DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Trump says he believes North Korean dictator had no knowledge of Ohio student’s mistreatment

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2019/02/t...streatment.html

Otto Warmbier was the Ohio student arrested, and tortured in North Korea. He was returned to Ohio, only to die shortly later from his treatment. Trump is siding with Kim on this one, one of the most brutal dictators on planet earth.

This is beyond a shame, pathetic. One of our own gets tortured, and Resident Rump sides with Kim, unbelievable.

It amazes me that the US consensus is that North Korea and Saudi Arabia are despotic regimes ran by dictators. Yet, when forced to take account of their mistreatment of prisoners and journalists, they're suddenly good nations full of rogue agents, acting on their own accord.

America First? trump is such a maroon.

"I never like being misinterpreted, but especially when it comes to Otto Warmbier and his great family. Remember, I got Otto out along with three others. The previous Administration did nothing, and he was taken on their watch. Of course I hold North Korea responsible for Otto’s mistreatment and death. Most important, Otto Warmbier will not have died in vain. Otto and his family have become a tremendous symbol of strong passion and strength, which will last for many years into the future. I love Otto and think of him often!"

-Donald Trump

would Donald trump know if a prisoner was tortured in a US prison?

Are you actually comparing North Korea to the US?

If you know about North Korea, this does not happen. Kim rules with more than an iron fist, it is the pure definition of control.

No, but he probably would know if a foreign national was in our prison system and getting tortured.


North Korea doesn't imprison an American and then lose him in their penal system. It's not America after all

Let me translate 40s post.

I have no actual argument to refute your claims. Here I will distract you with an Obama whataboutism.

Winning?

Kim might not now if some North Korean was being tortured or beaten, but you can bet your life Otto wasn't touched without his knowledge and authorization.

Just checking in on Trump,

US intelligence says Russia influenced the election, Trump says no

99% of educated humans say we significantly affect the climate, Trump says no

Nothing happens in North Korea, without Kim’s knowledge, Trump says no

Are we really going to let this happen? This is evil Star Wars stuff

Trump is just paying lip service to north korea for the sake of politics. He is just giving NK so candy to bring them to the table a little bit sweeter and nicer. He doesn't believe a word of it anymore than we do. But he knows the crazy SOB running NK will hear of it and it will create good relations as Trump tries to get rid of the nukes.

Yes sir, my point.

Is the life of 1 Ohioan worth negotiating with North Korea? The answer has been, and always will be no. I thought this was elementary. I just assumed people were still protecting Ohioans, I’ll try from Colorado. I got your back.

O H

Don’t forget he did everything possible to deny saudis were responsible for the death of the reporter.

Our government not only knew about the torture at Gitmo, but it approved it.

"I don't believe he knew about it," Trump said of Kim. "He tells me that he didn't know about it and I will take him at his word."

-Donald Trump

Let’s break this down.

• Travels to NK (dumb to me but ok)
• Tried to steal propaganda (dumb but ok)
• Gets arrested – sketchy, but I guess it’s theft.
• Gets 15 years – outrageous. Absolutely ridiculous.
• Likely is beaten – probably electrocuted (?) No signs of hits to the head or anything is found.
• Dies after he is returned, no signs of botulism or skull injuries.


So let me get this straight. A kid is arrested for stealing, goes to a prison, gulag whatever you want to call it. Is tortured and dies.

At what point in this story can we reasonably conclude that Kim would have been informed of any of this? I guess maybe since he was an American, they may have sent it up the chain? I just struggle to think that a warmongering, tyrannical state like NK would be advising Kim that they arrested someone for theft, even if it was an American.



Now, let’s say he was made aware of this.

1. How are you going to prove that? Beyond just assuming that this man is told everything?
2. Since you cannot possibly prove it, why would you want to argue with this man about it?


It seems that the left just wants him to squabble with a tyrannical Dictator that we for the first time in many decades have had decent talks with, just so they have something to complain about Trump with. Please give me a single reason that a President should be so involved in the Minutia that he should argue with this Dictator over it? I am genuinely open to hearing why this would be a good thing.

I suspect that if it was another countries citizen, especially a country that we have poor diplomatic relations with, yes, he'd know. He wouldn't admit it, but he'd know.

You can bet that Kim knew. Anything to do with American, he'd know.

NO question about it.

NONE.

J\C
Just like Obama ,Hillary , and the whole state dept, and MSM really stuck to their guns on their fairytale that some illiterate parolee made a cellphone video that lit the middle east on fire and he caused the Bengazi murders. and y,all fell for hook line and sinker..

Not sure what you are speaking of.....

why am i not surprised that BpG keeps making excuses for trump sucking up to dictators?

his message pretty much is the same whether its kim, putin, duterte, or any other authoritarian mass murderer.

BpG needs to stop being a closet trump supporter and just have the balls to come out and say he supports him. just simply pathetic at this point.

if osama was still alive, he'd tell trump he had nothing to do with 9/11. Trump would believe him, and BpG would go "the left just looking for a reason to hate trump".

I hope you're being obtuse on purpose.



An American hostage is a huge tool to leverage things from the U. S. We've seen foreign governments from Russia to China do this many times before. They are instantly a pawn in the chess match. They aren't a prisoner, they're a political prisoner.

That would be like saying Bush or Obama had no clue what was going on at Gitmo. Of course they did. The torture performed there was approved by the highest level of our government.

I actually can't believe you even attempted to try and make that point.

He's referring to the initial reports from our intel about what happened in Benghazi before it was quickly changed after the truth was found out.

It's the rights version of a conspiracy theory.

He was a political prisoner? He wasn't detained for no reason, from what I understand he was arrested and convicted at low level policing. I think there is a pretty big jump from getting arrested for a crime and being a hostage. Maybe I am being naive.

At the point he was arrested he became a political prisoner. The sentence he was given alone made it obvious he was a political prisoner. Unless of course you feel a 15 year sentence for removing a political banner isn't sending a statement to the United states.

there's a history of this type of thing happening everywhere from Russia to China and beyond. Once you have an American in prison, they become a pawn in a chess match.

GQ did an in-depth piece on Otto Warmbier back in July of 2018.

Long, but fascinating read for anyone interested...

https://www.gq.com/story/otto-warmbier-north-korea-american-hostage-true-story

I had no idea on a lot of that. That changes my perspective a lot, he was definitely a political prisoner.

Yes - and as such virtually impossible for Kim to now know how he was treated. But the Trump supporters do not care.

I'm not sure it's that they don't care as much I think many of them aren't actually aware of all of the facts. It still won't be enough for them to speak out against Trump on the matter.

I think my perspective changes after reading that article. Kim knew about it, but what is the actual quote from Donald? It’s that he did not know of the mistreatment and from the article I just read, it would seem that almost no one outside of hearsay knew about any mistreatment.



From the article:

The actual quote....

"I don't believe he knew about it," Trump said of Kim. "He tells me that he didn't know about it and I will take him at his word."

Speaking of mistreatment, as the subject of this thread suggest correct?

I think we both Know that Kim Jong-Un knew exactly what was going on.

What I'm saying is that from the article I just read, they are saying they could not find evidence this man was tortured. That Trump was also very heavily invested/upset in this situation I think the quote was "almost like a father". At the end of the day you and I can get into the minutia, Trump should not.

My point is this, it's a very unfortunate situation all around. Am I going to fault this man for not publicly denouncing a tyrannical dictator right after said sociopath just to agreed to meet and discuss peace? I think that's not only dumb for the President to do, I think it's irresponsible to do to the people of NK hoping for hope.

Putting all of this at the feet of Trump for when the details are so murky that even American doctors cannot say what actually happened is partisan and hasty. Your own Doctors cannot say what happened, the man says he didn't know about any mistreatment, what would you have him do, call the man a liar on his own soil to the world?

When you openly accept and absolve a man like Kim in front of the entire world you made a huge mistake. We both know he could have easily said he didn't have enough information to determine whether Kim knew or not. He could have said a host of things not to absolve Kim from the situation without calling him a liar.

That's fair. At times like these it shows just how off the cuff he is, he's an amateur politician at best when it comes to these sensitive situations.

Oh. Ok

I guess it's like some other crap that was started to mess with peoples heads..

Obama was born in Kenya

If Trump doesn't get the Buffalo Bills, they will move to Toronto

ETC....

Ya think? The jackass has been a total fail all his life. Failed marriages, failed businesses, failed Trump U., and Trump foundation. And how can you possibly fail and lose money in the gambling biz? That’s virtually impossible.

This was one of the things that most endeared him to his more fervent supporters, despite all logical arguments to the contrary. "He's not a politician... that's what we like about him-"

It was all well and good during the campaign. Now, we get to see another iteration of the phrase: "Elections have consequences."

Here's a guy who not only ignores but resists/defies his Intel agencies, refuses to sit for briefings, and believes that he can 'freestyle' his way through important international diplomatic meetings.

What could go wrong?

Living on the edge bro.