed them — at best, as not ready; at worst, as overvalued.

“We want to win,” Ball said. “It’s our team right now.”

As “their” team, the Lakers are 3-7, with every loss they absorb making their overall record of 23-21 look more and more like a James-inspired miracle. At this point, the primary obstacle James encounters in chasing his fifth MVP award could be the number of games he misses.

This leads to an uncomfortable question for the Lakers: What if the groin injury to the previously indestructible James wasn’t a fluke, but a symptom of age?

James turned 34 last month. He has shared his belief that his prime will extend beyond that of the typical player, which explains why he staked a significant part of his legacy on a move to a rebuilding franchise.

By now, it’s obvious the Lakers can’t win without James.

If he misses another week, the Lakers very well could be a sub-.500 team by the time he returns. Anything beyond that and their chances of reaching the postseason could be threatened. They have a relatively soft landing coming up Tuesday when they host the Chicago Bulls, though the Cavaliers proved no team should be considered a soft landing for these Lakers.

Next are road games at Oklahoma City and Houston, followed by a showdown at Staples Center against the Golden State Warriors.

James initially downplayed the severity of the groin strain, but only to now be in his third week in street clothes. The Lakers have offered no indication of when he could return, limiting their medical updates on him to carefully worded news releases. The latest news was that he would be reevaluated Wednesday.

The concerns extend beyond this season, however.

Considering the Lakers view anything other than a championship as a failure, the reality is that this was always destined to be a lost season. The dreaming would start when they added another star-caliber player to complement James.

That player could be signed in free agency. There’s also the possibility the Lakers will have to trade for him.

If the latter is the case, the Lakers have to be concerned if their young players have shown enough to merit a trade for a top player.

Kuzma is the best of the bunch and he remains maddeningly inconsistent. Ball is limited by his shooting. And who knows what to make of Ingram?

Without James, the Lakers are a team that requires everything to go right to win. Needless to say, that wasn’t the case against the Cavaliers.

As much as coach Luke Walton and assistant Brian Shaw warned the players multiple times before the contest to not underestimate the Cavaliers, they started slowly. The Lakers were down by as many as 15 points in the opening quarter.

The Lakers finished the game shooting 39.6% from the floor, including 20.6% on three-pointers.

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They missed 11 of 27 free-throw attempts.

Walton restated his belief in the group, as if there was any chance of him saying anything to the contrary.

Asked what that belief was based on, Walton referenced the victory over the Warriors in which James was injured, as well as a win in Dallas.

“I see them every day,” Walton said. “I see the way they work. I’ve seen who we can be. Had two big wins last week. When we were actually healthy, we were on the road, beat the defending champs.

“I know what this group is capable of. So you see that, you believe in it. You see it once, you know it can be repeated.”

So this is where the Lakers find themselves, latching their hopes on little slivers of evidence, wishing something emerges from nothing.

I weep for them about a much as the rest of the league weeps for us.

LeBron's greatness cannot be denied but he seems to have everybody else fit into this secondary role any time he is on the court because he demands the ball so much... so when he's not on the court, teams seem lost, nobody steps up and becomes the go-to guy.....

Kyrie did for a couple years because he envisioned himself as secondary to nobody... and Wade did because he had the history to back it up.. but absent that type of dominant proven player, other players seem to regress without him on the court rather than stepping up.

NBA is officially in crazy season, and I'm not sure many people really care anymore. Prozingas just got traded to the Mavs. Kyrie might get himself traded. AD wants traded. Carmelo just got waved.

But the NBA has a real problem. Stars want to force their ways on to super-teams. No team can really hold on to their superstars any more because they all want to dictate where and when they get traded.

It's the world we live in, get used to it.

Money and fame, baby.

Players like Anthony Davis are literally giving up $30 million in guaranteed money to be traded.

The goal is to win the championship. In the NBA, and this has almost always been true, you need to have multiple superstars to win. The Pelicans have had seven years to build a good team around one of the five best players in the league and have failed miserably. Anthony Davis deserves to play where he wants and should use any leverage he has to get what he wants.

Okay. So, they are so spoiled they'll give up (him) give up $30 million?

Hey, look, the money is going to dry up sooner or later.

Or he wants to win so bad that he'll give up that much.

Either way, Anthony Davis doesn't want to work where he currently works anymore. I'm sure many of us can relate to that problem. Many of us would also remedy that problem if we could.

The whole Superteam thing ruins the NBA.

It is unbalanced.

And I'm sure costs the owners a lot of money because they have non competitive teams.

Plus, as a fan, I want to see my team play and have a chance at being somewhat competitive.

Fans all over the nba got to feel that way.

The 80s Celtics had Bird, McHale, Parish, Dennis Johnson, and Bill Walton coming off the bench. The Lakers had Kareem, Magic, and James Worthy. This is not some new trend. This is how the NBA works.



The NBA owners are making more money than they ever have before. They are printing money. Literally every NBA franchise is worth over $1 billion:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenha...n/#dd0d3be71558

Just because this has gone on for years doesnt make it good.

From a fan standpoint it sucks.

The NFL is much more fair, and that's saying something coming from Browns fan.

The NBA is doing something right as it's never been more popular.



Unless you are in the NFC East!

No, it sucks.

Ordinary teams get little national airplay other than locally.

I have watched the Cavs zero times on espn/tnt this season.

From a fan standpoint there is nothing to root for. You know your team has zero chance.

We can argue this endlessly in the stupid loop.

But bottom line is, as a fan it sucks.

I don't really see it as a problem. Number one, it's been the lead on most talk shows during Super Bowl week. They're killing it with exposure. And this is way better than the bad refs kind of exposure.

Number two, if the Pelicans can't surround him with the talent to win, he should be allowed to leave or force a trade. The NBA is a "players league", so I'm fine with them using the leverage they have. It's so rare to see. In the NFL, MLB and NHL, they're treated like cattle. Heck, in the NFL, you can be cut any second. It's kind of cool to see the players throw their weight around a bit.

Also, I think it's a mistake to say no teams can hold on to their stars. Is that truly a bad thing? From the perspective of the Cavs, you want to be able to keep Lebron and Kyrie, however, they're grown men and should be able to make the decision where they want to work. I did. Plus, it's not like either of them put their time in Cleveland, in Lebron's case twice. I don't think the Cavs should be able to force them to stay. Actually, the Cavs could have forced Kyrie to stay, but he would have just torn the team down and been a distraction (even though he recently admitted Lebron was right all along and he made the mistake by forcing his way out).

OKC is holding onto Westbrook and they kept Paul George when NOBODY thought he'd stay. Giannis seems happy in Milwaukee, for now. We'll see what happens with Leonard, but if they make the Finals, maybe he sticks around. Philly was a cesspool a few seasons ago, but Embiid and Simmons are fresh and supporting the town. Is Houston a major market, because they've been holding down Harden without any talk of him being unhappy. Heck, Blake Griffin went from LA to Detroit and he seems happy too. The Bullets kept onto Wall and Beal, look where that got them.

I don't think the formation of super teams is all that big of a problem. Sure, the Warriors super team is insanely good ,but egos might end up tearing that thing apart this offseason. There's real talk that Durrant & Thompson are on the fence about leaving, and Cousin's is only on a $5m 1-year deal.

Also, it was a GOOD thing for the NBA that Carmelo just got waived. He's a black hole in any offense because he plays the old NBA game, plus, he's not very good at that ancient style too.

As far as AD, just like Lebron, he gave them a lot of years and it hasn't worked. They've only won one postseason series, ever. That's terrible compared to our first go around with Lebron. Why should he want to stay for more of that?

To me, I think it keeps the league fresh. It's not a perfect system, maybe even far from it, but it's possible to win in a non-traditional NBA market. Dallas, Miami, San Antonio, Cleveland and Golden State have been the champs this decade. Those aren't the tier one franchises you think of in the NBA, except maybe San Antonio. I mean, the Spurs weren't in that category until they exploded onto the scene in 1999 and have stayed relevant, but prior to that, they were bottom feeders.

Sorry, a long-winded reply, but I think the league is doing well. I think if the Warriors break up this offseason, the fans that were getting tired of it will come back. Even then, it'll only be 5 years the Warriors ruled the NBA, not like the Patriots ruling the league for 15+ years.

Did it suck when the Cavs had LeBron and they were on national TV all the time?

As a fan of the Cavs it definitely sucks. But your team also just went to a bunch of finals and won one. That doesn't suck.

As a fan of basketball, the league has never been in a better spot.

Yes, it didnt suck when we had Lebron.

The chance of us having another Lebron is zero.

Most teams dont have a Lebron. Because how often do you have a GOAT?

I am just speaking from a common sense point of view.

If every team had at least a small chance of being successful, then the league would be much more successful than it is.

Because people can get behind something when they feel it has a chance of success.

Go ask Vegas if this is true.

It sounds like you should are cryin for Zion.

What is Zion?

LOL. Nevermind.

Zion I think is projected to be the #1 pick?

I think Cavs fans were done dirty by the owner. I hate that lebron left and that might have been unavoidable but I don't think Lebron was put in position to thrive.

Like Eve, i don't care for the NBA, but i know a lot of people who make thousands of dollars playing DFS off the NBA. Im sure that's part of the popularity much like fantasy is for the NFL.

I'm saying this half sarcastically, but why would you want to? I was able to tune into the Cavs and Bulls game a few days ago being in the Chicago TV market, I had to turn it off because it was so unwatchable, and I like the Cavs, a lot.

Outside of baseball, which seems like there is a smaller mountain to compete, most of the leagues you know who is making the playoffs and who should be in the final series/game. It was like that in the 80's & 90's in the NBA, maybe even worse, but nobody complained then. It was the Celtics, Lakers and then Bulls....everyone else was cannon fodder. I think we all might think about that era with a bit of romance, but it was worse that today. Maybe there were more single stars spread across the league, but the same three teams dominated all the time (maybe the Pistons are the 4th).

This is my point. If teams are so worthless they are unwatchable, then the legaue needs fixing.

Even the Browns playing at their worst were watchable for the last 20 years.

This is not true.

Also, my brother is a diehard Cardinals fan. He could not bear to watch his team last year. I'll bet there are Raider fans who would say the same thing.

The Cavs being so unwatchable isn't really the leagues fault. This team is the cold, moldy leftovers of the 2nd Lebron era. Plus, with Kevin and Tristan being out seemingly all the time, that makes it extra hard to be watchable, while still losing, if that makes sense. If we were at least more competitive, maybe you could sit through 3 quarters, but man, it's over 4 minutes after the tip sometimes. But again, Kevin has been out all year, TT was out a long time and wasn't Nance was out a long string. When you subtract Lebron AND have injury problems, you get 10-12 wins at the All Star break. Oh well.

Sexton seems decent, and he might be very good in the long run, but I think he's running on empty. If there was any kind of decent scoring threat, like if Kevin and JR were still around and playing well, he'd be better off. However, JR was dying out there and the team wanted to play young, so he's gone.

I still can't get it out of my head that we could have had Donic. DAMN!

I had no problems watching the Browns for the last 20 years,

Neither have all the Browns backers bars everywhere.

Can't say the same for Cavs. 6 dollar tickets to games.

I'm gonna treat my fam to floor seats at a Cavs game because the team is so bad and the seats are so cheap.

If the Browns played 82 games instead of 16 games do you think there would be the same demand for games?

Well, the basketball teams only have to fill a small arena, and not a whole stadium.

If you cant even fill a small arena then what does it say?

It says that the team is crap on purpose and that the fans will come back once their is another star in town.